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Re: What I am doing

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  • Gloria Baikauskas
    I forgot to ask everyone their opinion on something. Realizing that the Queen Anne s Lace has similar roots to a daikon radish.....would you all cut the tops
    Message 1 of 8 , Mar 30, 2004
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      I forgot to ask everyone their opinion on something.

      Realizing that the Queen Anne's Lace has similar roots to a daikon
      radish.....would you all cut the tops of the plants this year to
      basically stop them from growing and allow the roots to
      decompose....do the same kind of work?

      Or.....would you allow this biennial to go on and come back next year
      with its flowers that truly help the beneficial insects, and
      basically still do the work of the similar daikon radish?

      I am trying to make a decision on this....and hoping I don't make a
      mistake. My gut instince initially was to cut them at soil
      level....then plant around them...using the tops as mulch. Then I
      began to think I would do my garden more of a favor by providing the
      cover for those beneficials next year and allowing Nature to make the
      decision for me. Still torn here. Need some advice.

      Gloria, Texas



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Beatrice Gilboa
      Gloria, ... basically stop them from growing and allow the roots to decompose....do the same kind of work? Or.....would you allow this biennial to go on and
      Message 2 of 8 , Mar 30, 2004
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        Gloria,
        >> would you all cut the tops of the plants this year to
        basically stop them from growing and allow the roots to
        decompose....do the same kind of work?
        Or.....would you allow this biennial to go on and come back next year with its flowers that truly help the beneficial insects, and
        basically still do the work of the similar daikon radish? I am trying to make a decision on this....and hoping I don't make a
        mistake.

        - I'm also thorn between the two solution you expose with the very strong wild plant of this kind (deeply rooted)that are growing here and obviously good for soil and insects. So I cut the plant but not on the soil level,(a bit higher) so they keep growing but much lower... a kind of bonzai torture. And from place to place I let it grow normaly. But my feeling is still not clear about it neither.

        That's not an advice... I do not think that to doubt is a mistake, it's a path to attention to what's happening, then, there is no mistake possible, just a choice to do ... wih ease or not.
        :-)

        Best wishes
        Beatrice
        Udim, Israel


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Gloria C. Baikauskas
        ... strong wild plant of this kind (deeply rooted)that are growing here and obviously good for soil and insects. So I cut the plant but not on the soil
        Message 3 of 8 , Mar 30, 2004
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          --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, "Beatrice Gilboa"
          <b.gilboa@w...> wrote:
          >> - I'm also thorn between the two solution you expose with the very
          strong wild plant of this kind (deeply rooted)that are growing here
          and obviously good for soil and insects. So I cut the plant but not
          on the soil level,(a bit higher) so they keep growing but much
          lower... a kind of bonzai torture. And from place to place I let it
          grow normaly. But my feeling is still not clear about it neither.
          >
          > That's not an advice... I do not think that to doubt is a mistake,
          it's a path to attention to what's happening, then, there is no
          mistake possible, just a choice to do ... wih ease or not.
          > :-)
          >
          > Best wishes
          > Beatrice
          > Udim, Israel
          >
          Beatrice......We feel our way through all of this as we go mindful of
          all the mistakes humans have made before us. I doubt they did as
          they did because they felt they were making mistakes either. It is
          the conscious idea we now have planted in our brains to do as little
          damage as possible.

          My hunch is that the right thing to do is to leave them alone and
          plant with them to see what happens. I think if Nature deems that
          the new plants we put in from seed, or from transplant, should not be
          there....they won't. Much like with the seedballs.

          Then......when I consider that I need a mulch of some kind....I get
          confused with it all. Here where so much damage has been done I so
          want to harm the land no more. Part of me believes that the land is
          more forgiving than we may think. Nature seems forgiving of so
          much.

          I have been sitting here staring out of the window....then going
          outside and staring at the garden trying to decide what to do. I
          think I am going to try adding some flowers and see what happens.
          Why flowers? It is because right now there is just so much green in
          that garden. It seems to scream that it wants more color. There is
          some other color. I do have some artemesia in the bed, and some
          kitchen sage with its silvery gray-green leaves. Soon the red roses
          will be blooming in there, too. Some amaranth might be a nice
          addition come to think of it. Hmmmm....maybe I will go outside again
          with my seeds.

          Gloria, Texas
        • Ingrid Bauer/Jean-Claude Catry
          ... The old land i used to garden was a hay field infested big time by wild carrots and daisies. i fenced off a part from deers and left things go its own way
          Message 4 of 8 , Mar 30, 2004
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            > Realizing that the Queen Anne's Lace has similar roots to a daikon
            > radish.....would you all cut the tops of the plants this year to
            > basically stop them from growing and allow the roots to
            > decompose....do the same kind of work?
            >
            > Or.....would you allow this biennial to go on and come back next year
            > with its flowers that truly help the beneficial insects, and
            > basically still do the work of the similar daikon radish?
            >
            > I am trying to make a decision on this....and hoping I don't make a
            > mistake. My gut instince initially was to cut them at soil
            > level....then plant around them...using the tops as mulch. Then I
            > began to think I would do my garden more of a favor by providing the
            > cover for those beneficials next year and allowing Nature to make the
            > decision for me. Still torn here. Need some advice.


            The old land i used to garden was a hay field infested big time by wild
            carrots and daisies.
            i fenced off a part from deers and left things go its own way while making
            beds here and there by planting potatoes directlly on the sod ,cutting grass
            on both side and mulching on top . after harvest and mulch pushed aside corn
            sald and other winter crops were sown.
            to mulch the potatoes during the season i was cutting here and there grass
            with the wild carrot .

            the wild carrots in this all field taken care by me were in drastic
            decreasing number the year after ,more so the following year and by the 3rd
            year only rare ones were left .
            during the same time the rest of the field was cut for hay once a year with
            hay taken out , wild carrots have been persisting there for 10 years after .

            the cutting of the carrot with a scythe 5 cm above ground seems to have
            weaken the carrot ( lot of them were left and did grow seeds) and letting
            them rot on the spot have discoraged them to grow back to the contrary of
            the rest of the field where they were taken away .also they were most
            likelly cut more than once while in the rest of the field they were cut once
            only every year.( they were branching new flowers )

            basically it doesnt seems hard to limit the population of wild carrot by
            just cutting them back few time before they can flower ,being bi-annual they
            die at the end of the second year .
            by the way i prefer wild carrot to domestic ones ( not so sweet and more
            aromatic , but small )
            when i grow domesticated carrot i prefer the white kind closer to the wild
            , for the same reason .

            jean-claude
          • Sergio Montinola
            If you practice Fukuoka s natural farming, he will allow it to grow and stop the cutting. Nature is still the best teacher. Serge Montinola Philippines ...
            Message 5 of 8 , Mar 30, 2004
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              If you practice Fukuoka's natural farming, he will
              allow it to grow and stop the cutting.

              Nature is still the best teacher.

              Serge Montinola
              Philippines




              --- Gloria Baikauskas <gcb49@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > I forgot to ask everyone their opinion on something.
              >
              >
              > Realizing that the Queen Anne's Lace has similar
              > roots to a daikon
              > radish.....would you all cut the tops of the plants
              > this year to
              > basically stop them from growing and allow the roots
              > to
              > decompose....do the same kind of work?
              >
              > Or.....would you allow this biennial to go on and
              > come back next year
              > with its flowers that truly help the beneficial
              > insects, and
              > basically still do the work of the similar daikon
              > radish?
              >
              > I am trying to make a decision on this....and hoping
              > I don't make a
              > mistake. My gut instince initially was to cut them
              > at soil
              > level....then plant around them...using the tops as
              > mulch. Then I
              > began to think I would do my garden more of a favor
              > by providing the
              > cover for those beneficials next year and allowing
              > Nature to make the
              > decision for me. Still torn here. Need some advice.
              >
              > Gloria, Texas
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been
              > removed]
              >
              >


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            • Gloria C. Baikauskas
              ... by wild ... making ... sod ,cutting grass ... aside corn ... there grass ... the 3rd ... year with ... years after . ... have ... letting ... contrary of
              Message 6 of 8 , Mar 30, 2004
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                --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, "Ingrid Bauer/Jean-Claude
                Catry" <instinct@s...> wrote:
                >
                > > > The old land i used to garden was a hay field infested big time
                by wild
                > carrots and daisies.
                > i fenced off a part from deers and left things go its own way while
                making
                > beds here and there by planting potatoes directlly on the
                sod ,cutting grass
                > on both side and mulching on top . after harvest and mulch pushed
                aside corn
                > sald and other winter crops were sown.
                > to mulch the potatoes during the season i was cutting here and
                there grass
                > with the wild carrot .
                >
                > the wild carrots in this all field taken care by me were in drastic
                > decreasing number the year after ,more so the following year and by
                the 3rd
                > year only rare ones were left .
                > during the same time the rest of the field was cut for hay once a
                year with
                > hay taken out , wild carrots have been persisting there for 10
                years after .
                >
                > the cutting of the carrot with a scythe 5 cm above ground seems to
                have
                > weaken the carrot ( lot of them were left and did grow seeds) and
                letting
                > them rot on the spot have discoraged them to grow back to the
                contrary of
                > the rest of the field where they were taken away .also they were
                most
                > likelly cut more than once while in the rest of the field they were
                cut once
                > only every year.( they were branching new flowers )
                >
                > basically it doesnt seems hard to limit the population of wild
                carrot by
                > just cutting them back few time before they can flower ,being bi-
                annual they
                > die at the end of the second year .
                > by the way i prefer wild carrot to domestic ones ( not so sweet and
                more
                > aromatic , but small )
                > when i grow domesticated carrot i prefer the white kind closer to
                the wild
                > , for the same reason .
                >
                > jean-claude

                Jean-Claude......I am wondering if the reason the wild carrots
                persist in the hayfield is that their job just isn't finished yet. I
                have this thing in my head after watching my land's plants/weeds
                change over each year that each weed persists until its reason for
                being there is over. Somehow I think you with the more diverse
                planting....and the way you handled the wild carrots....allowed it to
                do its job....and helped it a bit, too.

                Each year I see wildflowers come and go. Why don't they return in
                the same, or a nearby place, I ask myself? Could birds really be
                carrying away all of the seeds? I don't think so.

                I know I could be way off here. I was fascinated by what you wrote.
                I suspect the key to keeping the biennial under control would be to
                cut back the tops in the second year.....which you mentioned. I
                think I am going to leave them alone this year. I also find it
                interesting that they aren't growing in my neighbors' properties...or
                anywhere else on my acreage.

                This plant is the ancestor of all domestic carrots. I read that over
                and over in my research. Interesting you prefer it, Jean-Claude. *g*

                Gloria, Texas
              • pollywog
                ... else you have in mind for that spot. I try to remember you re in Texas, and the sun just flat out beats down on you hard in the summer. Because of that, I
                Message 7 of 8 , Apr 4, 2004
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                  ---My initial reaction is, let 'em grow: but it does depend on what
                  else you have in mind for that spot.

                  I try to remember you're in Texas, and the sun just flat out beats
                  down on you hard in the summer. Because of that, I wonder if some
                  other things that could use a bit of afternoon shade might be
                  benefited from proximital plantings?

                  The plant will, however, grow back from crown cuttings, so even if you
                  cut them at soil level early in the season, there will be re-growth. A
                  part of me thinks that cuttings throughout the season may give you
                  just that much more good above-ground cover, along with allowing those
                  roots to pull nutrients up from leach/percolation levels. So, in other
                  words, which do you most want: a spot of dappled shade, or mulch?

                  Ahem. All that talk to tell you, "I have no advice". <G> Did you
                  honestly expect better from the deb? Wheee-Hooooo! deb

                  In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, Gloria Baikauskas <gcb49@f...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > I forgot to ask everyone their opinion on something.
                  >
                  > Realizing that the Queen Anne's Lace has similar roots to a daikon
                  > radish.....would you all cut the tops of the plants this year to
                  > basically stop them from growing and allow the roots to
                  > decompose....do the same kind of work?
                  >
                  > Or.....would you allow this biennial to go on and come back next year
                  > with its flowers that truly help the beneficial insects, and
                  > basically still do the work of the similar daikon radish?
                  >
                  > I am trying to make a decision on this....and hoping I don't make a
                  > mistake. My gut instince initially was to cut them at soil
                  > level....then plant around them...using the tops as mulch. Then I
                  > began to think I would do my garden more of a favor by providing the
                  > cover for those beneficials next year and allowing Nature to make the
                  > decision for me. Still torn here. Need some advice.
                  >
                  > Gloria, Texas
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Beatrice Gilboa
                  Hi Gloria, I understand very well from inside your questionning to yourself. So much that sometimes when, - like you say - ... more. - I am saying to myself
                  Message 8 of 8 , Apr 14, 2004
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                    Hi Gloria,

                    I understand very well from inside your questionning to yourself.

                    So much that sometimes when, - like you say -
                    >>"Here where so much damage has been done I so want to harm the land no
                    more. "

                    - I am saying to myself that maybe the best think should be to do nothing
                    and not to want to "cultivate" any of "my" choice of transplant or seeded
                    vegetable ...
                    This idea is on one side relaxing me, and on the other side taking me again
                    wanting (!) to try a compromise on the middle way... that where I'm more and
                    more find myself: between the two ways doing or not doing. Hopfully there
                    are farmers as John to feed us because going back to gathering time would
                    make me quite starving (at least on this part of land) ...

                    >> I am going to try adding some flowers and see what happens. Why flowers?
                    It is because right now there is just so much green in that garden. It
                    seems to scream that it wants more color.

                    - It will be probably be very nice and harmonious and integrated (knowing
                    your experiences of gardening), but why not to be OK whith the green that it
                    is right now? Why do we want more?
                    I am not asking you, but myself. (sorry for not beeing very "on the ground"
                    today)

                    Thanks for your last sharing
                    .. that let me less alone <g>

                    With love
                    Beatrice

                    Udim, Israel
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