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Succession of Valentinus was Re: Question

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  • AJRoberti@aol.com
    Hello Mike,
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 13, 2003
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      Hello Mike,

      << Interesting, I though his succession was St. John the Divine, then Lucinius Celenius, then him.  At least I think this is what he said at Rome when he was trying to become Pope.  Not that he didn't have a Pauline succession too.  >>

      Huh, I was unaware of that succession.  The one I know of is from Paul through Theudas.  But it would come as no surprise at all that Valentinus came from a Johannine succession too.

      Tony Roberti

    • pmcvflag
      Same here Mike, I had never heard the notion of succession through John. Where can we look to find out more about that? PMCV ... then ... at Rome ... Pauline
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 14, 2003
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        Same here Mike, I had never heard the notion of succession through
        John. Where can we look to find out more about that?

        PMCV

        --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, AJRoberti@a... wrote:
        > Hello Mike,
        >
        > << Interesting, I though his succession was St. John the Divine,
        then
        > Lucinius Celenius, then him.  At least I think this is what he said
        at Rome
        > when he was trying to become Pope.  Not that he didn't have a
        Pauline
        > succession too. >>
        >
        >
        > Huh, I was unaware of that succession. The one I know of is from
        Paul
        > through Theudas. But it would come as no surprise at all that
        Valentinus
        > came from a Johannine succession too.
        >
        > Tony Roberti
      • Mike Leavitt
        Hello pmcvflag ... You would have to ask Stephen Hoeller, that is my source, and I can t remember who he was quoting. But historically Lucineus Celenius was
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 14, 2003
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          Hello pmcvflag

          On 14-Jan-03, you wrote:

          > Same here Mike, I had never heard the notion of succession through
          > John. Where can we look to find out more about that?
          >
          > PMCV

          You would have to ask Stephen Hoeller, that is my source, and I can't
          remember who he was quoting. But historically Lucineus Celenius was
          John's student, and Valentinus was his, so I guess that is where it
          comes from. A lot of Celenius stuff was quasi-Gnostic. He wrote a
          lot of gospel like stuff. Obvoiously that line, if it ever existed,
          died with the Valenininans. It would have made Valentinus a Bishop,
          even before running for Bishop of Rome. Who knows really at this
          distance in time.

          Regards
          --
          Mike Leavitt ac998@...
        • pmcvflag
          Hmmm, well, unfortunately I don t know Stephen so I can t ask him. I take it you do, and so do a couple of other people here. Perhpas Ernst has heard it from
          Message 4 of 5 , Jan 16, 2003
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            Hmmm, well, unfortunately I don't know Stephen so I can't ask him. I
            take it you do, and so do a couple of other people here. Perhpas
            Ernst has heard it from Stephen as well, and can clerify, since he
            also goes out there to Stephen's church. I am looking through all my
            historical sources, and just can't find the John- Celenius-
            Valintinus version (but these things can be hard to find for sure). I
            only see the Paul- Theudus- Valintinus version. Of course, we all
            know that these sources can be pretty fickle. However, please, if you
            do find it let us know. As I said, I am alwasy interested in these
            bits of info.

            PMCV

            > You would have to ask Stephen Hoeller, that is my source, and I
            can't
            > remember who he was quoting. But historically Lucineus Celenius was
            > John's student, and Valentinus was his, so I guess that is where it
            > comes from. A lot of Celenius stuff was quasi-Gnostic. He wrote a
            > lot of gospel like stuff. Obvoiously that line, if it ever existed,
            > died with the Valenininans. It would have made Valentinus a Bishop,
            > even before running for Bishop of Rome. Who knows really at this
            > distance in time.
            >
            > Regards
            > --
            > Mike Leavitt ac998@l...
          • Mike Leavitt
            Hello pmcvflag ... I ll try to remember to ask him next time I see him. I am not at church often as my back keeps me from driving even that far, too much of
            Message 5 of 5 , Jan 17, 2003
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              Hello pmcvflag

              On 16-Jan-03, you wrote:

              > Hmmm, well, unfortunately I don't know Stephen so I can't ask him. I
              > take it you do, and so do a couple of other people here. Perhpas
              > Ernst has heard it from Stephen as well, and can clerify, since he
              > also goes out there to Stephen's church. I am looking through all my
              > historical sources, and just can't find the John- Celenius-
              > Valintinus version (but these things can be hard to find for sure).
              > I only see the Paul- Theudus- Valintinus version. Of course, we all
              > know that these sources can be pretty fickle. However, please, if
              > you do find it let us know. As I said, I am alwasy interested in
              > these bits of info.
              >
              > PMCV
              >
              >> You would have to ask Stephen Hoeller, that is my source, and I
              > can't
              >> remember who he was quoting. But historically Lucineus Celenius was
              >> John's student, and Valentinus was his, so I guess that is where it
              >> comes from. A lot of Celenius stuff was quasi-Gnostic. He wrote a
              >> lot of gospel like stuff. Obvoiously that line, if it ever existed,
              >> died with the Valenininans. It would have made Valentinus a Bishop,
              >> even before running for Bishop of Rome. Who knows really at this
              >> distance in time.

              I'll try to remember to ask him next time I see him. I am not at
              church often as my back keeps me from driving even that far, too much
              of the time. The way Stephan said it, I thought it was commonly
              accepted, and it does make sense, given the nature of the three men.
              Of course, I can't guarantee that my memory isn't playing tricks on
              me. In fact, I'll Blind CC this to him through a friend.

              Regards
              --
              Mike Leavitt ac998@...


              BCC to B for Stephan.
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