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Re: [fukuoka_farming] RE: Children's education

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  • Larry Haftl
    ... one; please ... Hi Robert, I know what you mean about his URLs. Try this one. It seems to consistantly get through to his home page:
    Message 1 of 5 , Nov 5, 2002
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      At Tuesday, 5 November 2002, you wrote:

      >Hi Larry and Everybody,
      >Those Holmgren sites are hard to pull up--no response from this
      one; please
      >check again.

      Hi Robert,

      I know what you mean about his URLs. Try this one. It seems to consistantly
      get through to his home page:


      From there you can get to his articles by clicking on the "Articles
      CD" link.

      Larry Haftl
    • Justin .
      Regarding the trouble with getting this url to work: when I received this mail, the url is actually cut in two, with only the first part appearing in blue. Whn
      Message 2 of 5 , Nov 6, 2002
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        Regarding the trouble with getting this url to work: when I received this
        mail, the url is actually cut in two, with only the first part appearing in
        blue. Whn I stuck it back together it worked. So try this, all on one line:

        I've tried to start this message six times so far and it always comes
        out ugly. So let me ease into it by suggesting you read an article
        by David Holmgren about media technology and children's learning
        abilities. The link is http://www.spacountry.net.au/holmgren/CollWrit.
        and the article is I think the 24th on the list. Its about Media

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      • Robin, Maya, or Napi
        Good morning, Although I have not yet followed the instructions that you sent earlier for tracking down the Holmgren sites, I have saved the directions; it is
        Message 3 of 5 , Nov 6, 2002
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          Good morning,

          Although I have not yet followed the instructions that you sent
          earlier for tracking down the Holmgren sites, I have saved the
          directions; it is clearly a worthwhile project. Larry has piqued
          curiosity even further.

          The two children's projects below are enriching in their detail &
          inspiring in their example. These links are more to us about brother
          schools (what we also call sister schools) where observing nature &
          garden projects is in the curriculum of both science & spirit, far
          different from planting seeds in styrofoam (!) cups for sale as a PTA

          The two sites below are a crisp example of how knowledge from this
          group spreads in ripples through the Circle School. Thank you,
          Robert, for another treat. As we have many times, our staff took
          turns with reading the article & being on duty. One might think that
          we have been lazy to have let so much important research fall into our
          laps, when we could have just typed into the search engine & gone
          looking ourselves. It may be pertinent, not to boast, but proudly, to
          say that, thin as we are spread, we do conduct early childhood
          research, produce conferences & conduct creditable course work,
          including on computer for continuing education requirements of our

          Circle School has an infant nursery, goes through pre-school &
          early elementary, supports homeschoolers of many grades, including
          middle & high school, trains community service interns, including high
          school job training, court ordered community service, corporate &
          student program community service, & for 7 years we have been a
          work-study placement site, for students from the local university who
          are majoring in early childhood education, developmental psychology,
          nursing, physical therapy, social work, art education, physical
          education, etc. So, we are the place where children from the families
          of our blue-collar, drug-blighted, two-hundred year old neighborhood,
          literally from birth through college & still when they become parents,
          has a connection to ongoing natural gardening, a vegetarian cafeteria,
          earth-conscious community projects, & membership in an organic foods
          cooperative. Eight children who have come here have parents who also
          were students here. The parents began as teen interns, volunteered,
          went on staff, now have their own families. Their children here are
          like the grandchildren who share their Ol' Na Na, & inherited the
          schoolhouse & grounds that their parents literally helped build. They
          look through the mirror to see the complex feelings of Fukuoka's
          family. Can we just make this place spiffier, like our normal
          friends' schools?

          Sorry that my reference to the magic button was abstruse. I meant
          to find out if there are is any possibility or intent of visitors to
          the Fukuoka site having a page to early childhood educators, with
          references culled from Traveling with Seedballs, & with links to
          children's projects based on his work, or more generally toward
          children's projects in sustainable gardening. Even if the visitor
          could take the direction from that page only to the Moo Baan Dek
          School in Thailand, & the links below, then the seeking educator would
          have been well served, prepared thus with materials to impress the
          principal or the PTA, that this basis for botany is far beyond the
          flower bed projects where children spoon-dig ready-grown trays of
          seedlings into rows. I would humbly submit a description, with photos
          if necessary or appropriate, of Circle School's Fukuoka-based project
          in the city park.

          The use of the word ugly in an earlier message had alerted me to
          the misunderstanding. In Wednesday morning's e-mail was a happier
          flurry of discussion. Now the readable blurb on the Holmgren article
          (which clicks to say open in Quicktime, & have tried a couple ways to
          no avail) confirms that Mr. Larry & Circle School do have the same
          usage of ugly.

          Holmgrens's Collected Articles says, "The following articles were all
          written concurrently with the manuscript of the new book (in press)
          Permaculture: Principles & Pathways To Sustainability and illustrate
          both classic and novel applications of permaculture thinking.


          In this previously unpublished article I speculate on how media
          technologies may also involve conceptual
          regressions and losses which undermine our ability to think
          holistically and adapt to an emerging low energy
          future. The ideas were stimulated by the experience of learning
          and teaching skills in reading landscape and
          have been refined through informal discussions on Permaculture
          Design Courses over a number of years. The
          bleak analysis it contains provides a counterbalance to my
          prevailing optimism about information and design
          creativity providing the lubricant for rapid evolution of low
          energy systems."

          Circle School teaching is based on interactive, perceptive,
          television-free, 3D, breathing, live & in person relationships. The
          education includes the children's observation of trial & error. The
          web study of the links to projects that I requested is for the
          educators, with juicy information, like what school districts have
          gotten grants. The link I requested is not to occupy our children,
          that is what the park & the seafloor garden are for.

          One of the highlights of a teacher or parent's eager study of how
          to do right by children, must be the discovery of the works of Joseph
          Chilton Pierce, a strong advocate of Waldorf, as Permaculture's
          founder Holmgren is. Hearing Pierce succinctly lecture on brain
          development - lizard stem as a finger, overlapped by mammal brain as a
          fist, overlapped by human brain as an open hand layered on top -
          parents & teachers are firmly warned about the dangers of development
          out of sequence. By introducing the 'reading' of symbols & 2
          dimensional screens, EVEN interactive screens, little brains work up
          the intellectual human brain at the expense of the ability to relate
          in the warmth of mammalian eye-contact empathy. Society suffers
          already from the lack of exercise of the ability to care for our
          fellow mammals. The good news is: it is never too late to exercise
          the ability, by looking at our children, holding them, practicing
          caring about them & asking them to care. Hope that does nutshell
          justice to why Circle School is, in its TV-free way, practically
          Luddite compared with most programs out there in public schools.

          If Mr. Larry was about to get ugly at the notion of bringing the
          children out of the dirt to study gardening on the computer, bless
          him. Hope someone here can get that Holmgren article #24 open. We
          appreciate your comments, Mr. Bob. We readers are your students here
          in the Bergson Nature School Post. Where is Mr. Leland? All this
          ranting wanders right back to his stuff.
          Good night,

          Robert Monie wrote:

          > Hi Larry and Everybody,
          > Those Holmgren sites are hard to pull up--no response from this one;
          > please check again.
          > Children are not mechanistic and therefore may be ideally suited to
          > follow the natural farming way. Most children have no trouble just
          > marching after Fukuoka and throwing out the seedballs. Children are
          > featured throughout his latest book in Japanese, "Traveling with
          > Seedballs." Children take readily to any kind of approximately
          > natural agriculture, including biointensive, biodynamic, and
          > forest-farming.
          > I don't know of any "magic button" to link all the educational spots
          > that teach children about natural farming, and I doubt I can find
          > another "sister" school like the one in Thailand, but I do know two
          > more web sites about sustainable agriculture and kids. One is
          > concerned with Hidden Villa in the Los Altos Hills of California
          > (which might be a good place for a novice farmer to intern):
          > http://www.backdoorjobs.com/farming.html
          > and a web notice about a grant in Minnesota designed to give kids
          > some hands on experience in sustainable farming:
          > http://www.msmarket.org/news_mfc_children.htm
          > Many web sites are temperamental; I hope these come up.
          > If I were founding a school (perish the thought), I think I would
          > name it Bergson Nature School, after the French philosopher Henri
          > Bergson, who placed so much value on "intuition," a quality children
          > have in plenty. For grownups, though, we would need to teach a
          > course "engineering yourself, step by step into nature," which
          > Bergson would have found hilariously funny.
          > Bob Monie

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