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Sethians

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  • pmcvflag
    Hey all, hope the holiday season has been going well. We usually slow down in here quite a bit at this time of year, but there is a subject that I would like
    Message 1 of 4 , Dec 4, 2004
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      Hey all, hope the holiday season has been going well. We usually
      slow down in here quite a bit at this time of year, but there is a
      subject that I would like to bring up for the group.

      It seems to me that we almost never talk about Sethian Gnosticism in
      here. In some of my recent posts I have observed this leaning
      towards Valentinianism, not only here, but even in a lot of
      liturature on the topic. I would like to talk about the groups that
      are not so familiar to many people, namely Sethian forms of
      Gnosticism.

      A few specific issues I would like to bring up (but feel free to
      bring up your own questions comments and observations)....

      1) There is some debate as to whether Gnosticism is an outgrowth
      from Christianity with the Sethians being the farthest swing away
      (as A. Logan states), or whether Sethians are an original source and
      the Valentinians are more of an attempt to modify it towards
      Christianity (as B. Pearson outlines). Any comments?

      2) The Sethian cosmology is so destinct, and I can't think of any
      real direct statements of "This is allegory" the way we see in a
      couple Valentinian texts... and there has been some debate as to
      whether this IS meant to be allegory or literal (or both). Thoughts?

      3) I have observed that while Valentinian thought seems the most
      popular overall, there is a move by some modern groups that appeal
      very much to the counterculture to take the "Sethian" outline as a
      social rebelion, or an attack on "xians". Do you think this is an
      accurate usage?

      PMCV
    • janahooks
      ... in ... Could you suggest some reading in addition to the NH? I can find loads of Valentinian stuff, but I want a clearer grasp of Sethianism if I m going
      Message 2 of 4 , Dec 5, 2004
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        --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, pmcvflag <no_reply@y...> wrote:
        > It seems to me that we almost never talk about Sethian Gnosticism
        in
        > here. In some of my recent posts I have observed this leaning
        > towards Valentinianism, not only here, but even in a lot of
        > liturature on the topic. I would like to talk about the groups that
        > are not so familiar to many people, namely Sethian forms of
        > Gnosticism.

        Could you suggest some reading in addition to the NH? I can find
        loads of Valentinian stuff, but I want a clearer grasp of Sethianism
        if I'm going to have any hope of following this conversation! Hope
        you had a nice holiday as well. jana
      • mercyboxfan
        ... It s good to read your heady insights again. When I think about Seth and Sethian Gnosticism I think of just a derivation on Christian Gnosticism....Seth
        Message 3 of 4 , Dec 20, 2004
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          --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, pmcvflag <no_reply@y...> wrote:
          > Hi Karl,
          It's good to read your heady insights again. When I think about Seth
          and Sethian Gnosticism I think of just a derivation on Christian
          Gnosticism....Seth being substituted for Jesus. They were both (first
          century) baptism sects. Meaning that baptism was a way of bestowing
          or inviting gnosis for both beginning sects. They both believed that
          Seth and Jesus were embued with grace,christ,logos...whatever at the
          time of baptism. So much alike are they that you wonder how much of
          the Jesus mythos was taken from the already Sethian work in progress.
          This said...I really don't feel I know enough to make helpful
          comments. But here is a question....Some say the Sophian mythos
          started with Sethian Gnosticism...do you know what gospel, or what
          writing, this connection comes from?
          Sorry that I don't know enough to banter better...lol.

          Thanks
          Anne Marie


          > Hey all, hope the holiday season has been going well. We usually
          > slow down in here quite a bit at this time of year, but there is a
          > subject that I would like to bring up for the group.
          >
          > It seems to me that we almost never talk about Sethian Gnosticism
          in
          > here. In some of my recent posts I have observed this leaning
          > towards Valentinianism, not only here, but even in a lot of
          > liturature on the topic. I would like to talk about the groups that
          > are not so familiar to many people, namely Sethian forms of
          > Gnosticism.
          >
          > A few specific issues I would like to bring up (but feel free to
          > bring up your own questions comments and observations)....
          >
          > 1) There is some debate as to whether Gnosticism is an outgrowth
          > from Christianity with the Sethians being the farthest swing away
          > (as A. Logan states), or whether Sethians are an original source
          and
          > the Valentinians are more of an attempt to modify it towards
          > Christianity (as B. Pearson outlines). Any comments?
          >
          > 2) The Sethian cosmology is so destinct, and I can't think of any
          > real direct statements of "This is allegory" the way we see in a
          > couple Valentinian texts... and there has been some debate as to
          > whether this IS meant to be allegory or literal (or both). Thoughts?
          >
          > 3) I have observed that while Valentinian thought seems the most
          > popular overall, there is a move by some modern groups that appeal
          > very much to the counterculture to take the "Sethian" outline as a
          > social rebelion, or an attack on "xians". Do you think this is an
          > accurate usage?
          >
          > PMCV
        • hermetic_star
          Hmm, it s the lady who dropped off the face of the Earth. Nice to hear from you again too... :)
          Message 4 of 4 , Jan 15, 2005
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            Hmm, it's the lady who dropped off the face of the Earth. Nice to hear
            from you again too... :)

            --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "mercyboxfan" <mercyboxfan@y...>
            wrote:
            >
            >
            > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, pmcvflag <no_reply@y...> wrote:
            > > Hi Karl,
            > It's good to read your heady insights again. When I think about Seth
            > and Sethian Gnosticism I think of just a derivation on Christian
            > Gnosticism....Seth being substituted for Jesus. They were both (first
            > century) baptism sects. Meaning that baptism was a way of bestowing
            > or inviting gnosis for both beginning sects. They both believed that
            > Seth and Jesus were embued with grace,christ,logos...whatever at the
            > time of baptism. So much alike are they that you wonder how much of
            > the Jesus mythos was taken from the already Sethian work in progress.
            > This said...I really don't feel I know enough to make helpful
            > comments. But here is a question....Some say the Sophian mythos
            > started with Sethian Gnosticism...do you know what gospel, or what
            > writing, this connection comes from?
            > Sorry that I don't know enough to banter better...lol.
            >
            > Thanks
            > Anne Marie
            >
            >
            > > Hey all, hope the holiday season has been going well. We usually
            > > slow down in here quite a bit at this time of year, but there is a
            > > subject that I would like to bring up for the group.
            > >
            > > It seems to me that we almost never talk about Sethian Gnosticism
            > in
            > > here. In some of my recent posts I have observed this leaning
            > > towards Valentinianism, not only here, but even in a lot of
            > > liturature on the topic. I would like to talk about the groups that
            > > are not so familiar to many people, namely Sethian forms of
            > > Gnosticism.
            > >
            > > A few specific issues I would like to bring up (but feel free to
            > > bring up your own questions comments and observations)....
            > >
            > > 1) There is some debate as to whether Gnosticism is an outgrowth
            > > from Christianity with the Sethians being the farthest swing away
            > > (as A. Logan states), or whether Sethians are an original source
            > and
            > > the Valentinians are more of an attempt to modify it towards
            > > Christianity (as B. Pearson outlines). Any comments?
            > >
            > > 2) The Sethian cosmology is so destinct, and I can't think of any
            > > real direct statements of "This is allegory" the way we see in a
            > > couple Valentinian texts... and there has been some debate as to
            > > whether this IS meant to be allegory or literal (or both). Thoughts?
            > >
            > > 3) I have observed that while Valentinian thought seems the most
            > > popular overall, there is a move by some modern groups that appeal
            > > very much to the counterculture to take the "Sethian" outline as a
            > > social rebelion, or an attack on "xians". Do you think this is an
            > > accurate usage?
            > >
            > > PMCV
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