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Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!

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  • LadyElf
    What is your ammonia level? Water changes will effect nitrites for a few hours but they come right back. How often are you cleaning the tank (gravel?) what
    Message 1 of 26 , Aug 18, 2003
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      What is your ammonia level? Water changes will effect nitrites for a few
      hours but they come right back. How often are you cleaning the tank
      (gravel?) what type of a filter system do you have going? The tank may
      still be in it's cycling stages and the 25% water change every week is
      probably too much. When you stop and think about it that's actually changing
      out 50% of the water every two weeks, so it would be hard for beneficial
      bacteria to colonize. If you can, get some Prime and follow the directions
      on the bottle to help get rid of the nitrites and protect your fish. I
      don't know if you can do this for tetras or not, but you might check into
      adding salt to your aquarium. Salt will help protect the fish from nitrite
      poisoning as the tank cycles and the good bacteria can take over. The salt
      I'm speaking of is aquarium salt and NOT table salt.

      That's all I can think of right now get your ammonia readings and let us
      know. In the meantime definately get some Prime, it will help save your
      fishes lives :)

      Deb
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "animalsfan" <evnachum@...>
      To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 9:45 PM
      Subject: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


      > Hi, I have a 20 Gallon Long tank with 4 Black Widdow Tetra and 2
      > Serpae Tetra. My nitrite is at .5 and is not going down. I am doing
      > regular water changes (25% once a week) and am watching how much food
      > I am putting in the tank. I am 13 and have been in this hobby for a
      > little less then 2 months can someone please help me? The 2 serpae
      > tetra are also not eating as far as I can tell, I am feeding them
      > pellets once a day. Any ideas on how i can get them to eat before it
      > is to late? They might be nibbling on the flakes which I am feeding to
      > the 4 Black Widdow Tetra. But I don't know. Thanks alot!!
      >
      > ~~Evan
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      >
      >
      >
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      >
      >
    • Evan Davis
      The amonnia is at 0. I am using a penguin bio-wheel 175 filter. How often do you suggest doing the water changes and how much water should i take out? Evan ...
      Message 2 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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        The amonnia is at 0. I am using a penguin bio-wheel 175 filter. How often do you suggest doing the water changes and how much water should i take out?

        Evan
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: LadyElf
        To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 11:20 PM
        Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


        What is your ammonia level? Water changes will effect nitrites for a few
        hours but they come right back. How often are you cleaning the tank
        (gravel?) what type of a filter system do you have going? The tank may
        still be in it's cycling stages and the 25% water change every week is
        probably too much. When you stop and think about it that's actually changing
        out 50% of the water every two weeks, so it would be hard for beneficial
        bacteria to colonize. If you can, get some Prime and follow the directions
        on the bottle to help get rid of the nitrites and protect your fish. I
        don't know if you can do this for tetras or not, but you might check into
        adding salt to your aquarium. Salt will help protect the fish from nitrite
        poisoning as the tank cycles and the good bacteria can take over. The salt
        I'm speaking of is aquarium salt and NOT table salt.

        That's all I can think of right now get your ammonia readings and let us
        know. In the meantime definately get some Prime, it will help save your
        fishes lives :)

        Deb
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "animalsfan" <evnachum@...>
        To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 9:45 PM
        Subject: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


        > Hi, I have a 20 Gallon Long tank with 4 Black Widdow Tetra and 2
        > Serpae Tetra. My nitrite is at .5 and is not going down. I am doing
        > regular water changes (25% once a week) and am watching how much food
        > I am putting in the tank. I am 13 and have been in this hobby for a
        > little less then 2 months can someone please help me? The 2 serpae
        > tetra are also not eating as far as I can tell, I am feeding them
        > pellets once a day. Any ideas on how i can get them to eat before it
        > is to late? They might be nibbling on the flakes which I am feeding to
        > the 4 Black Widdow Tetra. But I don't know. Thanks alot!!
        >
        > ~~Evan
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        >
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        >
        >
        >



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        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • LadyElf
        Okay, so you have mechanical and bio filtration that s a good thing :) When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the nitrites finally went
        Message 3 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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          Okay, so you have mechanical and bio filtration that's a good thing :)

          When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the nitrites
          finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime, which helps convert the
          nitrite into a harmless form for the fish until the filter can get rid of
          it, then I also used Cycle on my bio wheel to help jumpstart it. You also
          need to remember that your PH and KH play a large roll in how your bacteria
          can work for you. If you have a PH tester and a KH tester that is the next
          thing I would test. Adding some aquarium salt to the level of .1% (read that
          as point 1% NOT 1%) will enable the fish to breathe easier and help prevent
          "brown blood disease" which is a direct result of nitrite poisoning.

          It could be that you are seeing the end of the cycling of the tank, since
          your ammonia is down to zero and your nitrites are high.....

          So, things that you need to do...do not change anymore water yet, since your
          ammonia is at 0 that is good, and changing out water for nitrites is a
          losing battle and changing out water that often will keep your tank at a
          cycling status.

          Need to get some Prime and some Cycle. You need to find out if you can salt
          the tank without hurting your tetras, I'm not sure about that.

          During these water changes have you cleaned the gravel at all?

          Deb
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
          To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 8:36 AM
          Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


          > The amonnia is at 0. I am using a penguin bio-wheel 175 filter. How often
          do you suggest doing the water changes and how much water should i take out?
          >
          > Evan
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: LadyElf
          > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 11:20 PM
          > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
          >
          >
          > What is your ammonia level? Water changes will effect nitrites for a
          few
          > hours but they come right back. How often are you cleaning the tank
          > (gravel?) what type of a filter system do you have going? The tank may
          > still be in it's cycling stages and the 25% water change every week is
          > probably too much. When you stop and think about it that's actually
          changing
          > out 50% of the water every two weeks, so it would be hard for beneficial
          > bacteria to colonize. If you can, get some Prime and follow the
          directions
          > on the bottle to help get rid of the nitrites and protect your fish. I
          > don't know if you can do this for tetras or not, but you might check
          into
          > adding salt to your aquarium. Salt will help protect the fish from
          nitrite
          > poisoning as the tank cycles and the good bacteria can take over. The
          salt
          > I'm speaking of is aquarium salt and NOT table salt.
          >
          > That's all I can think of right now get your ammonia readings and let us
          > know. In the meantime definately get some Prime, it will help save your
          > fishes lives :)
          >
          > Deb
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: "animalsfan" <evnachum@...>
          > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 9:45 PM
          > Subject: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
          >
          >
          > > Hi, I have a 20 Gallon Long tank with 4 Black Widdow Tetra and 2
          > > Serpae Tetra. My nitrite is at .5 and is not going down. I am doing
          > > regular water changes (25% once a week) and am watching how much food
          > > I am putting in the tank. I am 13 and have been in this hobby for a
          > > little less then 2 months can someone please help me? The 2 serpae
          > > tetra are also not eating as far as I can tell, I am feeding them
          > > pellets once a day. Any ideas on how i can get them to eat before it
          > > is to late? They might be nibbling on the flakes which I am feeding to
          > > the 4 Black Widdow Tetra. But I don't know. Thanks alot!!
          > >
          > > ~~Evan
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >
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          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
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        • Patrick A. Timlin
          ... The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just their plain tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply. Also test
          Message 4 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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            --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
            > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the nitrites
            > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,

            The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just their plain
            tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply. Also test
            your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do to your tap
            water and test it again to check if any of your products are giving you a
            false positive.


            =====
            Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
            http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/

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          • LadyElf
            Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where they are coming from and I ll bet they aren t coming from the tap water....I think the tank
            Message 5 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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              Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where they are
              coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming from the tap water....I think
              the tank is having trouble cycling because of the amount of water changes.

              Deb
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
              To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 3:19 PM
              Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


              > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
              > > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the nitrites
              > > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,
              >
              > The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just their
              plain
              > tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply. Also test
              > your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do to your
              tap
              > water and test it again to check if any of your products are giving you a
              > false positive.
              >
              >
              > =====
              > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
              > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
              >
              > __________________________________
              > Do you Yahoo!?
              > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
              > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
              >
              >
              > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              >
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
            • Evan Davis
              Thank you all very much!! I am going to be getting some aquarium salt tonight. I have been vaccuming the gravel. I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5. My local tap
              Message 6 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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                Thank you all very much!! I am going to be getting some aquarium salt tonight. I have been vaccuming the gravel. I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5. My local tap water is at 0. I am alittle confused because some people at my local fish store have been telling me that 10% water changes every day is the way to go, but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once a week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?

                ~~~Evan
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: LadyElf
                To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:45 PM
                Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where they are
                coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming from the tap water....I think
                the tank is having trouble cycling because of the amount of water changes.

                Deb
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 3:19 PM
                Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                > > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the nitrites
                > > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,
                >
                > The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just their
                plain
                > tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply. Also test
                > your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do to your
                tap
                > water and test it again to check if any of your products are giving you a
                > false positive.
                >
                >
                > =====
                > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                >
                > __________________________________
                > Do you Yahoo!?
                > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
                > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
                >
                >
                > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                >
                >
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                >
                >



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                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • LadyElf
                It s going to depend also on how large your fish are. But there is some reason your biological wheel isn t working yet and I m thinking that it could be too
                Message 7 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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                  It's going to depend also on how large your fish are. But there is some
                  reason your biological wheel isn't working yet and I'm thinking that it
                  could be too much water changing. But it's been a long time since I've had
                  a 20 gallon tank too, the smallest I have is a 30. But you need to give
                  your water time to cycle which is ammonia, then nitrites....since your
                  ammonia is 0 and your nitrites are high, it sounds like you are at the
                  beginning of the end of the cycle, the nitrites should go down by themselves
                  as the good bacteria take over the tank. That's why I was recommending not
                  only the salt (and talk to someone about how much you should give and even
                  if tetras can stand the salt at all) and the Prime to help get rid of the
                  nitrites and the Cycle to put onto your bio filters.

                  What is your PH? The KH sounds low...in order for your PH to be stable and
                  for your bacteria to work, the KH needs to be between 100-200ppm.....and I
                  don't think 3 is in that range, but I could be wrong since I don't have my
                  testing stuff in front of me.

                  Deb
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                  To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:18 PM
                  Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                  > Thank you all very much!! I am going to be getting some aquarium salt
                  tonight. I have been vaccuming the gravel. I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                  My local tap water is at 0. I am alittle confused because some people at my
                  local fish store have been telling me that 10% water changes every day is
                  the way to go, but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once a
                  week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a week
                  is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                  >
                  > ~~~Evan
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: LadyElf
                  > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:45 PM
                  > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                  >
                  >
                  > Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where they
                  are
                  > coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming from the tap water....I
                  think
                  > the tank is having trouble cycling because of the amount of water
                  changes.
                  >
                  > Deb
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                  > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                  > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 3:19 PM
                  > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                  >
                  >
                  > > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                  > > > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the
                  nitrites
                  > > > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,
                  > >
                  > > The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just
                  their
                  > plain
                  > > tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply. Also
                  test
                  > > your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do to
                  your
                  > tap
                  > > water and test it again to check if any of your products are giving
                  you a
                  > > false positive.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > =====
                  > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                  > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                  > >
                  > > __________________________________
                  > > Do you Yahoo!?
                  > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
                  > > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                  http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
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                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
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                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                  >
                  >
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                  >
                  >
                • Evan Davis
                  I paid a visit to my local fish store today to buy some aquarium salt and he show me something to get which was a chemi-pure filter medium bag which gets
                  Message 8 of 26 , Aug 19, 2003
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                    I paid a visit to my local fish store today to buy some aquarium salt and he show me something to get which was a chemi-pure filter medium bag which gets placed in front of the filter pad. This is supposed to take care of alot of things including nitrites. I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess will be legnthened because i only started with 4 fish and that is to little. What are your thoughts on this?

                    ~~~Evan
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: LadyElf
                    To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 10:48 PM
                    Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                    It's going to depend also on how large your fish are. But there is some
                    reason your biological wheel isn't working yet and I'm thinking that it
                    could be too much water changing. But it's been a long time since I've had
                    a 20 gallon tank too, the smallest I have is a 30. But you need to give
                    your water time to cycle which is ammonia, then nitrites....since your
                    ammonia is 0 and your nitrites are high, it sounds like you are at the
                    beginning of the end of the cycle, the nitrites should go down by themselves
                    as the good bacteria take over the tank. That's why I was recommending not
                    only the salt (and talk to someone about how much you should give and even
                    if tetras can stand the salt at all) and the Prime to help get rid of the
                    nitrites and the Cycle to put onto your bio filters.

                    What is your PH? The KH sounds low...in order for your PH to be stable and
                    for your bacteria to work, the KH needs to be between 100-200ppm.....and I
                    don't think 3 is in that range, but I could be wrong since I don't have my
                    testing stuff in front of me.

                    Deb
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                    To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:18 PM
                    Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                    > Thank you all very much!! I am going to be getting some aquarium salt
                    tonight. I have been vaccuming the gravel. I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                    My local tap water is at 0. I am alittle confused because some people at my
                    local fish store have been telling me that 10% water changes every day is
                    the way to go, but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once a
                    week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a week
                    is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                    >
                    > ~~~Evan
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: LadyElf
                    > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                    > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:45 PM
                    > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                    >
                    >
                    > Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where they
                    are
                    > coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming from the tap water....I
                    think
                    > the tank is having trouble cycling because of the amount of water
                    changes.
                    >
                    > Deb
                    > ----- Original Message -----
                    > From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                    > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                    > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 3:19 PM
                    > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                    >
                    >
                    > > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                    > > > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the
                    nitrites
                    > > > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,
                    > >
                    > > The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just
                    their
                    > plain
                    > > tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply. Also
                    test
                    > > your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do to
                    your
                    > tap
                    > > water and test it again to check if any of your products are giving
                    you a
                    > > false positive.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > =====
                    > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                    > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                    > >
                    > > __________________________________
                    > > Do you Yahoo!?
                    > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
                    > > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                    > > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
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                    >
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                    >
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                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
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                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
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                    >
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                  • Patrick A. Timlin
                    ... That depends on where the original poster is in the world. While here in the USA you are not as likely to get nitrites or nitrates in a public water
                    Message 9 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                    • 0 Attachment
                      --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                      > no matter where they are coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming
                      > from the tap water....

                      That depends on where the original poster is in the world. While here in the
                      USA you are not as likely to get nitrites or nitrates in a public water
                      supply, some other countries have much looser standards on the amount of
                      these allowed in public water systems. It is not entirely uncommon to have
                      people from Europe (for example) cite having tap water with already a
                      measurable amount of nitrates and nitrites in it.

                      Also, if the original poster is on a private well, and especially if they
                      live in a farming, livestock, or other agriculture industry area, you can
                      never be too sure what you might find in your water with fertilizer and
                      animal waste run off.


                      > I think the tank is having trouble cycling because
                      > of the amount of water changes.

                      I have never been a big fan of that theory. It would seem that as long as
                      there is an excess of ammonia or nitrites in the water, there should be no
                      reason why the bacteria growth would diminish or slow down. While you might
                      not want to mess with it too much, I do think water changes to keep ammonia
                      and/or nitrite levels to non-lethal levels is fine and probably won't slow
                      anything down. Of course I have no data or proof of that either, so I might
                      be wrong, but I suspect you are also lacking hard evidence on your theory as
                      well. <grin>


                      > What is your PH? The KH sounds low...in order for your PH to be stable and
                      > for your bacteria to work, the KH needs to be between 100-200ppm.....and I
                      > don't think 3 is in that range, but I could be wrong since I don't have my
                      > testing stuff in front of me.

                      I think 3 degrees of KH is probably fine. Most hard core planted tank people
                      who use CO2 injection try to aim for about 4-6 dKh and that is with injecting
                      CO2 which would really mess with the pH levels. 3 degrees, assuming we are
                      talking about the degree that are about equal to 17-18 ppm is enough.


                      =====
                      Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                      http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/

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                    • Patrick A. Timlin
                      ... Sounds like good water to me! ... Ask four more people if you want four more total different answers! Water changes are both a preference and also
                      Message 10 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                      • 0 Attachment
                        --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                        > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.

                        Sounds like good water to me!


                        > I am alittle confused because some people at my local fish store have
                        > been telling me that 10% water changes every day is the way to go,
                        > but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once a
                        > week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a
                        > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?

                        Ask four more people if you want four more total different answers! <smile>
                        Water changes are both a preference and also can depend on your specific tank
                        (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of food, plants or no plants,
                        stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25% weekly both sound great to
                        me. 50% every two weeks if you want.

                        I am of the opinion that partial water changes are the number one thing you
                        can do for you fish and are more beneficial than the best filter system on
                        the market. My own schedule/preference is to try and change about 20% weekly.
                        But some tanks I do less like a very lightly loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                        that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons every other week and some
                        tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                        water in each time rather than just 20%. Although sometimes laziness causes
                        me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon I have fish in there that I
                        have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are still going strong.


                        > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess will be legnthened
                        > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                        > to little. What are your thoughts on this?

                        Like my last post stated about water changes, it would seem to me that if you
                        have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have excess nitrites with
                        respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it, so I think the bacteria
                        should grow at the same rate as if had double or triple the bioload. I would
                        argue that if you had more fish in there, the bacteria would not multiply any
                        faster, but the levels would get higher and do it faster and be more
                        dangerous to your fish.

                        It sounds like you are doing fine so far.


                        =====
                        Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                        http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/

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                      • LadyElf
                        Personally, I found that they weren t worth the money spent on them. PRIME is what you need, it works and that is what people use that have Koi, show fish
                        Message 11 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Personally, I found that they weren't worth the money spent on them. PRIME
                          is what you need, it works and that is what people use that have Koi, show
                          fish etc.....This place, it has lots of info, even though it is more for Koi
                          and ponds, but there is some great people there and some wonderful advice
                          and has saved my fish several times :)

                          http://www.koivetforums.com/forums/index.php

                          When cycling an aquarium, four fish are plenty, usually one is enough, so I
                          think that they may have been trying to sell you more fish. Your tank is
                          cycling, definately, all you need to do is protect your fish from the
                          nitrite part of the cycle now and all should be fine. I had nine goldfish
                          in a 55 gallon tank, which is a lot of fish considering the smallest was 3
                          inches long and it still took my tank about two months to cycle.

                          In your fish medicine cabinent (that is what I like to call it) you need
                          Amquel (not ammolock) Prime, Aquarium Salt, and a master test kit, a salt
                          test kit and a two step ammonia test kit (that way you can measure ammonia
                          after you use Amquel). If you want to be even more safe, there is an
                          ammonia alert (I wish they made one for nitrites) test strip that goes into
                          the aquarium I believe. As I said before, I don't know how tetras take to
                          putting salt in their water, so you need to find someone that knows.

                          A salt test kit is important if you are going to add salt into the
                          tank.....in a twenty gallon it won't take much to bring it to a .1% (Point
                          1%, not 1%)

                          What is your PH???

                          Deb




                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                          To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                          Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 11:26 PM
                          Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                          > I paid a visit to my local fish store today to buy some aquarium salt and
                          he show me something to get which was a chemi-pure filter medium bag which
                          gets placed in front of the filter pad. This is supposed to take care of
                          alot of things including nitrites. I was also told that my tank's cycling
                          procesess will be legnthened because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                          to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                          >
                          > ~~~Evan
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: LadyElf
                          > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                          > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 10:48 PM
                          > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                          >
                          >
                          > It's going to depend also on how large your fish are. But there is some
                          > reason your biological wheel isn't working yet and I'm thinking that it
                          > could be too much water changing. But it's been a long time since I've
                          had
                          > a 20 gallon tank too, the smallest I have is a 30. But you need to give
                          > your water time to cycle which is ammonia, then nitrites....since your
                          > ammonia is 0 and your nitrites are high, it sounds like you are at the
                          > beginning of the end of the cycle, the nitrites should go down by
                          themselves
                          > as the good bacteria take over the tank. That's why I was recommending
                          not
                          > only the salt (and talk to someone about how much you should give and
                          even
                          > if tetras can stand the salt at all) and the Prime to help get rid of
                          the
                          > nitrites and the Cycle to put onto your bio filters.
                          >
                          > What is your PH? The KH sounds low...in order for your PH to be stable
                          and
                          > for your bacteria to work, the KH needs to be between 100-200ppm.....and
                          I
                          > don't think 3 is in that range, but I could be wrong since I don't have
                          my
                          > testing stuff in front of me.
                          >
                          > Deb
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                          > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                          > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:18 PM
                          > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                          >
                          >
                          > > Thank you all very much!! I am going to be getting some aquarium salt
                          > tonight. I have been vaccuming the gravel. I have a KH of 3 and a GH of
                          5.
                          > My local tap water is at 0. I am alittle confused because some people at
                          my
                          > local fish store have been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                          is
                          > the way to go, but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once
                          a
                          > week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a
                          week
                          > is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                          > >
                          > > ~~~Evan
                          > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > From: LadyElf
                          > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                          > > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:45 PM
                          > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where
                          they
                          > are
                          > > coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming from the tap water....I
                          > think
                          > > the tank is having trouble cycling because of the amount of water
                          > changes.
                          > >
                          > > Deb
                          > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                          > > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                          > > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 3:19 PM
                          > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                          > > > > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the
                          > nitrites
                          > > > > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,
                          > > >
                          > > > The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just
                          > their
                          > > plain
                          > > > tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply.
                          Also
                          > test
                          > > > your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do
                          to
                          > your
                          > > tap
                          > > > water and test it again to check if any of your products are
                          giving
                          > you a
                          > > > false positive.
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > =====
                          > > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                          > > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                          > > >
                          > > > __________________________________
                          > > > Do you Yahoo!?
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                        • Evan Davis
                          my PH is about 7.0 ~~ Evan ... From: LadyElf To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:54 AM Subject: Re: [Freshwater
                          Message 12 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                          • 0 Attachment
                            my PH is about 7.0

                            ~~ Evan
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: LadyElf
                            To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:54 AM
                            Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                            Personally, I found that they weren't worth the money spent on them. PRIME
                            is what you need, it works and that is what people use that have Koi, show
                            fish etc.....This place, it has lots of info, even though it is more for Koi
                            and ponds, but there is some great people there and some wonderful advice
                            and has saved my fish several times :)

                            http://www.koivetforums.com/forums/index.php

                            When cycling an aquarium, four fish are plenty, usually one is enough, so I
                            think that they may have been trying to sell you more fish. Your tank is
                            cycling, definately, all you need to do is protect your fish from the
                            nitrite part of the cycle now and all should be fine. I had nine goldfish
                            in a 55 gallon tank, which is a lot of fish considering the smallest was 3
                            inches long and it still took my tank about two months to cycle.

                            In your fish medicine cabinent (that is what I like to call it) you need
                            Amquel (not ammolock) Prime, Aquarium Salt, and a master test kit, a salt
                            test kit and a two step ammonia test kit (that way you can measure ammonia
                            after you use Amquel). If you want to be even more safe, there is an
                            ammonia alert (I wish they made one for nitrites) test strip that goes into
                            the aquarium I believe. As I said before, I don't know how tetras take to
                            putting salt in their water, so you need to find someone that knows.

                            A salt test kit is important if you are going to add salt into the
                            tank.....in a twenty gallon it won't take much to bring it to a .1% (Point
                            1%, not 1%)

                            What is your PH???

                            Deb




                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                            To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 11:26 PM
                            Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                            > I paid a visit to my local fish store today to buy some aquarium salt and
                            he show me something to get which was a chemi-pure filter medium bag which
                            gets placed in front of the filter pad. This is supposed to take care of
                            alot of things including nitrites. I was also told that my tank's cycling
                            procesess will be legnthened because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                            to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                            >
                            > ~~~Evan
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: LadyElf
                            > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                            > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 10:48 PM
                            > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                            >
                            >
                            > It's going to depend also on how large your fish are. But there is some
                            > reason your biological wheel isn't working yet and I'm thinking that it
                            > could be too much water changing. But it's been a long time since I've
                            had
                            > a 20 gallon tank too, the smallest I have is a 30. But you need to give
                            > your water time to cycle which is ammonia, then nitrites....since your
                            > ammonia is 0 and your nitrites are high, it sounds like you are at the
                            > beginning of the end of the cycle, the nitrites should go down by
                            themselves
                            > as the good bacteria take over the tank. That's why I was recommending
                            not
                            > only the salt (and talk to someone about how much you should give and
                            even
                            > if tetras can stand the salt at all) and the Prime to help get rid of
                            the
                            > nitrites and the Cycle to put onto your bio filters.
                            >
                            > What is your PH? The KH sounds low...in order for your PH to be stable
                            and
                            > for your bacteria to work, the KH needs to be between 100-200ppm.....and
                            I
                            > don't think 3 is in that range, but I could be wrong since I don't have
                            my
                            > testing stuff in front of me.
                            >
                            > Deb
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                            > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                            > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:18 PM
                            > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                            >
                            >
                            > > Thank you all very much!! I am going to be getting some aquarium salt
                            > tonight. I have been vaccuming the gravel. I have a KH of 3 and a GH of
                            5.
                            > My local tap water is at 0. I am alittle confused because some people at
                            my
                            > local fish store have been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                            is
                            > the way to go, but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once
                            a
                            > week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a
                            week
                            > is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                            > >
                            > > ~~~Evan
                            > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > From: LadyElf
                            > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                            > > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 6:45 PM
                            > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Yes, but either way, he needs to do something......no matter where
                            they
                            > are
                            > > coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming from the tap water....I
                            > think
                            > > the tank is having trouble cycling because of the amount of water
                            > changes.
                            > >
                            > > Deb
                            > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                            > > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                            > > Sent: Tuesday, August 19, 2003 3:19 PM
                            > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                            > > > > When I set up my 55 gallon, it took over two months before the
                            > nitrites
                            > > > > finally went away. In the meantime I used Prime,
                            > > >
                            > > > The original poster might also try doing the nitrite test on just
                            > their
                            > > plain
                            > > > tap water to see if the nitrites are really in the water supply.
                            Also
                            > test
                            > > > your tap water plain, then add what ever water treatments you do
                            to
                            > your
                            > > tap
                            > > > water and test it again to check if any of your products are
                            giving
                            > you a
                            > > > false positive.
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > =====
                            > > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                            > > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                            > > >
                            > > > __________________________________
                            > > > Do you Yahoo!?
                            > > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
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                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Evan Davis
                            My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no nitrites
                            Message 13 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                            • 0 Attachment
                              My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my city gets its money from tourism since we are right by the beach.

                              Evan
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: Patrick A. Timlin
                              To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                              Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                              --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                              > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.

                              Sounds like good water to me!


                              > I am alittle confused because some people at my local fish store have
                              > been telling me that 10% water changes every day is the way to go,
                              > but then somepeople are telling me that 25% changes once a
                              > week are the way to go. But then I am also being told that a 25% once a
                              > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?

                              Ask four more people if you want four more total different answers! <smile>
                              Water changes are both a preference and also can depend on your specific tank
                              (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of food, plants or no plants,
                              stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25% weekly both sound great to
                              me. 50% every two weeks if you want.

                              I am of the opinion that partial water changes are the number one thing you
                              can do for you fish and are more beneficial than the best filter system on
                              the market. My own schedule/preference is to try and change about 20% weekly.
                              But some tanks I do less like a very lightly loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                              that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons every other week and some
                              tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                              water in each time rather than just 20%. Although sometimes laziness causes
                              me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon I have fish in there that I
                              have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are still going strong.


                              > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess will be legnthened
                              > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                              > to little. What are your thoughts on this?

                              Like my last post stated about water changes, it would seem to me that if you
                              have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have excess nitrites with
                              respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it, so I think the bacteria
                              should grow at the same rate as if had double or triple the bioload. I would
                              argue that if you had more fish in there, the bacteria would not multiply any
                              faster, but the levels would get higher and do it faster and be more
                              dangerous to your fish.

                              It sounds like you are doing fine so far.


                              =====
                              Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                              http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/

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                            • LadyElf
                              Well, his aren t coming from his tapwater, he said that they tested zero. Personally, I don t care how many changes he does, or how often, my concern is the
                              Message 14 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Well, his aren't coming from his tapwater, he said that they tested zero.
                                Personally, I don't care how many changes he does, or how often, my concern
                                is the level of nitrites in his water, he needs to get that under control
                                and just changing the water isn't going to do it.

                                He's running a Penquin biowheel filtration system, which gives him
                                mechanical and bio filtration so he actually does have a place for his good
                                bacteria to grow. There simply isn't enough right now and just changing his
                                water isn't going to keep his fish from dying at this point.

                                Nitrites are every bit as poisonous to fish as ammonia, and the fact that
                                his ammonia is at 0 right now and his nitrites are high indicate to me that
                                he is at the end of the cycling period and so all he really needs to do is
                                protect his fish from the nitrites while the good bacteria build up. In
                                order to do that the KH needs to be at least 100, his ph is good.

                                Deb


                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: "Patrick A. Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                                To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 10:22 AM
                                Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                > --- LadyElf <ladyelf@...> wrote:
                                > > no matter where they are coming from and I'll bet they aren't coming
                                > > from the tap water....
                                >
                                > That depends on where the original poster is in the world. While here in
                                the
                                > USA you are not as likely to get nitrites or nitrates in a public water
                                > supply, some other countries have much looser standards on the amount of
                                > these allowed in public water systems. It is not entirely uncommon to have
                                > people from Europe (for example) cite having tap water with already a
                                > measurable amount of nitrates and nitrites in it.
                                >
                                > Also, if the original poster is on a private well, and especially if they
                                > live in a farming, livestock, or other agriculture industry area, you can
                                > never be too sure what you might find in your water with fertilizer and
                                > animal waste run off.
                                >
                                >
                                > > I think the tank is having trouble cycling because
                                > > of the amount of water changes.
                                >
                                > I have never been a big fan of that theory. It would seem that as long as
                                > there is an excess of ammonia or nitrites in the water, there should be no
                                > reason why the bacteria growth would diminish or slow down. While you
                                might
                                > not want to mess with it too much, I do think water changes to keep
                                ammonia
                                > and/or nitrite levels to non-lethal levels is fine and probably won't slow
                                > anything down. Of course I have no data or proof of that either, so I
                                might
                                > be wrong, but I suspect you are also lacking hard evidence on your theory
                                as
                                > well. <grin>
                                >
                                >
                                > > What is your PH? The KH sounds low...in order for your PH to be stable
                                and
                                > > for your bacteria to work, the KH needs to be between 100-200ppm.....and
                                I
                                > > don't think 3 is in that range, but I could be wrong since I don't have
                                my
                                > > testing stuff in front of me.
                                >
                                > I think 3 degrees of KH is probably fine. Most hard core planted tank
                                people
                                > who use CO2 injection try to aim for about 4-6 dKh and that is with
                                injecting
                                > CO2 which would really mess with the pH levels. 3 degrees, assuming we are
                                > talking about the degree that are about equal to 17-18 ppm is enough.
                                >
                                >
                                > =====
                                > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                >
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                                >
                              • Patrick A. Timlin
                                ... But VA Beach is still full of animals, right? ===== Patrick Timlin ptimlin@yahoo.com http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                Message 15 of 26 , Aug 20, 2003
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                  > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in Virginia Beach, Virgina
                                  > which is of course in the USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                  > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my city gets its money from
                                  > tourism since we are right by the beach.

                                  But VA Beach is still full of animals, right? <grin>


                                  =====
                                  Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                  http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/

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                                • Chris Mericle
                                  Evan, Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News and have dealt with all of those stores over
                                  Message 16 of 26 , Aug 21, 2003
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Evan,

                                    Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                    getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                    and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                    My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                    Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                    you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                    advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                    knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                    while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                    and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                    go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                    to run into someone from around here.

                                    Chris
                                    --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                    > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                    > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                    > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                    > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                    > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                    > by the beach.
                                    >
                                    > Evan
                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                    > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                    > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                    > Please Help!!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                    > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                    >
                                    > Sounds like good water to me!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                    > local fish store have
                                    > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                    > is the way to go,
                                    > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                    > changes once a
                                    > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                    > told that a 25% once a
                                    > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                    > different answers! <smile>
                                    > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                    > depend on your specific tank
                                    > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                    > food, plants or no plants,
                                    > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                    > weekly both sound great to
                                    > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                    >
                                    > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                    > the number one thing you
                                    > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                    > the best filter system on
                                    > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                    > and change about 20% weekly.
                                    > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                    > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                    > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                    > every other week and some
                                    > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                    > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                    > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                    > sometimes laziness causes
                                    > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                    > I have fish in there that I
                                    > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                    > still going strong.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                    > will be legnthened
                                    > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                    > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                    >
                                    > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                    > would seem to me that if you
                                    > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                    > excess nitrites with
                                    > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                    > so I think the bacteria
                                    > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                    > triple the bioload. I would
                                    > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                    > bacteria would not multiply any
                                    > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                    > faster and be more
                                    > dangerous to your fish.
                                    >
                                    > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > =====
                                    > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                    > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                    >
                                    > __________________________________
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                                  • Evan Davis
                                    I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore (sorry i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one guy and he told
                                    Message 17 of 26 , Aug 21, 2003
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore (sorry i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one guy and he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44 years. I am hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope i am dealing with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari. Thanks for letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they were reputable.

                                      ~~~Evan
                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                      From: Chris Mericle
                                      To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                      Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                      Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                      Evan,

                                      Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                      getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                      and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                      My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                      Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                      you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                      advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                      knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                      while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                      and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                      go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                      to run into someone from around here.

                                      Chris
                                      --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                      > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                      > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                      > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                      > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                      > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                      > by the beach.
                                      >
                                      > Evan
                                      > ----- Original Message -----
                                      > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                      > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                      > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                      > Please Help!!
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                      > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                      >
                                      > Sounds like good water to me!
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                      > local fish store have
                                      > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                      > is the way to go,
                                      > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                      > changes once a
                                      > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                      > told that a 25% once a
                                      > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                      > different answers! <smile>
                                      > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                      > depend on your specific tank
                                      > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                      > food, plants or no plants,
                                      > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                      > weekly both sound great to
                                      > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                      >
                                      > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                      > the number one thing you
                                      > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                      > the best filter system on
                                      > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                      > and change about 20% weekly.
                                      > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                      > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                      > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                      > every other week and some
                                      > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                      > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                      > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                      > sometimes laziness causes
                                      > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                      > I have fish in there that I
                                      > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                      > still going strong.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                      > will be legnthened
                                      > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                      > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                      >
                                      > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                      > would seem to me that if you
                                      > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                      > excess nitrites with
                                      > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                      > so I think the bacteria
                                      > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                      > triple the bioload. I would
                                      > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                      > bacteria would not multiply any
                                      > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                      > faster and be more
                                      > dangerous to your fish.
                                      >
                                      > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > =====
                                      > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                      > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                      >
                                      > __________________________________
                                      > Do you Yahoo!?
                                      > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site
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                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • LadyElf
                                      So how are your fish today Evan? Deb ... From: Evan Davis To: Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58
                                      Message 18 of 26 , Aug 22, 2003
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        So how are your fish today Evan?

                                        Deb
                                        ----- Original Message -----
                                        From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                        To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                        Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58 PM
                                        Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                        > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore (sorry
                                        i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one guy and
                                        he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44 years. I am
                                        hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope i am dealing
                                        with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari. Thanks for
                                        letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they were
                                        reputable.
                                        >
                                        > ~~~Evan
                                        > ----- Original Message -----
                                        > From: Chris Mericle
                                        > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                        > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                        > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Evan,
                                        >
                                        > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                        > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                        > and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                        > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                        > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                        > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                        > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                        > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                        > while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                        > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                        > go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                        > to run into someone from around here.
                                        >
                                        > Chris
                                        > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                        > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                        > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                        > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                        > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                        > > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                        > > by the beach.
                                        > >
                                        > > Evan
                                        > > ----- Original Message -----
                                        > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                        > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                        > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                        > > Please Help!!
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                        > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                        > >
                                        > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                        > > local fish store have
                                        > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                        > > is the way to go,
                                        > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                        > > changes once a
                                        > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                        > > told that a 25% once a
                                        > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                        > > different answers! <smile>
                                        > > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                        > > depend on your specific tank
                                        > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                        > > food, plants or no plants,
                                        > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                        > > weekly both sound great to
                                        > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                        > >
                                        > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                        > > the number one thing you
                                        > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                        > > the best filter system on
                                        > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                        > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                        > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                        > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                        > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                        > > every other week and some
                                        > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                        > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                        > > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                        > > sometimes laziness causes
                                        > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                        > > I have fish in there that I
                                        > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                        > > still going strong.
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                        > > will be legnthened
                                        > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                        > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                        > >
                                        > > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                        > > would seem to me that if you
                                        > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                        > > excess nitrites with
                                        > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                        > > so I think the bacteria
                                        > > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                        > > triple the bioload. I would
                                        > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                        > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                        > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                        > > faster and be more
                                        > > dangerous to your fish.
                                        > >
                                        > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > =====
                                        > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                        > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                        > >
                                        > > __________________________________
                                        > > Do you Yahoo!?
                                        > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site
                                        > > design software
                                        > > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
                                        > >
                                        > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                        > > ADVERTISEMENT
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                        > > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                                        > > Terms of Service.
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                        > > removed]
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                        >
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                                      • Evan Davis
                                        they are doing pretty, thank goodness!! But the nitrite is still at .5 unfortunatley. So im hoping that come saturday all will be good! Thanks for all the
                                        Message 19 of 26 , Aug 22, 2003
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          they are doing pretty, thank goodness!! But the nitrite is still at .5 unfortunatley. So im hoping that come saturday all will be good! Thanks for all the advice and help!

                                          Evan
                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: LadyElf
                                          To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                          Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 8:09 PM
                                          Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                          So how are your fish today Evan?

                                          Deb
                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                          To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                          Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58 PM
                                          Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                          > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore (sorry
                                          i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one guy and
                                          he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44 years. I am
                                          hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope i am dealing
                                          with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari. Thanks for
                                          letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they were
                                          reputable.
                                          >
                                          > ~~~Evan
                                          > ----- Original Message -----
                                          > From: Chris Mericle
                                          > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                          > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                          > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Evan,
                                          >
                                          > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                          > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                          > and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                          > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                          > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                          > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                          > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                          > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                          > while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                          > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                          > go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                          > to run into someone from around here.
                                          >
                                          > Chris
                                          > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                          > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                          > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                          > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                          > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                          > > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                          > > by the beach.
                                          > >
                                          > > Evan
                                          > > ----- Original Message -----
                                          > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                          > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                          > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                          > > Please Help!!
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                          > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                          > >
                                          > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                          > > local fish store have
                                          > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                          > > is the way to go,
                                          > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                          > > changes once a
                                          > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                          > > told that a 25% once a
                                          > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                          > > different answers! <smile>
                                          > > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                          > > depend on your specific tank
                                          > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                          > > food, plants or no plants,
                                          > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                          > > weekly both sound great to
                                          > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                          > >
                                          > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                          > > the number one thing you
                                          > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                          > > the best filter system on
                                          > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                          > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                          > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                          > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                          > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                          > > every other week and some
                                          > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                          > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                          > > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                          > > sometimes laziness causes
                                          > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                          > > I have fish in there that I
                                          > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                          > > still going strong.
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                          > > will be legnthened
                                          > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                          > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                          > >
                                          > > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                          > > would seem to me that if you
                                          > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                          > > excess nitrites with
                                          > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                          > > so I think the bacteria
                                          > > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                          > > triple the bioload. I would
                                          > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                          > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                          > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                          > > faster and be more
                                          > > dangerous to your fish.
                                          > >
                                          > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > =====
                                          > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                          > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                          > >
                                          > > __________________________________
                                          > > Do you Yahoo!?
                                          > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site
                                          > > design software
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                                          > >
                                          > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                          > > ADVERTISEMENT
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                          > > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                                          > > Terms of Service.
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                          > > removed]
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          >
                                          >
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                                          >
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                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • LadyElf
                                          You re welcome. I still would try to get some Prime, that will help get rid of the rest of it :) Please keep us informed!! Deb ... From: Evan Davis
                                          Message 20 of 26 , Aug 22, 2003
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            You're welcome. I still would try to get some Prime, that will help get rid
                                            of the rest of it :)

                                            Please keep us informed!!

                                            Deb
                                            ----- Original Message -----
                                            From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                            To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                            Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 7:56 PM
                                            Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                            > they are doing pretty, thank goodness!! But the nitrite is still at .5
                                            unfortunatley. So im hoping that come saturday all will be good! Thanks for
                                            all the advice and help!
                                            >
                                            > Evan
                                            > ----- Original Message -----
                                            > From: LadyElf
                                            > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                            > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 8:09 PM
                                            > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > So how are your fish today Evan?
                                            >
                                            > Deb
                                            > ----- Original Message -----
                                            > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                            > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                            > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58 PM
                                            > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore
                                            (sorry
                                            > i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one guy
                                            and
                                            > he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44 years. I
                                            am
                                            > hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope i am
                                            dealing
                                            > with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari. Thanks for
                                            > letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they were
                                            > reputable.
                                            > >
                                            > > ~~~Evan
                                            > > ----- Original Message -----
                                            > > From: Chris Mericle
                                            > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                            > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > Evan,
                                            > >
                                            > > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                            > > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                            > > and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                            > > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                            > > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                            > > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                            > > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                            > > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                            > > while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                            > > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                            > > go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                            > > to run into someone from around here.
                                            > >
                                            > > Chris
                                            > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                            > > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                            > > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                            > > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                            > > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                            > > > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                            > > > by the beach.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Evan
                                            > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                            > > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                            > > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                            > > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                            > > > Please Help!!
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                            > > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                            > > > local fish store have
                                            > > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                            > > > is the way to go,
                                            > > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                            > > > changes once a
                                            > > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                            > > > told that a 25% once a
                                            > > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                            > > > different answers! <smile>
                                            > > > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                            > > > depend on your specific tank
                                            > > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                            > > > food, plants or no plants,
                                            > > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                            > > > weekly both sound great to
                                            > > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                            > > > the number one thing you
                                            > > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                            > > > the best filter system on
                                            > > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                            > > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                            > > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                            > > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                            > > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                            > > > every other week and some
                                            > > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                            > > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                            > > > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                            > > > sometimes laziness causes
                                            > > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                            > > > I have fish in there that I
                                            > > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                            > > > still going strong.
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                            > > > will be legnthened
                                            > > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                            > > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                            > > > would seem to me that if you
                                            > > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                            > > > excess nitrites with
                                            > > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                            > > > so I think the bacteria
                                            > > > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                            > > > triple the bioload. I would
                                            > > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                            > > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                            > > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                            > > > faster and be more
                                            > > > dangerous to your fish.
                                            > > >
                                            > > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > =====
                                            > > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                            > > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                            > > >
                                            > > > __________________________________
                                            > > > Do you Yahoo!?
                                            > > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site
                                            > > > design software
                                            > > > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                            > > > ADVERTISEMENT
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                                            > > > freshwateraquariums-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                                            > > > Terms of Service.
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                            > > > removed]
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > __________________________________
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                                            > >
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                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
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                                          • Evan Davis
                                            If prime also gets rid of the chlorine in the water then i also have been putting in prime. Evan ... From: LadyElf To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                            Message 21 of 26 , Aug 23, 2003
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              If prime also gets rid of the chlorine in the water then i also have been putting in prime.

                                              Evan
                                              ----- Original Message -----
                                              From: LadyElf
                                              To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                              Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 11:00 PM
                                              Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                              You're welcome. I still would try to get some Prime, that will help get rid
                                              of the rest of it :)

                                              Please keep us informed!!

                                              Deb
                                              ----- Original Message -----
                                              From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                              To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                              Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 7:56 PM
                                              Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                              > they are doing pretty, thank goodness!! But the nitrite is still at .5
                                              unfortunatley. So im hoping that come saturday all will be good! Thanks for
                                              all the advice and help!
                                              >
                                              > Evan
                                              > ----- Original Message -----
                                              > From: LadyElf
                                              > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                              > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 8:09 PM
                                              > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > So how are your fish today Evan?
                                              >
                                              > Deb
                                              > ----- Original Message -----
                                              > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                              > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                              > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58 PM
                                              > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore
                                              (sorry
                                              > i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one guy
                                              and
                                              > he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44 years. I
                                              am
                                              > hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope i am
                                              dealing
                                              > with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari. Thanks for
                                              > letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they were
                                              > reputable.
                                              > >
                                              > > ~~~Evan
                                              > > ----- Original Message -----
                                              > > From: Chris Mericle
                                              > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                              > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > Evan,
                                              > >
                                              > > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                              > > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                              > > and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                              > > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                              > > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                              > > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                              > > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                              > > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                              > > while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                              > > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                              > > go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                              > > to run into someone from around here.
                                              > >
                                              > > Chris
                                              > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                              > > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                              > > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                              > > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                              > > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                              > > > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                              > > > by the beach.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Evan
                                              > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                              > > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                              > > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                              > > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                              > > > Please Help!!
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                              > > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                              > > > local fish store have
                                              > > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                              > > > is the way to go,
                                              > > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                              > > > changes once a
                                              > > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                              > > > told that a 25% once a
                                              > > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                              > > > different answers! <smile>
                                              > > > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                              > > > depend on your specific tank
                                              > > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                              > > > food, plants or no plants,
                                              > > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                              > > > weekly both sound great to
                                              > > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                              > > > the number one thing you
                                              > > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                              > > > the best filter system on
                                              > > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                              > > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                              > > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                              > > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                              > > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                              > > > every other week and some
                                              > > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                              > > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                              > > > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                              > > > sometimes laziness causes
                                              > > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                              > > > I have fish in there that I
                                              > > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                              > > > still going strong.
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                              > > > will be legnthened
                                              > > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                              > > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                              > > > would seem to me that if you
                                              > > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                              > > > excess nitrites with
                                              > > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                              > > > so I think the bacteria
                                              > > > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                              > > > triple the bioload. I would
                                              > > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                              > > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                              > > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                              > > > faster and be more
                                              > > > dangerous to your fish.
                                              > > >
                                              > > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > =====
                                              > > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                              > > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                              > > >
                                              > > > __________________________________
                                              > > > Do you Yahoo!?
                                              > > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site
                                              > > > design software
                                              > > > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
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                                              > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                                              > > > ADVERTISEMENT
                                              > > >
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                                              > > >
                                              > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                                              > > > Terms of Service.
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                                              > > > removed]
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                                              > >
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                                            • Patrick Timlin
                                              Hmmmm, I replied to this before but it doesn t seem to have made it onto the list, so I will try again... ... Agreed. But... ... I am confused by this
                                              Message 22 of 26 , Aug 23, 2003
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                Hmmmm, I replied to this before but it doesn't seem to have made it
                                                onto the list, so I will try again...

                                                --- "LadyElf" <ladyelf@k...> wrote:
                                                > Nitrites are every bit as poisonous to fish as ammonia, and the fact
                                                > that his ammonia is at 0 right now and his nitrites are high indicate
                                                > to me that he is at the end of the cycling period and so all he
                                                > really needs to do is protect his fish from the nitrites while the
                                                > good bacteria build up.

                                                Agreed. But...


                                                > In order to do that the KH needs to be at least 100, his ph is good.

                                                I am confused by this statement and was wondering if you could explain
                                                it. I am not sure how you are linking alkalinity with nitrites and how
                                                a higher alkalinity is any protection against nitrite poisoning.

                                                The opposite is often true for ammonia poisoning, where a lower KH
                                                gives you a lower pH and acidic pH converts most of the more toxic
                                                ammonia into less toxic ammonium. But I don't see how raising the KH
                                                over 100ppm is going to be helpful protecting fish against nitrite
                                                poisoning. Please explain.

                                                Patrick
                                              • animalsfan
                                                I measured my nitrites today and the are at 0 ppm!!! Thank you all to everyone who helped me! Evan ... get rid ... at .5 ... Thanks for ... trashmore ... one
                                                Message 23 of 26 , Aug 23, 2003
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  I measured my nitrites today and the are at 0 ppm!!! Thank you all to
                                                  everyone who helped me!

                                                  Evan

                                                  --- In freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com, "LadyElf" <ladyelf@k...>
                                                  wrote:
                                                  > You're welcome. I still would try to get some Prime, that will help
                                                  get rid
                                                  > of the rest of it :)
                                                  >
                                                  > Please keep us informed!!
                                                  >
                                                  > Deb
                                                  > ----- Original Message -----
                                                  > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@c...>
                                                  > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                                  > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 7:56 PM
                                                  > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > > they are doing pretty, thank goodness!! But the nitrite is still
                                                  at .5
                                                  > unfortunatley. So im hoping that come saturday all will be good!
                                                  Thanks for
                                                  > all the advice and help!
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Evan
                                                  > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                  > > From: LadyElf
                                                  > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                  > > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 8:09 PM
                                                  > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > So how are your fish today Evan?
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Deb
                                                  > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                  > > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@c...>
                                                  > > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                                  > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58 PM
                                                  > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount
                                                  trashmore
                                                  > (sorry
                                                  > > i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with
                                                  one guy
                                                  > and
                                                  > > he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44
                                                  years. I
                                                  > am
                                                  > > hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope
                                                  i am
                                                  > dealing
                                                  > > with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari.
                                                  Thanks for
                                                  > > letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they
                                                  were
                                                  > > reputable.
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > ~~~Evan
                                                  > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                  > > > From: Chris Mericle
                                                  > > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                  > > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                                  > > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please
                                                  Help!!
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > Evan,
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                                  > > > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                                  > > > and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                                  > > > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                                  > > > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                                  > > > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                                  > > > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                                  > > > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                                  > > > while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                                  > > > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                                  > > > go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                                  > > > to run into someone from around here.
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > Chris
                                                  > > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@c...> wrote:
                                                  > > > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                                  > > > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                                  > > > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                                  > > > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                                  > > > > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                                  > > > > by the beach.
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > Evan
                                                  > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                  > > > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                                  > > > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                  > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                                  > > > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                                  > > > > Please Help!!
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@c...> wrote:
                                                  > > > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                                  > > > > local fish store have
                                                  > > > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                                  > > > > is the way to go,
                                                  > > > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                                  > > > > changes once a
                                                  > > > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                                  > > > > told that a 25% once a
                                                  > > > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                                  > > > > different answers! <smile>
                                                  > > > > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                                  > > > > depend on your specific tank
                                                  > > > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                                  > > > > food, plants or no plants,
                                                  > > > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                                  > > > > weekly both sound great to
                                                  > > > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                                  > > > > the number one thing you
                                                  > > > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                                  > > > > the best filter system on
                                                  > > > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                                  > > > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                                  > > > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                                  > > > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                                  > > > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                                  > > > > every other week and some
                                                  > > > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                                  > > > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                                  > > > > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                                  > > > > sometimes laziness causes
                                                  > > > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                                  > > > > I have fish in there that I
                                                  > > > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                                  > > > > still going strong.
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                                  > > > > will be legnthened
                                                  > > > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                                  > > > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                                  > > > > would seem to me that if you
                                                  > > > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                                  > > > > excess nitrites with
                                                  > > > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                                  > > > > so I think the bacteria
                                                  > > > > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                                  > > > > triple the bioload. I would
                                                  > > > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                                  > > > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                                  > > > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                                  > > > > faster and be more
                                                  > > > > dangerous to your fish.
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > =====
                                                  > > > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@y...
                                                  > > > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > __________________________________
                                                  > > > > Do you Yahoo!?
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                                                • LadyElf
                                                  Prime is a complete water conditioner. I really like it and lots of professionals use it also. :) It s a tip I got from the Koi vet board :) Deb ... From:
                                                  Message 24 of 26 , Aug 23, 2003
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    Prime is a complete water conditioner. I really like it and lots of
                                                    professionals use it also. :)

                                                    It's a tip I got from the Koi vet board :)

                                                    Deb
                                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                                    From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                                    To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                                    Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 6:21 AM
                                                    Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                                    > If prime also gets rid of the chlorine in the water then i also have been
                                                    putting in prime.
                                                    >
                                                    > Evan
                                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                                    > From: LadyElf
                                                    > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 11:00 PM
                                                    > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > You're welcome. I still would try to get some Prime, that will help get
                                                    rid
                                                    > of the rest of it :)
                                                    >
                                                    > Please keep us informed!!
                                                    >
                                                    > Deb
                                                    > ----- Original Message -----
                                                    > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                                    > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                                    > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 7:56 PM
                                                    > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > > they are doing pretty, thank goodness!! But the nitrite is still at .5
                                                    > unfortunatley. So im hoping that come saturday all will be good! Thanks
                                                    for
                                                    > all the advice and help!
                                                    > >
                                                    > > Evan
                                                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                    > > From: LadyElf
                                                    > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 8:09 PM
                                                    > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > So how are your fish today Evan?
                                                    > >
                                                    > > Deb
                                                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                    > > From: "Evan Davis" <evnachum@...>
                                                    > > To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                                    > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:58 PM
                                                    > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by mount trashmore
                                                    > (sorry
                                                    > > i cant explain the location any better). I am only dealing with one
                                                    guy
                                                    > and
                                                    > > he told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for over 44 years.
                                                    I
                                                    > am
                                                    > > hoping he isnt knowingly coning me out of money. nor do i hope i am
                                                    > dealing
                                                    > > with some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish safari. Thanks
                                                    for
                                                    > > letting ,e know about them! i wasnt too sure wether or not they were
                                                    > > reputable.
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > ~~~Evan
                                                    > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                    > > > From: Chris Mericle
                                                    > > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                                    > > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > Evan,
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with when
                                                    > > > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport News
                                                    > > > and have dealt with all of those stores over there.
                                                    > > > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a Maine
                                                    > > > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch who
                                                    > > > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                                    > > > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                                    > > > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for a
                                                    > > > while but some of the newer people just like to try
                                                    > > > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry to
                                                    > > > go off the subject but well I was just very surprised
                                                    > > > to run into someone from around here.
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > Chris
                                                    > > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                                    > > > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live in
                                                    > > > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in the
                                                    > > > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are no
                                                    > > > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town, my
                                                    > > > > city gets its money from tourism since we are right
                                                    > > > > by the beach.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > Evan
                                                    > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                    > > > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                                    > > > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                                    > > > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                                    > > > > Please Help!!
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                                    > > > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > > I am alittle confused because some people at my
                                                    > > > > local fish store have
                                                    > > > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every day
                                                    > > > > is the way to go,
                                                    > > > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                                    > > > > changes once a
                                                    > > > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also being
                                                    > > > > told that a 25% once a
                                                    > > > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse me?
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > Ask four more people if you want four more total
                                                    > > > > different answers! <smile>
                                                    > > > > Water changes are both a preference and also can
                                                    > > > > depend on your specific tank
                                                    > > > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types of
                                                    > > > > food, plants or no plants,
                                                    > > > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and 25%
                                                    > > > > weekly both sound great to
                                                    > > > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes are
                                                    > > > > the number one thing you
                                                    > > > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial than
                                                    > > > > the best filter system on
                                                    > > > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to try
                                                    > > > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                                    > > > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                                    > > > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                                    > > > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                                    > > > > every other week and some
                                                    > > > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30 gallon
                                                    > > > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                                    > > > > water in each time rather than just 20%. Although
                                                    > > > > sometimes laziness causes
                                                    > > > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty gallon
                                                    > > > > I have fish in there that I
                                                    > > > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they are
                                                    > > > > still going strong.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling procesess
                                                    > > > > will be legnthened
                                                    > > > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that is
                                                    > > > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > Like my last post stated about water changes, it
                                                    > > > > would seem to me that if you
                                                    > > > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you have
                                                    > > > > excess nitrites with
                                                    > > > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert it,
                                                    > > > > so I think the bacteria
                                                    > > > > should grow at the same rate as if had double or
                                                    > > > > triple the bioload. I would
                                                    > > > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                                    > > > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                                    > > > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do it
                                                    > > > > faster and be more
                                                    > > > > dangerous to your fish.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > =====
                                                    > > > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                                    > > > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                                    > > > >
                                                    > > > > __________________________________
                                                    > > > > Do you Yahoo!?
                                                    > > > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site
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                                                  • LadyElf
                                                    Patrick, I didn t. If you reread my post the KH comment was in regards to getting the KH high enough for the good bacteria to be able to colonize and to keep
                                                    Message 25 of 26 , Aug 23, 2003
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      Patrick, I didn't. If you reread my post the KH comment was in regards to
                                                      getting the KH high enough for the good bacteria to be able to colonize and
                                                      to keep the PH stable, which in turn will help the tank finish it's cycling.
                                                      Without a KH of at least 100 and the ph at 7 good bacteria will take longer
                                                      to reach the amounts that are needed to completely cycle the tank. 80 is
                                                      okay, but 100-200 KH will be better. The ph at 7 is excellent, that way if
                                                      the ammonia spikes again, it won't be as deadly if the ph is higher.

                                                      The only thing that is going to "protect" the fish while all of this is
                                                      going on is aquarium salt, not Prime, not Amquel or any of the other
                                                      conditioner products. Salt will keep help keep the nitrite poisoning to a
                                                      minimum and it only has to be at a .1% solution. Doesn't take much. What
                                                      Prime will do is help neutralize the nitrites while the bacteria catches up
                                                      and will not impact the ph in the tank the way some other conditioners will.

                                                      I swear by salt and Prime and I've been through some nitrite spikes from
                                                      hell. Last summer comes to mind when I lost all but 9 of over 30 fish in a
                                                      week due to it, until some kind soul finally told me about the salt and
                                                      Prime. It's good stuff.

                                                      So back to your question of me explaining, you misunderstood what I said and
                                                      the quote you took was out of context.

                                                      Deb
                                                      ----- Original Message -----
                                                      From: "Patrick Timlin" <ptimlin@...>
                                                      To: <freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com>
                                                      Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2003 12:04 PM
                                                      Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite Please Help!!


                                                      > Hmmmm, I replied to this before but it doesn't seem to have made it
                                                      > onto the list, so I will try again...
                                                      >
                                                      > --- "LadyElf" <ladyelf@k...> wrote:
                                                      > > Nitrites are every bit as poisonous to fish as ammonia, and the fact
                                                      > > that his ammonia is at 0 right now and his nitrites are high indicate
                                                      > > to me that he is at the end of the cycling period and so all he
                                                      > > really needs to do is protect his fish from the nitrites while the
                                                      > > good bacteria build up.
                                                      >
                                                      > Agreed. But...
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      > > In order to do that the KH needs to be at least 100, his ph is good.
                                                      >
                                                      > I am confused by this statement and was wondering if you could explain
                                                      > it. I am not sure how you are linking alkalinity with nitrites and how
                                                      > a higher alkalinity is any protection against nitrite poisoning.
                                                      >
                                                      > The opposite is often true for ammonia poisoning, where a lower KH
                                                      > gives you a lower pH and acidic pH converts most of the more toxic
                                                      > ammonia into less toxic ammonium. But I don't see how raising the KH
                                                      > over 100ppm is going to be helpful protecting fish against nitrite
                                                      > poisoning. Please explain.
                                                      >
                                                      > Patrick
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                      >
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                                                      >
                                                    • Chris Mericle
                                                      Hey Evan I did have one quick question I meant to ask the other day. Have you gone 24 to 48 hours without feeding your fish since you have had the nitrate
                                                      Message 26 of 26 , Aug 24, 2003
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                                                        Hey Evan I did have one quick question I meant to ask
                                                        the other day. Have you gone 24 to 48 hours without
                                                        feeding your fish since you have had the nitrate
                                                        problem? If not I do recommend that. The fish will
                                                        be just fine not having food for that amount of time.

                                                        Chris
                                                        --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                                        > I go to the Animal Jungle on Holland Road right by
                                                        > mount trashmore (sorry i cant explain the location
                                                        > any better). I am only dealing with one guy and he
                                                        > told me that he has been in tghe fish buisness for
                                                        > over 44 years. I am hoping he isnt knowingly coning
                                                        > me out of money. nor do i hope i am dealing with
                                                        > some unknowledgable people. but i will try fish
                                                        > safari. Thanks for letting ,e know about them! i
                                                        > wasnt too sure wether or not they were reputable.
                                                        >
                                                        > ~~~Evan
                                                        > ----- Original Message -----
                                                        > From: Chris Mericle
                                                        > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                        > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:22 PM
                                                        > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High Nitrite
                                                        > Please Help!!
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        > Evan,
                                                        >
                                                        > Quick question, who in VA BCH do you deal with
                                                        > when
                                                        > getting your fish and supplies, I live in Newport
                                                        > News
                                                        > and have dealt with all of those stores over
                                                        > there.
                                                        > My suggestion is Fish Safari as the owner is a
                                                        > Maine
                                                        > Biologist. But if you like Animal Jungle watch
                                                        > who
                                                        > you talk to because I have gotten some really bad
                                                        > advice from them before. They have a lot of
                                                        > knowledgeable individuals that have been there for
                                                        > a
                                                        > while but some of the newer people just like to
                                                        > try
                                                        > and tell you something that they overheard. Sorry
                                                        > to
                                                        > go off the subject but well I was just very
                                                        > surprised
                                                        > to run into someone from around here.
                                                        >
                                                        > Chris
                                                        > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                                        > > My name is Evan I am the orignial poster I live
                                                        > in
                                                        > > Virginia Beach, Virgina which is of course in
                                                        > the
                                                        > > USA. I tested my local tap water and there are
                                                        > no
                                                        > > nitrites in it. We dont live in a farming town,
                                                        > my
                                                        > > city gets its money from tourism since we are
                                                        > right
                                                        > > by the beach.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Evan
                                                        > > ----- Original Message -----
                                                        > > From: Patrick A. Timlin
                                                        > > To: freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com
                                                        > > Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 11:31 AM
                                                        > > Subject: Re: [Freshwater Aquariums] High
                                                        > Nitrite
                                                        > > Please Help!!
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > --- Evan Davis <evnachum@...> wrote:
                                                        > > > I have a KH of 3 and a GH of 5.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Sounds like good water to me!
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > > I am alittle confused because some people at
                                                        > my
                                                        > > local fish store have
                                                        > > > been telling me that 10% water changes every
                                                        > day
                                                        > > is the way to go,
                                                        > > > but then somepeople are telling me that 25%
                                                        > > changes once a
                                                        > > > week are the way to go. But then I am also
                                                        > being
                                                        > > told that a 25% once a
                                                        > > > week is too much. Can someone help unconfuse
                                                        > me?
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Ask four more people if you want four more
                                                        > total
                                                        > > different answers! <smile>
                                                        > > Water changes are both a preference and also
                                                        > can
                                                        > > depend on your specific tank
                                                        > > (types & size of fish, feeding schedule, types
                                                        > of
                                                        > > food, plants or no plants,
                                                        > > stocking level, etc. etc. etc.) 10% daily and
                                                        > 25%
                                                        > > weekly both sound great to
                                                        > > me. 50% every two weeks if you want.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > I am of the opinion that partial water changes
                                                        > are
                                                        > > the number one thing you
                                                        > > can do for you fish and are more beneficial
                                                        > than
                                                        > > the best filter system on
                                                        > > the market. My own schedule/preference is to
                                                        > try
                                                        > > and change about 20% weekly.
                                                        > > But some tanks I do less like a very lightly
                                                        > > loaded (two fish) ten gallon
                                                        > > that I do maybe a gallon weekly or two gallons
                                                        > > every other week and some
                                                        > > tanks I do more like a heavily stocked 30
                                                        > gallon
                                                        > > that I change 1/3 to 1/2 the
                                                        > > water in each time rather than just 20%.
                                                        > Although
                                                        > > sometimes laziness causes
                                                        > > me to skip a week I must admit. The thirty
                                                        > gallon
                                                        > > I have fish in there that I
                                                        > > have had for about 8 or 9 years now and they
                                                        > are
                                                        > > still going strong.
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > > I was also told that my tank's cycling
                                                        > procesess
                                                        > > will be legnthened
                                                        > > > because i only started with 4 fish and that
                                                        > is
                                                        > > > to little. What are your thoughts on this?
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Like my last post stated about water changes,
                                                        > it
                                                        > > would seem to me that if you
                                                        > > have measurable amounts of nitrites, then you
                                                        > have
                                                        > > excess nitrites with
                                                        > > respect to the amount of bacteria to convert
                                                        > it,
                                                        > > so I think the bacteria
                                                        > > should grow at the same rate as if had double
                                                        > or
                                                        > > triple the bioload. I would
                                                        > > argue that if you had more fish in there, the
                                                        > > bacteria would not multiply any
                                                        > > faster, but the levels would get higher and do
                                                        > it
                                                        > > faster and be more
                                                        > > dangerous to your fish.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > It sounds like you are doing fine so far.
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > =====
                                                        > > Patrick Timlin ptimlin@...
                                                        > > http://www.geocities.com/ptimlin/
                                                        > >
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