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RE: [fukuoka_farming] Re: livestock

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  • Linda Shewan
    I would say no inputs is the aim of natural farming - but Fukuoka DID bring in chicken manure from a local farmer to put over the straw to help it decompose
    Message 1 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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      I would say no inputs is the aim of natural farming - but Fukuoka DID bring
      in chicken manure from a local farmer to put over the straw to help it
      decompose before spring. He only did this once his ducks were constrained by
      the highway though.



      If you don't raise livestock you need to determine if the manure is an
      absolute requirement for your needs. It quite likely isn't it but even then
      there is no need to raise livestock, just accommodate it - you could setup
      dovecotes and bat boxes and harvest the manure from them as an option.



      I don't think Raju uses any inputs? Am I correct Raju?



      Linda





      From: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
      [mailto:fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Boovarahan Srinivasan
      Sent: Wednesday, 3 August 2011 9:07 PM
      To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: A nice link

      Ok !

      Bringing in any outside thing is not considered as natural farming.
      Though Fukuoka did not bring in anything from outside the ducks did it for
      him.
      What if one doesn't grow livestock ?

      Boovarahan S
      Chennai.
      09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Ruthie Aquino
      Apparently birds do provide some form of manure. Anyway we live in diffrent parts of the world and we are each trying to do some natural farming despite
      Message 2 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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        Apparently birds do provide some form of manure.
        Anyway we live in diffrent parts of the world and we are each trying to do
        some natural farming despite opposition or incomprehension.
        We better stick together.
        best
        RUTHIE

        2011/8/3 Linda Shewan <linda_shewan@...>

        > **
        >
        >
        > I would say no inputs is the aim of natural farming - but Fukuoka DID bring
        > in chicken manure from a local farmer to put over the straw to help it
        > decompose before spring. He only did this once his ducks were constrained
        > by
        > the highway though.
        >
        > If you don't raise livestock you need to determine if the manure is an
        > absolute requirement for your needs. It quite likely isn't it but even then
        > there is no need to raise livestock, just accommodate it - you could setup
        > dovecotes and bat boxes and harvest the manure from them as an option.
        >
        > I don't think Raju uses any inputs? Am I correct Raju?
        >
        > Linda
        >
        > From: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
        > [mailto:fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Boovarahan
        > Srinivasan
        > Sent: Wednesday, 3 August 2011 9:07 PM
        > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: A nice link
        >
        > Ok !
        >
        > Bringing in any outside thing is not considered as natural farming.
        > Though Fukuoka did not bring in anything from outside the ducks did it for
        > him.
        > What if one doesn't grow livestock ?
        >
        > Boovarahan S
        > Chennai.
        > 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Boovarahan Srinivasan
        True ! But my land is devoid of trees / green cover . May try growing trees but it takes longer time. Until then I want to stick to NF principles as close as
        Message 3 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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          True !

          But my land is devoid of trees / green cover . May try growing trees but it
          takes longer time. Until then I want to stick to NF principles as close as
          possible with minimal inputs.

          On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 7:43 PM, Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...>wrote:

          > Apparently birds do provide some form of manure.
          > Anyway we live in diffrent parts of the world and we are each trying to do
          > some natural farming despite opposition or incomprehension.
          > We better stick together.
          > best
          > RUTHIE





          > Boovarahan S
          >
          Chennai.
          09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Ruthie Aquino
          Booze, Wouldn t it be a good idea to plant some fruit trees, even sparsely, say every 50 meters apart? I was thinking of mango, which likes a distinct dry
          Message 4 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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            Booze,
            Wouldn't it be a good idea to plant some fruit trees, even sparsely, say
            every 50 meters apart? I was thinking of mango, which likes a distinct dry
            season and seems to prosper in India.
            Trees develop deep roots, I think that is good for natural farming.
            Now, if it is impossible to plant trees in your land, then disregard this
            point of view.
            The idea is to develop a food forest, but that could take 50 years.
            Good luck.
            RUTHIE




            2011/8/3 Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>

            > **
            >
            >
            > True !
            >
            > But my land is devoid of trees / green cover . May try growing trees but it
            > takes longer time. Until then I want to stick to NF principles as close as
            > possible with minimal inputs.
            >
            > On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 7:43 PM, Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...>wrote:
            >
            >
            >
            > > Apparently birds do provide some form of manure.
            > > Anyway we live in diffrent parts of the world and we are each trying to
            > do
            > > some natural farming despite opposition or incomprehension.
            > > We better stick together.
            > > best
            > > RUTHIE
            >
            > > Boovarahan S
            > >
            > Chennai.
            > 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Nandan Palaparambil
            In chapter Farming Among Weeds in one straw revolution, Fukuoka san says... In making the transition to this kind of farming, some weeding, composting or
            Message 5 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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              In chapter 'Farming Among Weeds' in one straw revolution, Fukuoka san says...

              "In making the transition to this kind of farming, some weeding, composting or pruning may be necessary at first, but these measures should be gradually reduced each year. Ultimately, it is not the growing technique which is the most important factor, but rather the state of mind
              of the farmer".

              So it looks like there is no issue in adding compost or animal manure also, but we have to reduce it gradually. For most of us, who is in the transition phase this is true, for a few whose land has become fertile, application of animal manure etc.. may not be required at all.

              Also to make natural farming popular among farmers, if they directly start on natural farming, mostly they will fail and quit natural farming, so it be better to advise gradual transition.


              Regards,
              Nandan

              --- On Wed, 8/3/11, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...> wrote:

              From: Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>
              Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: livestock
              To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Wednesday, August 3, 2011, 8:46 PM







               









              True !



              But my land is devoid of trees / green cover . May try growing trees but it

              takes longer time. Until then I want to stick to NF principles as close as

              possible with minimal inputs.



              On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 7:43 PM, Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...>wrote:



              > Apparently birds do provide some form of manure.

              > Anyway we live in diffrent parts of the world and we are each trying to do

              > some natural farming despite opposition or incomprehension.

              > We better stick together.

              > best

              > RUTHIE



              > Boovarahan S

              >

              Chennai.

              09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






















              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Boovarahan Srinivasan
              I thought of that way but the problem is the land is a leased one for 5 years and the landlady may reclaim it any time before. And she may not like growing
              Message 6 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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                I thought of that way but the problem is the land is a leased one for 5
                years and the landlady may reclaim it any time before. And she may not like
                growing trees as the local villagers are of the view that shade giving trees
                deter the growth of grains. Even if I grow trees , the subsequent farmers
                will cut it down without mercy.

                I own another small piece of land ( 29 cents ) and am going to plant some
                trees there .

                On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 10:00 PM, Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...>wrote:

                > Booze,
                > Wouldn't it be a good idea to plant some fruit trees, even sparsely, say
                > every 50 meters apart? I was thinking of mango, which likes a distinct dry
                > season and seems to prosper in India.
                > Trees develop deep roots, I think that is good for natural farming.
                > Now, if it is impossible to plant trees in your land, then disregard this
                > point of view.
                > The idea is to develop a food forest, but that could take 50 years.
                > Good luck.
                > RUTHIE
                >



                > --
                >
                Boovarahan S
                Chennai.
                09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Harish Amur
                Turmeric, ginger and many creepers grow very well in shade. Most of these are cash crops . So if you grow trees and grow these crops below them, the successor
                Message 7 of 8 , Aug 3, 2011
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                  Turmeric, ginger and many creepers grow very well in shade. Most of these
                  are 'cash crops'. So if you grow trees and grow these crops below them, the
                  successor may not object. However I do know that it is hard to break this
                  'rigid' culture.

                  Is shade the reason or do they claim that the large trees consume all of the
                  nutrients? Or that they obstruct the tilling process?

                  On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 7:08 AM, Boovarahan Srinivasan <offtown@...>wrote:

                  > **
                  >
                  >
                  > I thought of that way but the problem is the land is a leased one for 5
                  > years and the landlady may reclaim it any time before. And she may not like
                  > growing trees as the local villagers are of the view that shade giving
                  > trees
                  > deter the growth of grains. Even if I grow trees , the subsequent farmers
                  > will cut it down without mercy.
                  >
                  > I own another small piece of land ( 29 cents ) and am going to plant some
                  > trees there .
                  >
                  > On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 10:00 PM, Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...
                  > >wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > > Booze,
                  > > Wouldn't it be a good idea to plant some fruit trees, even sparsely, say
                  > > every 50 meters apart? I was thinking of mango, which likes a distinct
                  > dry
                  > > season and seems to prosper in India.
                  > > Trees develop deep roots, I think that is good for natural farming.
                  > > Now, if it is impossible to plant trees in your land, then disregard this
                  > > point of view.
                  > > The idea is to develop a food forest, but that could take 50 years.
                  > > Good luck.
                  > > RUTHIE
                  > >
                  >
                  > > --
                  >
                  > >
                  > Boovarahan S
                  > Chennai.
                  > 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Raju Titus
                  Dear friend, This is true there is no need of bringing any organic matter from outside in Fukuoka farming if we protect it and not allow it go out side.The
                  Message 8 of 8 , Aug 4, 2011
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                    Dear friend,
                    This is true there is no need of bringing any organic matter from outside in
                    Fukuoka farming if we protect it and not allow it go out side.The shortage
                    of organic matter due to erosion of soil, erosion of biodiversity and
                    erosion water.This shortage directly liked with tilling,burning of
                    straws,and uncontrolled grazing. Fukuoka never said that do not keep animals
                    and never use organic matter. But he told that making compost is useless
                    work.
                    Thanks
                    Raju

                    On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 5:00 PM, Linda Shewan <linda_shewan@...>wrote:

                    > **
                    >
                    >
                    > I would say no inputs is the aim of natural farming - but Fukuoka DID bring
                    > in chicken manure from a local farmer to put over the straw to help it
                    > decompose before spring. He only did this once his ducks were constrained
                    > by
                    > the highway though.
                    >
                    > If you don't raise livestock you need to determine if the manure is an
                    > absolute requirement for your needs. It quite likely isn't it but even then
                    > there is no need to raise livestock, just accommodate it - you could setup
                    > dovecotes and bat boxes and harvest the manure from them as an option.
                    >
                    > I don't think Raju uses any inputs? Am I correct Raju?
                    >
                    > Linda
                    >
                    > From: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Boovarahan
                    > Srinivasan
                    > Sent: Wednesday, 3 August 2011 9:07 PM
                    > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: A nice link
                    >
                    > Ok !
                    >
                    > Bringing in any outside thing is not considered as natural farming.
                    > Though Fukuoka did not bring in anything from outside the ducks did it for
                    > him.
                    > What if one doesn't grow livestock ?
                    >
                    > Boovarahan S
                    > Chennai.
                    > 09962662717 (Vodafone) , 08825889492 (Videocon)
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >



                    --
                    Raju Titus. Hoshangabad. 461001.India.
                    +919179738049.
                    http://picasaweb.google.com/rajuktitus
                    fukuoka_farming yahoogroup


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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