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Non-Paternal Event Brick Wall

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  • tinker_tree
    Hello. I am new here, happy to have found a group such as this. I have been researching my own family tree since 1983. A couple years back I had my husbands
    Message 1 of 6 , Feb 6, 2012
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      Hello. I am new here, happy to have found a group such as this. I have been researching my own family tree since 1983. A couple years back I had my husbands DNA tested and we were very surprised at the results. It seems that a Non-Paternal event occured in his family. He was raised as a TINKER but his DNA matches that of the FANCHER surname. We have narrowed down which branch but we have no clue which generation it occured in. We have his fathers birth certificate as well as his own and both of them are listed as TINKER. So we think it occured further back. We have been in contact with some of the Biological Family who have been willing to help however, they have no clue where it occured either. I would love to solve this mystery for my husband and our children and grandchildren. I know very little about DNA and how far back it could have been. They seem to think it was likely my husbands grandfather that was fathered by a FANCHER. I would appreciate any help if anyone here has been thru anything similar. There is no paper trail whatsoever and I cannot place any of the TINKER family in the same area of the FANCHER family at the same time period. I am stuck! Thanks for listening!
    • timothyfcampbell
      Who performed your DNA test? I m not sure if any company is any better than any other. I had my test done by Family Tree DNA. I paid a lot of money for a lot
      Message 2 of 6 , Feb 8, 2012
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        Who performed your DNA test? I'm not sure if any company is any better than any other.

        I had my test done by Family Tree DNA. I paid a lot of money for a lot of bunk! I too have a "Non-Paternal Event" in my genetic history. If you read all there is to read you will find that it doesn't necessarily mean that someone was adopted (in the sense we understand today) but that there may have been something as simple as a name change. For example; my name is CAMPBELL but according to Family Tree DNA I am related to STEWART: CAMPBELL is a name that was adopted and not all CAMPBELL's are genetically related.

        Then there is the issue of surnames changing with each generation (yes, along the male or Y line). For example, before the practice of passing along a common surname some cultures (e.g. Irish, Icelandic) created patronyms for surnames; therefore instead of being a CAMPBELL I could have been a MacDONALD (son of Donald).

        Then there is the issue of time before surnames. For example, the earliest CAMPBELL I can find married a STEWART; but they were 2nd cousins with a common ancestor called "Robert The Bruce". From what I've learned that before 1000AD there were no surnames.

        Then there is the issue of shear numbers and the genetic genealogy companies don't have enough samples or matches to come anywhere near being able to find adequate results. For example, Family Tree DNA gives me "probabilities" of a common ancestor with my matches, and the common number is 24 generations for a 100% match. Tracing back my pedigree, when I reach 20 generations (barring duplicates) there are over 1,000,000 people in my tree; most of whom not only begat me but many more people as well. All the DNA testers combined have only scratched the iceburg.

        Depending on who did the test you may be able to share your results elsewhere. Family Tree DNA has a link with Ysearch (and Mitosearch for your mtDNA results): one click and FTDNA created the profile and passed on my DNA results. You can also create a free profile with Genetree, upload your results and look for matches in their database.

        Unfortunately genetic genealogy is a "Caveat emptor": I paid for a test because they advertised that DNA could help to break down brick walls, but once I've paid the piper and got my results they simply say "DNA testing cannot replace paper trail research": I paid for the test because the paper trail ended and now I feel ripped off.

        Don't worry about your DNA results.


        --- In genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com, "tinker_tree" <tinker_tree@...> wrote:
        >
        > A couple years back I had my husbands DNA tested and we were very surprised at the results. It seems that a Non-Paternal event occured in his family. He was raised as a TINKER but his DNA matches that of the FANCHER surname.
        >
      • Sunny Shafer
        Thanks for making these points. I have been contemplating using the FTDNA site and while I am not wealthy I could do without some things to afford it. I know
        Message 3 of 6 , Feb 8, 2012
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          Thanks for making these points.
          I have been contemplating using the FTDNA site and while I am not wealthy I could do without some things to afford it.
          I know someone who used it and seems to always be posting new 'finds' etc. as a result of the DNA workups. Not specific
          individuals (unless from a well-known line, which we all have and can find online) but a certain 'people'/culture etc.
          It looks rather difficult to me to figure out but then I have focus problems from a accident years ago so maybe it's just me.
          Sunny

          IBSSG



          > To: genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com
          > From: timothyfcampbell@...
          > Date: Wed, 8 Feb 2012 14:59:59 +0000
          > Subject: [Genealogy Research Club] Re: Non-Paternal Event Brick Wall
          >
          > Who performed your DNA test? I'm not sure if any company is any better than any other.
          >
          > I had my test done by Family Tree DNA. I paid a lot of money for a lot of bunk! I too have a "Non-Paternal Event" in my genetic history. If you read all there is to read you will find that it doesn't necessarily mean that someone was adopted (in the sense we understand today) but that there may have been something as simple as a name change. For example; my name is CAMPBELL but according to Family Tree DNA I am related to STEWART: CAMPBELL is a name that was adopted and not all CAMPBELL's are genetically related.
          >
          > Then there is the issue of surnames changing with each generation (yes, along the male or Y line). For example, before the practice of passing along a common surname some cultures (e.g. Irish, Icelandic) created patronyms for surnames; therefore instead of being a CAMPBELL I could have been a MacDONALD (son of Donald).
          >
          > Then there is the issue of time before surnames. For example, the earliest CAMPBELL I can find married a STEWART; but they were 2nd cousins with a common ancestor called "Robert The Bruce". From what I've learned that before 1000AD there were no surnames.
          >
          > Then there is the issue of shear numbers and the genetic genealogy companies don't have enough samples or matches to come anywhere near being able to find adequate results. For example, Family Tree DNA gives me "probabilities" of a common ancestor with my matches, and the common number is 24 generations for a 100% match. Tracing back my pedigree, when I reach 20 generations (barring duplicates) there are over 1,000,000 people in my tree; most of whom not only begat me but many more people as well. All the DNA testers combined have only scratched the iceburg.
          >
          > Depending on who did the test you may be able to share your results elsewhere. Family Tree DNA has a link with Ysearch (and Mitosearch for your mtDNA results): one click and FTDNA created the profile and passed on my DNA results. You can also create a free profile with Genetree, upload your results and look for matches in their database.
          >
          > Unfortunately genetic genealogy is a "Caveat emptor": I paid for a test because they advertised that DNA could help to break down brick walls, but once I've paid the piper and got my results they simply say "DNA testing cannot replace paper trail research": I paid for the test because the paper trail ended and now I feel ripped off.
          >
          > Don't worry about your DNA results.
          >
          >
          > --- In genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com, "tinker_tree" <tinker_tree@...> wrote:
          > >
          > > A couple years back I had my husbands DNA tested and we were very surprised at the results. It seems that a Non-Paternal event occured in his family. He was raised as a TINKER but his DNA matches that of the FANCHER surname.
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Searching for your ancestry? You'll find great help at Ancestry.Com
          >
          > http://service.bfast.com/bfast/click?bfmid=5647408&siteid=18621718
          >
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Joy Weaver
          Don t assume that there s an issue of illegitimacyjust because the surname associated with the DNA is not the one you think it should be. First of all, the
          Message 4 of 6 , Feb 9, 2012
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            Don't assume that there's an issue of illegitimacyjust because the
            surname associated with the DNA is not the one you think it should be.
            First of all, the sampling in the DNA test database is very small
            compared to the entire world population. It's possible that there is a
            TINKER line that also matches, as well as other surname lines you
            haven't seen. It's also possible that a few generations back, there was
            an adoption by a TINKER family of a child born to a FANCHER couple. And
            it's possible that at the time people were required to take surnames in
            whatever country of origin two brothers took different surnames, in this
            case probably based on their occupations.

            Joy Weaver

            ------------------------ "We are traveling in the footsteps of those
            who've gone before..."
            USA (northeast): BURNSIDE, GREEN, HALLOCK, HEAD, MERRITT, MORRIS,
            PALMER, SELDEN, WEAVER/ CANADA (ON/QC): BROWN, CLARK, GRANT/
            ENGLAND(Ches./Lanc.): HUNT,WALL,BRADBURN POLAND (Krasnik & Zaklikow in
            Lublin): BLUMBERG, FOGIEL, ROSENEL,HAJLMAN,ZAJBURSKI/ BELARUS
            (Wisoke-Litovsk in Brest, Grodno): FEINBERG, VILNER, GREENBERG,
            PETRUSKITZ?\ PODRITSKI?, DEIBACH\DAIBOG


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Nelda Eads
            My husbands test was done by Family Tree DNA and it offers the same as yours he did have one 36/37 match. It seems that NPE is common in the Fancher line
            Message 5 of 6 , Feb 9, 2012
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              My husbands test was done by Family Tree DNA and it offers the same as yours he did have one 36/37 match. It seems that NPE is common in the Fancher line though. We have been in touch with the Fancher family and are trying to narrow something down. Its aggravating to say the least. It just left us with nothing to go on but mere DNA results that it would take a rocket scientist to interpret. lol Thanks for the replies!



              ________________________________
              From: timothyfcampbell <timothyfcampbell@...>
              To: genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 8:59 AM
              Subject: [Genealogy Research Club] Re: Non-Paternal Event Brick Wall


               
              Who performed your DNA test? I'm not sure if any company is any better than any other.

              I had my test done by Family Tree DNA. I paid a lot of money for a lot of bunk! I too have a "Non-Paternal Event" in my genetic history. If you read all there is to read you will find that it doesn't necessarily mean that someone was adopted (in the sense we understand today) but that there may have been something as simple as a name change. For example; my name is CAMPBELL but according to Family Tree DNA I am related to STEWART: CAMPBELL is a name that was adopted and not all CAMPBELL's are genetically related.

              Then there is the issue of surnames changing with each generation (yes, along the male or Y line). For example, before the practice of passing along a common surname some cultures (e.g. Irish, Icelandic) created patronyms for surnames; therefore instead of being a CAMPBELL I could have been a MacDONALD (son of Donald).

              Then there is the issue of time before surnames. For example, the earliest CAMPBELL I can find married a STEWART; but they were 2nd cousins with a common ancestor called "Robert The Bruce". From what I've learned that before 1000AD there were no surnames.

              Then there is the issue of shear numbers and the genetic genealogy companies don't have enough samples or matches to come anywhere near being able to find adequate results. For example, Family Tree DNA gives me "probabilities" of a common ancestor with my matches, and the common number is 24 generations for a 100% match. Tracing back my pedigree, when I reach 20 generations (barring duplicates) there are over 1,000,000 people in my tree; most of whom not only begat me but many more people as well. All the DNA testers combined have only scratched the iceburg.

              Depending on who did the test you may be able to share your results elsewhere. Family Tree DNA has a link with Ysearch (and Mitosearch for your mtDNA results): one click and FTDNA created the profile and passed on my DNA results. You can also create a free profile with Genetree, upload your results and look for matches in their database.

              Unfortunately genetic genealogy is a "Caveat emptor": I paid for a test because they advertised that DNA could help to break down brick walls, but once I've paid the piper and got my results they simply say "DNA testing cannot replace paper trail research": I paid for the test because the paper trail ended and now I feel ripped off.

              Don't worry about your DNA results.

              --- In genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com, "tinker_tree" <tinker_tree@...> wrote:
              >
              > A couple years back I had my husbands DNA tested and we were very surprised at the results. It seems that a Non-Paternal event occured in his family. He was raised as a TINKER but his DNA matches that of the FANCHER surname.
              >




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Ann Sizemore
              Does anyone have thoughts about the National Geographic The Genogaphic Project ?
              Message 6 of 6 , Feb 9, 2012
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                Does anyone have thoughts about the National Geographic "The Genogaphic Project"?  https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/genographic/lan/en/index.htm%c2%a0How is that different then other DNA testing? 

                I'm glad this discussion came up, as we are considering having the DNA test done, and I'm already learning that there are many different things to consider.

                Also, when it comes to well known ancestry (Scotland Highlands), I wonder if they have DNA on such individuals as the Grant's and Stewarts which might make the link to them more definitive?

                Ann



                >________________________________
                > From: Nelda Eads <tinker_tree@...>
                >To: "genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com" <genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com>
                >Sent: Thursday, February 9, 2012 9:00 AM
                >Subject: Re: [Genealogy Research Club] Re: Non-Paternal Event Brick Wall
                >
                >

                >My husbands test was done by Family Tree DNA and it offers the same as yours he did have one 36/37 match. It seems that NPE is common in the Fancher line though. We have been in touch with the Fancher family and are trying to narrow something down. Its aggravating to say the least. It just left us with nothing to go on but mere DNA results that it would take a rocket scientist to interpret. lol Thanks for the replies!
                >
                >________________________________
                >From: timothyfcampbell <timothyfcampbell@...>
                >To: genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com
                >Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 8:59 AM
                >Subject: [Genealogy Research Club] Re: Non-Paternal Event Brick Wall
                >
                >

                >Who performed your DNA test? I'm not sure if any company is any better than any other.
                >
                >I had my test done by Family Tree DNA. I paid a lot of money for a lot of bunk! I too have a "Non-Paternal Event" in my genetic history. If you read all there is to read you will find that it doesn't necessarily mean that someone was adopted (in the sense we understand today) but that there may have been something as simple as a name change. For example; my name is CAMPBELL but according to Family Tree DNA I am related to STEWART: CAMPBELL is a name that was adopted and not all CAMPBELL's are genetically related.
                >
                >Then there is the issue of surnames changing with each generation (yes, along the male or Y line). For example, before the practice of passing along a common surname some cultures (e.g. Irish, Icelandic) created patronyms for surnames; therefore instead of being a CAMPBELL I could have been a MacDONALD (son of Donald).
                >
                >Then there is the issue of time before surnames. For example, the earliest CAMPBELL I can find married a STEWART; but they were 2nd cousins with a common ancestor called "Robert The Bruce". From what I've learned that before 1000AD there were no surnames.
                >
                >Then there is the issue of shear numbers and the genetic genealogy companies don't have enough samples or matches to come anywhere near being able to find adequate results. For example, Family Tree DNA gives me "probabilities" of a common ancestor with my matches, and the common number is 24 generations for a 100% match. Tracing back my pedigree, when I reach 20 generations (barring duplicates) there are over 1,000,000 people in my tree; most of whom not only begat me but many more people as well. All the DNA testers combined have only scratched the iceburg.
                >
                >Depending on who did the test you may be able to share your results elsewhere. Family Tree DNA has a link with Ysearch (and Mitosearch for your mtDNA results): one click and FTDNA created the profile and passed on my DNA results. You can also create a free profile with Genetree, upload your results and look for matches in their database.
                >
                >Unfortunately genetic genealogy is a "Caveat emptor": I paid for a test because they advertised that DNA could help to break down brick walls, but once I've paid the piper and got my results they simply say "DNA testing cannot replace paper trail research": I paid for the test because the paper trail ended and now I feel ripped off.
                >
                >Don't worry about your DNA results.
                >
                >--- In genealogyresearchclub@yahoogroups.com, "tinker_tree" <tinker_tree@...> wrote:
                >>
                >> A couple years back I had my husbands DNA tested and we were very surprised at the results. It seems that a Non-Paternal event occured in his family. He was raised as a TINKER but his DNA matches that of the FANCHER surname.
                >>
                >
                >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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