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12371Re: The Yezidis

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  • Will
    May 1, 2006
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      Ah comon man, where have you been studying? JoS? the color blue? The
      Yezidi say Melek Taus (btw, Melek does not mean black, it means king)
      is the demiurge, but as for Lucifer...they only say that he is Azazel,
      or Shaitan. So yes, the surrounding evironment labels them devil
      worshippers, but Lucifer is a rather elusive term... not very easily
      used here. But Yezidi as Gnostic? That's pretty silly to me. If
      anything, neo-gnostic... but even then, it doesn't really fit. Even
      though they see Melek Taus as the Demiurge, that doesn't mean
      anything. Jews and Christians believe YHWH is the demiurge, but that
      doesn't make them Gnostic. It would help your case a little if this
      demiurge was keepin the man down, especially for something Sethian,
      but that isn't the case... and even then, it would totally wipe out
      your arguement.

      As for them holding faith over knowledge, that simply can't be true.
      Think about what faith is: Even though everyone around them is against
      them, they are still faithful to Melek Taus. All the religions have
      their knowledge, but it's different with their faith. For example,
      it's hard to go to war and fight, but people look up to someone who
      fights to protect their country(I mean, pre-Iraq deal), and it can
      keep you going. But what if as a man, you dress up as a woman and walk
      around town? Everyone automatically turns against you. How much
      strength would you have then? Everyone around the Yezidi antagonizes
      them. So as you can see, faith is an integral part of Yezidi culture.
      Even more so than their "knowledge".


      --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, "icybrethovhecate"
      <icybrethovhecate@...> wrote:
      > Melek Taus is definetly Lucifer, I don't know what your talking
      > about. His name is Melek Taus(black peacock) because he is "as proud
      > as a peacock" and he's a sun-god(a peacock with spreaded tail
      > feathers is a symbol of the sun). His secret name is Shaitan(Satan)
      > which the Yezidis are forbidden to speak. His color is blue, as
      > Lucifer's color. And like Lucifer, he is fallen and has an evil
      > aspect(remember, he is fir as light and fire as burn). Read more on
      > Yezidism before you make claims. And yes, the Yezidis are Gnostic,
      > they believe that Lucifer(Melek Taus) is the Demiurge, and they value
      > knowledge rather than faith as the means of salvation(remember, it is
      > Lucifer who told Adam and Eve to eat from The Tree of Knowledge).
      > Theyn also honor Jesus. And the Mandeans are included in my Gnostic
      > Bible, so their Gnostic as well. Personally, I am a Luciferian and I
      > like the Yezidis even if I don't agree with all their beliefs.
      > http://n.webring.com/hub?ring=luciferiangnosis,
      > http://home.earthlink.net/~xristos/GoldenDawn/yezidi01.htm,
      > http://www.sacred-texts.com/asia/sby/,
      > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/The_Church_of_the_Peacock_Angel/,
      > http://www.churchofsatan.org/peacock.html
      > --- In gnosticism2@yahoogroups.com, pmcvflag <no_reply@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Hey Mer248lina
      > >
      > > >>>I would welcome a lengthier response please to the highlighted
      > > line. Could you please elucidate why neither the mandaeans nor the
      > > Yezidis are 'technically' gnostic groups.<<<
      > >
      > > Well, perhaps it is easier to raise the question of what exactly
      > > would make them "Gnostic" in the more technical sense. I know that
      > > right now it is a vogue to talk about everything esoteric
      > > as "Gnostic", and any kind of lesser known middle eastern religion
      > > gets thrown in, and anything mystical as well.
      > >
      > > I am not trying to be a "focus fascist" here *lol*, I think some of
      > > these groups certainly have enough in common to make them of
      > interest
      > > here. For instance, even though the Sufis are not technically
      > > Gnostics, the conversation about them certainly was of interest
      > here.
      > > Instead I am trying to keep the issue of categorization in the
      > > conversation here so that people do understand that this forum is
      > > much more specific than the other two hundred or so Yahoo groups on
      > > Gnosticism.
      > >
      > > A number of recent scholarly works, including "Rethinking
      > Gnosticism"
      > > by Williams, and "What is Gnosticism?" by King have raised
      > important
      > > issues with just what the historical category of "Gnosticism"
      > > technically is. Many groups that used to be lumped into the
      > category,
      > > such as Manichaeans, Mandaeans, Marcionites and Cathars don't
      > > actually fit.
      > >
      > > The Mandaeans were thrown in the category of "Gnosticism" initially
      > > by E. Drower, who said she did so based on the influence of a
      > friend.
      > > She stated that at the time she didn't know much about Gnosticism
      > > (her specialty was the Mid East, not Gnosticism), and after more
      > > study she realized that this categorization was false. Much of the
      > > categorization was based on the name "Mandaean", which was actually
      > > not even a name these people used for themselves. There was also a
      > > bit of a hasty generalization of thier soteriology that turned out
      > to
      > > not be completely accurate. The initial categorization was then
      > > repeated by people like Robinson who specialized in Gnosticism, but
      > > not necessarily clear on the Mandaean belief system.
      > >
      > > I have heard that as they have been in diaspora, many of the
      > Mandaean
      > > youth have taken up the "Gnostic" label and have actually become
      > > closer to Gnostic thinking by mixing the religions a little.
      > >
      > > Initially though, Mandaeans are not Platonists, and they don't
      > > believe that "Gnosis" is salvation (a critical attribute for
      > > something to be "Gnostic"). In the absence of such a defining
      > > attribute, the question would be why would we categorize them
      > > as "Gnostic" at all? The answer is that now scholars of this
      > subject
      > > generally don't.
      > >
      > > Yezidis were never categorized as "Gnostic" in the first place. Why
      > > would they be?
      > >
      > > PMCV
      > >
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