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Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties

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  • Sumant Joshi
    I think the point is, once it is acknowledged that it is farmers who are responsible for developing farmable food, these companies will find it much more
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 4, 2011
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      I think the point is, once it is acknowledged that it is farmers who are responsible for 'developing' farmable food, these companies will find it much more difficult to get patents for something they have not made. I have not understood how this initiative is supporting their DNA copyright? Well I guess money, especially if there is too much of it, is bad.
      and fujiinn, this is a place to rant and rant and rant, I do it all the time.
      :))
      Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone

      Warm regards,

      Sumant Joshi
      Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161

      --- On Mon, 4/4/11, fujiinn <fujiinn@...> wrote:

      From: fujiinn <fujiinn@...>
      Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Re: Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties
      To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Monday, 4 April, 2011, 1:59 PM
















       









      IMHO, there is a logic issue in your statement. If the question is not whether the peruvian communities will recieve their royalties, then what's the point of this tax? To put Monsanto on it's toes? And how will it accomplish that, by taxing common folk even more? I think Monsanto is really terrified, considering that this innitative is supporting their copyright on DNA. And I think it's really important to understand what's going to happen with all this money. I can't believe that from lying and cheating something good could come out. It just doesn't happen :)



      Sorry if I rant too much...



      --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, Sumant Joshi <sumant_jo@...> wrote:

      >

      > Well, the question is not whether they will get anything or not. It is a totally new concept, people have to get used to the fact that farmers should be given credit for developing farmable food. That should put Monsanto and cargill seed companies on the back foot. They have been taking patents for 'improved' seeds which have been developed by someone else and making money out of it without paying royalties.

      >

      > Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone

      >

      > Warm regards,

      >

      > Sumant Joshi

      > Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161

      >

      > --- On Sat, 2/4/11, Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...> wrote:

      >

      > From: Ruthie Aquino <ruthieaquino1@...>

      > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties

      > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com

      > Cc: "fujiinn" <fujiinn@...>

      > Date: Saturday, 2 April, 2011, 7:13 PM

      >

      > It won't

      > (Ah yes that's pessimistic alright.)

      > Maybe 10% will got to them and the rest to all the human resources required

      > to collect it, and they will need offices, and salaries, and lots of flights

      > to promote such a good idea, and they will need ads....

      > And there I'm being optimistic because the Indians might not even get those

      > 10%.

      > Who says charity isn't profitable?

      >

      > best

      > RUTHIE

      >

      > 2011/4/2 fujiinn <fujiinn@...>

      >

      > >

      > >

      > > And do you really think that the money will reach the Peruvian communities?

      > >

      > >

      > >

      >

      >

      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

      >

      >

      >

      > ------------------------------------

      >

      > Yahoo! Groups Links

      >

      >

      >

      >

      >

      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

      >



























      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Jason Stewart
      From: - http://www.facebook.com/survival/posts/145102382222736 . Survival International commented on their own link. . —Quoting them: . Survival
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 4, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        From:
        -> http://www.facebook.com/survival/posts/145102382222736
        .
        Survival International commented on their own link.
        .
        —Quoting them: "
        .
        Survival International Many people ask, ‘What can tribal peoples teach the rest
        of the world?’ Most don’t know that tribal peoples have already given the world
        some of its most important foodstuffs, which sustain billions of people and
        which have already saved countless lives.

        The purpose of the 2011 Survival April Fool was to shock people into realising
        this important fact.

        Tribal peoples did not develop advanced machine-based technology; but they did
        develop most of the world’s staple food crops. When allowed to, they often still
        choose a way of life different to that of industrialised society. This doesn’t
        mean they are ‘backward’ or ‘primitive’. They are a vital component of the
        world’s human diversity, but are routinely treated with contempt, their rights
        abused, and their ways of life denied them.

        Survival seeks to change this. Its April Fool is just one of many tools used to
        do so.
        "
        .
        -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desiree_potato
        .
        -> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dauphinoise
        .
        -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratin#Gratin_dauphinois
        .
        humour has great importance...

        ________________________________
        From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
        To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2011 10:39:56
        Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
        royalties


        Congratulations to all India! –winning the Cricket World Cup BTW (by the way) –
        entirely seriously i mean—and serious celebrations i hear—i say without any
        element at all of April 1st fools day humour joking at all... .
        .
        .
        Biggest best wishes to all Japanese, all cricket fans, and to all,
        .
        Jason Stewart
        –busy in south eastern Oz.

        ________________________________
        From: Sumant Joshi <sumant_jo@...>
        To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, April 2, 2011 12:58:09
        Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
        royalties

        Thanks Jason for sharing. Great news indeed, a step in the right direction.

        Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone

        Warm regards,

        Sumant Joshi
        Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161

        --- On Sat, 2/4/11, Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...> wrote:

        From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
        Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties
        To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Saturday, 2 April, 2011, 4:03 AM

        Some good news:

        -> http://www.survivalinternational.org/news/7144

        .

        from yesterday morning our time here in Australia :) .

        .

        .

        Biggest best wishes to all Japanese and to all,

        .

        Jason Stewart

        busy in south eastern Oz.

        .

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • fujiinn
        Thanks Jason for clearing this up. I was about to ask for the source of this news once I was unable to find anything about this Intellectual Property
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 5, 2011
        • 0 Attachment
          Thanks Jason for clearing this up. I was about to ask for the source of this news once I was unable to find anything about this "Intellectual Property Tribunal" or "Dr. Desiree Dauphinoise".

          To answer Sumant Joshi, this, now hypotetical, fee would have been paid by the consumer, and it's exactly that, copyright. Monsanto charges it's customers and imposes draconic measures on them so that it's copyright is preserved. What's the difference? Even if Monsanto was forced by this hypotethical tribunal to pay this fee (assuming the UN tribunal has jurisdiction over a multinational corporation, and potato GMO was an important crop for them - here I think soy and corn are the base for Monsanto), the fee would have been paid by the people buying the GMO potato seeds. I don't see how this fee would stop corporations to put a copyright claim on a crop they didn't develop from scratch, because the peruvians didn't develop this crop from scratch either. And the discussion could keep on, and on, and on :)

          --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...> wrote:
          >
          > From:
          > -> http://www.facebook.com/survival/posts/145102382222736
          > .
          > Survival International commented on their own link.
          > .
          > â€"Quoting them: "
          > .
          > Survival International Many people ask, ‘What can tribal peoples teach the rest
          > of the world?’ Most don’t know that tribal peoples have already given the world
          > some of its most important foodstuffs, which sustain billions of people and
          > which have already saved countless lives.
          >
          > The purpose of the 2011 Survival April Fool was to shock people into realising
          > this important fact.
          >
          > Tribal peoples did not develop advanced machine-based technology; but they did
          > develop most of the world’s staple food crops. When allowed to, they often still
          > choose a way of life different to that of industrialised society. This doesn’t
          > mean they are ‘backward’ or ‘primitive’. They are a vital component of the
          > world’s human diversity, but are routinely treated with contempt, their rights
          > abused, and their ways of life denied them.
          >
          > Survival seeks to change this. Its April Fool is just one of many tools used to
          > do so.
          > "
          > .
          > -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desiree_potato
          > .
          > -> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dauphinoise
          > .
          > -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratin#Gratin_dauphinois
          > .
          > humour has great importance...
          >
          > ________________________________
          > From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
          > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2011 10:39:56
          > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
          > royalties
          >
          >
          > Congratulations to all India! â€"winning the Cricket World Cup BTW (by the way) â€"
          > entirely seriously i meanâ€"and serious celebrations i hearâ€"i say without any
          > element at all of April 1st fools day humour joking at all... .
          > .
          > .
          > Biggest best wishes to all Japanese, all cricket fans, and to all,
          > .
          > Jason Stewart
          > â€"busy in south eastern Oz.
          >
          > ________________________________
          > From: Sumant Joshi <sumant_jo@...>
          > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Saturday, April 2, 2011 12:58:09
          > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
          > royalties
          >
          > Thanks Jason for sharing. Great news indeed, a step in the right direction.
          >
          > Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone
          >
          > Warm regards,
          >
          > Sumant Joshi
          > Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161
          >
          > --- On Sat, 2/4/11, Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...> wrote:
          >
          > From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
          > Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties
          > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
          > Date: Saturday, 2 April, 2011, 4:03 AM
          >
          > Some good news:
          >
          > -> http://www.survivalinternational.org/news/7144
          >
          > .
          >
          > from yesterday morning our time here in Australia :) .
          >
          > .
          >
          > .
          >
          > Biggest best wishes to all Japanese and to all,
          >
          > .
          >
          > Jason Stewart
          >
          > busy in south eastern Oz.
          >
          > .
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
        • Sumant Joshi
          Well, I guess this money thing sucks, one way or other. It destroys people.  Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone Warm regards, Sumant Joshi Tel - 09370010424,
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 5, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            Well, I guess this money thing sucks, one way or other. It destroys people. 
            Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone

            Warm regards,

            Sumant Joshi
            Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161

            --- On Tue, 5/4/11, fujiinn <fujiinn@...> wrote:

            From: fujiinn <fujiinn@...>
            Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Re: Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties
            To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Tuesday, 5 April, 2011, 5:20 PM
















             









            Thanks Jason for clearing this up. I was about to ask for the source of this news once I was unable to find anything about this "Intellectual Property Tribunal" or "Dr. Desiree Dauphinoise".



            To answer Sumant Joshi, this, now hypotetical, fee would have been paid by the consumer, and it's exactly that, copyright. Monsanto charges it's customers and imposes draconic measures on them so that it's copyright is preserved. What's the difference? Even if Monsanto was forced by this hypotethical tribunal to pay this fee (assuming the UN tribunal has jurisdiction over a multinational corporation, and potato GMO was an important crop for them - here I think soy and corn are the base for Monsanto), the fee would have been paid by the people buying the GMO potato seeds. I don't see how this fee would stop corporations to put a copyright claim on a crop they didn't develop from scratch, because the peruvians didn't develop this crop from scratch either. And the discussion could keep on, and on, and on :)



            --- In fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com, Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...> wrote:

            >

            > From:

            > -> http://www.facebook.com/survival/posts/145102382222736

            > .

            > Survival International commented on their own link.

            > .

            > â€"Quoting them: "

            > .

            > Survival International Many people ask, ‘What can tribal peoples teach the rest

            > of the world?’ Most don’t know that tribal peoples have already given the world

            > some of its most important foodstuffs, which sustain billions of people and

            > which have already saved countless lives.

            >

            > The purpose of the 2011 Survival April Fool was to shock people into realising

            > this important fact.

            >

            > Tribal peoples did not develop advanced machine-based technology; but they did

            > develop most of the world’s staple food crops. When allowed to, they often still

            > choose a way of life different to that of industrialised society. This doesn’t

            > mean they are ‘backward’ or ‘primitive’. They are a vital component of the

            > world’s human diversity, but are routinely treated with contempt, their rights

            > abused, and their ways of life denied them.

            >

            > Survival seeks to change this. Its April Fool is just one of many tools used to

            > do so.

            > "

            > .

            > -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desiree_potato

            > .

            > -> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dauphinoise

            > .

            > -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratin#Gratin_dauphinois

            > .

            > humour has great importance...

            >

            > ________________________________

            > From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>

            > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com

            > Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2011 10:39:56

            > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive

            > royalties

            >

            >

            > Congratulations to all India! â€"winning the Cricket World Cup BTW (by the way) â€"

            > entirely seriously i meanâ€"and serious celebrations i hearâ€"i say without any

            > element at all of April 1st fools day humour joking at all... .

            > .

            > .

            > Biggest best wishes to all Japanese, all cricket fans, and to all,

            > .

            > Jason Stewart

            > â€"busy in south eastern Oz.

            >

            > ________________________________

            > From: Sumant Joshi <sumant_jo@...>

            > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com

            > Sent: Saturday, April 2, 2011 12:58:09

            > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive

            > royalties

            >

            > Thanks Jason for sharing. Great news indeed, a step in the right direction.

            >

            > Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone

            >

            > Warm regards,

            >

            > Sumant Joshi

            > Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161

            >

            > --- On Sat, 2/4/11, Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...> wrote:

            >

            > From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>

            > Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive royalties

            > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com

            > Date: Saturday, 2 April, 2011, 4:03 AM

            >

            > Some good news:

            >

            > -> http://www.survivalinternational.org/news/7144

            >

            > .

            >

            > from yesterday morning our time here in Australia :) .

            >

            > .

            >

            > .

            >

            > Biggest best wishes to all Japanese and to all,

            >

            > .

            >

            > Jason Stewart

            >

            > busy in south eastern Oz.

            >

            > .

            >

            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            >

            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            >

            >

            >

            >

            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            >



























            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Ruthie Aquino
            You call this humor??? If I were an Indian I would feel very bad indeed, not to receive my money. It is bad taste, it is mean. Sorry for this late reaction,
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 7, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              You call this humor???
              If I were an Indian I would feel very bad indeed, not to receive my money.
              It is bad taste, it is mean.
              Sorry for this late reaction, but I couldn't pinpoint until now what was
              bothering me about this post and put it in words.
              Just a question, are our group members more aware now of the plight of
              tribal people, after reading this stuff?
              Does this article make them want to plant more, in smaller farms, with lower
              profit cash crops? (Cash crops?!?!)

              RUTHIE

              2011/4/5 Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>

              >
              >
              > From:
              > -> http://www.facebook.com/survival/posts/145102382222736
              > .
              > Survival International commented on their own link.
              > .
              > �Quoting them: "
              > .
              > Survival International Many people ask, �What can tribal peoples teach the
              > rest
              > of the world?� Most don�t know that tribal peoples have already given the
              > world
              > some of its most important foodstuffs, which sustain billions of people and
              >
              > which have already saved countless lives.
              >
              > The purpose of the 2011 Survival April Fool was to shock people into
              > realising
              > this important fact.
              >
              > Tribal peoples did not develop advanced machine-based technology; but they
              > did
              > develop most of the world�s staple food crops. When allowed to, they often
              > still
              > choose a way of life different to that of industrialised society. This
              > doesn�t
              > mean they are �backward� or �primitive�. They are a vital component of the
              > world�s human diversity, but are routinely treated with contempt, their
              > rights
              > abused, and their ways of life denied them.
              >
              > Survival seeks to change this. Its April Fool is just one of many tools
              > used to
              > do so.
              > "
              > .
              > -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desiree_potato
              > .
              > -> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dauphinoise
              > .
              > -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gratin#Gratin_dauphinois
              > .
              > humour has great importance...
              >
              > ________________________________
              > From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
              > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Sunday, April 3, 2011 10:39:56
              > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
              > royalties
              >
              > Congratulations to all India! �winning the Cricket World Cup BTW (by the
              > way) �
              > entirely seriously i mean�and serious celebrations i hear�i say without any
              >
              > element at all of April 1st fools day humour joking at all... .
              > .
              > .
              > Biggest best wishes to all Japanese, all cricket fans, and to all,
              > .
              > Jason Stewart
              > �busy in south eastern Oz.
              >
              > ________________________________
              > From: Sumant Joshi <sumant_jo@...>
              >
              > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Saturday, April 2, 2011 12:58:09
              > Subject: Re: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
              > royalties
              >
              > Thanks Jason for sharing. Great news indeed, a step in the right direction.
              >
              >
              >
              > Sent from my BSNL landline B-fone
              >
              > Warm regards,
              >
              > Sumant Joshi
              > Tel - 09370010424, 0253-2361161
              >
              > --- On Sat, 2/4/11, Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...> wrote:
              >
              > From: Jason Stewart <macropneuma@...>
              > Subject: [fukuoka_farming] Potatoes: South American Indians to receive
              > royalties
              >
              > To: fukuoka_farming@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Saturday, 2 April, 2011, 4:03 AM
              >
              > Some good news:
              >
              > -> http://www.survivalinternational.org/news/7144
              >
              > .
              >
              > from yesterday morning our time here in Australia :) .
              >
              > .
              >
              > .
              >
              > Biggest best wishes to all Japanese and to all,
              >
              > .
              >
              > Jason Stewart
              >
              > busy in south eastern Oz.
              >
              >
              > .
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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