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On the Death of Pope John Paul II

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  • wjf@bellsouth.net
    Friends, Today we are faced with the death of one of our world s spiritual leaders. In listening to his legacy on the Evening News, it occurs to me that this
    Message 1 of 5 , Apr 2, 2005
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      Friends,

      Today we are faced with the death of one of our world's spiritual leaders.

      In listening to his legacy on the Evening News, it occurs to me that this particular leader spoke to our
      plight when he said that "Politics is the Churches' business when it involves how people treat
      people." His leadership focused itself on the value and dignity of every human being.

      While our people continue to be openly oppressed by the Roman Catholic Church, it is the very
      words of this Pope within which we will ultimately find relief from this oppression of the ages.

      Therefore, for those who join me in mourning the loss of such a man, I share my condolences with
      you.

      I would also suggest to each of you that John Paul's work has only just now begun, and that for the
      man who sought conciliation here on earth between peoples of every stripe, in death he may have
      even greater power to unify our troubled world than he did in life.

      His legacy should be to remind each of us that we, as human beings, all have an equal place at the
      table of the spiritual commons. It is nothing less than our birthrite.

      In Peace,

      -William J. Freeman
    • Jase
      very good words indeed Bill. The pope was a reconciliast... he reconciled with my people and many others. While he was backwards in some of his thoughts on gay
      Message 2 of 5 , Apr 2, 2005
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        very good words indeed Bill.
         
        The pope was a reconciliast... he reconciled with my people and many others. While he was backwards in some of his thoughts on gay men and women, he was a leader none the less and a very passionate man.
         
        I will mourn his loss as a human being. 
         
        -------Original Message-------
         
        From: wjf@...
        Date: 04/02/05 18:40:55
        Subject: [gaykingdom] On the Death of Pope John Paul II
         
        Friends,
         
        Today we are faced with the death of one of our world's spiritual leaders.
         
        In listening to his legacy on the Evening News, it occurs to me that this particular leader spoke to our
        plight when he said that "Politics is the Churches' business when it involves how people treat
        people."  His leadership focused itself on the value and dignity of every human being.
         
        While our people continue to be openly oppressed by the Roman Catholic Church, it is the very
        words of this Pope within which we will ultimately find relief from this oppression of the ages.
         
        Therefore, for those who join me in mourning the loss of such a man, I share my condolences with
        you.
         
        I would also suggest to each of you that John Paul's work has only just now begun, and that for the
        man who sought conciliation here on earth between peoples of every stripe, in death he may have
        even greater power to unify our troubled world than he did in life.
         
        His legacy should be to remind each of us that we, as human beings, all have an equal place at the
        table of the spiritual commons.  It is nothing less than our birthrite.
         
        In Peace,
         
        -William J. Freeman
         
         
         
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      • stanford_giles
        Good riddance to bad rubbish. (Vatican City) Pope John Paul II has died ending what is regarded as the most homophobic pontificate in history. The Pope has
        Message 3 of 5 , Apr 2, 2005
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          Good riddance to bad rubbish.

          (Vatican City) Pope John Paul II has died ending what is regarded as
          the most homophobic pontificate in history.

          The Pope has been a constant voice of opposition to gay civil
          rights, same-sex marriage, and the use of condoms to prevent AIDS.

          His most recent attack on gays and lesbians came in his final
          book, "Memory and Identity," published last month. (story)

          The pope writes that gay marriage is "insidious" and "attempts to
          pit human rights against the family and against man."

          He also writes that lawmakers must resist the "pressures" put on
          them to legalize same-sex unions.

          In January, in a meeting with diplomats accredited to the Vatican
          the Pope said that families "must necessarily be that of a union
          between a man and a woman founded on marriage."

          A month earlier, in a pre-Christmas message the Pope accused gays of
          an "aggressive attempt to legally undermine the family." (story)

          "Attacks on marriage and the family, from an ideological and legal
          aspect, are becoming stronger and more radical every day," he said
          in a statement to be read in churches worldwide.

          "Who destroys this fundamental fabric causes a profound injury to
          society and provokes often irreparable damage."

          Last June, shortly after Spanish Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez
          Zapatero announced he would bring in a bill to legalize gay
          marriage, he was summoned to the Vatican for a severe tongue lashing
          from John Paul. (story)

          In a private audience the pope told Zapatero that his government
          must conserve ethical and moral values rooted in its Christian
          culture.

          Following the 15 minute meeting the two emerged and the pope read a
          public address to Zapatero in which he made clear his concern about
          gay marriage, telling him that the Spanish government must "give due
          attention to ethical values that are so rooted in the religious and
          cultural tradition of the population."

          Zapatero later said he appreciated the Pope's view but had no
          intention of dropping the legislation.

          Last summer, in advance of the US election, President Bush met with
          the Pope at the Vatican. (story) Bush implored the Pope to increase
          Catholic condemnation of gay marriage in the weeks leading up to the
          election, and that the request also was made by the president to
          senior Vatican officials.

          Shortly after the meeting US bishops stepped up their assaults on
          same-sex marriage, becoming actively involved in campaigns in 11
          states where constitutional bans on gay marriage were on the
          ballot. Voters in all 11 states approved the amendments.

          The Pope and other Vatican officials have called for the repeal of
          gay rights legislation passed by the European Union.

          Two years ago, the Vatican released a 12 page directive to priests
          around the world calling for a proactive stand to stop governments
          from legalizing same-sex marriage and for a repeal of those those
          already on the books that give rights, including adoption, to gay
          couples. (story)

          "Legal recognition of homosexual unions or placing them on the same
          level as marriage would mean not only the approval of deviant
          behavior ... but would also obscure basic values which belong to the
          common inheritance of humanity," the document said.

          On the subject of HIV/AIDS, the Pope in January attacked the use of
          condoms, (story) after a leading Spanish prelate said that bishops
          support the use of contraceptives to fight AIDS. The prelate quickly
          backtracked after the Vatican intervened.

          Education, chastity and sexual fidelity are the responsible methods
          to combat AIDS, the Pope said.

          John Paul's pontificate was also marked by the priest abuse scandal
          in the US. The Vatican turned a blind eye as abusive priests were
          moved from parish to parish.

          When the scandal broke the Church was slow in cooperating with law
          enforcement and fought lawsuits brought by abuse victims.

          But, John Paul is also credited with helping bring about the end of
          Communism, speaking out against the war in Iraq, and mending fences
          with the Jewish community. Early in pontificate there was an
          assignation attempt on him. Years later he met the man convicted of
          the attempt and said he forgave him.

          Cardinals will gather in Rome to chose a successor. That person
          likely will continue the Church's assault on gays. The leading
          candidates were all appointed by John Paul and are all theological
          conservatives.




          --- In gaykingdom@yahoogroups.com, "Jase" <neonjase@l...> wrote:
          > very good words indeed Bill.
          >
          > The pope was a reconciliast... he reconciled with my people and
          many others.
          > While he was backwards in some of his thoughts on gay men and
          women, he was
          > a leader none the less and a very passionate man.
          >
          > I will mourn his loss as a human being.
          >
          >
          > www.neonjase.com
        • Dallas Vinson
          Hey, just wanted to let you know that we are shutting down the #gayfiction IRC channel since nobody ever uses it anymore. However, if you go the channels
          Message 4 of 5 , Apr 3, 2005
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            Hey, just wanted to let you know that we are shutting down the #gayfiction
            IRC channel since nobody ever uses it anymore. However, if you go the
            channels webpage, you will find that we have instead set up forums for the
            discussion of gay fiction (stories and authors), so go on over to the
            website and be one of the first to register on the new forums and get into
            the discussions.

            http://gayfiction.webhop.net

            -Dallas
          • Pierre-Paul B
            I agree totally with what you said. Even if someone dies, we must not become hypocrit or politically correct . Please let me add some other point of view
            Message 5 of 5 , Apr 5, 2005
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              I agree totally with what you said.
              Even if someone dies, we must not become "hypocrit" or "politically
              correct".
              Please let me add some other point of view going in the same way (
              english and french version)

              Pierre Paul

              THE ULTIMATE HYPOCRISY:  THE POPE USED EVERY POSSIBLE MEDICAL RESOURCE
              TO PROLONG HIS OWN LIFE, DESPITE A LONG TRADITION OF CONDEMNING ALL
              MEDICINE FOR EVERYONE ELSE!

               

              In the last year, as the pope degenerated further into diseased
              unconsciousness, desperately trying by any means to prolong his own
              life, how many other lives had he caused to shorten?  He has been a
              wonderful example of hypocrisy, following in the true church's
              tradition of condemning any new advance in science which could prolong
              life, and yet he did not hesitate to use all possible medical treatment
              for himself, which only yesterday was condemned by his predecessors.
              The inquisition who burned midwives as witches in the 1500s would have
              condemned the dead pontiff for his hospitalisation as surely as the
              dead pontiff condemned tomorrows stem cell medicine.

               

              If it had not been for the Vatican, medical science would be much more
              advanced today, we would already have found the cures to cancers, AIDS
              and all ills. The blind would be able to see and the lame would walk as
              predicted by Jesus. The truth is that the Vatican hindered medicine
              every step of the way, right from its inception, everything, right up
              to today with the most promising medicine of all: stem cell therapy.

               

              And yet the hypocrite did everything he could to benefit from medicine
              to prolong his own life! If the pope is really infallible, then his
              decree should be valid for ever and today's pope should not benefit
              from the medicine that his predecessors condemned. Either that, or the
              pope is not infallible. Let the diseased church die with the pope and
              give the keys of the Vatican stolen from St Peter to its rightful
              owner, His Holiness Rael, the true messenger of the Elohim, the
              extra-terrestrials who created all life on earth, who were mystified as
              god. (see rael.org)

              .www.rael.org

              ===========================


              L'HYPOCRISIE ULTIME : LE PAPE A UTILISÉ TOUTES LES RESSOURCES MÉDICALES
              POSSIBLES POUR PROLONGER SA PROPRE VIE, EN DÉPIT D'UNE LONGUE TRADITION
              CONDAMNANT TOUTE MÉDECINE POUR TOUS LES AUTRES !

               

              Au cours de la dernière année, alors que le pape sombrait dans une
              inconscience maladive, essayant désespérément par tous les moyens de
              prolonger sa propre vie, combien d'autres vies avait-il abrégées ? Il a
              été un merveilleux exemple d'hypocrisie, continuant dans de la
              véritable tradition de l’Église de condamner toute nouvelle avance en
              science qui pourrait prolonger la vie, alors que lui n’a pas hésitez à
              utiliser tout traitement médical possible pour lui, traitement qui
              seulement hier était condamné par ses prédécesseurs. L’Inquisition qui
              a brûlé les sages-femmes comme sorcières en 1500 aurait condamné le
              pontife mort pour son hospitalisation aussi sûrement que le pontife
              mort a condamné la médecine de demain à base de cellules souches.

               

              Si ce n’avait été que du Vatican, la science médicale serait beaucoup
              plus avancée aujourd'hui, nous aurions déjà trouvé les traitements pour
              les cancers, le SIDA et toutes les maladies. L’aveugle pourrait voir et
              le boiteux marcherait comme prévu par Jésus. La vérité est que le
              Vatican a entravé la médecine tout au long de sa progression, depuis
              ses débuts, jusqu'à aujourd'hui avec la médecine la plus prometteuse de
              toutes : la thérapie des cellules souches.

               

              Mais l'hypocrite a fait tout ce qu'il pouvait pour bénéficier de la
              médecine et prolonger sa propre vie ! Si le pape est vraiment
              infaillible, alors son décret devrait être valide à jamais et le pape
              d'aujourd'hui ne devrait pas tirer bénéfice de la médecine que ses
              prédécesseurs ont condamnée. Ou alors, le pape n'est pas infaillible.
              Laissez l'église malade mourir avec le pape et donner les clés du
              Vatican, volées à St-Pierre, à son propriétaire légitime, Sa Sainteté
              Raël, le vrai messager des Élohim, les extraterrestres qui ont créé
              toute vie sur terre, qui ont été mystifiés en dieu.

              (voir rael.org)

               
               
              Le 05-04-02, à 20:32, stanford_giles a écrit :

              >
              >
              > Good riddance to bad rubbish.
              >
              > (Vatican City) Pope John Paul II has died ending what is regarded as
              > the most homophobic pontificate in history.
              >
              > The Pope has been a constant voice of opposition to gay civil
              > rights, same-sex marriage, and the use of condoms to prevent AIDS.
              >
              > His most recent attack on gays and lesbians came in his final
              > book, "Memory and Identity," published last month. (story)
              >
              > The pope writes that gay marriage is "insidious" and "attempts to
              > pit human rights against the family and against man."
              >
              > He also writes that lawmakers must resist the "pressures" put on
              > them to legalize same-sex unions.
              >
              > In January, in a meeting with diplomats accredited to the Vatican
              > the Pope said that families "must necessarily be that of a union
              > between a man and a woman founded on marriage."
              >
              > A month earlier, in a pre-Christmas message the Pope accused gays of
              > an "aggressive attempt to legally undermine the family." (story)
              >
              > "Attacks on marriage and the family, from an ideological and legal
              > aspect, are becoming stronger and more radical every day," he said
              > in a statement to be read in churches worldwide.
              >
              > "Who destroys this fundamental fabric causes a profound injury to
              > society and provokes often irreparable damage."
              >
              > Last June, shortly after Spanish Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez
              > Zapatero announced he would bring in a bill to legalize gay
              > marriage, he was summoned to the Vatican for a severe tongue lashing
              > from John Paul. (story)
              >
              > In a private audience the pope told Zapatero that his government
              > must conserve ethical and moral values rooted in its Christian
              > culture.
              >
              > Following the 15 minute meeting the two emerged and the pope read a
              > public address to Zapatero in which he made clear his concern about
              > gay marriage, telling him that the Spanish government must "give due
              > attention to ethical values that are so rooted in the religious and
              > cultural tradition of the population."
              >
              > Zapatero later said he appreciated the Pope's view but had no
              > intention of dropping the legislation.
              >
              > Last summer, in advance of the US election, President Bush met with
              > the Pope at the Vatican. (story) Bush implored the Pope to increase
              > Catholic condemnation of gay marriage in the weeks leading up to the
              > election, and that the request also was made by the president to
              > senior Vatican officials.
              >
              > Shortly after the meeting US bishops stepped up their assaults on
              > same-sex marriage, becoming actively involved in campaigns in 11
              > states where constitutional bans on gay marriage were on the
              > ballot. Voters in all 11 states approved the amendments.
              >
              > The Pope and other Vatican officials have called for the repeal of
              > gay rights legislation passed by the European Union.
              >
              > Two years ago, the Vatican released a 12 page directive to priests
              > around the world calling for a proactive stand to stop governments
              > from legalizing same-sex marriage and for a repeal of those those
              > already on the books that give rights, including adoption, to gay
              > couples. (story)
              >
              > "Legal recognition of homosexual unions or placing them on the same
              > level as marriage would mean not only the approval of deviant
              > behavior ... but would also obscure basic values which belong to the
              > common inheritance of humanity," the document said.
              >
              > On the subject of HIV/AIDS, the Pope in January attacked the use of
              > condoms, (story) after a leading Spanish prelate said that bishops
              > support the use of contraceptives to fight AIDS. The prelate quickly
              > backtracked after the Vatican intervened.
              >
              > Education, chastity and sexual fidelity are the responsible methods
              > to combat AIDS, the Pope said.
              >
              > John Paul's pontificate was also marked by the priest abuse scandal
              > in the US. The Vatican turned a blind eye as abusive priests were
              > moved from parish to parish.
              >
              > When the scandal broke the Church was slow in cooperating with law
              > enforcement and fought lawsuits brought by abuse victims.
              >
              > But, John Paul is also credited with helping bring about the end of
              > Communism, speaking out against the war in Iraq, and mending fences
              > with the Jewish community. Early in pontificate there was an
              > assignation attempt on him. Years later he met the man convicted of
              > the attempt and said he forgave him.
              >
              > Cardinals will gather in Rome to chose a successor. That person
              > likely will continue the Church's assault on gays. The leading
              > candidates were all appointed by John Paul and are all theological
              > conservatives.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > --- In gaykingdom@yahoogroups.com, "Jase" <neonjase@l...> wrote:
              >> very good words indeed Bill.
              >>
              >> The pope was a reconciliast... he reconciled with my people and
              > many others.
              >> While he was backwards in some of his thoughts on gay men and
              > women, he was
              >> a leader none the less and a very passionate man.
              >>
              >> I will mourn his loss as a human being.
              >>
              >>
              >> www.neonjase.com
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
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