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Re: [Gnosticism2] Re: The Black Arts by Richard Cavendish

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  • Coraxo
    ... so ... still ... power. ... 4. As, then, they (ed., followers of Ptolemy and Valentinus) represent all material substance to be formed from three
    Message 1 of 43 , Nov 7, 2002
      --- In gnosticism2@y..., incognito_lightbringer <no_reply@y...> wrote:
      > Again, the relationship between Sophia, Demiurge, and Satan isn't
      so
      > clear. Are they all the same force described as a plurality, where
      > some aspects are to redeemed, others destroyed? Is Sophia,
      > well...Sophia in the upper aeons, but Satan/Demiurge/Spirit in the
      > material world, a kind of fracture or psychosis or duality? I know
      > the gnostic texts present a linear story, but they do so with the
      > Pleroma also (this came first, then that, then that) but that's
      still
      > all a unity and stressed as such. Origin of the World, with
      > Ialdeboath and all his sons, may be similar. Thus when an upheaveal
      > takes place, it's within the demiurge himself, and the demiurge is
      > material (animate but not spiritual) and has part of Sophia's
      power.
      > Satan on the other hand is spiritual, but evil. Just throwing some
      > ideas around.
      >
      4. As, then, they (ed., followers of Ptolemy and Valentinus) represent all
      material substance to
      be formed from three passions, viz., fear, grief, and
      perplexity, the account they give is as follows: Animal
      substances originated from fear and from conversion; the
      Demiurge they also describe as owing his origin to
      conversion; but the existence of all the other animal
      substances they ascribe to fear, such as the souls of
      irrational animals, and of wild beasts, and men. And on
      this account, he (the Demiurge), being incapable of
      recognising any spiritual essences, imagined himself to
      be God alone, and declared through the prophets, "I am
      God, and besides me there is none else."(3) They further
      teach that the spirits of wickedness derived their origin
      from grief.

      ***Hence the devil, whom they also call
      Cosmocrator (the ruler of the world), and the demons, and
      the angels, and every wicked spiritual being that exists,
      found the source Of their existence. They represent the
      Demiurge as being the son of that mother of theirs
      (Achamoth), and Cosmocrator as the creature of the
      Demiurge.

      ***Cosmocrator has knowledge of what is above
      himself, because he is a spirit of wickedness;

      ***but the
      Demiurge is ignorant of such things, inasmuch as he is
      merely animal. Their mother dwells in that place which is
      above the heavens, that is, in the intermediate abode;
      the Demiurge in the heavenly place, that is, in the
      hebdomad; but the Cosmocrator in this our world.

      Irenaeus Adv. Haer. V.
    • fred60471
      ... http://classics.mit.edu/Antoninus/meditations.html Regards, fred
      Message 43 of 43 , Nov 15, 2002
        --- In gnosticism2@y..., "Wayne" <waynel@i...> wrote:
        > --- In gnosticism2@y..., "Kishara" <kisharaiwass@y...> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > You should read "meditations" by marcus aurelius.
        > >
        > > -K.A.
        >
        >
        > Can I find it on the internet?

        http://classics.mit.edu/Antoninus/meditations.html

        Regards,
        fred
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