Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates

Expand Messages
  • Boovarahan Srinivasan
    Thanks for your encouraging words. Normally we get rains in October / November. And the summer is from March peaking in May. On first June I prepared the
    Message 1 of 13 , Sep 2, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      Thanks for your encouraging words.
      Normally we get rains in October / November. And the summer is from March
      peaking in May.
      On first June I prepared the saplings. They were transplanted after one
      month on the main field.
      Still the tender plants could not withstand the intense heat and hot air and
      about 50 % of them died.
      I replaced them with cut setts .

      As you have rightly said , I have noted the stem borer doing more good.
      Though they suck the stem of the main crop , it results in a number of
      tillers to sprout.

      Normally in our area , farmers cut the sugarcane into three or four pieces
      and bury them in wet soil. This resylts in crowded growth of sugarcane
      making them compete for sunlight. Also not all setts sprout in this method.
      So I tried to grow them in tea cups and select good saplings and transplant
      them . The process went on well so long as the saplings were in shade. Once
      the were exposed to intense heat , many of them could not survive. I learnt
      a big lesson that that the old saying in Tamil " AAdi Pattam Theadi Vidhai "
      meaning sow in the Tamil month of Aadi ( July end / August beginning ) - the
      period after the sun starts to travel in the southern hemisphere , is worth
      gold. This results in slanting sun rays from the south lessening the
      intensity of heat. Also this gives the plants to grow sufficiently high to
      withstand the ensuing rains .

      The land has been taken on lease and the previous owner had already ploughe
      it and I got nothing to do in this regard. But I have not done adding
      anything nor weeding . All the weeds are allowed to grow and die on their
      own. I hope to see good growth in the coming months.

      Also I have notice no earthworms in the field due to chemical farming for
      the past 20 years. Let's hope they turn in soon to bore the field.

      On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:

      > **
      >
      >
      > From my little experience, your plants look ok. I would be worried if they
      > grew too much in the first few months as the stem would become weak. The
      > growth is exponential in the 4-5 months and then it continues that way all
      > along.
      >
      > Here is what I think might be the reason for a Jan - Dec season for
      > sugarcane in our region. We get rains in monsoon season - June to Sep. We
      > get odd rains in April and May. March and April are the only months that
      > require irrigation.
      >
      > Another interesting observation was about the infections/insect attacks.
      > The
      > only attack I saw in the early months was the borer. However this did not
      > apparently cause much harm. It in fact it helped in the further branching
      > of
      > the plant.
      >
      > I have a few questions:
      > a. Why did you not do direct seeding? What disadvantages do you see in this
      > method?
      > b. How was the land prepared for transplanting?
      > c. What is pattern of rains in that part of the country?
      >
      > Regards,
      > Harish
      >



      > Boovarahan S
      >
      Chennai.
      09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Harish Amur
      Interesting. *Growing season:* Are all the farmers in your region harvest sugarcane just before the monsoon? It occurs to me that the growing season is driven
      Message 2 of 13 , Sep 3, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        Interesting.

        *Growing season:* Are all the farmers in your region harvest sugarcane just
        before the monsoon? It occurs to me that the growing season is driven more
        by the 'sugar factories' rather than old practice! The factories in our
        region are functional during the first half of the year. And that is why
        sugarcane is grown jan - dec here. Now, I do not know if the factories work
        based on the sugarcane growth cycle or the sugarcane is grown based on
        factory demand!

        *Area per plant:* I was also worried about the area per plant. On repeated
        requests our farmer listened to me and provided 5' between the rows. Subhash
        Palekarji (http://palekarzerobudgetnaturalfarming.com/home.html)recommends8'
        between the rows and I was trying to push this through! Although this
        distance seems too much when they are planted, it is quite evident when they
        grow. Even with the 5' distance the plants do not have enough room in our
        farm. The local practice is to plant them even closer, some at 2' while some
        at 1'. (And they argue that this kind of spacing leaves no room for weeds!
        And that you get more yield per acre.)

        The other day, I was reading this from OSR.

        "I do not try to raise tall fast-growing plants with big leaves. Instead, I
        keep the plants as compact as possible. Keep the head small, do not
        overnourish the plants, and let them grow true to the natural form of the
        rice plant. Usually rice plants three or four feet tall produce luxuriant
        leaves and give the impression that the plant is going to produce a lot of
        grain, but it is only the leafy stalks that are growing strongly. Starch
        production is great but efficiency is low, and so much energy is expended in
        vegetative growth that not much is left to be stored in the grains. For
        example, if tall; over-sized plants yield 2,000 pounds of straw the yield of
        rice will be about 1,000-1,200 pounds. For small rice plants, such as those
        grown in my fields, 2,000 pounds of straw yields 2,000 pounds of rice. In a
        good harvest the yield of rice from my plants will reach about 2,400 pounds;
        that is, it will be 20 percent heavier than the straw."

        Of course, we are talking apples and oranges. Fukuoka san's rice experience
        cannot be directly applied to sugarcane. Still ...

        Regards,
        Harish

        On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 8:03 AM, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>wrote:

        > **
        >
        >
        > Thanks for your encouraging words.
        > Normally we get rains in October / November. And the summer is from March
        > peaking in May.
        > On first June I prepared the saplings. They were transplanted after one
        > month on the main field.
        > Still the tender plants could not withstand the intense heat and hot air
        > and
        > about 50 % of them died.
        > I replaced them with cut setts .
        >
        > As you have rightly said , I have noted the stem borer doing more good.
        > Though they suck the stem of the main crop , it results in a number of
        > tillers to sprout.
        >
        > Normally in our area , farmers cut the sugarcane into three or four pieces
        > and bury them in wet soil. This resylts in crowded growth of sugarcane
        > making them compete for sunlight. Also not all setts sprout in this method.
        > So I tried to grow them in tea cups and select good saplings and transplant
        > them . The process went on well so long as the saplings were in shade. Once
        > the were exposed to intense heat , many of them could not survive. I learnt
        > a big lesson that that the old saying in Tamil " AAdi Pattam Theadi Vidhai
        > "
        > meaning sow in the Tamil month of Aadi ( July end / August beginning ) -
        > the
        > period after the sun starts to travel in the southern hemisphere , is worth
        > gold. This results in slanting sun rays from the south lessening the
        > intensity of heat. Also this gives the plants to grow sufficiently high to
        > withstand the ensuing rains .
        >
        > The land has been taken on lease and the previous owner had already ploughe
        > it and I got nothing to do in this regard. But I have not done adding
        > anything nor weeding . All the weeds are allowed to grow and die on their
        > own. I hope to see good growth in the coming months.
        >
        > Also I have notice no earthworms in the field due to chemical farming for
        > the past 20 years. Let's hope they turn in soon to bore the field.
        >
        > On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:
        >
        > > **
        >
        > >
        > >
        > > From my little experience, your plants look ok. I would be worried if
        > they
        > > grew too much in the first few months as the stem would become weak. The
        > > growth is exponential in the 4-5 months and then it continues that way
        > all
        > > along.
        > >
        > > Here is what I think might be the reason for a Jan - Dec season for
        > > sugarcane in our region. We get rains in monsoon season - June to Sep. We
        > > get odd rains in April and May. March and April are the only months that
        > > require irrigation.
        > >
        > > Another interesting observation was about the infections/insect attacks.
        > > The
        > > only attack I saw in the early months was the borer. However this did not
        > > apparently cause much harm. It in fact it helped in the further branching
        > > of
        > > the plant.
        > >
        > > I have a few questions:
        > > a. Why did you not do direct seeding? What disadvantages do you see in
        > this
        > > method?
        > > b. How was the land prepared for transplanting?
        > > c. What is pattern of rains in that part of the country?
        > >
        > > Regards,
        > > Harish
        > >
        >
        > > Boovarahan S
        > >
        > Chennai.
        > 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Boovarahan Srinivasan
        Hi ! Area per plant : There are two ways about the planting distance. 1. Distance between successive rows and plant to plant distance in a row : While
        Message 3 of 13 , Sep 4, 2011
        • 0 Attachment
          Hi !

          Area per plant :

          There are two ways about the planting distance.
          1. Distance between successive rows and plant to plant distance in a row :

          While coventionally farmeres plant sugarcane with just 2 feet gap , this
          makes sugarcane to grow too crowded and compete with each other for air and
          sunlight.

          In my farm , I have planted sugarcane with 6 feet of inter row distance and
          2 feet of plant to plant distance . And this makes the field look too
          sparcely planted . Subash Palekar recommends 8 feet inter row distance but
          this is to accomodate multi cropping.

          2. Number of plants in a row:

          Normally farmers used to plant two setts , each on one side of the ridges
          and not on the furrows . Each sett of sugarcane contains minimum three buds
          . In essence 6 palnts are to be grown within 2 feet . This makes the number
          of setts to be planted more , usually about 30000 setts for an acre.

          I did not follow this method but planted single saplings ( not setts ) at 6
          ft. by 2 ft. intervals.
          This made me to plant just 4500 saplings , a big savings in the cost of
          sugarcane to be bought for planting.



          Growing season :
          The sugarcane companies take a wider area into consideration , usually a
          cluster of villages and the acreage under sugarcane cultivation. The just
          plan the seeding in such a way that they can get the sugarcane produce
          evenly all through the year. In fact I brought the sugarcane inspectors to
          my field for survey and the advised me to plant immediately . Not only me
          but a good number of farmers seed sugarcane in that period . Almost all of
          us are affected by the intense heat of summer sun and hot air wave . Those
          who planted in August didn't face that problem. From this experience I have
          commented on the planting season. Whether the factories function based on
          sugarcane growth cycle or not , nature doesn't give us a chance . It has its
          own agenda of favouring some crops as summer crops and some as winter crops
          . Not every crop can be grown all through the year except trees. Even trees
          when they are too young are affected by untimely planting and off season
          growth retardation. So timing of planting plays an important role. This has
          been my experience and I learnt it the hard way.

          I am waiting for my sugarcane crops to pick up growth . As Fukuoka has
          rightly said , the more the growth of the plants , the less is the produce.
          In rice , if one gets more straw , the grain production is lessened. Since
          our farmers usually need straw for their cattle ,they strike a balance and
          go in for tall variety rice with accelerated growth. This is my observation.

          By next fortnight I may commence rice planting since this is our main season
          for our staple food of rice. Hope this process goes smoothly.

          Thanks.
          On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 9:34 AM, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:

          > **
          >
          >
          > Interesting.
          >
          > *Growing season:* Are all the farmers in your region harvest sugarcane just
          > before the monsoon? It occurs to me that the growing season is driven more
          > by the 'sugar factories' rather than old practice! The factories in our
          > region are functional during the first half of the year. And that is why
          > sugarcane is grown jan - dec here. Now, I do not know if the factories work
          > based on the sugarcane growth cycle or the sugarcane is grown based on
          > factory demand!
          >
          > *Area per plant:* I was also worried about the area per plant. On repeated
          > requests our farmer listened to me and provided 5' between the rows.
          > Subhash
          > Palekarji (http://palekarzerobudgetnaturalfarming.com/home.html
          > )recommends8'
          > between the rows and I was trying to push this through! Although this
          > distance seems too much when they are planted, it is quite evident when
          > they
          > grow. Even with the 5' distance the plants do not have enough room in our
          > farm. The local practice is to plant them even closer, some at 2' while
          > some
          > at 1'. (And they argue that this kind of spacing leaves no room for weeds!
          > And that you get more yield per acre.)
          >
          > The other day, I was reading this from OSR.
          >
          > "I do not try to raise tall fast-growing plants with big leaves. Instead, I
          > keep the plants as compact as possible. Keep the head small, do not
          > overnourish the plants, and let them grow true to the natural form of the
          > rice plant. Usually rice plants three or four feet tall produce luxuriant
          > leaves and give the impression that the plant is going to produce a lot of
          > grain, but it is only the leafy stalks that are growing strongly. Starch
          > production is great but efficiency is low, and so much energy is expended
          > in
          > vegetative growth that not much is left to be stored in the grains. For
          > example, if tall; over-sized plants yield 2,000 pounds of straw the yield
          > of
          > rice will be about 1,000-1,200 pounds. For small rice plants, such as those
          > grown in my fields, 2,000 pounds of straw yields 2,000 pounds of rice. In a
          > good harvest the yield of rice from my plants will reach about 2,400
          > pounds;
          > that is, it will be 20 percent heavier than the straw."
          >
          > Of course, we are talking apples and oranges. Fukuoka san's rice experience
          > cannot be directly applied to sugarcane. Still ...
          >
          > Regards,
          > Harish
          >


          > Boovarahan S
          >
          Chennai.
          09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Nandan Palaparambil
          To me it looks like that, grass varieties grow very close..Especially rice when broadcasted there is no 1 feet distance which is recommended in SRI method,but
          Message 4 of 13 , Sep 4, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            To me it looks like that, grass varieties grow very close..Especially
            rice when broadcasted there is no 1 feet distance which is recommended
            in SRI method,but still they grow healthy and produce good yield. Also natural grass if you observe they grows very close
            and dense.



            Another aspect is weed control..if plants grow close they may crowd out
            weeds well, or you should have another leguminous ground cover like
            clover used by Fukuoka san, may be that is the best.





            Regards,

            Nandan

            --- On Sun, 9/4/11, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:

            From: Harish Amur <harishamur@...>
            Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates
            To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:34 AM







             









            Interesting.



            *Growing season:* Are all the farmers in your region harvest sugarcane just

            before the monsoon? It occurs to me that the growing season is driven more

            by the 'sugar factories' rather than old practice! The factories in our

            region are functional during the first half of the year. And that is why

            sugarcane is grown jan - dec here. Now, I do not know if the factories work

            based on the sugarcane growth cycle or the sugarcane is grown based on

            factory demand!



            *Area per plant:* I was also worried about the area per plant. On repeated

            requests our farmer listened to me and provided 5' between the rows. Subhash

            Palekarji (http://palekarzerobudgetnaturalfarming.com/home.html)recommends8'

            between the rows and I was trying to push this through! Although this

            distance seems too much when they are planted, it is quite evident when they

            grow. Even with the 5' distance the plants do not have enough room in our

            farm. The local practice is to plant them even closer, some at 2' while some

            at 1'. (And they argue that this kind of spacing leaves no room for weeds!

            And that you get more yield per acre.)



            The other day, I was reading this from OSR.



            "I do not try to raise tall fast-growing plants with big leaves. Instead, I

            keep the plants as compact as possible. Keep the head small, do not

            overnourish the plants, and let them grow true to the natural form of the

            rice plant. Usually rice plants three or four feet tall produce luxuriant

            leaves and give the impression that the plant is going to produce a lot of

            grain, but it is only the leafy stalks that are growing strongly. Starch

            production is great but efficiency is low, and so much energy is expended in

            vegetative growth that not much is left to be stored in the grains. For

            example, if tall; over-sized plants yield 2,000 pounds of straw the yield of

            rice will be about 1,000-1,200 pounds. For small rice plants, such as those

            grown in my fields, 2,000 pounds of straw yields 2,000 pounds of rice. In a

            good harvest the yield of rice from my plants will reach about 2,400 pounds;

            that is, it will be 20 percent heavier than the straw."



            Of course, we are talking apples and oranges. Fukuoka san's rice experience

            cannot be directly applied to sugarcane. Still ...



            Regards,

            Harish



            On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 8:03 AM, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>wrote:



            > **

            >

            >

            > Thanks for your encouraging words.

            > Normally we get rains in October / November. And the summer is from March

            > peaking in May.

            > On first June I prepared the saplings. They were transplanted after one

            > month on the main field.

            > Still the tender plants could not withstand the intense heat and hot air

            > and

            > about 50 % of them died.

            > I replaced them with cut setts .

            >

            > As you have rightly said , I have noted the stem borer doing more good.

            > Though they suck the stem of the main crop , it results in a number of

            > tillers to sprout.

            >

            > Normally in our area , farmers cut the sugarcane into three or four pieces

            > and bury them in wet soil. This resylts in crowded growth of sugarcane

            > making them compete for sunlight. Also not all setts sprout in this method.

            > So I tried to grow them in tea cups and select good saplings and transplant

            > them . The process went on well so long as the saplings were in shade. Once

            > the were exposed to intense heat , many of them could not survive. I learnt

            > a big lesson that that the old saying in Tamil " AAdi Pattam Theadi Vidhai

            > "

            > meaning sow in the Tamil month of Aadi ( July end / August beginning ) -

            > the

            > period after the sun starts to travel in the southern hemisphere , is worth

            > gold. This results in slanting sun rays from the south lessening the

            > intensity of heat. Also this gives the plants to grow sufficiently high to

            > withstand the ensuing rains .

            >

            > The land has been taken on lease and the previous owner had already ploughe

            > it and I got nothing to do in this regard. But I have not done adding

            > anything nor weeding . All the weeds are allowed to grow and die on their

            > own. I hope to see good growth in the coming months.

            >

            > Also I have notice no earthworms in the field due to chemical farming for

            > the past 20 years. Let's hope they turn in soon to bore the field.

            >

            > On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:

            >

            > > **

            >

            > >

            > >

            > > From my little experience, your plants look ok. I would be worried if

            > they

            > > grew too much in the first few months as the stem would become weak. The

            > > growth is exponential in the 4-5 months and then it continues that way

            > all

            > > along.

            > >

            > > Here is what I think might be the reason for a Jan - Dec season for

            > > sugarcane in our region. We get rains in monsoon season - June to Sep. We

            > > get odd rains in April and May. March and April are the only months that

            > > require irrigation.

            > >

            > > Another interesting observation was about the infections/insect attacks.

            > > The

            > > only attack I saw in the early months was the borer. However this did not

            > > apparently cause much harm. It in fact it helped in the further branching

            > > of

            > > the plant.

            > >

            > > I have a few questions:

            > > a. Why did you not do direct seeding? What disadvantages do you see in

            > this

            > > method?

            > > b. How was the land prepared for transplanting?

            > > c. What is pattern of rains in that part of the country?

            > >

            > > Regards,

            > > Harish

            > >

            >

            > > Boovarahan S

            > >

            > Chennai.

            > 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)

            >

            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            >

            >

            >



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






















            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Nishad S K
            Hi What s the malayalam name for alfalfa and white clover? To use a cover crop among cowpea, alfalfa and white clover which suits kerala coastal area better.
            Message 5 of 13 , Sep 4, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              Hi
              What's the malayalam name for alfalfa and white clover? To use a cover crop
              among cowpea, alfalfa and white clover which suits kerala coastal area
              better.

              Thanks

              Regards,
              Dr Nishad S K

              9895755690
              On 4 Sep 2011 17:07, "Nandan Palaparambil" <p_k_nandanan@...> wrote:
              > To me it looks like that, grass varieties grow very close..Especially
              > rice when broadcasted there is no 1 feet distance which is recommended
              > in SRI method,but still they grow healthy and produce good yield. Also
              natural grass if you observe they grows very close
              > and dense.
              >
              >
              >
              > Another aspect is weed control..if plants grow close they may crowd out
              > weeds well, or you should have another leguminous ground cover like
              > clover used by Fukuoka san, may be that is the best.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Regards,
              >
              > Nandan
              >
              > --- On Sun, 9/4/11, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:
              >
              > From: Harish Amur <harishamur@...>
              > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates
              > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:34 AM
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Interesting.
              >
              >
              >
              > *Growing season:* Are all the farmers in your region harvest sugarcane
              just
              >
              > before the monsoon? It occurs to me that the growing season is driven more
              >
              > by the 'sugar factories' rather than old practice! The factories in our
              >
              > region are functional during the first half of the year. And that is why
              >
              > sugarcane is grown jan - dec here. Now, I do not know if the factories
              work
              >
              > based on the sugarcane growth cycle or the sugarcane is grown based on
              >
              > factory demand!
              >
              >
              >
              > *Area per plant:* I was also worried about the area per plant. On repeated
              >
              > requests our farmer listened to me and provided 5' between the rows.
              Subhash
              >
              > Palekarji (
              http://palekarzerobudgetnaturalfarming.com/home.html)recommends8'
              >
              > between the rows and I was trying to push this through! Although this
              >
              > distance seems too much when they are planted, it is quite evident when
              they
              >
              > grow. Even with the 5' distance the plants do not have enough room in our
              >
              > farm. The local practice is to plant them even closer, some at 2' while
              some
              >
              > at 1'. (And they argue that this kind of spacing leaves no room for weeds!
              >
              > And that you get more yield per acre.)
              >
              >
              >
              > The other day, I was reading this from OSR.
              >
              >
              >
              > "I do not try to raise tall fast-growing plants with big leaves. Instead,
              I
              >
              > keep the plants as compact as possible. Keep the head small, do not
              >
              > overnourish the plants, and let them grow true to the natural form of the
              >
              > rice plant. Usually rice plants three or four feet tall produce luxuriant
              >
              > leaves and give the impression that the plant is going to produce a lot of
              >
              > grain, but it is only the leafy stalks that are growing strongly. Starch
              >
              > production is great but efficiency is low, and so much energy is expended
              in
              >
              > vegetative growth that not much is left to be stored in the grains. For
              >
              > example, if tall; over-sized plants yield 2,000 pounds of straw the yield
              of
              >
              > rice will be about 1,000-1,200 pounds. For small rice plants, such as
              those
              >
              > grown in my fields, 2,000 pounds of straw yields 2,000 pounds of rice. In
              a
              >
              > good harvest the yield of rice from my plants will reach about 2,400
              pounds;
              >
              > that is, it will be 20 percent heavier than the straw."
              >
              >
              >
              > Of course, we are talking apples and oranges. Fukuoka san's rice
              experience
              >
              > cannot be directly applied to sugarcane. Still ...
              >
              >
              >
              > Regards,
              >
              > Harish
              >
              >
              >
              > On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 8:03 AM, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...
              >wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              >> **
              >
              >>
              >
              >>
              >
              >> Thanks for your encouraging words.
              >
              >> Normally we get rains in October / November. And the summer is from March
              >
              >> peaking in May.
              >
              >> On first June I prepared the saplings. They were transplanted after one
              >
              >> month on the main field.
              >
              >> Still the tender plants could not withstand the intense heat and hot air
              >
              >> and
              >
              >> about 50 % of them died.
              >
              >> I replaced them with cut setts .
              >
              >>
              >
              >> As you have rightly said , I have noted the stem borer doing more good.
              >
              >> Though they suck the stem of the main crop , it results in a number of
              >
              >> tillers to sprout.
              >
              >>
              >
              >> Normally in our area , farmers cut the sugarcane into three or four
              pieces
              >
              >> and bury them in wet soil. This resylts in crowded growth of sugarcane
              >
              >> making them compete for sunlight. Also not all setts sprout in this
              method.
              >
              >> So I tried to grow them in tea cups and select good saplings and
              transplant
              >
              >> them . The process went on well so long as the saplings were in shade.
              Once
              >
              >> the were exposed to intense heat , many of them could not survive. I
              learnt
              >
              >> a big lesson that that the old saying in Tamil " AAdi Pattam Theadi
              Vidhai
              >
              >> "
              >
              >> meaning sow in the Tamil month of Aadi ( July end / August beginning ) -
              >
              >> the
              >
              >> period after the sun starts to travel in the southern hemisphere , is
              worth
              >
              >> gold. This results in slanting sun rays from the south lessening the
              >
              >> intensity of heat. Also this gives the plants to grow sufficiently high
              to
              >
              >> withstand the ensuing rains .
              >
              >>
              >
              >> The land has been taken on lease and the previous owner had already
              ploughe
              >
              >> it and I got nothing to do in this regard. But I have not done adding
              >
              >> anything nor weeding . All the weeds are allowed to grow and die on their
              >
              >> own. I hope to see good growth in the coming months.
              >
              >>
              >
              >> Also I have notice no earthworms in the field due to chemical farming for
              >
              >> the past 20 years. Let's hope they turn in soon to bore the field.
              >
              >>
              >
              >> On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:
              >
              >>
              >
              >> > **
              >
              >>
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> > From my little experience, your plants look ok. I would be worried if
              >
              >> they
              >
              >> > grew too much in the first few months as the stem would become weak.
              The
              >
              >> > growth is exponential in the 4-5 months and then it continues that way
              >
              >> all
              >
              >> > along.
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> > Here is what I think might be the reason for a Jan - Dec season for
              >
              >> > sugarcane in our region. We get rains in monsoon season - June to Sep.
              We
              >
              >> > get odd rains in April and May. March and April are the only months
              that
              >
              >> > require irrigation.
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> > Another interesting observation was about the infections/insect
              attacks.
              >
              >> > The
              >
              >> > only attack I saw in the early months was the borer. However this did
              not
              >
              >> > apparently cause much harm. It in fact it helped in the further
              branching
              >
              >> > of
              >
              >> > the plant.
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> > I have a few questions:
              >
              >> > a. Why did you not do direct seeding? What disadvantages do you see in
              >
              >> this
              >
              >> > method?
              >
              >> > b. How was the land prepared for transplanting?
              >
              >> > c. What is pattern of rains in that part of the country?
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> > Regards,
              >
              >> > Harish
              >
              >> >
              >
              >>
              >
              >> > Boovarahan S
              >
              >> >
              >
              >> Chennai.
              >
              >> 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)
              >
              >>
              >
              >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >>
              >
              >>
              >
              >>
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Boovarahan Srinivasan
              Grass varieties normally outgrow paddy and other crops. To my mind I don t consider them as weeds since I believe nature will feed all crops on it. It is our
              Message 6 of 13 , Sep 4, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                Grass varieties normally outgrow paddy and other crops.
                To my mind I don't consider them as weeds since I believe nature will feed
                all crops on it. It is our mind which conceives that one type of crops
                should be overgrown ( ? ) than others. That is why I have not weeded my
                farm. There are some plants which twine up on others. I have seen a creeper
                entwining the sugarcane restricting its spread . In such cases it becomes
                necessary to free the sugarcane from the aggression / encroachment of other
                plants . Even in such cases , I have not killed the weeds but simply trimmed
                and removed the entwining portion.

                In SRI method , the main point is to plant single seedlings in an arranged
                manner of say 1 foot distance thereby allowing each plant to have better
                sunlight and air. Also weeding is a must in SRI using a weeder but this
                results in soil disturbance . And this is to be done once in 15 days which
                results in frequent soil disturbance . SRI method advocates ploughing and
                levelling of land whereas in NF we are against it. Mulching is avoided in
                SRI and the farm is maintained clean whereas in NF and ZBF mulching is of
                paramount importance. In SRI ,application of fertilizers , whether chemical
                or organic manure, is followed but in NF there is no such necessity. The
                soil improves on its own. SRI is better suited to farmers whose mindset
                relies on the belief that something should be done to increase grain
                production , whereas in NF we leave it to nature. What we try to do is just
                to mimic nature and a forest and provide a conducive atmosphere for the
                micro organisms to thrive in and asee nature do the rest . But for the
                initial little efforts in NF ,it is mostly watching nature play its own game
                .

                Correct me if I am wrong.

                On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 5:07 PM, Nandan Palaparambil
                <p_k_nandanan@...>wrote:

                > **
                >
                >
                > To me it looks like that, grass varieties grow very close..Especially
                > rice when broadcasted there is no 1 feet distance which is recommended
                > in SRI method,but still they grow healthy and produce good yield. Also
                > natural grass if you observe they grows very close
                > and dense.
                >
                > Another aspect is weed control..if plants grow close they may crowd out
                > weeds well, or you should have another leguminous ground cover like
                > clover used by Fukuoka san, may be that is the best.
                >
                > Regards,
                >
                > Nandan
                >



                > Boovarahan S
                >
                Chennai.
                09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Nandan Palaparambil
                If you are a farmer and depends for your food from farming, then you may do weeding !!! I think there is no problem in doing that since even Fukuoka san
                Message 7 of 13 , Sep 4, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  If you are a farmer and depends for your food from farming, then you may do weeding !!! I think there is no problem in doing that since even Fukuoka san suggested that initial weeding, composting may be necessary, but it should be reduced gradually when the land improves. Most of us, directly jump into pure natural farming, one reason being even if there is crop loss, we can afford it.

                  Fukuoka san also suggested shallow-tillage direct-seeding for rice and later switching to no-tillage (Please see page 147 of natural farming - online book).


                  Regards,
                  Nandan

                  --- On Mon, 9/5/11, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...> wrote:

                  From: Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>
                  Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates
                  To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                  Date: Monday, September 5, 2011, 8:38 AM







                   









                  Grass varieties normally outgrow paddy and other crops.

                  To my mind I don't consider them as weeds since I believe nature will feed

                  all crops on it. It is our mind which conceives that one type of crops

                  should be overgrown ( ? ) than others. That is why I have not weeded my

                  farm. There are some plants which twine up on others. I have seen a creeper

                  entwining the sugarcane restricting its spread . In such cases it becomes

                  necessary to free the sugarcane from the aggression / encroachment of other

                  plants . Even in such cases , I have not killed the weeds but simply trimmed

                  and removed the entwining portion.



                  In SRI method , the main point is to plant single seedlings in an arranged

                  manner of say 1 foot distance thereby allowing each plant to have better

                  sunlight and air. Also weeding is a must in SRI using a weeder but this

                  results in soil disturbance . And this is to be done once in 15 days which

                  results in frequent soil disturbance . SRI method advocates ploughing and

                  levelling of land whereas in NF we are against it. Mulching is avoided in

                  SRI and the farm is maintained clean whereas in NF and ZBF mulching is of

                  paramount importance. In SRI ,application of fertilizers , whether chemical

                  or organic manure, is followed but in NF there is no such necessity. The

                  soil improves on its own. SRI is better suited to farmers whose mindset

                  relies on the belief that something should be done to increase grain

                  production , whereas in NF we leave it to nature. What we try to do is just

                  to mimic nature and a forest and provide a conducive atmosphere for the

                  micro organisms to thrive in and asee nature do the rest . But for the

                  initial little efforts in NF ,it is mostly watching nature play its own game

                  .



                  Correct me if I am wrong.



                  On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 5:07 PM, Nandan Palaparambil

                  <p_k_nandanan@...>wrote:



                  > **

                  >

                  >

                  > To me it looks like that, grass varieties grow very close..Especially

                  > rice when broadcasted there is no 1 feet distance which is recommended

                  > in SRI method,but still they grow healthy and produce good yield. Also

                  > natural grass if you observe they grows very close

                  > and dense.

                  >

                  > Another aspect is weed control..if plants grow close they may crowd out

                  > weeds well, or you should have another leguminous ground cover like

                  > clover used by Fukuoka san, may be that is the best.

                  >

                  > Regards,

                  >

                  > Nandan

                  >



                  > Boovarahan S

                  >

                  Chennai.

                  09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






















                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Nandan Palaparambil
                  Hi Nishad, I have never heard any one using Alfalfa and clover in Kerala. I also searched for clover, but it looks like it grows only in cold climates. From
                  Message 8 of 13 , Sep 4, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Hi Nishad,

                    I have never heard any one using Alfalfa and clover in Kerala. I also searched for clover, but it looks like it grows only in cold climates. From the descriptions, it looked to be the best cover crop, since it reseeds well and also grows like a carpet and does not grow tall.

                    I had some issues with cow pea in germination and establishing it, so using sun-hemp for the time being, but next time, I would like to again try cow-pea since it has some food value also.

                    For rice, I am still looking for a correct legume which I can mix it with rice and sow. Some suggestion was there to use methi, but it was not establishing well here. As of now I am planning to use horse gram.

                    Why don't you introduce and brief about your farming activities.


                    Regards,
                    Nandan
                    http://www.farming-experiments.blogspot.com/

                    --- On Sun, 9/4/11, Nishad S K <drnishadsk@...> wrote:

                    From: Nishad S K <drnishadsk@...>
                    Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates
                    To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Sunday, September 4, 2011, 11:54 PM







                     









                    Hi

                    What's the malayalam name for alfalfa and white clover? To use a cover crop

                    among cowpea, alfalfa and white clover which suits kerala coastal area

                    better.



                    Thanks



                    Regards,

                    Dr Nishad S K



                    9895755690

                    On 4 Sep 2011 17:07, "Nandan Palaparambil" <p_k_nandanan@...> wrote:

                    > To me it looks like that, grass varieties grow very close..Especially

                    > rice when broadcasted there is no 1 feet distance which is recommended

                    > in SRI method,but still they grow healthy and produce good yield. Also

                    natural grass if you observe they grows very close

                    > and dense.

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > Another aspect is weed control..if plants grow close they may crowd out

                    > weeds well, or you should have another leguminous ground cover like

                    > clover used by Fukuoka san, may be that is the best.

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > Regards,

                    >

                    > Nandan

                    >

                    > --- On Sun, 9/4/11, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:

                    >

                    > From: Harish Amur <harishamur@...>

                    > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates

                    > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com

                    > Date: Sunday, September 4, 2011, 9:34 AM

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > Interesting.

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > *Growing season:* Are all the farmers in your region harvest sugarcane

                    just

                    >

                    > before the monsoon? It occurs to me that the growing season is driven more

                    >

                    > by the 'sugar factories' rather than old practice! The factories in our

                    >

                    > region are functional during the first half of the year. And that is why

                    >

                    > sugarcane is grown jan - dec here. Now, I do not know if the factories

                    work

                    >

                    > based on the sugarcane growth cycle or the sugarcane is grown based on

                    >

                    > factory demand!

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > *Area per plant:* I was also worried about the area per plant. On repeated

                    >

                    > requests our farmer listened to me and provided 5' between the rows.

                    Subhash

                    >

                    > Palekarji (

                    http://palekarzerobudgetnaturalfarming.com/home.html)recommends8'

                    >

                    > between the rows and I was trying to push this through! Although this

                    >

                    > distance seems too much when they are planted, it is quite evident when

                    they

                    >

                    > grow. Even with the 5' distance the plants do not have enough room in our

                    >

                    > farm. The local practice is to plant them even closer, some at 2' while

                    some

                    >

                    > at 1'. (And they argue that this kind of spacing leaves no room for weeds!

                    >

                    > And that you get more yield per acre.)

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > The other day, I was reading this from OSR.

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > "I do not try to raise tall fast-growing plants with big leaves. Instead,

                    I

                    >

                    > keep the plants as compact as possible. Keep the head small, do not

                    >

                    > overnourish the plants, and let them grow true to the natural form of the

                    >

                    > rice plant. Usually rice plants three or four feet tall produce luxuriant

                    >

                    > leaves and give the impression that the plant is going to produce a lot of

                    >

                    > grain, but it is only the leafy stalks that are growing strongly. Starch

                    >

                    > production is great but efficiency is low, and so much energy is expended

                    in

                    >

                    > vegetative growth that not much is left to be stored in the grains. For

                    >

                    > example, if tall; over-sized plants yield 2,000 pounds of straw the yield

                    of

                    >

                    > rice will be about 1,000-1,200 pounds. For small rice plants, such as

                    those

                    >

                    > grown in my fields, 2,000 pounds of straw yields 2,000 pounds of rice. In

                    a

                    >

                    > good harvest the yield of rice from my plants will reach about 2,400

                    pounds;

                    >

                    > that is, it will be 20 percent heavier than the straw."

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > Of course, we are talking apples and oranges. Fukuoka san's rice

                    experience

                    >

                    > cannot be directly applied to sugarcane. Still ...

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > Regards,

                    >

                    > Harish

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 8:03 AM, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...

                    >wrote:

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >> **

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> Thanks for your encouraging words.

                    >

                    >> Normally we get rains in October / November. And the summer is from March

                    >

                    >> peaking in May.

                    >

                    >> On first June I prepared the saplings. They were transplanted after one

                    >

                    >> month on the main field.

                    >

                    >> Still the tender plants could not withstand the intense heat and hot air

                    >

                    >> and

                    >

                    >> about 50 % of them died.

                    >

                    >> I replaced them with cut setts .

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> As you have rightly said , I have noted the stem borer doing more good.

                    >

                    >> Though they suck the stem of the main crop , it results in a number of

                    >

                    >> tillers to sprout.

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> Normally in our area , farmers cut the sugarcane into three or four

                    pieces

                    >

                    >> and bury them in wet soil. This resylts in crowded growth of sugarcane

                    >

                    >> making them compete for sunlight. Also not all setts sprout in this

                    method.

                    >

                    >> So I tried to grow them in tea cups and select good saplings and

                    transplant

                    >

                    >> them . The process went on well so long as the saplings were in shade.

                    Once

                    >

                    >> the were exposed to intense heat , many of them could not survive. I

                    learnt

                    >

                    >> a big lesson that that the old saying in Tamil " AAdi Pattam Theadi

                    Vidhai

                    >

                    >> "

                    >

                    >> meaning sow in the Tamil month of Aadi ( July end / August beginning ) -

                    >

                    >> the

                    >

                    >> period after the sun starts to travel in the southern hemisphere , is

                    worth

                    >

                    >> gold. This results in slanting sun rays from the south lessening the

                    >

                    >> intensity of heat. Also this gives the plants to grow sufficiently high

                    to

                    >

                    >> withstand the ensuing rains .

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> The land has been taken on lease and the previous owner had already

                    ploughe

                    >

                    >> it and I got nothing to do in this regard. But I have not done adding

                    >

                    >> anything nor weeding . All the weeds are allowed to grow and die on their

                    >

                    >> own. I hope to see good growth in the coming months.

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> Also I have notice no earthworms in the field due to chemical farming for

                    >

                    >> the past 20 years. Let's hope they turn in soon to bore the field.

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Harish Amur <harishamur@...> wrote:

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> > **

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> > From my little experience, your plants look ok. I would be worried if

                    >

                    >> they

                    >

                    >> > grew too much in the first few months as the stem would become weak.

                    The

                    >

                    >> > growth is exponential in the 4-5 months and then it continues that way

                    >

                    >> all

                    >

                    >> > along.

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> > Here is what I think might be the reason for a Jan - Dec season for

                    >

                    >> > sugarcane in our region. We get rains in monsoon season - June to Sep.

                    We

                    >

                    >> > get odd rains in April and May. March and April are the only months

                    that

                    >

                    >> > require irrigation.

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> > Another interesting observation was about the infections/insect

                    attacks.

                    >

                    >> > The

                    >

                    >> > only attack I saw in the early months was the borer. However this did

                    not

                    >

                    >> > apparently cause much harm. It in fact it helped in the further

                    branching

                    >

                    >> > of

                    >

                    >> > the plant.

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> > I have a few questions:

                    >

                    >> > a. Why did you not do direct seeding? What disadvantages do you see in

                    >

                    >> this

                    >

                    >> > method?

                    >

                    >> > b. How was the land prepared for transplanting?

                    >

                    >> > c. What is pattern of rains in that part of the country?

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> > Regards,

                    >

                    >> > Harish

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> > Boovarahan S

                    >

                    >> >

                    >

                    >> Chennai.

                    >

                    >> 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >>

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    >

                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                    >



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






















                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Boovarahan Srinivasan
                    I don t consider weeds decrease the grain production. In June me and other farmers planted sugarcane . While they ploughed and applied fertilizers and weeded ,
                    Message 9 of 13 , Sep 5, 2011
                    • 0 Attachment
                      I don't consider weeds decrease the grain production.
                      In June me and other farmers planted sugarcane . While they ploughed and
                      applied fertilizers and weeded , I did nothing but all lost the crops due to
                      unseasonal planting . It is their misconception that weeds take away the
                      nutrients from the crops making them give lesser produce . I think nature
                      provides enough nutrients to all plants , grains or weeds.

                      What Fukuoka said is an one time affair. But what people do is recurring in
                      nature.


                      On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 12:20 PM, Nandan Palaparambil <p_k_nandanan@...
                      > wrote:

                      > **
                      >
                      >
                      > If you are a farmer and depends for your food from farming, then you may do
                      > weeding !!! I think there is no problem in doing that since even Fukuoka san
                      > suggested that initial weeding, composting may be necessary, but it should
                      > be reduced gradually when the land improves. Most of us, directly jump into
                      > pure natural farming, one reason being even if there is crop loss, we can
                      > afford it.
                      >
                      > Fukuoka san also suggested shallow-tillage direct-seeding for rice and
                      > later switching to no-tillage (Please see page 147 of natural farming -
                      > online book).
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      > Nandan
                      >

                      Boovarahan S
                      Chennai.
                      09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Nandan Palaparambil
                      Boovarahan, My observation contradicts this..when there are strong weeds around, growth of plants is less and also for rice, weeds blocks sunlights also and
                      Message 10 of 13 , Sep 5, 2011
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Boovarahan,

                        My observation contradicts this..when there are strong weeds around, growth of plants is less and also for rice, weeds blocks sunlights also and they don't grow at all. My thinking was that after weeding once and if rice is given an upper hand, then things should be OK. But to my surprise weeds again had grown faster than rice and completely surrounded them. In some area, I kept on weeding and after some time, when the rice plant had reached sufficient height, it was fine. So for reasonable yield, we should replace weeds with legume cover crops and also our crop should crowd out weeds.

                        This may be different for sugar cane since they grow tall


                        Regards,
                        Nandan

                        --- On Mon, 9/5/11, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...> wrote:

                        From: Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>
                        Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Updates
                        To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                        Date: Monday, September 5, 2011, 8:20 PM







                         









                        I don't consider weeds decrease the grain production.

                        In June me and other farmers planted sugarcane . While they ploughed and

                        applied fertilizers and weeded , I did nothing but all lost the crops due to

                        unseasonal planting . It is their misconception that weeds take away the

                        nutrients from the crops making them give lesser produce . I think nature

                        provides enough nutrients to all plants , grains or weeds.



                        What Fukuoka said is an one time affair. But what people do is recurring in

                        nature.



                        On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 12:20 PM, Nandan Palaparambil <p_k_nandanan@...

                        > wrote:



                        > **

                        >

                        >

                        > If you are a farmer and depends for your food from farming, then you may do

                        > weeding !!! I think there is no problem in doing that since even Fukuoka san

                        > suggested that initial weeding, composting may be necessary, but it should

                        > be reduced gradually when the land improves. Most of us, directly jump into

                        > pure natural farming, one reason being even if there is crop loss, we can

                        > afford it.

                        >

                        > Fukuoka san also suggested shallow-tillage direct-seeding for rice and

                        > later switching to no-tillage (Please see page 147 of natural farming -

                        > online book).

                        >

                        > Regards,

                        > Nandan

                        >



                        Boovarahan S

                        Chennai.

                        09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






















                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Boovarahan Srinivasan
                        I do agree ! Growth of grass surpasses that of paddy and in the initial stages we have to weed out, but this is to ensure enough sunlight available to paddy .
                        Message 11 of 13 , Sep 5, 2011
                        • 0 Attachment
                          I do agree !

                          Growth of grass surpasses that of paddy and in the initial stages we have to
                          weed out, but this is to ensure enough sunlight available to paddy . But
                          farmers don't consider this but they think the nutrients available to paddy
                          are consumed by weeds . In NF we consider that plants get most of the needs
                          from sunlight and water vapour whereas the general opinion of the farmers is
                          that plants get their needs mostly from soil and water .

                          I have also witnessed the enormous growth of grass dwarfing paddy . So long
                          as we don't provide enough vegetative cover to arrest the growth of grass ,
                          this will be a perennial problem.

                          My point is how farmers view weeds and how we NFs differ from them.

                          On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 9:44 PM, Nandan Palaparambil
                          <p_k_nandanan@...>wrote:

                          > **
                          >
                          >
                          > Boovarahan,
                          >
                          > My observation contradicts this..when there are strong weeds around, growth
                          > of plants is less and also for rice, weeds blocks sunlights also and they
                          > don't grow at all. My thinking was that after weeding once and if rice is
                          > given an upper hand, then things should be OK. But to my surprise weeds
                          > again had grown faster than rice and completely surrounded them. In some
                          > area, I kept on weeding and after some time, when the rice plant had reached
                          > sufficient height, it was fine. So for reasonable yield, we should replace
                          > weeds with legume cover crops and also our crop should crowd out weeds.
                          >
                          > This may be different for sugar cane since they grow tall
                          >
                          > Regards,
                          > Nandan
                          >


                          > Boovarahan S
                          >
                          Chennai.
                          09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.