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RE: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

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  • Jim M.
    Is Green County defunct? If so, I may have mixed it up with Dobbs, but doubt it. Twenty years ago in State archives Raleigh, the archivist was attempting
    Message 1 of 20 , Jul 14, 2009
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      Is Green County defunct? If so, I may have mixed it up with Dobbs, but doubt it. Twenty years ago in State archives Raleigh, the archivist was attempting reconstitute records for Dobbs Co. My Lt. Arthur Forbes, Sr. (believed in education, we both share that value still) was on the Pitt Co. Comm. of Secrecy, Intelligence and Observation (Jim Wooten, ex-Cold War head of FBI counter intelligence is also a descendant. That's mom's side, on dad's side I desc. 2nd Maj. James Smith, Sr., of the Rowan Com. of Secrecy, Intelligence and Observation. I was talking with a retired CIA fella' and book writer who know all about Committees of Safety, but was amazed he'd never hear of the CofSIO sub-committees in many counties. There were also committees of correspondence: communications. Anyway, I'd never connected Forbes with Dobbs County--but there it was. It was the ya or nay votes of the perhaps thirty men (no women's names) allowed to vote on the acceptance of the US Constitution. There too, a tiny printed version of the Constitution. Anyway Patriot Forbes voted against the U.S. Constitution. Too radical Liberal a document I thought? That was in my right-wing ideology days--I was delighted. Today I do not cotton to the notion that "facts" should be acceptable or not, based on the facts acceptability to conforming to either right-wing or left-wing ideology. Rather ideologies, should conform to the facts.

      To: genpcncfir@yahoogroups.com
      From: amaryllish@...
      Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 13:30:16 -0400
      Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek


























      I love all this wonderful history. Please tell me your name. My Murphey

      family is Jack Murphey, married Winifred Unknown and lived in Greene County,

      NC. Their daughter Nancy Mary Murphey married my great grandfather Jacob

      Wainwright. Their son James Murphey married Jacob's sister Catherine

      Wainwright. No one knows anything about this Murphey family and I have not been able

      to trace them back anywhere. They were there the same time and same area

      that Thomas Murphey & family was (1810-1880), but everyone around here says

      they are not related. I don't know.... I've mostly been working on my

      Wainwright's and Turner's as well as Hunt's and Sizemore's (My husbands

      families). Again, Just wanted to say thank you for your excellenct information.

      Amy W. Hunt Ancestor Seekers of Farmville &

      Greene County Researchers, Inc.

      **************Summer concert season is here! Find your favorite artists on

      tour at TourTracker.com.

      (http://www.tourtracker.com/?ncid=emlcntusmusi00000006)



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    • Jim M.
      While don t know this for sure; this is my speculation. up to the 1850 s, where Shade Wooten lived, was called Johnson s Mills to the post office. Don t think
      Message 2 of 20 , Jul 14, 2009
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        While don't know this for sure; this is my speculation. up to the 1850's, where Shade Wooten lived, was called Johnson's Mills to the post office. Don't think of romantic visions of big watermills and dams, but of millstones only three or four feet across. Think of a long, narrow, not too deep canal (ditch) to/from the river from low areas to high ground. The Johnson's Mill's canal may have been dug by Blackledge? Thirty years ago in the basement of the Pitt register of deeds vault, I met a lawyer who ever heard me tell the register of deeds I wanted to look in a perhaps ten miles longs by one or two miles wide strip of Pitt Co. that remain in Craven Co. for a decade or two after Pitt was founded, and then added to Pitt. The lawyer said he did not know that. That he had attempted to settle a contemporary boundryline dispute based on historical legal records, but could not find the records in Pitt Co. I said because they were, and still are, in Craven. He'd settled it by mutual agreement. Every N.C. register of deeds vault should have a copy of N.C. state archives book, the legal histories (geographically) of the counties. That's where I learned it. If the Pitt vault does not have it; there's a project for the Pitt genealogy or historical society and perhaps a newspaper squib about the donation.

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogroups.com
        From: carolinaguyesq@...
        Date: Tue, 14 Jul 2009 13:01:02 -0700
        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek


























        im going to try to send you a link to the google map. it's on the north side of the tar river in eastern pitt county very near to beaufort. i cross over grindle creek every day on the way to work.

        http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?address=3405%20Yankee%20Hall%20Road&city=Greenville&state=NC&zipcode=27834&country=US&cid=lfmaplink



        as you can see if you change the map to aerial, there is nothing there now as far as buildings go....where grindle meets the tar....and most of the land east of grindle up to grimesland bridge road is either old swamp or is man made lakes. if you are looking for moore's that settled on grindle you may be looking for the family that settle further up on grindle....on "old creek road" grindle is a very long body of water. thanks!

        --- On Tue, 7/14/09, cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@...> wrote:



        From: cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@...>

        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogroups.com

        Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:48 PM



        David, thanks ,,, please keep in mind that I am in Southern California ,,, although before this search is over I am positive I will know the creeks and rivers of NC better than I do those in Ca. Where would I find 'pactolus/yankee hall' ?? This is fun. It is also annoying ,, but in a fun way. Trust you fellow researchers know what I mean. all best,, cheryl o7o



        ____________ _________ _________ __

        From: DAVID SMITH <carolinaguyesq@ yahoo.com>

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com

        Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:27:30 PM

        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek



        grindle creek pours into the tar river near pactolus/yankee hall.



        --- On Mon, 7/13/09, cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@yahoo. com> wrote:



        From: cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@yahoo. com>

        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com

        Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 6:34 PM



        Faye, When you say you were "surprised at how far down the line came into NC..." did you mean the boundary change between Va and Nc? Thanks for the tip on latitude and longitude. From what I read the1728 survey was along the VA/NC border and 15 miles due north and south became NC. We're trying to get a handle on that so we know whether we need to start to also look back into VA records.



        I appreciate all the comments from everyone. best, cheryl rhoden o7o



        ____________ _________ _________ __

        From: jonefa <jonefa@embarqmail. com>

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com

        Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 3:14:23 PM

        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek



        You can do a search and find the lattitude and longitude of the earliest boundaries of the land granted to the early proprietors of the colonial lands. I have seen it, probably have it tucked away somewhere, but you can find it by googling it.

        I was surpised by how far down the line came into North Carolina and present day cities. Been quite a while since I looked at it so won't make comments on it.

        Faye Hays

        ----- Original Message -----

        From: cheryl rhoden

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com

        Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 4:43 PM

        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek



        Trish and Julian ,, Thank you both. I also found a great reference today called: "Sketches of Pitt County" by Henry T. King. It has a good number of old maps (maps you can actually read) and wonderful info about early Pitt Co.



        Trish: Why do you think that sections of Pitt were not part of VA before the survey in 1728? The old maps I found today preceeded and followed that survey ,, so heck if I know exactly and they didn't have 'scale' ,, so you can't really figure out without doing overlays of the old and the new. It does seem like that section may have been in early Albemarle County??? And Pitt was formed mostly from Beaufort Co. (And, I still love the reference to the "Great Dismal Swamp." ) Thank you both again for these tips. best, cheryl rhoden o7o



        ____________ _________ _________ __

        From: Trish Worthington Cobb <turniproots@ mac.com>

        To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com

        Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:43:12 AM

        Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek



        Cheryl,



        Grindle Creek rises in n.e. Pitt County and flows s.e. into the Tar

        River on the north side of the river east of Greenville between

        Simpson and

        Grimesland.



        Sometimes spelled Grindal or Grindool on old maps and deeds.



        Here is a link to a map that shows it very clearly.



        http://www.ncfloodm aps.com/pubdocs/ Tar-Pamlico/ Pitt_Comm_ Rec.pdf



        Pitt County was never part of the Colony of Virginia.

        Pitt County was formed from a part of Beaufort County, NC in 1760.



        Two useful reference books that I would not be without are:



        The North Carolina Gazetteer by William S. Powell



        and



        The Formation of the North Carolina Counties by David Leroy Corbitt.



        Also, if you can find one, DeLorme's North Carolina Gazetteer has very

        detailed maps with the waterways and poquosins on them.



        Trish Worthington Cobb



        On Jul 13, 2009, at 12:44 PM, cheryl rhoden wrote:

        >

        > Good morning, I'm trying to figure out the location of the Tar River

        > and Grindal's Creek. I can find both on Internet maps but I can't

        > figure out where they may intersect. Any clues would be appreciated.

        > And, I'd love to figure out if that location was in Va prior to the

        > 1728 survey that changed the state boundary lines.

        >

        > We're still trying to sort out our John and Moses Moores. Thanks,

        > Cheryl Rhoden

        >

        > Researching: Moore/Rhoden/ Raulerson/ Johns/Music/ Dowling/Altman/

        > Davis/Chancy and more.

        >



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      • cheryl rhoden
        Daviid  ,, Thank you!! This was a great link. I cannot believe that it still looks like nothing is there. I tried to zoom in and I still didn t see a house or
        Message 3 of 20 , Jul 14, 2009
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          Daviid  ,, Thank you!! This was a great link. I cannot believe that it still looks like nothing is there. I tried to zoom in and I still didn't see a house or any outbuildings. Why is that?

          The deed info we have is on the North side of the Tar River and  Grindle's Creek. Course ,, we have a lot of other deed info for Moores and we're trying to sort that out.

          And, what really amazes me is that the various properties other ancestors lived on in GA/FL are still just as rural as they likely were all those years ago. And, half or more of us in our cousin research group also live in very rural areas. Must be in the blood. Thanks again for that link. All best,
          Cheryl Rhoden o7o




          ________________________________
          From: DAVID SMITH <carolinaguyesq@...>
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 1:01:02 PM
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek





          im going to try to send you a link to the google map.  it's on the north side of the tar river in eastern pitt  county very near to beaufort.  i cross over grindle creek every day on the way to work.  
          http://www.mapquest .com/maps/ map.adp?address= 3405%20Yankee% 20Hall%20Road& city=Greenville& state=NC& zipcode=27834& country=US& cid=lfmaplink
           
          as you can see if you change the map to aerial, there is nothing there now as far as buildings go....where grindle meets the tar....and most of the land east of grindle up to grimesland bridge road is either old swamp or is man made lakes.    if you are looking for moore's that settled on grindle you may be looking for the family that settle further up on grindle....on "old creek road"  grindle is a very long body of water.  thanks!
          --- On Tue, 7/14/09, cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@yahoo. com> wrote:

          From: cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@yahoo. com>
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com
          Date: Tuesday, July 14, 2009, 3:48 PM

          David, thanks ,,, please keep in mind that I am in Southern California ,,, although before this search is over I am positive I will know the creeks and rivers of NC better than I do those in Ca. Where would I find 'pactolus/yankee hall' ?? This is fun. It is also annoying ,, but in a fun way. Trust you fellow researchers know what I mean. all best,, cheryl o7o

          ____________ _________ _________ __
          From: DAVID SMITH <carolinaguyesq@ yahoo.com>
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com
          Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:27:30 PM
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

          grindle creek pours into the tar river near pactolus/yankee hall. 

          --- On Mon, 7/13/09, cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@yahoo. com> wrote:

          From: cheryl rhoden <rhodenccc@yahoo. com>
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com
          Date: Monday, July 13, 2009, 6:34 PM

          Faye, When you say you were "surprised at how far down the line came into NC..." did you mean the boundary change between Va and Nc?  Thanks for the tip on latitude and longitude. From what I read the1728 survey was along the VA/NC border and 15 miles due north and south became NC. We're trying to get a handle on that so we know whether we need to start to also look back into VA records.

          I appreciate all the comments from everyone. best, cheryl rhoden o7o

          ____________ _________ _________ __
          From: jonefa <jonefa@embarqmail. com>
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com
          Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 3:14:23 PM
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

          You can do a search and find the lattitude and longitude of the earliest boundaries of the land granted to the early proprietors of the colonial lands. I have seen it, probably have it tucked away somewhere, but you can find it by googling it.
          I was surpised by how far down the line came into North Carolina and present day cities. Been quite a while since I looked at it so won't make comments on it.
          Faye Hays
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: cheryl rhoden
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com
          Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 4:43 PM
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

          Trish and Julian ,, Thank you both. I also found a great reference today called: "Sketches of Pitt County" by Henry T. King. It has a good number of old maps (maps you can actually read) and wonderful info about early Pitt Co.

          Trish: Why do you think that sections of Pitt were not part of VA before the survey in 1728? The old maps I found today preceeded and followed that survey ,, so heck if I know exactly and they didn't have 'scale' ,, so you can't really figure out without doing overlays of the old and the new. It does seem like that section may have been in early Albemarle County??? And Pitt was formed mostly from Beaufort Co. (And, I still love the reference to the "Great Dismal Swamp." ) Thank you both again for these tips. best, cheryl rhoden o7o

          ____________ _________ _________ __
          From: Trish Worthington Cobb <turniproots@ mac.com>
          To: genpcncfir@yahoogro ups.com
          Sent: Monday, July 13, 2009 11:43:12 AM
          Subject: Re: [genpcncfir] Tar River and Grindal's Creek

          Cheryl,

          Grindle Creek rises in n.e. Pitt County and flows s.e. into the Tar
          River on the north side of the river east of Greenville between
          Simpson and
          Grimesland.

          Sometimes spelled Grindal or Grindool on old maps and deeds.

          Here is a link to a map that shows it very clearly.

          http://www.ncfloodm aps.com/pubdocs/ Tar-Pamlico/ Pitt_Comm_ Rec.pdf

          Pitt County was never part of the Colony of Virginia.
          Pitt County was formed from a part of Beaufort County, NC in 1760.

          Two useful reference books that I would not be without are:

          The North Carolina Gazetteer by William S. Powell

          and

          The Formation of the North Carolina Counties by David Leroy Corbitt.

          Also, if you can find one, DeLorme's North Carolina Gazetteer has very
          detailed maps with the waterways and poquosins on them.

          Trish Worthington Cobb

          On Jul 13, 2009, at 12:44 PM, cheryl rhoden wrote:
          >
          > Good morning, I'm trying to figure out the location of the Tar River
          > and Grindal's Creek. I can find both on Internet maps but I can't
          > figure out where they may intersect. Any clues would be appreciated.
          > And, I'd love to figure out if that location was in Va prior to the
          > 1728 survey that changed the state boundary lines.
          >
          > We're still trying to sort out our John and Moses Moores. Thanks,
          > Cheryl Rhoden
          >
          > Researching: Moore/Rhoden/ Raulerson/ Johns/Music/ Dowling/Altman/
          > Davis/Chancy and more.
          >

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        • rhodenccc
          Jim, I was searching the Pitt Deed Notes today and found references to William Murphy. I hope this link works:
          Message 4 of 20 , Jul 18, 2009
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            Jim,

            I was searching the Pitt Deed Notes today and found references to William Murphy.

            I hope this link works:

            www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ncpcfr/pittdeednotes.htm

            Scroll to entry # 150 and entry # 497. There are also a good number of references to the Blounts. best, cheryl o7o--- In genpcncfir@yahoogroups.com, Jim M. <focusoninfinity@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > A place I'd like to locate once in old, now defunct Dobbs Co., and
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