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12469Re: It's in our DNA

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  • eagleeyedwildwoman
    Jun 11, 2006
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      Darkchylde, I Never said certin Christians were wrong in my first
      post on this line. I was expressing a point of view that we all have
      God in our DNA and that having the blood line of Jesus was, again in
      my opinion, of no consequence nor should it be. Also, I want to
      stress that the quest for Gnosis should be an individual matter with
      teachers along the way; but ultimately between you and God. If you
      read what I wrote this is it, so why the discussion about that I
      said someone was wrong? Unless we are continuing an argument from
      another group? Also consider dear Gnostics, that just because some
      in a certain Royal line in Europe claim heredity to Jesus does not
      make it so. It's a claim made by wealthy people that helps justify
      their leadership, also something to consider. I really don't want to
      be jumped all over when I try to make a point so please really
      consider what I write and don't read other things into it and I will
      try to do the same for you.

      Quietly, Aleada



      Hi I'm new here
      Looks like I'm come across an intelligent group of thinkers. I know
      I'm going to be a bit behind the times with this comment but perhaps
      I have something different to say on the subject so, here goes: I
      finally saw The Da Vinci Code at the movies Wednesday night. I will
      not give a movie review. I did not read the book. I do like that
      this movie and book get people interested in the alternative
      scriptures and therefore Gnostic thinking. But the idea of this
      woman descendant of Mary Magdalene and Jesus being the Holy Grail
      becomes a road block to Gnosis which is a direct knowledge of God.
      It is also a problem in the Omen which I know is pure fun but
      unfortunately is what many people believe, that is the idea of the
      big characters playing these big roles while we sit back a watch.
      Many people do not realize they are the Hero of their own story and
      have a direct connection to God or the Great Spirit. Our path is to
      realize that connection and have direct experience of this.
      Realization with direct experience of the Divine is Enlightenment or
      Gnosis and it may be so individual that it is experienced or related
      differently for each of us. Gnosis is an on going process, it is the
      road traveled ever onward. Leader or teacher come into our life and
      will help us on our way but it is we who decides and we who exert
      the effort, I mean to say don't rely on the way showers, it is your
      journey and all you really need is you. The blood line of Jesus was
      said to be part of the royal family of the Hapsburgs, who's line
      runs through most of the royal houses of Europe, this is another
      form of Hierarchy which is anti Gnostic thinking. I see little
      evidence of Jesus in the royal lines. I see more evidence among the
      rich about power, selfishness, and oppression. I see evidence of
      his teachings among those who relinquish power in favor of helping
      humanity. Sacred words from my own countries constitution say, All
      men are created equal and endowed by the Creator with unalienable
      rights of Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness. I believe
      Eve, our original Earth Mother chose Gnosis over obedience and
      opened the door for Men to become Gods which was the Creators test
      of our capacity to make our own way. We too become Gods and create
      our own Universes as Great Spirit wills it so, ever onward. Yes
      Barbara I too have visions and as the veil gets thinner it seems
      more of us are doing so. Some of the visions I have had are not all
      light and gold some are about being stripped naked of all beliefs
      and ego, some were harsh from where I have sat but I am thankful for
      all revelation which aids my souls growth. I am working each day to
      simplify my soul and be open to the purest gold the soul has to
      offer, Gnosis.

      In Peace,
      Your Sister,
      Aleada Barbara Aine
      --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, pmcvflag <no_reply@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hey Darkchylde
      >
      > >>>When I am working with a horse I know the horse technically
      > doesn't do wrong- he (or she) is acting on instinct and impulse
      and
      > I inadvertantly triggered a response that is detrimental to the
      > training process. WHereas the horse would not be considered wrong,
      > I, as the human, being more enlightened and I AM
      > the one bothering him in the first place (they don't come in my
      > living room and run me off the couch on a whim to go for a run)I
      can
      > be wrong in that I would give into frustration and anger and
      > aggression and abuse an animal that wouldn't be doing anything but
      > grazing if it wasn't for me anyway.<<<
      >
      > I like that picture you paint. It allows for openness towards
      > other's beliefs without stating that we must throw out critical
      > perspective in the mix.
      >
      > >>>So much to reply to. I do not see it as an attack (although it
      > seems my opinion might have been taken as one.)<<<
      >
      > Don't worry, Darkchylde, most of us in this group actually respect
      > and enjoy a little bit of a friendly challenge ;) . Honestly, you
      > don't need to apologize. We test ideas and debate as friends here.
      > Not everyone is able to do that, and when they find this to be a
      > threat they write us off as "silly academics". You are welcome to
      > question my ideas, but expect me to question in return. Keep in
      mind
      > that this should always be brought back to the subject at hand....
      > not just our personal views (that rule applies to me as well).
      >
      > >>>As a gnostic I avoid anything that smacks of domination, and I
      > believe the only absolute truth is that we are all in this
      > together.<<<
      >
      > Very understandable, though I would question whether it is
      > indicative of being a Gnostic. Of course, the Gnostic was a rebel
      > against temporal authority, Yaldebaoth and maybe even the Roman
      > occupation, but on the other hand the Gnostic also believed in a
      > rightful cosmic order. Personally, I probably still have some of
      > that punk rock anarchism in me from my youth, but it would not be
      > right of me to foist that on to historical Gnostic thinking.
      >
      > >>>Have a problem with dissention? Quite the contrary, my point is
      > that we cannot judge anothers beliefs to be wrong. That hardly
      > sounds like there is no room for dissention. And I do believe(this
      > doesn't make it truth, albeit MY truth) that enlightment will not
      > come if there is not a tolerance for ALL beliefs and faiths.<<<
      >
      > I can certainly sympathize, but I am not so sure the Gnostics
      would.
      > Think about it another way, Yaldebaoth can be seen as an allegory
      > for the those very religions you say we should respect (and I
      > generally feel ambivalent for). In fact, that is actually partly
      > what his function is. It becomes very clear in the Gospel of Judas
      > that the Demiurge is intended as an attack on religious faith.
      This
      > is not what we can call tolerance of all beliefs and faiths, but
      > just the opposite... it is a rejection of blind faith and poorly
      > thought beliefs.
      >
      > Now, I am not saying the Gnostics must be right about this. Once
      > again, that is for people figure out on their own. What I AM
      saying
      > is that no one can say that the Gnostics were particularly
      > relativist.
      >
      > >>>I can only speak from my person experience, but I have searched
      > many faiths, and even put my name to a few of them, and my present
      > evolution has led me to gnostism.<<<
      >
      > I'm sure nearly everyone here can sympathise with the growth
      process.
      >
      > >>>And I might point out gnosis means knowledge, and that can take
      > many forms and have many names but you will know it to
      > be the truth when you FEEL it, as I do.<<<
      >
      > Well, actually that isn't really an accurate meaning for the
      > word "Gnosis" as the Gnostics used it. This is a subject this
      forum
      > does tend to revisit pretty often.
      >
      > >>>Christ never told anyone they were wrong, yet he imparted a
      > belief that I believe brought people around because of that
      fact.<<<
      >
      > I guess that depends on who's version we are reading. ;) In the
      > Bible the "Christ" is quite direct in calling people hypocrites,
      > etc.. However, we don't have to take the Bible seriously here if
      we
      > don't want. There is no assumption of scriptural validity here.
      >
      > >>>Perhaps you miss the point with so much polartization and
      > judgement on what is "wrong" and what is "right". I do not even
      > believe that you are wrong for casting judgement.<<<
      >
      > I didn't cast any judgement, Darkchylde. I am simply trying to
      > present a historically acurate understanding of the Gnostic belief
      > system so people can think and talk about about them in an
      informed
      > way. Please don't assume that I am some kind of missionary for
      that
      > position.
      >
      > >>>But I will remind that to dominate, to make oneslef superior
      for
      > what is believed or not is the very urges I seek to eliminate on
      my
      > effort to expand the Christ consciouness within me.<<<
      >
      > No one is trying to dominate here, Darkchylde. This forum deals
      with
      > historical forms of Gnosticism, and all we want to do is make sure
      > that it is understood.... not agreed with.
      >
      > >>>>I was unaware that Gnosis meant "right" anything. I was under
      the
      > impression it meant knowledge and didn't make such constrictive and
      > human confines on ideas that extend beyond the physical realm.<<<
      >
      > Like I mentioned above, we do try to stick with the historical
      > Gnostic meaning of the word "Gnosis" in this group.... for the
      sake
      > of communication. I think you will find that Gnostic ideas were
      very
      > open in many ways that many people find very interesting today,
      but
      > maybe not in the ways that many would LIKE them to be open.
      >
      > >>>Uncritical acceptance is not what I have for the traditions of
      > others, but rather a healthy respect and the true spirit of
      > compassion and acceptance for anyone - which cannot exist in my
      heart
      > while I harbor judgemnt and critism.<<<<
      >
      > Respect and tolerence is not the same as agreement. Glad you
      pointed
      > that out.
      >
      > >>>And to think that I excuse all behavior because I refuse to
      think
      > another is wrong shows you have made judgments on my
      rationallizing
      > that are incomplete, as you do not know me very well.<<<
      >
      > Hmmmmm, maybe you are right. However, on what grounds do you NOT
      > excuse a behavior? How can you say something is not ok if you
      can't
      > say it is wrong? What is the arbitrary difference you assign?
      >
      > >>>If as a gnostic I seek to elimiate cosmic ignorance then I
      would
      > do well to steer away from judgements or condemnations. My heart,
      > which I have learned to listen to, tells me that my head is
      right.<<<
      >
      > You needn't defend your heart here (the head may be something a
      bit
      > more testable), thit is your own. Honestly, it simply isn't the
      > point of this forum. What we are talking about is Gnosticism.
      >
      > >>>I do find it much more interesting with different points of
      view.
      > After all, aren't we just individual flames of a larger fire?<<<
      >
      > I find various views interesting as well. After all, without the
      > challenge I would not have been able to test my own views.
      Sometimes
      > I have been wrong (yes, I can say "wrong"), but I think the trick
      > has been to accept that with humility rather than saying nobody
      can
      > be wrong therefore I must be right (Thanks Mike.... I think *lol*).
      >
      > PMCV
      >
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