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Re: What battery shortage?--selling by the megawatts

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  • contact4223
    Smith Electric Vehicles, uses ZEBRA batteries in their new(?) line of trucks, or not? Please enlighten me.
    Message 1 of 48 , Mar 4, 2008
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      Smith Electric Vehicles, uses
      ZEBRA batteries in their new(?) line of trucks,
      or not? Please enlighten me.
    • Yodda Pierce
      Hi Randy, You indicate below that you feel that nothing illegal has been done with regard to the alleged NiMH battery technology suppression. If true that
      Message 48 of 48 , Mar 20, 2008
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        Hi Randy,

        You indicate below that you feel that nothing illegal
        has been done with regard to the alleged NiMH battery
        technology suppression. If true that Chevron has
        conspired to keep NiMH battery technology off the
        market for the purposes of monopoly or oligopoly, (in
        oil)this would seem to qualify as a violation of the
        Sherman Antitrust Act.

        Here's the link:

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherman_Antitrust_Act

        Yes, I have seen how oil company executives work hard
        to tell the public that electric vehicle technology
        won't work and it's unrealistic and that it is a
        fossil fuel world for all of us. It is up to the
        public to not be so easily fooled by the propaganda.
        As we have seen by some articles I posted here, the
        propaganda is everywhere. We must all scrutinize the
        words and articles to find the truth and not summarily
        accept what the corporations tell us.

        If I had nothing else to do I think I would join Nader
        in his fight against corporate abuse and advocacy of
        consumer protection law.

        Yodda



        --- Randy Juras <rcjuras@...> wrote:

        > It is also my opinion that something is up.
        >
        > The oil patch has all the reason in the world to
        > keep electric cars
        > off the road. They are controling a true fortune,
        > and the greedy
        > people running that corporation clearly have no
        > intention of giving
        > up that power.
        >
        > Doing what they are doing, legally surpressing
        > battery technology,
        > may be unethical. But it is still not illegal.
        >
        > Lee Raymond is having trouble living his retirement
        > on over 8 million
        > a year. So if this is the thinking that is going on
        > in the oil patch
        > Board rooms, surpressing electric cars is an easy
        > choice.
        >
        > Right here in Illinois, the local official for the
        > petroleum
        > institute is saying that fossil fuel will always be
        > the main source
        > of energy. That America HAS NO CHOICE!
        > It is very easy for me to assume he knows what is
        > going on, and he
        > already knows the oil patch will make sure cars such
        > as EV1 will
        > never make it.
        >
        > Do not forget that General Motors had gone to great
        > lengths in the
        > 60's to surpress Nader. As GM once said "What is
        > good for General
        > Motors is good for America".
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In future-fuels-and-vehicles@yahoogroups.com,
        > Yodda Pierce
        > <ntsl532@...> wrote:
        > >
        > > The obvious answer to your question is "no" of
        > course,
        > > but allow me to qualify what I would invest in.
        > Yes,
        > > I would use my real name, and my own real money
        > (not
        > > someone else), but of course I would not invest my
        > > life savings in any one thing period. I invested
        > in
        > > Dell Computer when the stock was 5 cents a share,
        > but
        > > I do not regret investing all my money even now.
        > > Anybody that would put all their money in any one
        > > thing, batteries or other is foolish. Finally, I
        > > would not invest it in nickel metal hydride
        > because
        > > that is a patented technology owned by Ovonics.
        > Why
        > > invest in something someone else holds patent to?
        > > Instead I would consider investing my own money in
        > > lithium polymer batteries and figure out ways to
        > > produce the batteries inexpensively. I would also
        > > consider and have invested in other battery
        > > chemistries I will not get into here. Anyway,
        > lithium
        > > polymer is likely the holy grail in battery
        > > technology once they overcome the production
        > > challenges. An inexpensive high output, high
        > > reliability battery.
        > >
        > > As far as the market goes let's consider the
        > Toyota
        > > Prius introduction 2000. When the cars were
        > initially
        > > sold they were sold below cost. According to
        > Toyota
        > > they initially lost thousands on the sales of the
        > > vehicles as they were one of the first to sell
        > these
        > > cars in North America. Now they are profitable.
        > As
        > > with much of new technology there is a learning
        > curve
        > > and initially introductions may involve negative
        > cash
        > > flow, but in time that changes. Now Toyota has
        > reaped
        > > the benefits by capturing a large part of the
        > market
        > > share for hybrid vehicles. GM had that chance in
        > 1996
        > > with the EV-1 and blew it. Any businessman that
        > > expects immediate positive cash flow from a new
        > > automotive technology introduction like hybrids
        > and
        > > electric cars is engaged in wishful thinking.
        > >
        > > I'm not big on fossil fuel and I am slowly getting
        > off
        > > it. The only thing I have left to do is get an
        > > electric car and I will be happy being completely
        > free
        > > of it. I think lithium batteries provide a
        > suitable
        > > concentration of energy similar to fossil fuel
        > energy
        > > densities in terms of how far I can travel with it
        > > (lithium car goes 300 miles/charge). People will
        > not
        > > purchase electric cars because of preconceived
        > notions
        > > on how they operate. Beyond cost of batteries the
        > > change is public perception, which can change with
        > > education.
        > >
        > > As I said here before, and this is only my
        > opinion,
        > > but when I look at all the evidence and all the
        > > business decisions and hear the inventor (Stan
        > > Ovshinsky NiMH inventor) himself interviewed and
        > > describing what happened after GM and Chevron
        > bought
        > > his company, the only conclusion I can only draw
        > is
        > > that something was up. There seemed to be some
        > > attempt to suppress the technology for some
        > reason.
        > > What that reason is I don't know, but it makes
        > sense
        > > to me that they wanted to limit the availability
        > of
        > > high tech battery technology. Logically if you
        > are an
        > > oil company you would wish to limit any
        > competitive
        > > technology that would interfere with your primary
        > > business model.
        > >
        > > I guess time will tell if Tesla and other start up
        > are
        > > a success.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > > BUT MY QUESTION, TO THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN AN OIL
        > > > COMPANY CONSPIRACY TO
        > > > UNDERMINE BATTERY DEVELOPMENT AND THE ELECTRIC
        > CAR,
        > > > IS THIS: USING YOUR REAL NAME
        > > > AND REAL MONEY WOULD YOU INVEST YOUR LIFE
        > SAVINGS IN
        > > > A COMPANY COMMITTED TO
        > > > MASS PRODUCING NICKEL METAL HYDRIDE BATTERIES
        > > > SUITABLE FOR THE ELECTRIC CAR?
        > > >
        > > > Would you seriously advise your children or
        > close
        > > > friends to plunge all of
        > > > their investments into a company that set out to
        > be
        > > > the leader in EV batteries
        > > > only?
        > > >
        > > > Personally I lean toward the view expressed by
        > Dave
        > > > Goldstein's that there
        > > > is no present secure available market for
        > electric
        > > > vehicle batteries in the
        > > > near future. Forgetting the environment,
        > strictly on
        > > > an energy basis, it is
        > > > hard to beat carbon fuels in terms of energy per
        >
        > > > pound. You can carry your fuel
        > > > to the arctic in a can for your snowmobile if
        > it
        > > > has an IC engine. And if I
        > > > am in the arctic I do not want to depend upon
        > > > electric power for my
        > > > snowmobile.
        > > >
        > > > Most people (by far) (we call them consumers) in
        > the
        > > > world know this. They
        > > > will not purchase a totally electric vehicle
        > unless
        > > > forced to. Hybrids yes,,
        > > > totally electric no. Therefore until the public
        > > > mind set changes, the mass
        > > > demand for EV batteries is questionable.
        > > >
        > > > If those who believe in the conspiracy theory
        > were
        > > > suddenly hired to work
        > > > for Chevron and they began to take an honest
        > look
        === message truncated ===



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