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Mediterranean Forest Gardens

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  • jamie
    Hello everyone, and a particular hello to all at the Circle School, good to know you re still there too. As to Don Graves, if I remember rightly he s of at the
    Message 1 of 8 , Nov 1, 2003
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      Hello everyone, and a particular hello to all at the Circle School, good to
      know you're still there too. As to Don Graves, if I remember rightly he's of
      at the IFOAM conference in Canada, or working his way to or from there on
      farms between New Zealand and BC (was it BC?). A good man to have on the
      list for his intimate knowledge of the little critters that play such a
      vital role in soil's self-fertility, I hope he's back online with us soon.

      Also I'd like to offer a thought to those suffering from the fires in
      Southern California. Having seen many fires in this area of France and
      particularly a fire that has transformed a friends property on the hill
      above Souscayrous, I can attest to the disorientation and sadness that such
      a charred vista creates. If there are those who would seek to protect
      themselves (as far as possible) from this very real possibility in marginal
      arid lands (and this is what the Fukuoka-inspired Greenbelt Europe Project
      was about) then get seedballing with native species - and I'd also recommend
      Bill Mollison for an excellent insight into planting fire resistant species
      and the best placement of houses etc in fire-prone areas.

      Anyway, I thought I'd ask a question of the assembled knowledge of this
      list: does anyone have a fully stocked forest garden or list of plants for a
      forest garden in a Mediterranean climate (USDA Hardiness Zone 9)? Although
      this is for a project I'm involved with, it does relate to my reformulation
      of what is required for sustainable (zero off-farm input for Souscayrous)
      natural farm. Inspiration for such a garden comes directly from Robert Hart
      in the UK, his and Sholto Douglas' "Forest Farming: Towards a Solution to
      Problems of World Hunger and Conservation" and Russel Smith's "Tree Crops"
      (which are also seminal texts for Permaculture - I'm reading all the PC
      books at the moment and discovering just how much Fukuoka meant to the
      approach in its early days: see especially PC1 and PC2).

      The idea is to have a fully integrated, many-tiered, naturally
      self-supportive (a PC plant guild for instance) and adaptive system of
      plants that will fill each ecological niche, eg canopy, 1st understory, 2nd
      understory, bushes, ground cover and climbers. I suspect the greatest
      difficulty in establishing such a garden would be the initial summer drought
      conditions (especially summers like the last one) so would appreciate any
      experience gained in forest gardens or planting trees in droughty areas.

      I'm also going to be developing some natural orchards at the same project
      (very much along the lines set out by Fukuoka in The Natural Way of farming)
      but would like to have some forest gardens on slightly more difficult
      terrain, where differences in topography and microclimate will allow the
      greater diversity of plant species to adapt better to the mixed
      circumstances.

      Anyway, all personal experience or links to more information will be much
      appreciated.

      Incidentally, to anyone who has attempted or is looking to attempt the
      Bonfils-Fukuoka Winter Wheat Method, we've recently discovered photocopies
      of Marc Bonfils' agricultural notes previous thought burnt by him, and also
      some wheat seeds of the winter wheat varieties he was experimenting with. If
      anyone would like more information on this or have experience to share
      perhaps they would like to contact either me or lasencantadas@...
      <mailto:lasencantadas@...> .

      Jamie
      Souscayrous


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • corfuku
      talking about fires, just thought i d post a link to a very interesting website offering some alternative interpretations of the recent (and on-going) forest
      Message 2 of 8 , Nov 1, 2003
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        talking about fires, just thought i'd post a link to a very
        interesting website offering some alternative interpretations of the
        recent (and on-going) forest fires which are devastating areas of
        california:

        http://www.nomorefakenews.com

        there are some articles on the main page, and then many more on the
        page entitled "searchable archives".
        apart from the fires, this journalist deals with many other important
        issues in an illuminating way. even though the vast majority of the
        issues are off-topic regarding this list, i reccomend a look at the
        other parts of his site.

        pavle
      • Robin, Maya, or Napi
        Thanks, pavle. A lot of research there. N. ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        Message 3 of 8 , Nov 1, 2003
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          Thanks, pavle. A lot of research there. N.

          corfuku wrote:

          >
          > talking about fires, just thought i'd post a link to a very
          > interesting website offering some alternative interpretations of the
          > recent (and on-going) forest fires which are devastating areas of
          > california:
          >
          > http://www.nomorefakenews.com
          >
          > there are some articles on the main page, and then many more on the
          > page entitled "searchable archives".
          > apart from the fires, this journalist deals with many other important
          > issues in an illuminating way. even though the vast majority of the
          > issues are off-topic regarding this list, i reccomend a look at the
          > other parts of his site.
          >
          > pavle


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Gloria C. Baikauskas
          ... Those smoke clouds are over Texas now. We have a strong south wind blowing. That will probably carry them north. My keyboard broke down.....felt like my
          Message 4 of 8 , Nov 2, 2003
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            --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, "Robin, Maya, or Napi"
            <seafloorgarden@g...> wrote:
            > Thanks, pavle. A lot of research there. N.
            >
            Those smoke clouds are over Texas now. We have a strong south wind
            blowing. That will probably carry them north.

            My keyboard broke down.....felt like my mouth.....errrrr.....my
            fingers.....were taped over to gag me. New keyboard....gags off
            now.

            Anyone having an unusual autumn.....or spring? It is obviously
            November, but I am still in shorts here in NCentral Texas. Not
            complaining mind you! I would love to find myself in a warmer
            climate zone so I could try new plants here. Of course, it could
            also meaning saying good bye to old friends.

            Jamie.....glad to see you back and posting!
            Gloria
          • OneSpirit - Autumn Joy
            Pavle, thank you so much for the link you sent. For some reason, I was unable to get your email to be accessible to me; I wanted to reply off list. ~Autumn
            Message 5 of 8 , Nov 2, 2003
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              Pavle, thank you so much for the link you sent. For some reason, I was unable to get your email to be accessible to me; I wanted to reply off list. ~Autumn
              Together we are healing the world...One heart at a time.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Xavier Dequaire
              I do not know if the following experience is reproductible, but it stroke me. Last year some potato must have been forgotten in the soil, this winter was not
              Message 6 of 8 , Nov 8, 2003
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                I do not know if the following experience is reproductible, but it
                stroke me.

                Last year some potato must have been forgotten in the soil, this winter
                was not to hard (I live in Norway), snow was early protecting soil for
                hard frost.

                This year I have been growing potatoes, and the very best harvest was
                from that one potato forgotten from last on a spot I did not touch at
                all.

                I wonder why I would bother growing any thing...

                any comment?

                Xavier
              • jamie
                Hello Xavier, the use of self-seeding vegetables makes agricultural life very easy - as Fukuoka notes, potatoes are vigorous enough to see off most other
                Message 7 of 8 , Nov 9, 2003
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                  Hello Xavier, the use of self-seeding vegetables makes agricultural life
                  very easy - as Fukuoka notes, potatoes are vigorous enough to see off most
                  other plants and will soon spread. I guess in Norway as long as the potatoes
                  are away from air contact they should not be destroyed if the snow cover
                  insulates the ground. Here in France I'm watching some potatoes I've left
                  under mulch shoot up, unfortunately, unless we have only light frosts this
                  winter (just dipping below freezing) they'll not produce a crop before dying
                  off - they lasted well into December last year.

                  I'm still not getting volunteer tomatoes even though i leave many tomatoes
                  to fall to the ground, any ideas on how to get them to volunteer, or does
                  some frost kill the seeds?

                  Jamie
                  Souscayrous

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Xavier Dequaire [mailto:xavier@...]
                  Sent: samedi 8 novembre 2003 22:28
                  To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [fukuoka_farming] naturally big


                  I do not know if the following experience is reproductible, but it
                  stroke me.

                  Last year some potato must have been forgotten in the soil, this winter
                  was not to hard (I live in Norway), snow was early protecting soil for
                  hard frost.

                  This year I have been growing potatoes, and the very best harvest was
                  from that one potato forgotten from last on a spot I did not touch at
                  all.

                  I wonder why I would bother growing any thing...

                  any comment?

                  Xavier


                  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  fukuoka_farming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com



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                • Xavier Dequaire
                  Tomato seeds tolerate well frost, and I guess hard frost ( below -15) like we can get here. Their germination hability is very much increased by a travel
                  Message 8 of 8 , Nov 9, 2003
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                    Tomato seeds tolerate well frost, and I guess hard frost ( below -15)
                    like we can get here.
                    Their germination hability is very much increased by a travel through
                    our digestive system.

                    The most spontaneous germination of tomato I recall is from the toilet
                    compost....
                    And then what an explosion.

                    Otherwise tomatoes do resseed well, but depending of your climate, it
                    can be too late in the season to be able to produce mature fruits
                    before the next winter. This is my experience.
                    May be it will work in the south of France

                    peace

                    Xavier


                    På søndag, 9. november 2003, kl. 12:31, skrev jamie:

                    > Hello Xavier, the use of self-seeding vegetables makes agricultural
                    > life
                    > very easy - as Fukuoka notes, potatoes are vigorous enough to see off
                    > most
                    > other plants and will soon spread. I guess in Norway as long as the
                    > potatoes
                    > are away from air contact they should not be destroyed if the snow
                    > cover
                    > insulates the ground. Here in France I'm watching some potatoes I've
                    > left
                    > under mulch shoot up, unfortunately, unless we have only light frosts
                    > this
                    > winter (just dipping below freezing) they'll not produce a crop before
                    > dying
                    > off - they lasted well into December last year.
                    >
                    > I'm still not getting volunteer tomatoes even though i leave many
                    > tomatoes
                    > to fall to the ground, any ideas on how to get them to volunteer, or
                    > does
                    > some frost kill the seeds?
                    >
                    > Jamie
                    > Souscayrous
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: Xavier Dequaire [mailto:xavier@...]
                    > Sent: samedi 8 novembre 2003 22:28
                    > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [fukuoka_farming] naturally big
                    >
                    >
                    > I do not know if the following experience is reproductible, but it
                    > stroke me.
                    >
                    > Last year some potato must have been forgotten in the soil, this winter
                    > was not to hard (I live in Norway), snow was early protecting soil for
                    > hard frost.
                    >
                    > This year I have been growing potatoes, and the very best harvest was
                    > from that one potato forgotten from last on a spot I did not touch at
                    > all.
                    >
                    > I wonder why I would bother growing any thing...
                    >
                    > any comment?
                    >
                    > Xavier
                    >
                    >
                    > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > fukuoka_farming-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    >
                    >
                    >
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