Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [fukuoka_farming] fukuoka

Expand Messages
  • Nandan Palaparambil
    Hi Steve, I also have faced with disturbing soil while planting ginger, turmeric, tapioca, elephant foot yam etc..it looks like it is unavoidable being the
    Message 1 of 9 , Dec 10, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi Steve,

      I also have faced with disturbing soil while planting ginger, turmeric, tapioca, elephant foot yam etc..it looks like it is unavoidable being the root crops. Conventionally each time raised bed is created for planting these root crops which causes lot of soil disturbance. Hoping that this can be avoided in future.


      Jason - Thanks for the interpretation of 'Do nothing' as 'Do nothing against nature', it brings more clarity.



      Regards,

      Nandan



      ________________________________
      From: Steve Grannis <grannis04@...>
      To: "fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com" <fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2011 10:29 PM
      Subject: [fukuoka_farming] fukuoka


       
      To all,
                 I am always amazed by the way something new is learned each time I watch films of Fukuoka. A picture is worth a thousand words.

                 What I observed was the vegetable gardening in the orchard. I see that a small cut has been made in the ground cover and the earth has been pulled back. The resulting open earth is then seeded. This shows there are many approaches to natural farming. There may be an assumption that NF does not disturb the soil but there are times when it is unavoidable such as in harvesting root crops. I have avoided cutting into the soil and have employed mulches to prepare seed beds. I have crimped tall ground covers and made a small seed beds in the exposed soil. I have transplanted seedlings into mulched beds. I've made small furrows in the ground cover and hand seeded. When we farm naturally the disruption we cause in the soil is unavoidable. The damage can be measured by what nature presents to herself. If an animal's hoof penetrate the soil, a tree uproots in the forest or a flood or fire changes the land there is disruption. Our approaches
      can be informed by these events. I see it not as "Do-nothing" but "Do-Nature" farming. Peace, Steve G.

      ________________________________
      From: SteveG <grannis04@...>
      To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Saturday, December 3, 2011 10:31 PM
      Subject: [fukuoka_farming] fukuoka


       
      To all,
      If you enjoyed the previous link these will be more enlightening and closer to the source. Steve G.

      -> http://themotivatedyouth.com/2010/06/cool-cat-masanobu-fukuoka/
      > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSKSxLHMv9k )

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Ruthie Aquino
      Dear Jason, The Sherlock Holmes of natural farming is you. At best I could be Watson...hehe... Your translation seems to be on the spot:
      Message 2 of 9 , Dec 11, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        Dear Jason,

        The Sherlock Holmes of natural farming is you. At best I could be
        Watson...hehe...
        Your translation seems to be on the spot: do-nothing-against-Nature. I
        understand it also as : do-nothing-to-hinder-Nature.
        Let her have a free hand and give her some assistance when she needs it.
        Fukuoka explains it in the videos.
        You can also see him and the youths working hard with sickles, or pails
        hung round their shoulders, while neighboring farmers use machines. He
        makes seed balls to trick the appetites of birds and rodents. So...he's
        not exactly being passive. He's actively giving his favored crops a hand.
        You can also view him strewing chicken droppings and disheveling straw
        bundles. It's all work.
        And play.
        Ever heard of the story of the man who never worked and never will?

        Have a nice day.
        RUTHIE

        I'm still looking for your lady, Sir.

        2011/12/10 Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>

        > **
        >
        >
        > Thanks Steve Grannis,
        >
        > for your thoughts i heartily agree with,
        > and for posting those "closer to the source" film links.
        >
        > Fukuoka Masanobu's Oct 2002 teachings at the "Nature as Teacher" workshop,
        > Navdanya, India,
        > relayed by Kristi, in brief-part, in Jan 2003,
        > quoting:
        > "
        > Fukuoka said that while most farmers run around asking questions like "how
        > do i do this?" or "what can i do about this?", he asks "how can i NOT do
        > this?" or "how can i let nature do this for me?" but, he reminded us that
        > his techniques are not literally do-nothing. they are more like do nothing
        > against nature.
        > "
        > -> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/fukuoka_farming/message/1889
        >
        > This Yahoo! group on 31 January 2003.
        >
        > Furthermore, in my longish words, but as brief as seems possible without
        > spending time copyediting them:
        >
        > "Do-nothing" the phrase is used in quotes in the translations books,
        > because of "do-nothing" as the Japanese idiom signifier in English
        > (only in Fukuoka Masanobu's simplifying English, and
        > signifying--of--a--Japanese--meaning--only English)---it gets its intended
        > meaning from the Japanese meaning (only).
        > It does not at all get its meaning from the literal 'doing nothing'
        > English phrase's meaning---this literal--ness has caused confusion. As a
        > game instructing those do who behave destructively of nature and
        > are Anglophones (English speakers) to literally do nothing, to literally
        > stop any practises, it is useful---in that simplistic double meaning from
        > the literal reading.
        > In those of us Anglophones who heartfelt, genuinely do not wish to destroy
        > nature, and wish to advance in our nature/natural farming practises to
        > having some plants growing themselves well, it is not at all literally
        > doing nothing... . Nature includes the whole Universe--Cosmos, including us
        > Homo sapiens, including ourselves. So, i'm referring to not being self
        > destructive, not being self punishing, as much as i'm referring to not
        > destructive of forests, plants, animals, insects, frogs, reptiles, snakes,
        > tigers, monkeys, spiders, soil organisms incl. worms, bacteria, fungi,
        > liverworts, mosses, crytogamic--crusts, lichens, velvet worms, etc. etc.
        >
        > "Do-nothing" provides a simplification English translation of the
        > widespread--around--east--Asia Tao--philosophy Wú wéi (the idiom well known
        > in the West: Wú wéi idiom, well known nowadays, since it was not well known
        > in the time of the 1978 English translation "The One--Straw Revolution").
        > "Do-nothing" the Japanese idiom signifier written by Japanese people:
        > 無為 (mu i (--transliteration---pronounced moo i), including by late sensei
        > Fukuoka Masanobu in all, probably all, must be all, of his books in
        > Japanese.
        > Written in olden times by Japanese people as the traditional:
        > 無爲 characters (mu i (--roman characters transliteration---pronounced moo
        > i)---the same just an old, traditional version.
        >
        > Below linked are the into--English full dictionary translations, of the
        > "Do-nothing" Japanese idiom signifier:
        > " www.buddhism-dict.net/cgi-bin/xpr-ddb.pl?q=無爲<http://www.buddhism-dict.net/cgi-bin/xpr-ddb.pl?q=%E7%84%A1%E7%88%B2>"
        >
        > " www.buddhism-dict.net/cgi-bin/xpr-dealt.pl?71.xml+id('c7121-7232') "
        > ---from the ways it is said in Japanese, Chinese, Korean, ... (see under
        > the pronunciation list--transliterations) and the ways it is said in its
        > Sanskrit equivalent(s), India, and in Tibetan equivalent(s)
        > (transliterations of equivalents):Please copy and paste those link URLs,
        > written between the quote marks, into your browser address bars, as Yahoo
        > has always technically corrupted those links by breaking them after the
        > question marks. Let me know if it doesn't work for you please. --- Dear Mr.
        > Muthu Kannan, did it work for you, in the end??
        > Non-members login as "guest" (username), without any password. See the top
        > right of -> http://www.buddhism-dict.net/ddb/
        >
        > Please all let me know if you want me to write that above more plainly and
        > simply, to copyedit it more and write it more properly, and to explain what
        > i know about it more properly---longer but clearer writing.
        >
        > Please read:
        > Sugawara, Makoto; Sabin, Burritt (1989). Nihongo: A Japanese approach to
        > Japanese. Tōkyo, Japan: East Publications. ISBN 4915645061.
        >
        > Google Books link: ->
        > http://books.google.com.au/books?id=fKkPAAAAYAAJ&redir_esc=y
        > Coincidently, i happened to be reading it for ongoing learning last night
        > in front of the fire--wood stove before going to bed.
        > ---about general Japanese language including about literal meanings taken
        > out of context by non-native Japanese language students, about idioms and
        > many very rich word's implied meaning when taken in context of Japanese
        > customs, classical culture(s), literature, history, combination history of
        > development of the culture from both original Indigenous Japanese peoples
        > and rice growing farmers' peoples from the mainland (nowadays called Korea
        > and China).
        >
        > 'best true nature' with all,
        >
        > Mr. Jason Stewart.
        >
        > ________________________________
        > From: Steve Grannis <grannis04@...>
        > To: "fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com" <fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com>
        > Sent: Sunday, 11 December 2011, 3:59
        > Subject: [fukuoka_farming] fukuoka
        >
        >
        >
        > To all,
        > I am always amazed by the way something new is learned each
        > time I watch films of Fukuoka. A picture is worth a thousand words.
        >
        > What I observed was the vegetable gardening in the orchard. I
        > see that a small cut has been made in the ground cover and the earth has
        > been pulled back. The resulting open earth is then seeded. This shows there
        > are many approaches to natural farming. There may be an assumption that NF
        > does not disturb the soil but there are times when it is unavoidable such
        > as in harvesting root crops. I have avoided cutting into the soil and have
        > employed mulches to prepare seed beds. I have crimped tall ground covers
        > and made a small seed beds in the exposed soil. I have transplanted
        > seedlings into mulched beds. I've made small furrows in the ground cover
        > and hand seeded. When we farm naturally the disruption we cause in the soil
        > is unavoidable. The damage can be measured by what nature presents to
        > herself. If an animal's hoof penetrate the soil, a tree uproots in the
        > forest or a flood or fire changes the land there is disruption. Our
        > approaches
        > can be informed by these events. I see it not as "Do-nothing" but
        > "Do-Nature" farming. Peace, Steve G.
        >
        > ________________________________
        > From: SteveG <grannis04@...>
        > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Saturday, December 3, 2011 10:31 PM
        > Subject: [fukuoka_farming] fukuoka
        >
        >
        > To all,
        > If you enjoyed the previous link these will be more enlightening and
        > closer to the source. Steve G.
        >
        > -> http://themotivatedyouth.com/2010/06/cool-cat-masanobu-fukuoka/
        > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XSKSxLHMv9k)
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Jason Stewart
        To anyone who reads late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei s large body of Japanese original published works and reads his works in their various English translations,
        Message 3 of 9 , Dec 11, 2011
        • 0 Attachment
          To anyone who reads late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei's large body of Japanese original published works and reads his works in their various English translations, these points i have previously pointed out have early on become quite obvious, eg. the translation errors, the out of context�ness where it occurs, the majority of great parts of translations, the inserted words of the translators (some helpful and some not helpful) which are not words of his own, etc. etc. .

          --His Japanese original books, more than 15 of them documented,
          --his Japanese original Japanese�published scholarly journal papers, more than 10 documented,
          --his original Japanese government reports he wrote while working for the gov't,
          --his national public Japan Broadcasting Corporation NHK television documentaries and interviews,
          --his authored many many newspaper articles and the newspaper column, farming advice, he wrote for many years in the Ehime Shimbun newspaper,
          And the many many original writings about his works and himself,
          --by independent 3rd party Japanese people, from scholarly high quality articles and professional elite�quality journalism articles and the many high quality newspaper obituaries of him after he died 3 years ago, --to everything in between, to,
          --the comments sometimes trashy, sometimes slanderous--scandalous--&--outrageous and sometimes just plainly despicable, in the internet and in particular some blogs about him, in both Japanese and of course occuring in ignorant English internet stuff.

          Then, after the Japanese original sources, the many *partial* translations, in English and documented more than 20 other languages.

          On 11/12/2011, at 8:11 PM, Ruthie Aquino wrote:

          > The Sherlock Holmes of natural farming is you. At best I could be
          > Watson...hehe...



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Steve Grannis
          Jason,         I would be very interested in this; --his authored many many newspaper articles and the newspaper column, farming advice, he wrote for
          Message 4 of 9 , Dec 12, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            Jason,
                    I would be very interested in this;
            --his authored many many newspaper articles and the newspaper
            column, farming advice, he wrote for many years in the Ehime Shimbun
            newspaper,
                    Is there a way to access this material either through print or web preferably in Ehglish? Thanks,  Steve G.



            ________________________________
            From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
            To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2011 5:53 PM
            Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] ' "Do-nothing" against nature' Re: Fukuoka Masanobu

            To anyone who reads late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei's large body of Japanese original published works and reads his works in their various English translations, these points i have previously pointed out have early on become quite obvious, eg. the translation errors, the out of context–ness where it occurs, the majority of great parts of translations, the inserted words of the translators (some helpful and some not helpful) which are not words of his own, etc. etc. .

            --His Japanese original books, more than 15 of them documented,
            --his Japanese original Japanese–published scholarly journal papers, more than 10 documented,
            --his original Japanese government reports he wrote while working for the gov't,
            --his national public Japan Broadcasting Corporation NHK television documentaries and interviews,
            --his authored many many newspaper articles and the newspaper column, farming advice, he wrote for many years in the Ehime Shimbun newspaper,
            And the many many original writings about his works and himself,
            --by independent 3rd party Japanese people, from scholarly high quality articles and professional elite–quality journalism articles and the many high quality newspaper obituaries of him after he died 3 years ago, --to everything in between, to,
            --the comments sometimes trashy, sometimes slanderous--scandalous--&--outrageous and sometimes just plainly despicable, in the internet and in particular some blogs about him, in both Japanese and of course occuring in ignorant English internet stuff.

            Then, after the Japanese original sources, the many *partial* translations, in English and documented more than 20 other languages.

            On 11/12/2011, at 8:11 PM, Ruthie Aquino wrote:

            > The Sherlock Holmes of natural farming is you. At best I could be
            > Watson...hehe...



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Jason Stewart
            Dear Steve Grannis, and all, I ve got some more research to do on that subject, before i can explain all, and answer all at once, all the points and history
            Message 5 of 9 , Dec 13, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              Dear Steve Grannis, and all,

              I've got some more research to do on that subject, before i can explain all, and answer all at once, all the points and history about it, that i would like to say, to cover it comprehensively, in a message about it to this group. Unfortunately this afternoon, one of the starting points for explanation, i need to re-find, as i didn't find it this afternoon in the location in the document i thought it was---it is elsewhere. So, to be continued... . And as always i'm busy.

              Meanwhile Steve, have you seen dodgy--pedia's editor's attempts at encyclopaedically writing up late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei's term "do--nothing", in Chinese it is written 無爲 -- in Pinyin Chinese wúwéi,
              in his Japanese written: 無為 (mu i – pronounced moo i (like short ee sound))
              --see the fun learner's song, children i know here in Australia love this fun song: → http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Zxuy6eojZY

              here:
              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wu_wei

              This recent editor of dodgy--pedia's addition, of this re--quoted story below, is quite a good start of the idiom intended,
              Wikipedia quotation:
              "
              Idea: A man has a horse to work the fields and the horse runs away one day. The man's son becomes very anxious and worried that they will not be able to work the fields without the horse. The father says do nothing (wu wei)this may be a blessing. A few days later the horse returns with a group of horses. The father and son are very happy because of their luck and now have many horses to work the fields. Since they have so many horses the son is now able to ride a new horse daily. His father warns him not to take so much pride and to stop riding the horses, but the son ignores him. One day the son falls from the horse that he was riding and breaks both of his legs. All the neighbors come to tell the father this is terrible luck as his son will be unable to help in the fields. The wise father tells his neighbors, do nothing (wu wei) this may be a blessing. A few weeks later war breaks out in the region and all the young men are taken off to fight in the war. Many of the boys die; however, the son who has broken his legs is unable to leave and fight and his life was spared.
              "

              To everyone applicable, no necessarily you Steve,
              if you are a very serious or 'born again' Christian person, then as i did with such a friend of mine yesterday,
              read this good story above with the phrase "God's plan" instead of wúwéi --as the Christian--idiomatic translation of wúwéi, of late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei' "do--nothing"!


              'best true nature' with all,

              Jason Stewart san.

              On 13/12/2011, at 8:12 AM, Steve Grannis wrote:

              > Jason,
              > I would be very interested in this;
              > --his authored many many newspaper articles and the newspaper
              > column, farming advice, he wrote for many years in the Ehime Shimbun
              > newspaper,
              > Is there a way to access this material either through print or web preferably in Ehglish? Thanks, Steve G.



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Steve Grannis
              Dear Jason and all,                                Thank you for the further refinement of do-nothing . I have always been
              Message 6 of 9 , Dec 13, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                Dear Jason and all,
                                               Thank you for the further refinement of "do-nothing". I have always been uncomfortable with the "do-nothing" translation. Wu wei fits the idea but we are still left without a suitable word in english unless we venture into the religious or spiritual realms as you imply. The story speaks to me of Lao Tzu and the Tao Te Ching. The american inventer Buckminster Fuller coined the expression "spaceship Earth" . He said there was no operation manual for the planet. The Tao Te Ching is the closest thing we have for an operation manual for the planet. The idea of non-action yet alert awareness brings me close to the natural farming of Fukuoka. This subject could be discussed endlessly. Thank you for the great story.Steve G.



                ________________________________
                From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
                To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2011 4:15 AM
                Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] ' "Do-nothing" against nature' Re: Fukuoka Masanobu


                 
                Dear Steve Grannis, and all,

                I've got some more research to do on that subject, before i can explain all, and answer all at once, all the points and history about it, that i would like to say, to cover it comprehensively, in a message about it to this group. Unfortunately this afternoon, one of the starting points for explanation, i need to re-find, as i didn't find it this afternoon in the location in the document i thought it was---it is elsewhere. So, to be continued... . And as always i'm busy.

                Meanwhile Steve, have you seen dodgy--pedia's editor's attempts at encyclopaedically writing up late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei's term "do--nothing", in Chinese it is written 無爲 -- in Pinyin Chinese wúwéi,
                in his Japanese written: 無為 (mu i – pronounced moo i (like short ee sound))
                --see the fun learner's song, children i know here in Australia love this fun song: → http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Zxuy6eojZY

                here:
                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wu_wei

                This recent editor of dodgy--pedia's addition, of this re--quoted story below, is quite a good start of the idiom intended,
                Wikipedia quotation:
                "
                Idea: A man has a horse to work the fields and the horse runs away one day. The man's son becomes very anxious and worried that they will not be able to work the fields without the horse. The father says do nothing (wu wei)this may be a blessing. A few days later the horse returns with a group of horses. The father and son are very happy because of their luck and now have many horses to work the fields. Since they have so many horses the son is now able to ride a new horse daily. His father warns him not to take so much pride and to stop riding the horses, but the son ignores him. One day the son falls from the horse that he was riding and breaks both of his legs. All the neighbors come to tell the father this is terrible luck as his son will be unable to help in the fields. The wise father tells his neighbors, do nothing (wu wei) this may be a blessing. A few weeks later war breaks out in the region and all the young men are taken off to fight in the
                war. Many of the boys die; however, the son who has broken his legs is unable to leave and fight and his life was spared.
                "

                To everyone applicable, no necessarily you Steve,
                if you are a very serious or 'born again' Christian person, then as i did with such a friend of mine yesterday,
                read this good story above with the phrase "God's plan" instead of wúwéi --as the Christian--idiomatic translation of wúwéi, of late Fukuoka Masanobu sensei' "do--nothing"!

                'best true nature' with all,

                Jason Stewart san.

                On 13/12/2011, at 8:12 AM, Steve Grannis wrote:

                > Jason,
                > I would be very interested in this;
                > --his authored many many newspaper articles and the newspaper
                > column, farming advice, he wrote for many years in the Ehime Shimbun
                > newspaper,
                > Is there a way to access this material either through print or web preferably in Ehglish? Thanks, Steve G.

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.