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RE: [gaykingdom] dream

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  • Dallas Vinson
    Don, I apologize for jumping to conclusions. I am in support of free speech upto the point where it causes harm to others. But to openly make the
    Message 1 of 4 , Mar 29, 2005
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      Don, I apologize for jumping to conclusions. I am in support of free speech
      upto the point where it causes harm to others. But to openly make the
      declarations that Jaix did was, in my opinion, treasonous because he was
      advocating the overthrough of our government.

      I now know that he signed peoples names to that message without their
      knowledge and/or consent. If you were one of those persons who was wronged
      by his actions, then I humbly apologize to you.

      It is one thing to voice discontent with a group or government, it is
      another thing all together to openly declare revolt. What do you think the
      US Government, or any government for that matter, would do if a group of its
      citizens made the same declarations that Jaix made? I think their reactions
      would be similar, if not identicle, to some of the ones made here.

      If you do not agree whith Jaix's words to which he attached your name, then
      I would realy like to have you stay with us and try to fix the problems.
      This however, does not mean throwing out everything that has already been
      done and starting over. We have a loose framework already in place, what we
      need to do is work within that framework and do what we can to expand on it
      and make it stronger.

      That's just my 2 euros worth. I think on a lot of these things, I hope that
      we can just agree to disagree and keep moving forward.

      -Dallas


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Donald Clark [mailto:donclarkii@...]
      Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 12:07 AM
      To: gaykingdom@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [gaykingdom] dream




      hello,

      I would like to apologize, to everyone about what has transpired in the
      last week, I have been trying to deal with some health issues. O entered
      the hospital Saturday night sufering fromapanic attack, and of very high
      blood pressure. Now I amnot going to place the blame for this on any one
      person, but I am saying that I want this whole thing to calm down.

      I ask when did we start behaving like the people in the 1700's? I feel like
      a resident of salem, I feel like an accused witch. When did it become High
      Treasom to speak ones mind? When did it become a crime, to question the
      leadership of a country? I was reading an article today about the president
      of I think zimbobway (spelling?)He said that anyone who runs against him in
      the election coming up, and those people who vote against him are traitors
      and would be punished, do we really want to be on the same levalof this guy?
      I know I Don't. Now regardless of what has been said about me in the
      past, and those whom have said it, I want the records to be clear.
      Yes I do in principle agree with some things that have been said, BUT I AM
      CLEAR THAT I HAVE NOT NOR WILL I EVER BE LIKE PRESIDENT BUSH,THE GOVERNMENT
      OF AUSTRALIA OR ANYONE WHOM OPRESSES OUR HUMAN RIGHTS!

      I do however think that there are some serious issues at hand here. I do
      believe that we need some changes. I been called a traitor because I spoke
      my mind about some things, Dallas said this, he called it high treason to
      speak ones mind? When did we start acting this way? Why? When a letter
      from jaix came in with my name on it did anyone ask me if I allowed this to
      happen before they started calling me a traitor, no they started to call me
      this before they asked, dan fowler said my actions said I was resigning from
      the assembly and renouncing my ctizenship BEFORE ANYONE ASKED ME IF I HAD
      ALLOWED THIS. The only person to ask was Jon Matlick, and he really never
      asked,he gave an ultimatum, so I responded with a e-mail saying I was done
      with this group, I belived and still do a little bit that no matter what I
      said I was guilty before bieng inncocent, I felt that I had to prove my
      innocents, but why should I thought this is supposed to be a country of
      refuge a place of freedom, then why is it that I was thought of as bieng
      gulity, I thought it wasinnocent until proven guilty,not the other way
      around. Now I know some people also think of me as a traitor because Jaix,
      and I are friends, and yes I am still his friend, and will contunue to be,
      One member,at least i think he was a member, of the priivy council said
      anyone whom is a friend or a member of the other group should be thought
      of as person non grata, this is another serious issue, just because one is
      friends with a person, or a member of a group whom is opposing another is
      a wrong. well I dont plan on dropping a friend, I just wanted to say this
      because to me this doesnt sound, or feel like a free country in fact the
      USA looks more free then here, now dont take this the wrong way, I am not
      saying that because I oppose what is going on here but I do think these
      issues need to be talked about.

      till later

      Don








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    • stanford_giles
      I will say sorry for assuming you Don allowed jaix to sign your name to the leter of overthrow. I did not think jaix was so daft to sign people s names who
      Message 2 of 4 , Mar 30, 2005
      • 0 Attachment
        I will say sorry for assuming you Don allowed jaix to sign your name
        to the leter of overthrow. I did not think jaix was so daft to sign
        people's names who could easy say they did not agree. That was a
        mistake I made. Also, I read this entire post you made and still
        don't know the answers so I will ask meaning no lack of respect. Did
        you allow Jaix to put your name on his letter of overthrow or did
        you not? You said "The only person to ask was Jon Matlick, and he
        really never asked,he gave an ultimatum, so I responded with a e-
        mail saying I was done with this group". I ask then if by doing that
        you resigned the parliemant, or did not? All it is unclear and so
        the only way to know is to ask and so I ask.





        --- In gaykingdom@yahoogroups.com, "Donald Clark" <donclarkii@y...>
        wrote:
        >
        >
        > hello,
        >
        > I would like to apologize, to everyone about what has transpired
        in
        > the last week, I have been trying to deal with some health
        issues. O
        > entered the hospital Saturday night sufering fromapanic attack,
        and
        > of very high blood pressure. Now I amnot going to place the
        blame
        > for this on any one person, but I am saying that I want this whole
        > thing to calm down.
        >
        > I ask when did we start behaving like the people in the 1700's? I
        > feel like a resident of salem, I feel like an accused witch. When
        > did it become High Treasom to speak ones mind? When did it become
        a
        > crime, to question the leadership of a country? I was reading an
        > article today about the president of I think zimbobway (spelling?)
        He
        > said that anyone who runs against him in the election coming up,
        and
        > those people who vote against him are traitors and would be
        > punished, do we really want to be on the same levalof this guy? I
        > know I Don't. Now regardless of what has been said about me in
        the
        > past, and those whom have said it, I want the records to be
        clear.
        > Yes I do in principle agree with some things that have been said,
        BUT
        > I AM CLEAR THAT I HAVE NOT NOR WILL I EVER BE LIKE PRESIDENT
        BUSH,THE
        > GOVERNMENT OF AUSTRALIA OR ANYONE WHOM OPRESSES OUR HUMAN RIGHTS!
        >
        > I do however think that there are some serious issues at hand
        here. I
        > do believe that we need some changes. I been called a traitor
        > because I spoke my mind about some things, Dallas said this, he
        > called it high treason to speak ones mind? When did we start
        acting
        > this way? Why? When a letter from jaix came in with my name on
        it
        > did anyone ask me if I allowed this to happen before they started
        > calling me a traitor, no they started to call me this before they
        > asked, dan fowler said my actions said I was resigning from the
        > assembly and renouncing my ctizenship BEFORE ANYONE ASKED ME IF I
        HAD
        > ALLOWED THIS. The only person to ask was Jon Matlick, and he
        really
        > never asked,he gave an ultimatum, so I responded with a e-mail
        saying
        > I was done with this group, I belived and still do a little bit
        that
        > no matter what I said I was guilty before bieng inncocent, I felt
        > that I had to prove my innocents, but why should I thought this is
        > supposed to be a country of refuge a place of freedom, then why is
        it
        > that I was thought of as bieng gulity, I thought it wasinnocent
        until
        > proven guilty,not the other way around. Now I know some people
        also
        > think of me as a traitor because Jaix, and I are friends, and yes
        I
        > am still his friend, and will contunue to be, One member,at least
        i
        > think he was a member, of the priivy council said anyone whom is a
        > friend or a member of the other group should be thought of as
        > person non grata, this is another serious issue, just because one
        is
        > friends with a person, or a member of a group whom is opposing
        > another is a wrong. well I dont plan on dropping a friend, I
        just
        > wanted to say this because to me this doesnt sound, or feel like
        a
        > free country in fact the USA looks more free then here, now dont
        take
        > this the wrong way, I am not saying that because I oppose what is
        > going on here but I do think these issues need to be talked about.
        >
        > till later
        >
        > Don
      • Donald Clark
        Stan, No I Did not allow him to sign my name it was done without my knowledge, I did not read the letter until Monday, I was upset that you all assumed I had
        Message 3 of 4 , Mar 30, 2005
        • 0 Attachment
          Stan, No I Did not allow him to sign my name it was done without my
          knowledge, I did not read the letter until Monday, I was upset that
          you all assumed I had done what was said, and so yes I sent a message
          to certain people saying I was done with the group because I was
          presumed guilty, do you not understand what that feels like, It is
          not a good feeling, and I dont care if you are innocent and you know
          that you are, when people presume you guilty and just start acting
          like you are guilty without proof without asking it hurts, you could
          have asked I would have responded, though not until Monday because I
          was in Hospital. I hope that answers your questions.


          --- In gaykingdom@yahoogroups.com, "stanford_giles"
          <stanford_giles@y...> wrote:
          >
          > I will say sorry for assuming you Don allowed jaix to sign your
          name
          > to the leter of overthrow. I did not think jaix was so daft to sign
          > people's names who could easy say they did not agree. That was a
          > mistake I made. Also, I read this entire post you made and still
          > don't know the answers so I will ask meaning no lack of respect.
          Did
          > you allow Jaix to put your name on his letter of overthrow or did
          > you not? You said "The only person to ask was Jon Matlick, and he
          > really never asked,he gave an ultimatum, so I responded with a e-
          > mail saying I was done with this group". I ask then if by doing
          that
          > you resigned the parliemant, or did not? All it is unclear and so
          > the only way to know is to ask and so I ask.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In gaykingdom@yahoogroups.com, "Donald Clark" <donclarkii@y...>
          > wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > > hello,
          > >
          > > I would like to apologize, to everyone about what has transpired
          > in
          > > the last week, I have been trying to deal with some health
          > issues. O
          > > entered the hospital Saturday night sufering fromapanic attack,
          > and
          > > of very high blood pressure. Now I amnot going to place the
          > blame
          > > for this on any one person, but I am saying that I want this
          whole
          > > thing to calm down.
          > >
          > > I ask when did we start behaving like the people in the 1700's?
          I
          > > feel like a resident of salem, I feel like an accused witch.
          When
          > > did it become High Treasom to speak ones mind? When did it
          become
          > a
          > > crime, to question the leadership of a country? I was reading an
          > > article today about the president of I think zimbobway (spelling?)
          > He
          > > said that anyone who runs against him in the election coming up,
          > and
          > > those people who vote against him are traitors and would be
          > > punished, do we really want to be on the same levalof this guy? I
          > > know I Don't. Now regardless of what has been said about me in
          > the
          > > past, and those whom have said it, I want the records to be
          > clear.
          > > Yes I do in principle agree with some things that have been said,
          > BUT
          > > I AM CLEAR THAT I HAVE NOT NOR WILL I EVER BE LIKE PRESIDENT
          > BUSH,THE
          > > GOVERNMENT OF AUSTRALIA OR ANYONE WHOM OPRESSES OUR HUMAN
          RIGHTS!
          > >
          > > I do however think that there are some serious issues at hand
          > here. I
          > > do believe that we need some changes. I been called a traitor
          > > because I spoke my mind about some things, Dallas said this, he
          > > called it high treason to speak ones mind? When did we start
          > acting
          > > this way? Why? When a letter from jaix came in with my name on
          > it
          > > did anyone ask me if I allowed this to happen before they
          started
          > > calling me a traitor, no they started to call me this before they
          > > asked, dan fowler said my actions said I was resigning from the
          > > assembly and renouncing my ctizenship BEFORE ANYONE ASKED ME IF I
          > HAD
          > > ALLOWED THIS. The only person to ask was Jon Matlick, and he
          > really
          > > never asked,he gave an ultimatum, so I responded with a e-mail
          > saying
          > > I was done with this group, I belived and still do a little bit
          > that
          > > no matter what I said I was guilty before bieng inncocent, I felt
          > > that I had to prove my innocents, but why should I thought this
          is
          > > supposed to be a country of refuge a place of freedom, then why
          is
          > it
          > > that I was thought of as bieng gulity, I thought it wasinnocent
          > until
          > > proven guilty,not the other way around. Now I know some people
          > also
          > > think of me as a traitor because Jaix, and I are friends, and yes
          > I
          > > am still his friend, and will contunue to be, One member,at
          least
          > i
          > > think he was a member, of the priivy council said anyone whom is
          a
          > > friend or a member of the other group should be thought of as
          > > person non grata, this is another serious issue, just because one
          > is
          > > friends with a person, or a member of a group whom is opposing
          > > another is a wrong. well I dont plan on dropping a friend, I
          > just
          > > wanted to say this because to me this doesnt sound, or feel like
          > a
          > > free country in fact the USA looks more free then here, now dont
          > take
          > > this the wrong way, I am not saying that because I oppose what is
          > > going on here but I do think these issues need to be talked
          about.
          > >
          > > till later
          > >
          > > Don
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