Re: some of the threads under moderation
- --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Alan Sloan <alan851603@...> wrote:
> IMHO all threads have been squarely within that definition, except perhaps the recent spat regarding moderation of another site.If Shashi wants to limit discussion only to the 'agricultural aspects' of Natural Farming, then that is his right. I would accept that, however, I think it would make the list a little dry at times.
> Not everything uncomfortable is off topic, but discussions about another forum, well, it's on the edge, by definition......
Again, this is a discussion about the pros and cons of a mailing list versus a discussion forum where different areas of discussion can be separated off and ignored if not of interest.
The concept and theory of Natural Farming has a far greater circle of influence into one's own life and the world around us. At this moment, accepted, it is very weak in the world but if practised on a personal level requires and creates change in the person and has far reaching ramifications.
Although it is something that can be used as a gee-whiz marketing device to increase website clicks, it's not a "product". To be frank, approached properly, it does challenge current orders in society.
Natural Farming also has a social aspect, the nature of the society of Natural Farming, its relationship with its close neighbours such as the Permiesculturists, and opposing cultures such as industrial agriculture.
I would say that is all open to discussion and do not see that as "mud slinging".
In this case, it directly included the mishandling of a discussion with Larry Korn about Fukuoka, and so it is impossible to say it is "not connected". It cut down a value tree or crop. Actually, the difference in cultures is very interesting to observe from a Natural Farming perspective (which some here have little clue about).
If someone is to adopt "Natural Farming" as a purely marketing device, I would say it is no longer Natural Farming. If "Big Ag" were tomorrow run out of fossil fuels and steam wholesale into "Natural Farming" as they are currently in Organic Farming ... applying their same politics and exploitative mode of operation ... then I would say it is unnatural farming again.
(Totalitarianism, exploitation of land rights and labor etc are not Natural Farming)
I think Permaculture and Natural Farming are far too small and intricate theories for big business to ever be interest but it will come and rob whatever is of value that it can, and some people will sell out to it for the money. Again, just as in the wholefoods world, organic farming and environmental movements.
So the cultures and leaders of these movements are worth watching.
Some people will be unhappy with exacting discussion. They want FNF or PC to be an escapist dream, a sounds good business device, a cult even. They don't want to observe closely and question. Imagine if Fukuoka were observing this discussion and seeing it as one of his fields, how would he deal it?