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[FSP] Nevada report take two

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  • Anita Joule
    Sorry guys. Hope this words this time. Anita ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    Message 1 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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      Sorry guys. Hope this words this time.
      Anita

      Phyllis wrote:

      > I didn't receive the attachment. Did anyone else not
      > receive it?
      >
      > Phyllis
      >
      > --- Anita Joule <mega_joule@...> wrote:
      > > Here's my report on Nevada. Hope it is helpful.
      > >
      > > Anita Joule
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      > =====
      > The saddest epitaph which can be carved in memory of a
      > vanished liberty is that it was lost because its possessors
      > failed to stretch forth a saving hand while yet there was
      > time.--George Sutherland, 1862-1942 US Supreme Court Justice
      >
      > "May you live all the days of your life."
      > - Jonathan Swift
      >
      > __________________________________________________
      > Do You Yahoo!?
      > Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
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      >
      >
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      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Anita Joule
      I don t get. For reasons I do not understand I cannot get the attachment to show up. Anyone have any suggestions? ... [Non-text portions of this message have
      Message 2 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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        I don't get. For reasons I do not understand I cannot get the
        attachment to show up. Anyone have any suggestions?

        Anita Joule wrote:

        > Sorry guys. Hope this words this time.
        > Anita
        >
        > Phyllis wrote:
        >
        > > I didn't receive the attachment. Did anyone else not
        > > receive it?
        > >
        > > Phyllis
        > >
        > > --- Anita Joule <mega_joule@...> wrote:
        > > > Here's my report on Nevada. Hope it is helpful.
        > > >
        > > > Anita Joule
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > > =====
        > > The saddest epitaph which can be carved in memory of a
        > > vanished liberty is that it was lost because its possessors
        > > failed to stretch forth a saving hand while yet there was
        > > time.--George Sutherland, 1862-1942 US Supreme Court Justice
        > >
        > > "May you live all the days of your life."
        > > - Jonathan Swift
        > >
        > > __________________________________________________
        > > Do You Yahoo!?
        > > Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
        > > http://health.yahoo.com
        > >
        > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
        > > [Click here to visit our exclusive feature of ACUVUE2 Colours at
        > > LensExpress.com!]
        > > Click here to find your contact lenses!
        > >
        > > <
        > http://rd.yahoo.com/M=225674.2075965.3644786.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705060375:HM/A=1153156/R=0/*http://www.lensexpress.com/tracker/trackclick.aspx?Page=ACUVUE%202%20Colors&AffUrl=273&AffCode=14
        > <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=225674.2075965.3644786.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705060375:HM/A=1153156/R=0/*http://www.lensexpress.com/tracker/trackclick.aspx?Page=ACUVUE%202%20Colors&AffUrl=273&AffCode=14>
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > freestateproject-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
        > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > .
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Debra Ricketts
        ... Nope - I think Yahoo Groups is stripping it off. You might try emailing it to an individual (moi, perhaps?? :) ) to see if the attachment takes that way.
        Message 3 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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          On Tuesday 30 July 2002 11:15 am, you wrote:
          > Sorry guys. Hope this words this time.
          > Anita
          >

          Nope - I think Yahoo Groups is stripping it off. You might try emailing it to
          an individual (moi, perhaps?? :) ) to see if the attachment takes that way.
          If so, I can upload it to the site and/or we can upload it to the FSP Yahoo
          Group "files" section.
          --
          -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
          Hash: SHA1

          Debra J Ricketts
          - ------------------------------
          The Free State Project - Liberty in Our Lifetime
          (702) 993-6593 / info@...
          http://www.freestateproject.org

          -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
          Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux)

          iD8DBQE9NKMfsn9jnmIfOwMRAtZSAKCwA2h3MhPJDGPsdT4GN0XEFT0FJgCfSI+T
          z7FxGQ6+mJz8l57Ml7oO//A=
          =8ou5
          -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
        • Anita Joule
          ... I tried sending to myself and it works fine but when I send it to yahoogroups it is gone. I also tried pasting the report into the compose window and
          Message 4 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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            Debra Ricketts wrote:

            > Nope - I think Yahoo Groups is stripping it off. You might try
            > emailing it to
            > an individual (moi, perhaps?? :) ) to see if the attachment takes
            > that way.


            I tried sending to myself and it works fine but when I send it to
            yahoogroups it is gone. I also tried pasting the report into the
            compose window and sending it not as an attachment but I got some
            message about bad characters or something that it does not recognize.
            Rats! Foiled again. I'll figure something out.

            >
            > If so, I can upload it to the site and/or we can upload it to the FSP
            > Yahoo
            > Group "files" section.

            Thanks but Jason will be adding it to the website with the others
            anyways. I just wanted to put up here so everyone can read it with
            going hunting for it. Two of the reports are already up on the articles
            section of the FSP site. You have to scroll all the way to the botton
            to find them in case anyone is interested. So far Jason and Ben's
            reports are up.
          • Benjy Buckman
            The list probably doesn t allow attachments, in order to avoid viruses getting on it. I don t get. For reasons I do not understand I cannot get the attachment
            Message 5 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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              The list probably doesn't allow attachments, in order to avoid viruses getting on it.

              I don't get. For reasons I do not understand I cannot get the
              attachment to show up. Anyone have any suggestions?

              Anita Joule wrote:

              > Sorry guys. Hope this words this time.
              > Anita
              >
              > Phyllis wrote:
              >
              > > I didn't receive the attachment. Did anyone else not
              > > receive it?
              > >
              > > Phyllis
              > >
              > > --- Anita Joule <mega_joule@...> wrote:
              > > > Here's my report on Nevada. Hope it is helpful.
              > > >
              > > > Anita Joule
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > > =====
              > > The saddest epitaph which can be carved in memory of a
              > > vanished liberty is that it was lost because its possessors
              > > failed to stretch forth a saving hand while yet there was
              > > time.--George Sutherland, 1862-1942 US Supreme Court Justice
              > >
              > > "May you live all the days of your life."
              > > - Jonathan Swift
              > >
              > > __________________________________________________
              > > Do You Yahoo!?
              > > Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
              > > http://health.yahoo.com
              > >
              > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
              > > [Click here to visit our exclusive feature of ACUVUE2 Colours at
              > > LensExpress.com!]
              > > Click here to find your contact lenses!
              > >
              > > <
              > http://rd.yahoo.com/M=225674.2075965.3644786.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705060375:HM/A=1153156/R=0/*http://www.lensexpress.com/tracker/trackclick.aspx?Page=ACUVUE%202%20Colors&AffUrl=273&AffCode=14
              > <http://rd.yahoo.com/M=225674.2075965.3644786.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705060375:HM/A=1153156/R=0/*http://www.lensexpress.com/tracker/trackclick.aspx?Page=ACUVUE%202%20Colors&AffUrl=273&AffCode=14>
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > > freestateproject-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
              > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > .
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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              >
              >
              >
              > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • npkarem@juno.com
              I believe Jason may have the site set to not forward attachments. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Didn t come thru here either. Nick On
              Message 6 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                I believe Jason may have the site set to not forward attachments.
                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Didn't come thru
                here either.
                Nick

                On Tue, 30 Jul 2002 11:15:24 -0700 Anita Joule
                <mega_joule@...> writes:
                Sorry guys. Hope this words this time.
                Anita

                Phyllis wrote:

                > I didn't receive the attachment. Did anyone else not
                > receive it?
                >
                > Phyllis
                >
                > --- Anita Joule <mega_joule@...> wrote:
                > > Here's my report on Nevada. Hope it is helpful.
                > >
                > > Anita Joule
                > >
                > >
                > >

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Dan Weiner
                Usually, the moderator has access to setting up the issue of attachments for a given group. It sounds to me like this group is not set up to permit
                Message 7 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                  Usually, the moderator has access to setting up the issue of attachments for a given group. It sounds to me like this group is not set up to permit attachments. If we want to allow them, then the moderator will need to enable attachments.

                  Normally, the default is to allow them, so someone has changed it to not allow attachments. The next question is: attachments: yes or no? The reason to say no is that it keeps viruses sent to the group from going out to all the members. Attachments are the most common means of sending viruses around.

                  Dan Weiner

                  Gun Control: The theory that Matthew Shepard hanging from a fence post in Wyoming is morally superior to Matthew Shepard explaining to the local sheriff how his attackers got those fatal bullet wounds.
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Anita Joule
                  To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 2:03 PM
                  Subject: Re: [FSP] Nevada report take two




                  Debra Ricketts wrote:

                  > Nope - I think Yahoo Groups is stripping it off. You might try
                  > emailing it to
                  > an individual (moi, perhaps?? :) ) to see if the attachment takes
                  > that way.


                  I tried sending to myself and it works fine but when I send it to
                  yahoogroups it is gone. I also tried pasting the report into the
                  compose window and sending it not as an attachment but I got some
                  message about bad characters or something that it does not recognize.
                  Rats! Foiled again. I'll figure something out.

                  >
                  > If so, I can upload it to the site and/or we can upload it to the FSP
                  > Yahoo
                  > Group "files" section.

                  Thanks but Jason will be adding it to the website with the others
                  anyways. I just wanted to put up here so everyone can read it with
                  going hunting for it. Two of the reports are already up on the articles
                  section of the FSP site. You have to scroll all the way to the botton
                  to find them in case anyone is interested. So far Jason and Ben's
                  reports are up.


                  Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  ADVERTISEMENT




                  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  freestateproject-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com



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                  Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
                  Version: 6.0.377 / Virus Database: 211 - Release Date: 7/15/02


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Jason P Sorens
                  ... I d advise uploading it to the Files section, and people could download it from there. But I should have it up on the website tonight too. Jason
                  Message 8 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                    On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Anita Joule wrote:

                    > I don't get. For reasons I do not understand I cannot get the
                    > attachment to show up. Anyone have any suggestions?

                    I'd advise uploading it to the "Files" section, and people could download
                    it from there. But I should have it up on the website tonight too.

                    Jason
                  • Adam Gonnerman
                    I m not sure this list is set to accept attachments. Adam G. ... _______________________ THE FREE STATE PROJECT -- LIBERTY IN OUR LIFETIME
                    Message 9 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                      I'm not sure this list is set to accept attachments.

                      Adam G.


                      >From: Anita Joule <mega_joule@...>
                      >Reply-To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
                      >To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
                      >Subject: [FSP] Nevada report take two
                      >Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 11:15:24 -0700
                      >
                      >Sorry guys. Hope this words this time.
                      >Anita
                      >
                      >Phyllis wrote:
                      >
                      > > I didn't receive the attachment. Did anyone else not
                      > > receive it?
                      > >
                      > > Phyllis
                      > >
                      > > --- Anita Joule <mega_joule@...> wrote:
                      > > > Here's my report on Nevada. Hope it is helpful.
                      > > >
                      > > > Anita Joule
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > =====
                      > > The saddest epitaph which can be carved in memory of a
                      > > vanished liberty is that it was lost because its possessors
                      > > failed to stretch forth a saving hand while yet there was
                      > > time.--George Sutherland, 1862-1942 US Supreme Court Justice
                      > >
                      > > "May you live all the days of your life."
                      > > - Jonathan Swift
                      > >
                      > > __________________________________________________
                      > > Do You Yahoo!?
                      > > Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
                      > > http://health.yahoo.com
                      > >
                      > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                      > > [Click here to visit our exclusive feature of ACUVUE2 Colours at
                      > > LensExpress.com!]
                      > > Click here to find your contact lenses!
                      > >
                      > >
                      ><http://rd.yahoo.com/M=225674.2075965.3644786.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705060375:HM/A=1153156/R=0/*http://www.lensexpress.com/tracker/trackclick.aspx?Page=ACUVUE%202%20Colors&AffUrl=273&AffCode=14>
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                      > > freestateproject-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
                      > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >




                      _______________________
                      THE FREE STATE PROJECT -- LIBERTY IN OUR LIFETIME
                      http://www.freestateproject.org

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                    • Mary Lou Seymour
                      Yahoo groups has probably been set to strip off attachments. This avoids spreading viruses. I know i set all the groups i moderate to no attachments back
                      Message 10 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                        Yahoo groups has probably been set to strip off attachments. This avoids
                        spreading viruses. I know i set all the groups i moderate to "no attachments"
                        back last year because of the viruses threat.

                        Send it as inline lext.

                        > Debra Ricketts wrote:
                        >
                        > > Nope - I think Yahoo Groups is stripping it off. You might try
                        > > emailing it to an individual (moi, perhaps?? :) ) to see if the
                        > > attachment takes that way.
                        >
                        >
                        > I tried sending to myself and it works fine but when I send it to
                        > yahoogroups it is gone. I also tried pasting the report into the
                        > compose window and sending it not as an attachment but I got some
                        > message about bad characters or something that it does not recognize.
                        > Rats! Foiled again. I'll figure something out.
                        >
                        > >
                        > > If so, I can upload it to the site and/or we can upload it to the
                        > > FSP Yahoo Group "files" section.
                        >
                        > Thanks but Jason will be adding it to the website with the others
                        > anyways. I just wanted to put up here so everyone can read it with
                        > going hunting for it. Two of the reports are already up on the
                        > articles section of the FSP site. You have to scroll all the way to
                        > the botton to find them in case anyone is interested. So far Jason
                        > and Ben's reports are up.
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                        > ---------------------~--> Free $5 Love Reading Risk Free!
                        > http://us.click.yahoo.com/NsdPZD/PfREAA/Ey.GAA/XgSolB/TM
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                        > ->
                        >
                        > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                        > freestateproject-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                        > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        >
                        >
                      • John Gilger
                        A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern bias. John
                        Message 11 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                          A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern bias.

                          John
                        • Anita Joule
                          ... I certainly respect your opinion but I must say that I have no particular bias for the east coast. I ve only been there once briefly. I have lived my
                          Message 12 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
                          • 0 Attachment
                            John Gilger wrote:

                            > A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern bias.
                            >
                            > John

                            I certainly respect your opinion but I must say that I have no
                            particular bias for the east coast. I've only been there once briefly.
                            I have lived my entire life on the west coast and I love it here. If
                            I have any bias it would be for the west.

                            Anita
                          • Anita Joule
                            ... I m sorry you did not like the report and if you have other data please feel free to share. The information in the report is based on factual data from
                            Message 13 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
                            • 0 Attachment
                              John Gilger wrote:

                              > A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern bias.
                              >
                              > John
                              >
                              I'm sorry you did not like the report and if you have other data please
                              feel free to share. The information in the report is based on factual
                              data from various sources and does not mean that I have anything in
                              particular against Nevada. My family visits there often as it is only a
                              two hour drive from our home and we always truly enjoy it. The report
                              was not based on whether or not I "like" Nevada but rather on the
                              information I was able to locate.

                              Don't take it personally.

                              Anita
                            • Dan Weiner
                              I have found the bias between east and west varies depending on who is posting this week. I tend to favor the western states myself, but New Hampshire and
                              Message 14 of 28 , Jul 30, 2002
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                                I have found the bias between east and west varies depending on who is posting this week. I tend to favor the western states myself, but New Hampshire and Delaware have interesting possibilities. It will be interesting to figure out where we will end up. Too bad there wasn't enough interest in both an east FSP and a west FSP.

                                Dan Weiner

                                Gun Control: The theory that Matthew Shepard hanging from a fence post in Wyoming is morally superior to Matthew Shepard explaining to the local sheriff how his attackers got those fatal bullet wounds.
                                ----- Original Message -----
                                From: Anita Joule
                                To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
                                Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2002 11:30 PM
                                Subject: Re: [FSP] Nevada report take two




                                John Gilger wrote:

                                > A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern bias.
                                >
                                > John

                                I certainly respect your opinion but I must say that I have no
                                particular bias for the east coast. I've only been there once briefly.
                                I have lived my entire life on the west coast and I love it here. If
                                I have any bias it would be for the west.

                                Anita


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                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • Adam Gonnerman
                                ... I m a midwesterner, and my two favorites are NH and Idaho. Funny...one in the east and one in the west. Adam G.
                                Message 15 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  >From: "Dan Weiner" <danweiner@...>
                                  >I have found the bias between east and west varies depending on who is
                                  >posting this week. I tend to favor the western states myself, but New
                                  >Hampshire and Delaware have interesting possibilities. It will be
                                  >interesting to figure out where we will end up. Too bad there wasn't enough
                                  >interest in both an east FSP and a west FSP.

                                  I'm a midwesterner, and my two favorites are NH and Idaho. Funny...one in
                                  the east and one in the west.

                                  Adam G.

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                                • Tim Condon
                                  ... From Tim Condon: What the heck, I may as well get in on this. I live in the South, in Florida. My two favorites so far are Montana and New Hampshire. No
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
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                                    At 08:04 AM 7/31/02 -0300, you wrote:
                                    > >From Dan Weiner
                                    > >I have found the bias between east and west varies depending on who
                                    > is >posting this week. I tend to favor the western states myself, but New
                                    > Hampshire and Delaware have interesting possibilities.
                                    >
                                    > From Adam G.: I'm a midwesterner, and my two favorites are NH and
                                    > Idaho. Funny...one in the east and one in the west.
                                    >Adam G.

                                    From Tim Condon: What the heck, I may as well get in on this. I live in
                                    the South, in Florida. My two favorites so far are Montana and New
                                    Hampshire. No East-West bias there either.
                                  • Ernest Moosa
                                    Why not pick two states? One east and one west of the Mississippi? If we get 20,000, I am sure we will get 40,000. The posibbility of NOT having to relocate
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
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                                      Why not pick two states? One east and one west of the
                                      Mississippi?

                                      If we get 20,000, I am sure we will get 40,000.

                                      The posibbility of NOT having to relocate as far away
                                      as the east coast for westerners and vice versa for
                                      the easterners might actually bring more people into
                                      the project.

                                      The learning curve for both states would be steeper as
                                      we would have the ability to learn from one another as
                                      we progressed.

                                      If we are going to think big, why not think REALLY
                                      BIG?

                                      EJ

                                      --- Tim Condon <tim@...> wrote:
                                      > At 08:04 AM 7/31/02 -0300, you wrote:
                                      > > >From Dan Weiner
                                      > > >I have found the bias between east and west
                                      > varies depending on who
                                      > > is >posting this week. I tend to favor the western
                                      > states myself, but New
                                      > > Hampshire and Delaware have interesting
                                      > possibilities.
                                      > >
                                      > > From Adam G.: I'm a midwesterner, and my two
                                      > favorites are NH and
                                      > > Idaho. Funny...one in the east and one in the
                                      > west.
                                      > >Adam G.
                                      >
                                      > From Tim Condon: What the heck, I may as well get
                                      > in on this. I live in
                                      > the South, in Florida. My two favorites so far are
                                      > Montana and New
                                      > Hampshire. No East-West bias there either.
                                      >
                                      >


                                      =====
                                      Where has your money been? HTTP://www.wheresgeorge.com
                                      "The individual is the single most important minority. If your rights are removed by the majority, you have been enslaved." EJ

                                      "If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." - Samuel Adams

                                      www.ejmoosa.com

                                      __________________________________________________
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                                    • Tim Condon
                                      ... One, you don t want to divide your forces; makes em weaker. Two, there may not *be* 20,000, much less 40,000, libertarians willing to relocate. Three,
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        At 06:29 AM 7/31/02 -0700, you wrote:
                                        >Why not pick two states? One east and one west of the Mississippi? If we
                                        >get 20,000, I am sure we will get 40,000. The posibbility of NOT having to
                                        >relocate as far away as the east coast for westerners and vice versa for
                                        >the easterners might actually bring more people into the project. The
                                        >learning curve for both states would be steeper as we would have the
                                        >ability to learn from one another as we progressed. If we are going to
                                        >think big, why not think REALLY BIG? EJ

                                        One, you don't want to divide your forces; makes'em weaker.
                                        Two, there may not *be* 20,000, much less 40,000, libertarians
                                        willing to relocate.
                                        Three, moving 200 miles away from where you live is conceptually
                                        really not that much different from moving 2,000 miles away from where you
                                        live. Either way, you're well away from where you used to live.
                                        Four, the undertaking is so humongous that even trying to do it
                                        with one state is an overwhelming proposition; trying to do the same trick
                                        with two states would make the undertaking titanically double-humongous.
                                        Five, personally I don't see the bias in favor of eastern or
                                        western states that other people posting here see; I think most people have
                                        an attitude like mine: I'll go wherever the organization finally settles
                                        upon. TIM C.
                                      • Jason P Sorens
                                        ... I don t know - I think it s really unlikely we could get 40,000, certainly not within 5 years. And if we did, we should probably try to get the extra
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
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                                          On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Ernest Moosa wrote:

                                          > If we get 20,000, I am sure we will get 40,000.

                                          I don't know - I think it's really unlikely we could get 40,000, certainly
                                          not within 5 years. And if we did, we should probably try to get the
                                          extra people into the same state as the first 20,000. The more activists
                                          we have in a single state, the more ambitious we can make our goals.

                                          ________________________________________________________________________

                                          Jason P Sorens---jason.sorens@...---http://pantheon.yale.edu/~jps35

                                          http://www.freestateproject.org - Do you want liberty in your lifetime?
                                        • Jason P Sorens
                                          ... Yes - fortunately there s an objective way to discern this. ;) The vast majority of people who ve signed the Statement of Intent have not put down a great
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Tim Condon wrote:

                                            > Five, personally I don't see the bias in favor of eastern or
                                            > western states that other people posting here see; I think most people have
                                            > an attitude like mine: I'll go wherever the organization finally settles
                                            > upon. TIM C.

                                            Yes - fortunately there's an objective way to discern this. ;) The vast
                                            majority of people who've signed the Statement of Intent have not put down
                                            a great many states to which they reserve the right not to move. Probably
                                            of the states we're considering, Alaska and Hawaii have gotten the most
                                            "reservations," but even they are chosen only by a minority (rough guess:
                                            20%).

                                            ________________________________________________________________________

                                            Jason P Sorens---jason.sorens@...---http://pantheon.yale.edu/~jps35

                                            http://www.freestateproject.org - Do you want liberty in your lifetime?
                                          • G
                                            As a person who moved from NJ to FL at age 8, I think I can shed a little light on the subject. I literally outgrew my cloths before they even partially came
                                            Message 21 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              As a person who moved from NJ to FL at age 8, I think I can shed a
                                              little light on the subject. I literally outgrew my cloths before they
                                              even partially came into style here. Florida was 5 to 150 years behind
                                              the North in many ways. It is still difficult for me to understand why
                                              anyone likes it here, other than that it is their home. No matter where
                                              we go, it will not be home to many people. Most of us will feel out of
                                              place and find many things about the state we dislike. Tim said moving
                                              200 or 2000 miles makes no difference. I respectfully disagree. It can
                                              be like moving to another country. The South may not be able to make a
                                              decent pizza or hoagie to save their lives, but I'd keep eating these
                                              cheesy crackers they call pizza if it was the means to freedom. Freedom,
                                              I'll out run the Marlborough/Camel man for it.

                                              My step-father's description of Nevada was that it was like holding a
                                              big hair dryer in your face while some guy in a pimp outfit throws
                                              psychedelic Christmas trees at you. That alone is enough to make me
                                              lose interest in the state. Nuclear waste storage seems like a good
                                              business to get into to me (NJ Pride!:)) make monuments out of it like
                                              the French do. The hysteria is as usual politically generated. (not
                                              saying the paper was, just people in general.) But again, I'll face
                                              hairdryer air for freedom, just as Tim and most of us would.

                                              g
                                              --
                                              Don't worry about avoiding temptation -- as you grow older, it starts
                                              avoiding you.
                                              -- The Old Farmer's Almanac
                                            • Ernest Moosa
                                              I have to disagree with you on a few points. I am not sure why you feel you are dividing forces when in effect you are making the free state available to more
                                              Message 22 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                I have to disagree with you on a few points. I am not
                                                sure why you feel you are dividing forces when in
                                                effect you are making the free state available to more
                                                people that would not choose to move so far. There
                                                is not a fixed number of people that would move for
                                                freedom. And the more convenient it is for them to
                                                do, the more likely they are to do it.

                                                For example, if Delaware was chosen, there is the
                                                potential to have thousands that work in the cities of
                                                neighboring states near Delaware to migrate to
                                                Delaware for the benefits of living in the Free State.

                                                In Georgia, something called the Hope Scholarship was
                                                created. This is a grant to go to a Georgia
                                                university paid for by the state as long as the
                                                student makes a B average. What has happened?
                                                Thousands of families along North Carolina, Tennessee,
                                                Alabama, Sout Carolina and Florida have moved just
                                                over the borders to Georgia so that they could get
                                                this benefit for their child. But there is no
                                                evidence of people moving from the west coast for such
                                                a benefit.

                                                Those with the chance to benefit by a few thousand
                                                dollars a year relocated quickly. If the same were
                                                true for relocating to Delaware, and saving thousands
                                                on taxes, you can bet they would be moving.

                                                Your third point I also disagree with. There is a big
                                                difference. if you have family, 200 miles is a 3 hour
                                                drive. Two thousand miles is a plane trip. The
                                                concept of still being close to friends and relatives
                                                disappears after 400 miles or so.

                                                Your fourth point that it is humongous, and would be
                                                doubly tough with two states is interesting. If
                                                simpler government, simpler laws, and freedom are
                                                gonna be that tough, then something is wrong. That is
                                                not a message that will get us many new members. We
                                                are making it too complicated if it turns out that
                                                way.

                                                I have been discussing the concept with many of my
                                                friends. Many are interested in finding out more
                                                about it. While there may be concerns about finding
                                                20,000 or so, I believe that many here could be
                                                underestimating the potential. There are already 566
                                                members. How much exposure has this project actually
                                                had? Do you think that it has been introduced to
                                                500,000 people yet?

                                                Those are a few of my thoughts. Thanks for taking
                                                time to respond.

                                                EJ

                                                --- Tim Condon <tim@...> wrote:
                                                > At 06:29 AM 7/31/02 -0700, you wrote:
                                                > >Why not pick two states? One east and one west of
                                                > the Mississippi? If we
                                                > >get 20,000, I am sure we will get 40,000. The
                                                > posibbility of NOT having to
                                                > >relocate as far away as the east coast for
                                                > westerners and vice versa for
                                                > >the easterners might actually bring more people
                                                > into the project. The
                                                > >learning curve for both states would be steeper as
                                                > we would have the
                                                > >ability to learn from one another as we progressed.
                                                > If we are going to
                                                > >think big, why not think REALLY BIG? EJ
                                                >
                                                > One, you don't want to divide your forces;
                                                > makes'em weaker.
                                                > Two, there may not *be* 20,000, much less
                                                > 40,000, libertarians
                                                > willing to relocate.
                                                > Three, moving 200 miles away from where you
                                                > live is conceptually
                                                > really not that much different from moving 2,000
                                                > miles away from where you
                                                > live. Either way, you're well away from where you
                                                > used to live.
                                                > Four, the undertaking is so humongous that
                                                > even trying to do it
                                                > with one state is an overwhelming proposition;
                                                > trying to do the same trick
                                                > with two states would make the undertaking
                                                > titanically double-humongous.
                                                > Five, personally I don't see the bias in
                                                > favor of eastern or
                                                > western states that other people posting here see; I
                                                > think most people have
                                                > an attitude like mine: I'll go wherever the
                                                > organization finally settles
                                                > upon. TIM C.
                                                >
                                                >


                                                =====
                                                Where has your money been? HTTP://www.wheresgeorge.com
                                                "The individual is the single most important minority. If your rights are removed by the majority, you have been enslaved." EJ

                                                "If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." - Samuel Adams

                                                www.ejmoosa.com

                                                __________________________________________________
                                                Do You Yahoo!?
                                                Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
                                                http://health.yahoo.com
                                              • Debra Ricketts
                                                ... In what way? FWIW, I actually live in Las Vegas, and it seemed pretty accurate to me. Nevada as a state is pretty cool. Clark County, which has the
                                                Message 23 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
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                                                  On Tuesday 30 July 2002 09:21 pm, you wrote:
                                                  > A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern bias.
                                                  >
                                                  > John
                                                  >


                                                  In what way? FWIW, I actually live in Las Vegas, and it seemed pretty
                                                  accurate to me. Nevada as a state is pretty cool. Clark County, which has
                                                  the majority of the people and legislatively controls the state, sucks.



                                                  --
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                                                  Debra J Ricketts
                                                  - ------------------------------
                                                  The Free State Project - Liberty in Our Lifetime
                                                  (702) 993-6593 / info@...
                                                  http://www.freestateproject.org

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                                                • Debra Ricketts
                                                  ... I *love* the west (I ve lived in Michigan and Nevada, BTW). But I d be willing to move to NH, although I m not real thrilled about it. It would probably
                                                  Message 24 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    On Wednesday 31 July 2002 06:15 am, you wrote:
                                                    > At 08:04 AM 7/31/02 -0300, you wrote:
                                                    > > >From Dan Weiner
                                                    > > >I have found the bias between east and west varies depending on who
                                                    > >
                                                    > > is >posting this week. I tend to favor the western states myself, but New
                                                    > > Hampshire and Delaware have interesting possibilities.
                                                    > >
                                                    > > From Adam G.: I'm a midwesterner, and my two favorites are NH and
                                                    > > Idaho. Funny...one in the east and one in the west.
                                                    > >Adam G.
                                                    >
                                                    > From Tim Condon: What the heck, I may as well get in on this. I live in
                                                    > the South, in Florida. My two favorites so far are Montana and New
                                                    > Hampshire. No East-West bias there either.
                                                    >

                                                    I *love* the west (I've lived in Michigan and Nevada, BTW). But I'd be
                                                    willing to move to NH, although I'm not real thrilled about it. It would
                                                    probably turn out fine...but I am UTTERLY biased for the West. Montana,
                                                    Idaho, Wyoming, even staying here in Nevada would be my choice!


                                                    --
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                                                    Debra J Ricketts
                                                    - ------------------------------
                                                    The Free State Project - Liberty in Our Lifetime
                                                    (702) 993-6593 / info@...
                                                    http://www.freestateproject.org

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                                                  • Jason P Sorens
                                                    ... Exposure is the key issue. If we could expose this plan fully to 500,000 people, who knows how big this could get? But getting that kind of exposure
                                                    Message 25 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Ernest Moosa wrote:

                                                      > I have been discussing the concept with many of my
                                                      > friends. Many are interested in finding out more
                                                      > about it. While there may be concerns about finding
                                                      > 20,000 or so, I believe that many here could be
                                                      > underestimating the potential. There are already 566
                                                      > members. How much exposure has this project actually
                                                      > had? Do you think that it has been introduced to
                                                      > 500,000 people yet?

                                                      Exposure is the key issue. If we could expose this plan fully to 500,000
                                                      people, who knows how big this could get? But getting that kind of
                                                      exposure requires major resources. Maybe we'll get there, but we're just
                                                      building up to it right now.

                                                      ________________________________________________________________________

                                                      Jason P Sorens---jason.sorens@...---http://pantheon.yale.edu/~jps35

                                                      http://www.freestateproject.org - Do you want liberty in your lifetime?
                                                    • Tim Condon
                                                      ... All right EJ, make it 400 miles. The same point is valid I think. ... No, no: When I said it was a humongous undertaking, I m talking about wresting
                                                      Message 26 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                                      • 0 Attachment
                                                        >Your third point I also disagree with. There is a big
                                                        >difference. if you have family, 200 miles is a 3 hour
                                                        >drive. Two thousand miles is a plane trip. The
                                                        >concept of still being close to friends and relatives
                                                        >disappears after 400 miles or so.

                                                        All right EJ, make it 400 miles. The same point is valid I think.

                                                        >Your fourth point that it is humongous, and would be
                                                        >doubly tough with two states is interesting. If
                                                        >simpler government, simpler laws, and freedom are
                                                        >gonna be that tough, then something is wrong. That is
                                                        >not a message that will get us many new members. We
                                                        >are making it too complicated if it turns out that
                                                        >way.

                                                        No, no: When I said it was a humongous undertaking, I'm talking
                                                        about wresting control from the statists. Government is the huge behemoth
                                                        it is because people *want* it to be that way, they *vote* for people who
                                                        make it that way. We'll have friends waiting to welcome us in whatever
                                                        state is chosen, but we're going to need to do a lot of work to get at
                                                        least half the total voting population to go along with us (which may be
                                                        easier as the benefits are shown; however, fear and loathing will dominate
                                                        in the beginning, fanned on by the existing political structure and their
                                                        lackeys in the media).

                                                        >Those are a few of my thoughts. Thanks for taking
                                                        >time to respond.
                                                        >EJ

                                                        Thanks for *participating*! Tim Condon
                                                      • Phyllis
                                                        I, too, am biased toward the West, but I will move to New Hampshire if that is the choice. I m not so sure about Delaware. Phyllis ...
                                                        Message 27 of 28 , Jul 31, 2002
                                                        • 0 Attachment
                                                          I, too, am biased toward the West, but I will move to New
                                                          Hampshire if that is the choice. I'm not so sure about
                                                          Delaware.

                                                          Phyllis

                                                          --- Debra Ricketts <dricketts@...> wrote:
                                                          > On Wednesday 31 July 2002 06:15 am, you wrote:
                                                          > > At 08:04 AM 7/31/02 -0300, you wrote:
                                                          > > > >From Dan Weiner
                                                          > > > >I have found the bias between east and west varies
                                                          > depending on who
                                                          > > >
                                                          > > > is >posting this week. I tend to favor the western
                                                          > states myself, but New
                                                          > > > Hampshire and Delaware have interesting
                                                          > possibilities.
                                                          > > >
                                                          > > > From Adam G.: I'm a midwesterner, and my two
                                                          > favorites are NH and
                                                          > > > Idaho. Funny...one in the east and one in the west.
                                                          > > >Adam G.
                                                          > >
                                                          > > From Tim Condon: What the heck, I may as well get in
                                                          > on this. I live in
                                                          > > the South, in Florida. My two favorites so far are
                                                          > Montana and New
                                                          > > Hampshire. No East-West bias there either.
                                                          > >
                                                          >
                                                          > I *love* the west (I've lived in Michigan and Nevada,
                                                          > BTW). But I'd be
                                                          > willing to move to NH, although I'm not real thrilled
                                                          > about it. It would
                                                          > probably turn out fine...but I am UTTERLY biased for the
                                                          > West. Montana,
                                                          > Idaho, Wyoming, even staying here in Nevada would be my
                                                          > choice!
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                          > --
                                                          > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
                                                          > Hash: SHA1
                                                          >
                                                          > Debra J Ricketts
                                                          > - ------------------------------
                                                          > The Free State Project - Liberty in Our Lifetime
                                                          > (702) 993-6593 / info@...
                                                          > http://www.freestateproject.org
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                                                          =====
                                                          The saddest epitaph which can be carved in memory of a
                                                          vanished liberty is that it was lost because its possessors
                                                          failed to stretch forth a saving hand while yet there was
                                                          time.--George Sutherland, 1862-1942 US Supreme Court Justice

                                                          "May you live all the days of your life."
                                                          - Jonathan Swift

                                                          __________________________________________________
                                                          Do You Yahoo!?
                                                          Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better
                                                          http://health.yahoo.com
                                                        • elizabeth_freestate
                                                          ... bias. ... Feel free to submit your own report! :^) I thought Anita s was great.
                                                          Message 28 of 28 , Aug 1, 2002
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                                                            --- In freestateproject@y..., John Gilger <bjgilger@e...> wrote:
                                                            > A pretty poor report, IMHO, but consistent with this lists eastern
                                                            bias.
                                                            >
                                                            > John

                                                            Feel free to submit your own report! :^)

                                                            I thought Anita's was great.
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