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Re: Lies Lies

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  • burning_ut
    ... Why do you think that? I would say that there have been very few characters I can think of who haven t at least made lies of omission if not lies of
    Message 1 of 45 , Nov 1, 2006
      "elan_paragon" <elan_paragon@...> wrote:
      > Nah. That's too mindless. Things may be more convoluted than
      > we know, but I don't believe anyone in the whole series lies.

      Why do you think that? I would say that there have been very few
      characters I can think of who haven't at least made lies of omission
      if not lies of comission. And that's not that surprising. Everyone
      in the real world lies. Everyone. That doesn't mean that everyone
      is evil, or rotten. It just means that everyone at some point will
      have what they feel to be a good reason to deliberately conceal at
      least part of the truth. Why should the characters here be
      different?

      As for Tarvek, he strikes me as the character that it is easiest to
      say that he lies. He's a good (as in skillful) liar; he puts in the
      maximum amount of truth to whatever he says. But if he presents
      himself to both Agatha and Lucrezias as an ally, he has to be lying
      to at least one of them.

      As for the specific case, I don't understand why it is so
      implausible that Tarvek is lying about being the one to monkey with
      the recording. Lucregatha and Vrin both had no knowledge of the
      recording, based on their reactions. Lunevka has been put forward
      as a suspect, but she didn't have a body that long to do the work
      herself. Tarvek quite definitely knew about the message and had
      better oppurtunity to actually do the editing, so he's quite
      plausible as a suspect. If he did do it, his motivations for lying
      about it now are pretty clear. He doesn't need to be twisty for
      that lie; he just needs a strong sense of self-preservation.
    • rja_carnegie
      ... I don t think anyone wants that but she did last time. But readers were surprised when Agatha s message got played. It would be about right for the
      Message 45 of 45 , Nov 8, 2006
        "elan_paragon" <elan_paragon@...> wrote:
        > So, to bring this thread back to our heroes -- will
        > Agatha actually loose her conciousness to Lu like
        > a lightswitch?

        I don't think anyone wants that but she did last time.
        But readers were surprised when Agatha's message got
        played. It would be about right for the destruction
        of the machine to be another surprise, in its
        consequences, such as nothing at all.

        One other way for it to go:

        AGATHA (in person): People of Sturmhalten, listen to me -

        (The BOMB explodes and destroys the MACHINE. And, WOW,
        the HETERODYNES really do SIGN everything they BUILD.)

        AGATHA: Uh-oh.

        AGATHA: Everybody, quick - SING!

        AGATHA: "I'm Agatha Heterodyne,
        I'm Agatha Heterodyne,
        I got much more reckless
        Since I lost my necklace -
        I'm Agatha Heterodyne!"

        THE PEOPLE OF STURMHALTEN: "She's Agatha Heterodyne", etc.

        AGATHA: Phew, that was close!

        TARVEK: I'm just glad (ow!) Kaja didn't go with the
        "Crash Test Dummies" thing after all.

        AGATHA: Mmmm?

        ----

        Another way is for Klaus to arrive having Figured It Out,
        and to signal the fleet to go all "Close Encounters at
        the end" on the town. Possibly with Gil's orchestra
        converted. Or just put parachutes on the clank musicians
        and drop 'em overboard.

        > After Tarvek didn't get away, I thought it
        > would be Klaus who'd be turning off the thing,
        > not Bang.

        After the Evil Message started, I was expecting someone
        to wind up either missing-presumed-dead, or actually dead,
        after going in to shut the thing down /when/ it was bombed.
        I was steeling myself for a noble sacrifice on the part
        of Tarvek (or, by now, any remaining parts not already
        sacrificed), or else a way for Agatha to disappear again
        - cured, touch wood - to disappear from Wulfenbach attention.

        Though they know she has been exposed to Othar Trygvassen.
        Escapes are infectious, probably.

        ...Also, she was DEAD and they got the BODY and she's
        STILL back. She is Cartoon Girl. You have to look closely
        to make sure she isn't Bugs Bunny cross-dressing again.

        Yours dreading Tarvek lying back clasping a Tex Avery sign
        saying "Sad Ending Ain't It!")
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