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Re: As an aside...

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  • pollywog
    Hi Connie! Thanks for your comment on my original reply, I was hoping, after I sent it, I hadn t started a flame war. I know, I shoulda thought of that
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 28, 2006
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      Hi Connie! Thanks for your comment on my original reply, I was hoping, after I sent it, I
      hadn't started a flame war. <G> I know, I shoulda thought of that before I hit the "send"
      button. I'm not known for foresight, though, mostly I'm known for saying "uh-oh. There
      goes my mouth again!" after the fact, and when the armies of Armaggedon are ranking.
      {;)

      It strikes me that Katherine, being a lady who takes such care in the best utilization of
      her output, would be just as careful, if not more, about her intake. She doesn't strike me
      as the Twinkies for breadfast, Hershey bar and Fritos for lunch, Hormone-laced Breaded
      Fried Pork Loin for dinner sort of eater.

      I also would not be as worried about her food intake, as any meds she might be
      injesting. There is a lot of change from food/liquid intake to final funnel-function
      production, especially when we are talking about the chemical changes and extreme
      filtering that happens in the overall system that produces, as it's final product, our urine.
      Many meds are not so cleansed, however, and that may be problematic; but I still do not
      see that one person's output (we humans produce about 50cc's of urine an hour, if
      memory serves right) would make a big difference unless one is absolute purist.

      I wouldn't even worry about her eating black walnuts and pouring her void on the tomato
      plants. <G> deb

      --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, "Connie Kuramoto" <kuramoto@M...>
      wrote:
      >
      > Doesn't it depend on what the human is eating?
      > Connie K.
    • redlunarmoon
      here s a good article from http://www.ruaf.org/no10/29_mexico.html ... Organoponics - the Use of Human Urine in Composting MC. Francisco J. Arroyo G.D.
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 28, 2006
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        here's a good article from http://www.ruaf.org/no10/29_mexico.html

        ----------------------------------------------------------
        Organoponics - the Use of Human Urine in Composting

        MC. Francisco J. Arroyo G.D.
        Co-ordinator CEDICAR and of the Urban Agriculture Network (Red Aguila
        - Mexicana).
        E-mail: farroyo@...

        Experiments and tests using fermented human urine in the production of
        legumes, medicinal and aromatic plants in containers, began 10 years
        ago1 in the Rural Research and Training Centre A.C. (CEDICAR). This
        cultivation system has been called "organoponics" or "urineponics". It
        is a cost-effective system, saving money, water, and being capable of
        producing an average of 25 kg of legumes per year per m2, and which
        has been culturally accepted by most of the families and institutions
        with which we have worked.

        The main advantage of this cultivation system, especially where land
        is scarce, is that after 10 months of growth, the initial substratum
        has decomposed, resulting in compost, rich in organic matter.

        Organoponics
        The organoponic system developed in Mexico, mainly in urban areas, is
        extremely simple. First, containers are filled with leaves and/or
        grass trimmings up to 85% of their capacity. Then they are inoculated
        with fermented urine and filled with an additional 15% of topsoil.
        Finally, the seed is transplanted or sown.

        Urine is fermented by placing one litre of urine in a container and
        adding a spoonful of black soil, compost or vermicompost. It is left
        to sit without cover for 28 days. The process is completed when the
        smell of ammonia becomes pervasive and the colour changes from light
        yellow to dark brown.

        Use of the ferment:

        * In organoponics, 3 litres per bucket with 19 litres of
        compressed leaves, (15 litres per m2 of leaves, 20 cm deep). This is
        the initial dose. Then, it is diluted at a ratio of 10:1, (10 parts
        water to 1 part ferment). A quarter of a litre of this is applied per
        bucket, three times a week (Monday, Wednesday and Friday).
        * On the soil, it is applied combined with irrigation and/or
        rainwater in doses still being tested for different crops.
        Composting activator: as urine ferments, significant
        populations of Actinomycets emerge, which are microorganisms
        especially apt to degrade lignin and cellulose. For this reason, it
        can be applied at a dose of 5 to 20 litres per m3 of carbon rich
        material, to substitute and/or complement other manure.
        Consult web page: www.laneta.apc.org/sarar

        Environmental health
        The use of urine as fertilizer highlights the added benefits of dry
        toilets, as well as edible backyard and rooftop gardens. Families are
        also encouraged to donate their urine to the municipal system for
        treatment and use in peri urban agriculture.

        Urine is innocuous, its use is guaranteed and carries no health
        risks2. Most of the pathogens that cause human diseases die quickly
        once urine leaves the body. If some subsist, the lactic bacteria and
        the Actinomycets would destroy them during storage and during the
        fermenting process.

        Organoponics and other components of Urban Agriculture
        The technique allows the recycling of organic matter (used as
        substrata) and promotes the sorting of household wastes and the
        development of household, neighbourhood and municipal composting
        centres. It also saves water, promoting dry, urine-separating toilets,
        which alleviates the accidental discharges from toilets and septic
        tanks reaching water bodies, causing their eventual eutrophication.

        Although household gardens are not conceived as a business or a small
        undertaking, a 10 m2 garden can bring a family savings of 80 to 100
        US$ per month. The household diet is improved as healthy and fresh
        legumes become more easily available.

        The practice can be used as participatory environmental education
        process for the poorer segments of the population, which will
        reinforce community ties and neighbourhood organizations. Gender
        studies and surveys on the distribution of household work are being
        conducted. The provision of support and incentives to environmentally
        conscious families needs to be included in environment, public
        service, health and economic policies of local authorities. It would
        also be feasible and desirable, for local authorities to set up urban
        agriculture divisions and integrate urban agriculture into municipal
        agricultural initiatives. Having a municipal greenhouse and composting
        centre that supplies seedlings and compost is, without doubt, a
        strategic action that will help to achieve continuity and maintain
        family gardens in good condition.

        The use of human urine as fertilizer in urban agriculture requires
        that it be developed as a local authority backed programme. Systems to
        collect, transport, store, treat (ferment) and apply, need to be
        developed. The same farmers interested in using urine can take part in
        this programme and develop an enterprise for the handling both of
        urine and faeces and their secondary treatments before being used as
        fertilizers. The role of the municipality will be to facilitate these
        activities and perhaps, find funds to partially subsidize the process.

        Notes
        1) Based on a brochure published by the State of California, USA,
        written by Dr. Barbara Daniels (Fairfax California. USA, year unknown).
        2) Vinneras Björn "Possibilities for sustainable nutrient recycling by
        fecal separation combined with urine diversion. Doctoral thesis.
        Swedish University of Agricultural Sciences. Uppsala 2002.
        Esrey A. Steve, et.al. "Cerrando el Ciclo. Saneamiento ecológico para
        la seguridad alimentaria. UNDP-SIDA. Mexico, 2001.
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