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slopes and books

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  • tiakd14477 <sentree@hotmail.com>
    I m re-reading my permaculture manual, and it, along with several other books, mention planting on north slopes in the northern hemisphere as they are warmer
    Message 1 of 3 , Dec 30, 2002
      I'm re-reading my permaculture manual, and it, along with several
      other books, mention planting on north slopes in the northern
      hemisphere as they are warmer than the south slopes. I do not find
      this is true, and we noted that anything that slopes north is a
      frost pocket and tends to get frosts when the rest of the yard is
      frost free. Anybody else notice this? Why would they say the
      northern hemisphere the north slopes are warmer? Our sun does not
      move across the sky more to the north.
      Are Bill Mollison's permaculture 1 and 2 good additions to
      his "permaculture : a designer's manual", or does his designer's
      manual cover everything that are in 1 and 2?
      Also, does anybody have web sites with information on Marc Bonfils
      or articles on his teachings? Emilia mentioned his name when she was
      giving me advice on hay production, and I'm not finding much on-
      line.
      Emilia, I'm trying to do more research on your hay recommendations
      which I plan on following, just so I can understand more. I know you
      said you learned mainly from Marc Bonfils and Andre Voisin, but I
      can't find much on Marc Bonfils, and don't recall Andre Voisin
      recommending to cut hay before it heads out. Do any books address
      why it is more beneficial to the soil etc. to cut the hay before it
      starts heading out? Does it cause more stress to the plant to put
      more into heading and then cut it or something like that? How does
      cutting it after bloom affect the microclimate, total environment
      etc? I'm trying to share some of the stuff with interested friends,
      but don't really understand the method myself, so it is a case of
      the blind leading the blind :<).
      Thanks
      Heather
    • Wldwstent@aol.com
      I for one will not BUY hay that has headed out. The protein content drops from 12-14% in grass hay that has not headed to a mere eight per cent TOPS for hay
      Message 2 of 3 , Jan 3, 2003
        I for one will not BUY hay that has headed out. The protein content drops
        from 12-14% in grass hay that has not headed to a mere eight per cent TOPS
        for hay that has BEGUN to bloom. Once grass has bloomed it is STRAW. THAT IS
        THE DEFINITION OF STRAW my dear. The heads shatter, the seeds scatter. Not
        only is the protein content of the "hay" lost but most of the grain involved
        is also lost in the cutting and curing of said "hay."


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • tiakd14477 <sentree@hotmail.com>
        Just a confusion in definition of terms. I live in a prairie province where everybody grows grain and hay, and this is how they refer to their crops. Around
        Message 3 of 3 , Jan 3, 2003
          Just a confusion in definition of terms. I live in a prairie
          province where everybody grows grain and hay, and this is how they
          refer to their crops.
          Around here (the grain province of Canada), nothing is straw until
          the seeds have fallen off. When grain plants "head out", they are
          FORMING heads, not shattering seeds. If they were to cut all the
          straw here when it was "heading out", they would lose all their
          grain crops because the grain hasn't properly matured when it is
          heading out. IF they cut it when it is heading out, it is called
          green feed, because the heads are still in the dough/soft stage, and
          stay on the stalks. When the heads are "ripe" they are ready to be
          combined for grain.
          Once grass has "headed out", it does not shatter. Nobody cuts their
          grass for seed after it has headed out, or they will get no seeds.
          It is not considered straw unless the heads mature, then bloom and
          pollinate, then go to seed, and THEN shatter (which from heading to
          shattering can be a period of 2-4 weeks around here). Here, they
          usually cut timothy just as it is heading (or just as the heads are
          forming), but before blooming. If they cut alfalfa "before it
          heads", they means they have cut it before any heads ie. before it
          has heads to bloom.
          You obviously mean something different than I meant. Around
          here "heading out" and "has bloomed" do not mean the same thing.
          IT doesn't mean the farmers here are cutting hay at the correct
          time, as they are cutting for maximum yields, not health of the
          field or top protien content.
          Emilia said to cut it before the heads even formed, not before
          blooming, which is after heads have formed and are now opening. If
          the alfalfa headed out here, you would have a 2-4 week period before
          it bloomed and then went to seed ie. became straw.

          --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, Wldwstent@a... wrote:
          > I for one will not BUY hay that has headed out. The protein
          content drops
          > from 12-14% in grass hay that has not headed to a mere eight per
          cent TOPS
          > for hay that has BEGUN to bloom. Once grass has bloomed it is
          STRAW. THAT IS
          > THE DEFINITION OF STRAW my dear. The heads shatter, the seeds
          scatter. Not
          > only is the protein content of the "hay" lost but most of the
          grain involved
          > is also lost in the cutting and curing of said "hay."
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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