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Re: Fwd: Re: [FSP] Choosing a state where we can be successful

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  • Tim Condon
    ... Well spoken, Zack. The notion of the Second Wave is something that we should consider and plan for. The pioneer Porcupines are going to migrate come hell
    Message 1 of 4 , Oct 31, 2002
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      >>I bet that no matter which of the ten we choose, there will be some
      >>who won't sign up for it and some who will. The only thing that
      >>REALLY matters is getting a State that we can Control. It will be one
      >>that people will move to. Maybe more people would have moved to
      >>another State. Doesn't matter. All we need is one that will WORK.
      >>I'd rather have 20,000 porcupines in a State we can control than
      >>40,000 well-employed and housed in a State we can't. You CAN live on
      >>McDonald's pay for a couple of years until our reforms kick in. If you
      >>don't want to, wait until the others make it work; they exist. The only
      >>time "jobs" ought to be a concern is when even minimum-wage jobs are
      >>unobtainable. But don't worry about GOOD jobs at this point.
      >>For every porcupine who thinks the chosen State is too harsh, there
      >>will be another who moves BECAUSE it is the one where there is little
      >>opposition. So don't worry about catering to the timid. They will be
      >>welcome in the Second Wave.

      Well spoken, Zack. The notion of the Second Wave is something that
      we should consider and plan for. The pioneer Porcupines are going to
      migrate come hell or high water. Then once they've shown that it can be
      done, the Second Wave will be welcome reinforcements. ---Tim C.

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    • nixicat
      ... What is most exciting to me is the Third Wave... the truly timid who will become excited by this idea after they see what the pioneers and the rest of the
      Message 2 of 4 , Nov 2, 2002
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        >>So don't worry about catering to the timid. They will be
        >>welcome in the Second Wave.

        >Well spoken, Zack. The notion of the Second Wave is
        >something that we should consider and plan for. The
        >pioneer Porcupines are going to migrate come hell or
        >high water. Then once they've shown that it can be
        >done, the Second Wave will be welcome reinforcements.
        >---Tim C.

        What is most exciting to me is the Third Wave... the truly
        timid who will become excited by this idea after they see
        what the pioneers and the rest of the Porcupines do. I
        think we could double the population of our chosen state
        once freedom-minded people see what is going on. There
        are far more than 20,000 freedom-loving people still living
        in this country. The 20,000 is just 1/2 of paying LP
        members, and people who choose to join the LP are only a
        portion of the libertarians in this country. In fact, most
        of the people I know with libertarian leanings have some
        problem with the national party that prevents them from
        participating in that body.

        I think the sort of people who have the gumption to
        completely uproot themselves and reorient their lives
        for the cause of re-establishing liberty will be the sort
        of people with what it takes to found strong new businesses.
        They will be the sort of people who will be stimulating to
        the economy of the state that is chosen, not a drain on it.
        One great thing about freedom is that it tends to lead to
        greater wealth and prosperity. I don't think we need to
        worry about how successful we will be. We are the kind of
        people who can succeed anywhere we choose to do so. The
        magic rests in us, not in our surroundings.

        Nixi
      • Zack Bass
        ... I think the Third Wave (which you have described well) will be a MILLION. Fourth Wave will be others (including some of the first and Second Wave)
        Message 3 of 4 , Nov 2, 2002
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          --- In freestateproject@y..., "nixicat" <nixi@c...> wrote:
          >
          > What is most exciting to me is the Third Wave... the truly
          > timid who will become excited by this idea after they see
          > what the pioneers and the rest of the Porcupines do. I
          > think we could double the population of our chosen state
          > once freedom-minded people see what is going on.
          >

          I think the Third Wave (which you have described well) will be a
          MILLION.
          Fourth Wave will be others (including some of the first and Second
          Wave) extending the concept to a BIG Populous State. Or Alaska.

          The First Wave will not be able to make a huge difference in the job
          market, although they can ensure that you won't starve there; but if
          the First Wave is not successful in getting rid of most of the bad
          Laws, there will be no Second Wave.
        • Tim Condon
          ... Well spoken, *Nixi*! I think there *will* be basically three waves of Porcupines moving into the Freestate, with a fourth wave of people who aren t
          Message 4 of 4 , Nov 2, 2002
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            At 01:30 PM 11/2/2002 +0000, you wrote:
            > >>So don't worry about catering to the timid. They will be
            > >>welcome in the Second Wave.
            >
            > >Well spoken, Zack. ---Tim C.
            >
            > What is most exciting to me is the Third Wave... the truly timid
            > who will become excited by this idea after they see what the pioneers and
            > the rest of the Porcupines do. I think we could double the population
            > of our chosen state once freedom-minded people see what is going on.
            > There are far more than 20,000 freedom-loving people still living in this
            > country....We are the kind of people who can succeed anywhere we choose
            > to do so. The magic rests in us, not in our surroundings. ---Nixi

            Well spoken, *Nixi*! I think there *will* be basically "three
            waves" of Porcupines moving into the Freestate, with a "fourth wave" of
            people who aren't really "porcupines". Consider:
            1. First there are the what might be called the SUPER-PORCUPINES,
            pioneers who will start moving as soon as the state is chosen (within the
            next year or so probably).
            2. Next there will be the largest group, the "second wave" who
            will move into the Freestate in a more leisurely fashion, taking advantage
            of the time it takes for the FSP to gain 20,000 adherents, and then the
            5-year grace period thereafter (which probably includes me; we have elderly
            parents to care for, career and family considerations, etc. that will
            prevent us from being one of the super-Porcs). Let's call these the MASS
            MIGRATION PORCUPINES.
            3. The "third wave" will be a more timid group, people who
            basically share our goals and ideals but just can't bring themselves to
            believe it "can really work." They'll be on the sidelines watching, maybe
            even cheering us on, but won't actually commit to moving to the
            Freestate...*until* the super-Porcs and the mass-migration Porcs have shown
            that it's actually coming to pass. At that point, the SUPPORTER PORCUPINES
            (let's call them) will start to migrate into the Freestate, swelling our
            numbers hugely over time.
            4. A "fourth wave" will probably appear also; they won't really be
            Porcupines at all, but rather people who just want to be left alone or who
            want to participate in both the wealth and the freedom that will be
            consistently growing in the Freestate. I don't want to call these people
            "opportunists," as that word has a negative connotation. However, when this
            fourth wave starts moving in, that is when the libertarians will have to
            remain vigilant, since many of the fourth-wave people won't really believe
            in absolute individual freedom and the non-aggression principle (which,
            when you think about it, is what has happened to America over the past 300
            years or so).
            It's going to be one *hell* of an adventure, hah? We're going to
            make history that will go down in the annals of human freedom, to be read
            about by students of politics and freedom, for centuries. ---Tim Condon


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