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Re: [Gnosticism2] Re: The Valentinian System of Ptolemaeus, nature of the universe

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  • Darius C. Rohman
    where did I find The Gnostic Bible? please someone tell me!!! Mike Leavitt wrote: Hello lady_caritas ... [cut long quote] I have Layton s
    Message 1 of 13 , Jul 11 11:29 PM
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      where did I find The Gnostic Bible?
      please someone tell me!!!

      Mike Leavitt <ac998@...> wrote:
      Hello lady_caritas

      On 07/11/05, you wrote:

      > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, Mike Leavitt <ac998@l...> wrote:
      >> Hello frendlyfascist
      >>
      >> On 07/11/05, you wrote:
      >>
      >>> Lately Ive been questioning the nature of the universe and one
      >>> scripture which really attracts me is The Valentinian System of
      >>> Ptolemaeus. In this text the material world is made out of
      > Achamoths
      >> > emotions. Scientists tell us that all matter is actually energy,
      > but
      >>> is not all this energy actually spirit? Will not even Achamoth's
      >>> negative emotions be cleansed and restored to the pleroma?
      >>
      >> Where did you find that scripture?
      >>
      >> Regards
      >> --
      >> Mike Leavitt  ac998_@_lafn._org  remove -'s
      >
      >
      >
      > Hi, Mike.  I'm not sure which scripture frendly is referring to
      > (he/she can enlighten us), but Bentley Layton in _The Gnostic
      > Scriptures_ has Ptolemy's Version of the Gnostic Myth (according to
      > St. Irenaeus of Lyon, Against Heresies 1.1.1-1.8.5).
      >
      > Regarding Achamoth and the origin of matter (p. 289):

      [cut long quote]

      I have Layton's book, but I'm reading the Gnostic Bible first, and had
      not noticed this when I went through Layton's table of contents.  Of
      course I wasn't looking for it in particular.

      Regards
      --
      Mike Leavitt  ac998_@_lafn._org  remove -'s




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    • Gerry
      ... In the interest of clarifying the clarifications, I d like to point out that Willis Barnstone does cite the sources of these texts. In _The Other Bible_,
      Message 2 of 13 , Jul 12 10:40 AM
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        --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "frendlyfascist"
        <frendlyfascist@y...> wrote:
        > Ptolemaeus writtings in the "Other Bible" include The Valentinian
        > System of Ptolemaeus and his letter to Flora. Ptolemaeus Commentary
        > on John isnt in the "Other Bible", but is in the "Gnostic Bible"
        >
        > >
        > > Ptolemaeus is another name for ptolemy, and indeed Cari seems
        > > to be qouting Ptolemaeus Valentinian System. But the text I have
        > > is not written by the St. Irenaeus of Lyon, it was written by
        > > Ptolemaeus himself. I found this text in a book titled "The Other
        > > Bible" which contains a wide variety of Gnostic gospels and other
        > > texts. Ptolemaeus Valentinian System starts with the emanation of
        > > 30 Aeons and ends with a teaching on the three "classes" of
        > > humans. After each "chapter" of this text Ptolemaeus offers
        > > Biblical proof for his claims.
        > >



        In the interest of clarifying the clarifications, I'd like to point
        out that Willis Barnstone does cite the sources of these texts. In
        _The Other Bible_, he mentions the following on pg. 621:

        Irenaeus' refutation of Valentinianism is directed primarily against
        that form of it created by Ptolemaeus, and our description of the
        system is translated from Irenaeus, Adv. haer. i. 1-8 . . . .

        In his "Letter to Flora" he set forth the answers to some theological
        difficulties encountered by a Christian woman named Flora, carefully
        leading her along a seemingly orthodox path to the point where she
        will recognize that the Valentinians share in the apostolic tradition
        and that the truth of their teaching is guaranteed by the words of
        the Savior. This letter is preserved by Epiphanius, Pan. haer.
        xxxiii. 3-7 . . . .


        He attributes the latter text again in _The Gnostic Bible_ on pg. 300:

        Ptolemy's Letter to Flora survives in Greek as a quotation from a
        work by the heresiologist Epiphanius of Salamis in his Panarion
        (33.3–7); translated by Grant, _Gnosticism_, pp. 184–90; adapted by
        Willis Barnstone.

        Also included in this volume is *Herakleon's* Commentary on the
        Gospel of John (pg. 307).

        Gerry
      • Gerry
        ... A bookstore sounds like a reasonable answer. Gerry
        Message 3 of 13 , Jul 12 10:51 AM
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          --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "Darius C. Rohman"
          <simongnosticus@y...> wrote:
          > where did I find The Gnostic Bible?
          > please someone tell me!!!
          >



          "A bookstore" sounds like a reasonable answer.

          Gerry
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