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Re: natural farming in Mexico

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  • torskel87
    Hi Bart an yuri It is so nice to read that you are interested in zen and starting a natural farm, I am trying to do the same but in Ecuador, I am really really
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 15, 2007
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      Hi Bart an yuri
      It is so nice to read that you are interested in zen and starting a
      natural farm, I am trying to do the same but in Ecuador, I am really
      really interested in the prectice of zen and I am also starting a
      natural farm in the middle of the highlands.I already started the farm
      alone, but I didn´t like to work alone so now I am trying to set up a
      coomunity, where I would like to unify a zen mind and working with
      natural farming.
      Can be really interesting share ideas, words, thoughts, anythinng
      since we are looking for something similar.
      One of my plans now is to go to California to a Zen Center called
      green gulch,where they also have a farm, do you know something about
      it.???
      Hope to keep in contact.
      Miguel
      Sacha Runa Farm
      Ecuador.


      --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, "Bart" <bartovan@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hello,
      >
      > we are a Belgian-Mexican couple of 34 with a son of 18 months,
      > settling down in Mexico on a small farm. Well, that's the plan at
      > least :) .
      > We spent a year and a half in the Mexican state Michoacan looking for
      > a spot and tasting the simple, rural working life - tastes great! -
      > but for practical reasons we had to come back to Belgium where we plan
      > on staying some 2 years before really buying a farm in Mexico.
      > We know we can do it, and we know how to do it, but we did become
      > aware of the fact that it is almost necessary to find some people who
      > are walking the same road, as neighbours or friends closeby (not like
      > a tight community in our view).
      > So we are very interested in contacting people with whome we share an
      > alike or compatible cosmovision. Ours would be zen-buddhist (for this
      > reason we like to live reasonably close to a zen center, like John
      > Tesshin Sanderson's "Zen Center de Mexico") and, for what's concerned
      > things practical, living a simple, hardworking life on an ecological
      > (fukuoka/permaculture) small farm in rural Mexico, preferably in the
      > state of Michoacan (for reasons of climate and forementioned closeness
      > to zen in Mexico City).
      >
      > Please do not hesitate to contact us if you think this would apply to
      > you or to some friend or acquintance...
      >
      > thank you,
      > Bart and Yuri
      >
    • Bart
      Hello Miguel, thank you very much for responding, it s always very warming to encounter companeros walking more or less the same road... We also experienced
      Message 2 of 7 , Jan 16, 2007
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        Hello Miguel,

        thank you very much for responding, it's always very warming to
        encounter companeros walking more or less the same road...

        We also experienced the need for having spiritual and practical
        companeros closeby, and we also have thought about some kind of
        community of
        natural farmers, but partly because of some
        experiences we have had with communities or intended
        communities, and partly because of more
        philosophical/spiritual reasons, we don't believe a
        community project is viable or necessary. The only
        community that works, we think, is a religious temple,
        led by an authentic spiritual leader. Otherwise we think a
        village-like organisation is just right, close enough to help and
        share things but not too close to disturb. Or even just living like
        good neighbours close to an existing village - we're not trying to run
        away from "civilization", just trying to live an honest, meaningful
        life without harming anyone or any living thing...

        The only people we met who were interested in setting up a community,
        were people who had already tried to live in existing communities, but
        failed because they couldn't harmonize with the others and needed
        their OWN community with their OWN rules THEY liked - rather funny,
        no, different people living alone on their huge piece of land waiting
        for someone who would accept to live with them following the rules
        they invented and they liked best...

        But maybe you mean by community just being
        geographically close, like neighbours, organizing
        some of the activities together, learning from each other's
        experiences and knowledge, keeping an eye on
        each other's children, and on the farm when someone
        has to leave for a while - this would interest us
        greatly.

        When we went to Mexico, we went with the idea of
        integrating us in a small village, thinking people
        over there would have some living spiritual tradition
        and some ancestral farming knowledge. Sadly, both
        ideas are false (at least in the places where we
        were), materialism all over and pesticides also. Our
        neighbours were always nice and rather helpful people
        once the ice was broken, but not the kind we wanted to
        let our children go to play with a lot (watching TV,
        eating garbage, being yelled at and watching the dog
        get kicked at, and in case of medical problems a quick
        injection of some horse-remedy), nor could they begin
        to understand what and why we were trying to do with
        our lives.

        So as we see it, the ideal would be living in or
        around a "normal" small village somewhere in
        the mountains, but with a few natural farmers families
        close by, living like neighbours and, if it comes out
        that way, friends (or family when the children mary ;)
        ). And this at a reasonable distance from a zen
        practice center (4-5 hours still would be
        reasonable)...

        We're not even really fixed on Mexico, could be any
        country. But inside of Europe we would first have to
        work 30 years to pay off the land and house, and
        regulations are really strangling, we know of a lot of
        bad stories by organic growers, trials, hate, etc.. And outside Europe
        the only country to let us in easily is Mexico, because my wife
        is Mexican...

        Looking forward to hearing from you again... (Maybe we should start
        another topic if it would be of interest to the others, or go off-list...)
        If anyone else on this list has experiences, good or bad, with natural
        farming communities, please join in...

        greetings,
        Bart
      • torskel87
        Hi Bart I completely agree with you in relation to the way of doing a community, I lived for two years in a community in Venezuela´s Gran Sabana where we were
        Message 3 of 7 , Jan 17, 2007
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          Hi Bart
          I completely agree with you in relation to the way of doing a
          community, I lived for two years in a community in Venezuela´s Gran
          Sabana where we were trying to be self sufficient with permaculture
          and bio dynamic methods, but it didn´t work at all, as 15 people
          lived together in the same place, eveything was diagreement and life
          was out of harmony, with this experience never I would try to do a
          community like that, I think that the best community is the community
          with nature and with the family, and in relation to the people is fine
          like the way that people used to live before here in the Andes,
          communities were a group of families gathered in one place, every
          family lived independiently working in their lands, but all the
          families shared communitary work for the bennefit of all, like working
          in the building of a community house, or working in base of
          reciprocity, a person helped other family to harvest, so a member of
          the family was in debt to hepl him, the inca´s empire worked just in
          base of this reciprocity and that was the way that they were able to
          do so many things in a short period.
          I think that this would be a great way to build a "community of
          communities"a pleasant life and a pleasant world.And if life is
          pleasant and happy, shurely we will be getting close to nature.
          Cheers
          Miguel




          --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, "Bart" <bartovan@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hello Miguel,
          >
          > thank you very much for responding, it's always very warming to
          > encounter companeros walking more or less the same road...
          >
          > We also experienced the need for having spiritual and practical
          > companeros closeby, and we also have thought about some kind of
          > community of
          > natural farmers, but partly because of some
          > experiences we have had with communities or intended
          > communities, and partly because of more
          > philosophical/spiritual reasons, we don't believe a
          > community project is viable or necessary. The only
          > community that works, we think, is a religious temple,
          > led by an authentic spiritual leader. Otherwise we think a
          > village-like organisation is just right, close enough to help and
          > share things but not too close to disturb. Or even just living like
          > good neighbours close to an existing village - we're not trying to run
          > away from "civilization", just trying to live an honest, meaningful
          > life without harming anyone or any living thing...
          >
          > The only people we met who were interested in setting up a community,
          > were people who had already tried to live in existing communities, but
          > failed because they couldn't harmonize with the others and needed
          > their OWN community with their OWN rules THEY liked - rather funny,
          > no, different people living alone on their huge piece of land waiting
          > for someone who would accept to live with them following the rules
          > they invented and they liked best...
          >
          > But maybe you mean by community just being
          > geographically close, like neighbours, organizing
          > some of the activities together, learning from each other's
          > experiences and knowledge, keeping an eye on
          > each other's children, and on the farm when someone
          > has to leave for a while - this would interest us
          > greatly.
          >
          > When we went to Mexico, we went with the idea of
          > integrating us in a small village, thinking people
          > over there would have some living spiritual tradition
          > and some ancestral farming knowledge. Sadly, both
          > ideas are false (at least in the places where we
          > were), materialism all over and pesticides also. Our
          > neighbours were always nice and rather helpful people
          > once the ice was broken, but not the kind we wanted to
          > let our children go to play with a lot (watching TV,
          > eating garbage, being yelled at and watching the dog
          > get kicked at, and in case of medical problems a quick
          > injection of some horse-remedy), nor could they begin
          > to understand what and why we were trying to do with
          > our lives.
          >
          > So as we see it, the ideal would be living in or
          > around a "normal" small village somewhere in
          > the mountains, but with a few natural farmers families
          > close by, living like neighbours and, if it comes out
          > that way, friends (or family when the children mary ;)
          > ). And this at a reasonable distance from a zen
          > practice center (4-5 hours still would be
          > reasonable)...
          >
          > We're not even really fixed on Mexico, could be any
          > country. But inside of Europe we would first have to
          > work 30 years to pay off the land and house, and
          > regulations are really strangling, we know of a lot of
          > bad stories by organic growers, trials, hate, etc.. And outside Europe
          > the only country to let us in easily is Mexico, because my wife
          > is Mexican...
          >
          > Looking forward to hearing from you again... (Maybe we should start
          > another topic if it would be of interest to the others, or go
          off-list...)
          > If anyone else on this list has experiences, good or bad, with natural
          > farming communities, please join in...
          >
          > greetings,
          > Bart
          >
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