Re: [fukuoka_farming] Digest Number 404
- Dear Larry,
We had connected before about me trying to figure out contact info. etc. of
Mr. Fukuoka and I think about a New Zealand connection. I have a lot going
on with family health issues and so I will be unsubscribing again and just
visting the website when I have time. Might you keep my email address and
if you hear of anything, send me an email at terra_amore8@... ???
please let me know. I understand if you don't have time for that.
take care all,
hoping for peace...
Martha's Vineyard, MA
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 12:23 PM
Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Digest Number 404
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> There are 4 messages in this issue.
> Topics in this digest:
> 1. Petition
> From: tsering@...
> 2. Fukuoka and the art of dieing !
> From: "Steve Walpole" <stevewalpole@...>
> 3. Re: Fukuoka and the art of dieing !
> From: jbmc@...
> 4. Re: RAW FOODS AND DIET IN GENERAL
> From: "Ingrid Bauer/Jean-Claude Catry"
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 01:28:47 +0100
> From: tsering@...
> Subject: Petition
> Please save the life of this woman! She'll be executed after one month in
> Nigeria because she gave birth to a baby after her divorce. In Amnistia
> Internacional webpage, you can write your surname in "Nombre", your name
> in "Apellidos", your city in "Provincia" and your country in "Pais".
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 11:51:54 +1100
> From: "Steve Walpole" <stevewalpole@...>
> Subject: Fukuoka and the art of dieing !
> So Fukuoka gave us an insight into his understanding of how one can use
> natural farming to perfect the human being.
> "Giving up your ego is the shortest way to unification with nature."
> He talked about becoming the rice plant, not just observing its nature!
> When I read the words of Fukuoka and try to apply them, something rings
> in my heart. Being economical in our action and sustainable action are
> concepts, but Fukuoka appears to come from space rather than a thing.
> Remember when he talked about letting the crops go, so he could observe
> they survive and the result was death of most of his crops. Well I have
> tried to live this experience too.
> The last year or so, I have continued in my endeavours to incorporate his
> initial findings and simply do almost nothing. It has been an amazing
> discovery, in what has died and what has continued to live in my ecosystem
> ie the ego ! Now this has been not easy as I have alot of "crops in my
> garden". I am a "father", "husband", "small business owner", "sports
> etc Therefore my endeavour was to dscover what would happen if allowed
> "crops of the mind to die" to live without a carer persa.
> I personally thought that this was the most econimical lesson Fukuoka
> on to the reader. I have found that this path of letting go, has helped my
> awareness, as the focus has been on space rather than action. For too long
> action has dominated my life. Or should I say the anxiety underlying my
> What I have discovered within myself is simply an anxiety that is present
> alot of the time. This anxiety has a desire and that desire is " to do
> things". I know this sounds crude, yet I have found that this anxiety, has
> little regard for economy, nature, sustainability or space. It just
> "to do things".
> In my opinion, know one can say with certainty that Fukuoka's treatise on
> natural farming is a metaphor. Nor can one truly answer that it is a
> paractise or philosophy. Most certaiinly we will struggle to prove that it
> leads to the perfection of humanity!
> BUT, I do know that it creates space in one life and breathing deep
> of air feels good.
> So now I am left with the awareness that I like "to do things" alot. I am
> also aware that I have attachment to "my crops". That I still dont like
> Thanks for listening,
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 06:15:24 -0800
> From: jbmc@...
> Subject: Re: Fukuoka and the art of dieing !
> Mr. Walpole reported Mr. Fukuoka as writing:
> > "Giving up your ego is the shortest way to unification with nature".
> * * * * * * *
> Profoundly true!, Mr. Walpole. Unfortunately, however,
> Mr. Fukuoka failed to realize that "giving up the ego", that is,
> overcoming the condition of dualism, - far from being a metaphy-
> sical phenomenon - is, in fact, a *physical* process, more speci-
> fically a neurological one, which is inexorably dependent on diet.
> Mr. Fukuoka fatally "assumed" that "the knowledge
> acquired in ancient times of using fire and salt was humanity's na-
> tural destiny", and it is on the quicksand of this fatal assumptioin
> that His tension of re-unification with Nature collapses.
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 11:23:01 -0800
> From: "Ingrid Bauer/Jean-Claude Catry" <instinct@...>
> Subject: Re: RAW FOODS AND DIET IN GENERAL
> > Mr. Catry wrote:
> > > Instinctive regulation of eating works at his most efficient with
> > > undenatured foods ( as we evolved with them for most of our evolution)
> > * * * * * * *
> > I hope You will excuse my ignorance, Mr. Catry,
> > but if i were to eat "instinctively" unadultereted foods, i would
> > end up eating *exclusively* juicy-sweet fruits. I cannot possi-
> > bly think of anything else. But You are stating also that we
> > Human Beings have, prior to the last ten thousands years, a
> > five-million-years long meat-eating evolutive background.
> > I am confused! Where does my fruits-eating
> > instinct come from? And how can i have possibly lost the
> > instinct of my five-million-years long meat-eating heritage?
> > Am i to consider myself a pervert ?
> thanks for asking this question !.
> I am afraid we don't understand the same way the word instinct .
> the way your sentence have been written demonstrate this to me .
> you wrote <if i were to do that experience ( eating instinctivelly
> unenatured foods) i would ..... >
> then you add< i can't possibly think ....
> When i am eating instinctivelly ( and it is an ongoing proposition ) i
> in the present moment and don't think ,i do choose one food among the
> available to me at that precise time following my sense of smell and taste
> That is a primal experience that by pass the cortex .
> The experience of eating instinctivelly can be made easelly if one present
> oneself blind folded to a choice of differents foods as they will be
> presented in nature to us, whole undenatured for the most part ( and big
> mammal meats as bone marrow and brain is available to an hominid on the
> left over carcasses killed by carnivorous in the state of mature half
> meats ).
> Also from the experience of thousands of peoples who have experience
> instinctive eating none had end up eating exclusivelly sweets juicy fruits
> .That is a fact .Tho quite a few have not been able to go beyond their
> vegetarian decision and stayed away from meats as long their body stores
> allowed them to .( B12 deficiency arise after years of deprivation ...)
> Masanobu wrote:
> < animals are born with an instinctive ability to distinguish
> between what they can and cannot eat , and so are able to partake fully
> nature's plentiful stores.
> In man however ,the stage of infancy during wich he feeds instinctivelly
> So he aknowlege the instinctive ability of animals to regulate their food
> intake thru an innate wisdom and deny it to humans because they didn't
> pursue on the experience of practicing it .
> what is the fundamental difference with animals ? ( i will come back to
> question in other posts )
> for that inborn ability to be confirmed by experience babies need to be
> breast fed on cue ( and most of us have not even that ) then introduce to
> foods in their undenatured state and let to choose , from their own
> genetically memorised wisdom, to respond to their present meatabolic
> state .
> Peoples who eat instinctivelly discover that taste and smell are an ever
> changing experience .what is tasting very good can taste bland or even
> distastfull from one day to another and even from one mouthfull to the
> Those differents experiences with the same foods are dependant on the
> metabolic state of the moment and so our nutrients specific needs of the
> what is left for us to do without that practical experience of
> of our instinctive drive .?
> we are left in the situation where a tree have been pruned
> The peoples who put themselves in the position of doing that experience
> decide to trust fully "their instinct " without no more guidelines
> discovered that it was in the long term leading to unbalanced food intake
> the reason is that the context in which our instintive wisdom establish it
> self is not natural anymore .( that is the aera that natural farming CAN
> that context have many aspects :
> 1- fruits especially have been bred over centuries to become "easy" to the
> instinctive barrier ( loss of sharp change of taste when metabolic needs
> fulfilled ) because they have been for the most part continued to be eaten
> in their raw state .the consequence of that to modern instinctive eater
> even more true with modernly bred varieties is overconsumption of fruits .
> 2-the avalability of differents categories of foods ( fruits, seeds ,
> leaves , flowers , animals flesh and bodies etc...) as our hominids
> experienced in their wild environment have been changed thru domestication
> In the tropical forests that shelter our closer relatives fruits are
> available to very agile climbers ,
> In the savannha that nourished our hominids ancestors or even closer
> hominids relatives ( now disapeared) fruits are rare , but tubers and
> over of carnivorous animals are the nutrients dense foods avalable to us
> quantities .
> 3- the neolithic revolution have brought humanity to switch quite abruptly
> ( in evolutionary terms ) from a high protein and fat diets ( bone marrow
> and brain are very fatty foods ) to a high carbonhydrate with the
> introduction of grains and pulses .
> The metabolic disturbances that ensue are starting to be recognised by
> modern science ( insuline resistance , cardiovascular health status ...)
> this upset glycemic yoyo lead to addiction to sweets in an endless
> cycle ( the same way than tilling bring the need for tilling , fertilisers
> Paleo ancestors and hunter gartherers who still live by the old paradigme
> ( high meats and low carbohydrate intake ) have been and are healthier
> the agriculturists .
> More the food is available less the instintive drive toward it need to be
> strong . strongly sweets foods are very attractive because they are rare
> difficult to obtain in our natural environment ( honey and fruits ) .so
> of the
> regulation happens because of this rather that the taste and smell barrier
> for meats who play a big role in regulating the intake .
> so that is where your "fruit eating instinct" come from .
> If you were to put aside evrything that you know about foods (
> discriminating knowdledge ) and play the game of instinctive choice of
> moment You will be very surprised of your choices .
> Blinding the eyes is a good way to bypass a lot of the preconceived ideas
> about foods and their taste.
> you will not be necessarelly able to give a name to the foods you smell
> that are very
> "familiar" to you .
> I did personally the experience of having smelled and tasted something
> sweetly delicious and attractive that i discovered afterward was an onion
> ( and not a walla walla type but a pungeant one) and having smelled a
> grapefruit without being able to recognise it ( everybody "knows" the
> of a grapefruit ).
> masanobu p 253 of natural way of farming ,classifie the 4 major types of
> diets .
> 1the indulgent diet
> 2the nutritional diet ( based on science )
> 3the diet of principal
> 4the non discriminating diet
> the instinctive eating framework is an open door to the last one .( there
> no limitation of what can be food apart of being in its natural state )
> preconceived ideas about foods need to be discarded.foods are chosen in
> present moment .
> The instinctive eating framework is also not a guaranteed opening to stage
> to the dismay of many of its followers.
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