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7269Re: [fukuoka_farming] Re: Fukuoka's Books

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  • Dieter Brand
    Mar 1, 2008
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      > The important part of any scientific community is the open exchange of
      > ideas and the ability of those ideas to be OPENLY tested.

      The important part for society as a whole is that new ideas can be
      made public without the originator (inventor, author, etc.) having to
      fear that the fruit of his/her labour will be stolen by third parties for
      their own financial gain. Intellectual property rights governing
      inventions and copyright are a contract between the inventor/author
      and the public with the express purpose that any new idea is made
      public as soon as possible so that others might _use_ it to improve
      on that idea. Without this contract any inventor/author would be forced
      to keep his/her idea secret as long as possible. I don't believe that
      is in the interest of the scientific community you are so concerned
      about.

      The equivalent of copyright for authors or the priority date for inventions
      is the publication date for scientific discoveries. As soon as you can
      present your idea at a scientific meeting or have it published in a
      scientific publication the homogeneity of the scientific community
      will assure that it is you and not somebody else who will sack in the
      Nobel price for it.

      > The world will never be changed by something that costs money.
      > What do you mean I can't USE a word. that's stupidity.
      > language is fundamental.

      You can and do use as many words as you like. If, however, you
      use a photocopier or some other mechanical devise of replication,
      that on your part does not involve a great amount of ingenuity, to
      copy 10,000 words from somebody else's work in the exact some
      order, that can be intellectual property theft. Most people do it anyway,
      and as long as they don't make a great deal of money by selling,
      it is usually not prosecuted.

      For example, if I sit at my computer for 6 months to do the translation
      of a book, do a lot of sweating to produce the best translation possible.
      And if after that, a "smart guy" with a photocopier would say thank you
      (or probably not event that) and sell the work as his own, where would
      I live from during 6 months? Or if I managed to live somehow, would I
      ever want to translate another book? Hardly! The same applies to
      authors, inventors and other creators.

      And yes, intellectual property theft _is_ no different from any other
      theft. If you want a World without money, then this must apply
      for _all_ and not just for creators. Which means the farmer must
      give away his produce for nothing, the scientist must work without
      salary, the seed company must give away its seeds for nothing,
      etc. It is a common feature among many "idealists" that they want
      others to pay for putting their idealistic dreams into practice.

      Having said that, it goes without saying that copyright law, like any
      other form of regulation, is subject to misuse by the "smart guys",
      the corporate ones just like the individual ones. Confucius was correct
      to advice not to put any law into writing, because as soon as you cut
      a law into stone (didn‘t have paper in those days), people will start
      finding loopholes. Unfortunately, Confucianism only works in a
      feudalistic society. But to listen to some of the more extreme ravings
      on assorted mailing lists, some want to cut short that stage to go
      directly to a totalitarian society, which is convenient in that it doesn't
      require any laws whatsoever.

      Dieter Brand
      Portugal


      Jeff <shultonus@...> wrote:
      > Hi Iris and Ibo,
      >
      > What kind of copyright agreement do you have?
      >
      > You know that theft of intellectual property is no different from
      stealing somebody's property.
      >
      > While the _restricted_ distribution of out of print texts free of
      charge > may in some cases be viewed mildly. Selling somebody
      else's (author, translator or publisher) property is straightforward
      theft.
      >
      besides since Fukuoka is out of print, ......

      Wow, I'm shocked.

      Intellectual property theft is NOTHING like actual theft.
      In fact what we view as intellectual property has been blown way out
      of proportion to the original concept.
      (see "FREE CULTURE" by Lawrence Lessig)

      The important part of any scientific community is the open exchange of
      ideas and the ability of those ideas to be OPENLY tested.

      Originally the copyright was for 17 years.. because of RCA and Disney
      corporations, art and science are being smothered to feed corporate
      coffers.. the current copywrite extends for more than 100 years. this
      is rediculous. THen we have estates getting involved and even further
      in hibiting the transfer of these things.

      The world will never be changed by something that costs money.

      THis is my primary problem with keyline and permaculture...
      What do you mean I can't USE a word. that's stupidity. language is
      fundamental.






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