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Re: [FSP] Digest Number 1678

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  • tanstaafl@libertytrek.org
    I am intentionally quoting this entire Digest to make a point... Would you guys PLEASE trim your posts? Reading this list via the digest is extremely painful
    Message 1 of 1 , Aug 19, 2009
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      I am intentionally quoting this entire Digest to make a point...

      Would you guys PLEASE trim your posts?

      Reading this list via the digest is extremely painful with all of the
      mindless quoting of endless requotes of the sdame regurgitated mindless
      quotes...

      Thanks,

      Charles

      On 8/19/2009 8:34 AM, freestateproject@yahoogroups.com wrote:
      >
      > The Free State Project
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject;_ylc=X3oDMTJkY2MwZTk3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BHNlYwNoZHIEc2xrA2hwaARzdGltZQMxMjUwNjg1Mjgz>
      >
      >
      >
      > Messages In This Digest (5 Messages)
      >
      > 1a.
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up <#1a> From: GaryT
      > 1b.
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up <#1b> From: Tim Condon
      > 1c.
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up <#1c> From: Tim Condon
      > 1d.
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up <#1d> From: GaryT
      > 1e.
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up <#1e> From: GaryT
      >
      > View All Topics
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJmOXBxYnZtBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNhdHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM-?xm=1&m=p&tidx=1>
      > | Create New Topic
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZTFmZTY3BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM->
      >
      >
      >
      > Messages
      >
      > 1a.
      >
      >
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15641;_ylc=X3oDMTJycHVia2pkBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQxBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM->
      >
      >
      >
      > Posted by: "GaryT" garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet@...?Subject=
      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
      > garyonthenet <http://profiles.yahoo.com/garyonthenet>
      >
      >
      > Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:38 am (PDT)
      >
      >
      >
      > Well the arguments may coincide, (mine and theirs) but that doesn't
      > mean too much, because obversely Demopublicans' political positions
      > also coincide with libertarian political positions (as do sheer
      > Socialist arguments), but only part of the time.
      >
      > I don't think guns should be outlawed, or zoned, or real id'd, etc.
      > Those are laws infringing upon the right to carry and bear arms.
      > My commentary never mentioned laws, it only concerned applied
      > civility under the right circumstances.
      >
      > Again, I don't suggest an infringement of rights, just the social
      > wherewithal to know when and where public social behavior is
      > appropriate.
      > This is a problem that those with Aspberger's often have, they are
      > good at understanding the black and white of laws and rights, but
      > they have a tough time with the variations of grey as applied in
      > social situations.
      > There is a value associated with social conduct, which a
      > meta-libertarian concept, and a society I would hope to live in,
      > within a libertarian legal system.
      >
      > Gary T
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Tim Condon
      > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com> ; RLCNH ;
      > nhrvc@yahoogroups.com <mailto:nhrvc%40yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Monday, August 17, 2009 10:27 PM
      > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      >
      > No offense taken, Gary. However, the arguments you make below sound
      > an awful
      > lot like the arguments liberals and other statists use all the time to
      > continually encroach upon individual liberties. They think guns
      > should be
      > outlawed because if guns were legal "people would be shooting each
      > other on
      > the street every day." We must have zoning because "if we don't have
      > zoning
      > they'll put up a pig farm (or chemical factory; those are the two
      > favorites)
      > right next door to your house!" And we must have Real ID because
      > terrorists
      > will run rampant throughout America and kill everyone if we don't have
      > "papers" that everyone must carry.
      > You pick out some examples below that are certainly designed to
      > elicit the
      > same response. But we're not talking about doing any of those
      > things. We're
      > talking about a specific, inalienable, Constitutionally mandated
      > right, i.e.
      > the right to keep and "bear" arms. I don't particularly care if
      > every other
      > person in America (in addition to Chris Matthews) thinks was
      > "inappropriate"
      > to openly carry a sidearm at the Portsmouth protest. I repeat: "It is
      > *never* inappropriate to openly exercise a specific right that is
      > guaranteed
      > in the U.S. Constitution." So although there may be all kinds of
      > people who
      > think exercising that particular right, at that particular time, at that
      > particular venue was "in poor taste," or "silly," or "scary," or
      > whatever....that's too bad. This is the Free State. We take our
      > natural and
      > Constitutional rights seriously, and there's never a "wrong" time to
      > exercise any of them. ---Tim Condon
      >
      > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:14 AM, GaryT <garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
      >
      > > Well, don't take this personally, but I think that is extremist
      > thinking
      > > and can lead to foolish behavior.
      > >
      > > Once again, as I said before, there are many things you may have legal
      > > right to do, but may be completely socially inappropriate nonetheless.
      > > You may invited to a vegetarian dinner function, yet choose to
      > slaughter a
      > > rabbit and eat it raw in front of all there.
      > > Legal? Yes. Appropriate? No. Unless you were affirmatively trying to
      > > offend.
      > >
      > > You might take a dump on public land in front of a 7 year old
      > child. Legal?
      > > Probably.
      > > Acceptable under social civililty norms? Not at all.
      > >
      > > You might stand outside a restaurant on a public sidewalk, and
      > proceed to
      > > cut yourself and bleed on the sidewalk in front of the patrons.
      > Legal? Yes.
      > > Appropriate? No.
      > >
      > > The list is endless.
      > >
      > > The point being, the level of legality is not the same level for
      > social
      > > consideration or politeness, or common decency.
      > > The fact that you can do something, does not mean you should do it.
      > >
      > > Gary T
      > >
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: Tim Condon
      > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009 6:01 PM
      > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > >
      > >
      > > So long as your activity doesn't aggress against anyone else or their
      > > co-equal right to do what they want without aggressing against
      > you, yes.
      > > Appropriateness isn't the measure of whether other people
      > disapprove, or
      > > are
      > > made uncomfortable. And it is *never* inappropriate to openly
      > exercise a
      > > specific right that is guaranteed in the U.S. Constitution. In
      > fact, it is
      > > absolutely necessary that people exercise such rights openly; such
      > actions
      > > should be encouraged, or such rights will come to be frowned upon, and
      > > even
      > > judged "inappropriate" in many---and eventually all---circumstances.
      > > Exhibit
      > > #1: The Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, which
      > William Kostic
      > > was peaceably and entirely legitimately exercising. I wish I had been
      > > present to support him by keeping and bearing my own openly-carried
      > > side-arm, the right to which is guaranteed by the above-said Second
      > > Amendment. ---Tim Condon (who is a lawyer)
      > >
      > > On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 11:55 AM, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>> wrote:
      > >
      > > > It would be perfectly legal for me to wear a big
      > > > fake breasts prop to speak up for nudists rights
      > > > on private property, but would it be appropriate
      > > > at every libertarian protest??
      > > >
      > > > GTriest wrote:
      > > > > I think Chris Matthews had a point though, many things are
      > perfectly
      > > > legal but simply inappropriate.
      > > > > The sign of course refers to blood and revolution, etc.
      > > > > I think it might have been too close to other implications to have
      > > been
      > > > appropriate. Sure a judgment call, but that is my opinion.
      > > > >
      > > > > If this was the president campaigning for an anti-gun law, then it
      > > might
      > > > be appropriate.
      > > > >
      > > > > Gary T
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > From: Chris Lawless
      > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:36 PM
      > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > Carol I don't really know who you are directing that at.
      > > > >
      > > > > In NH it is 100% legal to have a gun in then open. (see the
      > video of
      > > > the police officer and William)
      > > > >
      > > > > I won't speak for William but I know that many of the people
      > that I
      > > was
      > > > with at the 'rally' were also protesting President Bush in the
      > past. In
      > > > fact the Obama fans couldn't figure us out because we were anti
      > > Government
      > > > healthcare, anti occupation of Iraq, expansion of Afghan war,
      > anti Bush
      > > etc
      > > > etc.
      > > > >
      > > > > --- On Wed, 8/12/09, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > From: Carol Moore/Secession.Net <contacts@...
      > <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 6:20 AM
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > And let's not forget "Gun toting to prove you are a "real man" can
      > > ruin
      > > > >
      > > > > a revolution."
      > > > >
      > > > > Not to mention where was he when Bush was stealing all our
      > liberties,
      > > > >
      > > > > which Obama is merely expanding upon?? And where were the
      > Republicans
      > > > >
      > > > > in producing a free market in health care the 6 years they
      > controlled
      > > > >
      > > > > presidency, house and senate? Where's their united front on
      > such an
      > > > >
      > > > > alternative now? Could it be: "Sold to the insurance industry that
      > > > >
      > > > > doesn't want competition, be it from lower priced individual plans
      > > > >
      > > > > (which would flourish if individuals got same tax break as
      > business)
      > > > and
      > > > >
      > > > > doesn't want cross-state competition, which currently is
      > illegal. Just
      > > > >
      > > > > for starters...
      > > > >
      > > > > Chris Lawless wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > > http://digg. com/politics/ Gun_Toting_ Man_Draws_ Scrutiny_
      > > > Outside_Obama_ Town_Hall
      > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > > and please forward
      > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > > ************ ********* ********* ********* *
      > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > > I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty
      > is no
      > > > vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of
      > > justice
      > > > is no virtue!
      > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > > --
      > > > >
      > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > >
      > > > > http://carolmoore. net/
      > > > >
      > > > > http://carolmoorere port.blogspot. com/
      > > > >
      > > > > http://youtube. com/carolmoore
      > > > >
      > > > > http://secession. net
      > > > >
      > > > > http://stopthewarno w.net
      > > > >
      > > > > http://whatwouldgan dhido.net
      > > > >
      > > > > http://radicalbutto ns.com
      > > > >
      > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > >
      > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > >
      > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > >
      > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > >
      > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > >
      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > > --
      > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > http://carolmoore.net/ <http://carolmoore.net/>
      > > > http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/
      > <http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/>
      > > > http://youtube.com/carolmoore <http://youtube.com/carolmoore>
      > > > http://secession.net <http://secession.net>
      > > > http://stopthewarnow.net <http://stopthewarnow.net>
      > > > http://whatwouldgandhido.net <http://whatwouldgandhido.net>
      > > > http://radicalbuttons.com <http://radicalbuttons.com>
      > > >
      > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ------------------------------------
      > > >
      > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------------
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > Back to top <#toc>
      > Reply to sender
      > <mailto:garyonthenet@...?Subject=Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
      > | Reply to group <mailto:freestateproject@yahoogroups.com?Subject=
      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up> | Reply via
      > web post
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJycXZmazN1BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQxBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM-?act=reply&messageNum=15641>
      >
      > Messages in this topic
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15611;_ylc=X3oDMTM3ODVuZ29rBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQxBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODMEdHBjSWQDMTU2MTE->
      > (20)
      > 1b.
      >
      >
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15642;_ylc=X3oDMTJyN2drZ3N1BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQyBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM->
      >
      >
      >
      > Posted by: "Tim Condon" tim@...
      > <mailto:tim@...?Subject=
      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
      > suggesto <http://profiles.yahoo.com/suggesto>
      >
      >
      > Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:38 am (PDT)
      >
      >
      >
      > Thank you, Ma'am.
      > If only someone in the gym other than the mentally deranged killer
      > had had a
      > sidearm...it might have been only him who got killed. As it was, no
      > one had
      > the means to put a quick stop to him. One more example and reason
      > why "more
      > guns means less crime." <http://www.aei.org/book/605
      > <http://www.aei.org/book/605>> ---Tim Condon
      >
      > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 10:56 PM, Lady Liberty
      > <ladylibrty@... <mailto:ladylibrty%40ladylibrty.com>>wrote:
      >
      > > I'm falling on the side of the angels, here. In case it's not obvious,
      > > Tim, that's you. :-)
      > >
      > > Here's a brief excerpt from my commentary this week which talks about
      > > the Pittsburgh gym shooter and the New Hampshire free man:
      > >
      > > "These two scenarios occurring two weeks apart couldn't be much more
      > > different. In the first, a man with a gun committed murder. In the
      > > second, a man with a gun did...nothing. And yet both have engendered
      > > horror from anti-gun advocates. To me, this proves that some people
      > > are far more fearful of firearms than they are of the person wielding
      > > them. Given the end result of both these incidents, I think there's
      > > ample evidence instead that they might want to place blame where it
      > > goes rather than on a tool that can be used, misused, or, most often,
      > > not used at all."
      > >
      > > Lady Liberty
      > >
      > >
      > > On Aug 17, 2009, at 10:27 PM, Tim Condon wrote:
      > >
      > > > No offense taken, Gary. However, the arguments you make below sound
      > > > an awful
      > > > lot like the arguments liberals and other statists use all the
      > time to
      > > > continually encroach upon individual liberties. They think guns
      > > > should be
      > > > outlawed because if guns were legal "people would be shooting each
      > > > other on
      > > > the street every day." We must have zoning because "if we don't have
      > > > zoning
      > > > they'll put up a pig farm (or chemical factory; those are the two
      > > > favorites)
      > > > right next door to your house!" And we must have Real ID because
      > > > terrorists
      > > > will run rampant throughout America and kill everyone if we
      > don't have
      > > > "papers" that everyone must carry.
      > > > You pick out some examples below that are certainly designed to
      > > > elicit the
      > > > same response. But we're not talking about doing any of those
      > > > things. We're
      > > > talking about a specific, inalienable, Constitutionally mandated
      > > > right, i.e.
      > > > the right to keep and "bear" arms. I don't particularly care if
      > > > every other
      > > > person in America (in addition to Chris Matthews) thinks was
      > > > "inappropriate"
      > > > to openly carry a sidearm at the Portsmouth protest. I repeat:
      > "It is
      > > > *never* inappropriate to openly exercise a specific right that is
      > > > guaranteed
      > > > in the U.S. Constitution." So although there may be all kinds of
      > > > people who
      > > > think exercising that particular right, at that particular time, at
      > > > that
      > > > particular venue was "in poor taste," or "silly," or "scary," or
      > > > whatever....that's too bad. This is the Free State. We take our
      > > > natural and
      > > > Constitutional rights seriously, and there's never a "wrong" time to
      > > > exercise any of them. ---Tim Condon
      > > >
      > > > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:14 AM, GaryT <garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > > Well, don't take this personally, but I think that is extremist
      > > > thinking
      > > > > and can lead to foolish behavior.
      > > > >
      > > > > Once again, as I said before, there are many things you may have
      > > > legal
      > > > > right to do, but may be completely socially inappropriate
      > > > nonetheless.
      > > > > You may invited to a vegetarian dinner function, yet choose to
      > > > slaughter a
      > > > > rabbit and eat it raw in front of all there.
      > > > > Legal? Yes. Appropriate? No. Unless you were affirmatively
      > trying to
      > > > > offend.
      > > > >
      > > > > You might take a dump on public land in front of a 7 year old
      > > > child. Legal?
      > > > > Probably.
      > > > > Acceptable under social civililty norms? Not at all.
      > > > >
      > > > > You might stand outside a restaurant on a public sidewalk, and
      > > > proceed to
      > > > > cut yourself and bleed on the sidewalk in front of the patrons.
      > > > Legal? Yes.
      > > > > Appropriate? No.
      > > > >
      > > > > The list is endless.
      > > > >
      > > > > The point being, the level of legality is not the same level for
      > > > social
      > > > > consideration or politeness, or common decency.
      > > > > The fact that you can do something, does not mean you should
      > do it.
      > > > >
      > > > > Gary T
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > From: Tim Condon
      > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009 6:01 PM
      > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > So long as your activity doesn't aggress against anyone else or
      > > > their
      > > > > co-equal right to do what they want without aggressing against
      > > > you, yes.
      > > > > Appropriateness isn't the measure of whether other people
      > > > disapprove, or
      > > > > are
      > > > > made uncomfortable. And it is *never* inappropriate to openly
      > > > exercise a
      > > > > specific right that is guaranteed in the U.S. Constitution. In
      > > > fact, it is
      > > > > absolutely necessary that people exercise such rights openly; such
      > > > actions
      > > > > should be encouraged, or such rights will come to be frowned upon,
      > > > and
      > > > > even
      > > > > judged "inappropriate" in many---and eventually
      > all---circumstances.
      > > > > Exhibit
      > > > > #1: The Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, which
      > > > William Kostic
      > > > > was peaceably and entirely legitimately exercising. I wish I had
      > > > been
      > > > > present to support him by keeping and bearing my own
      > openly-carried
      > > > > side-arm, the right to which is guaranteed by the above-said
      > Second
      > > > > Amendment. ---Tim Condon (who is a lawyer)
      > > > >
      > > > > On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 11:55 AM, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > > It would be perfectly legal for me to wear a big
      > > > > > fake breasts prop to speak up for nudists rights
      > > > > > on private property, but would it be appropriate
      > > > > > at every libertarian protest??
      > > > > >
      > > > > > GTriest wrote:
      > > > > > > I think Chris Matthews had a point though, many things are
      > > > perfectly
      > > > > > legal but simply inappropriate.
      > > > > > > The sign of course refers to blood and revolution, etc.
      > > > > > > I think it might have been too close to other implications to
      > > > have
      > > > > been
      > > > > > appropriate. Sure a judgment call, but that is my opinion.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > If this was the president campaigning for an anti-gun law,
      > > > then it
      > > > > might
      > > > > > be appropriate.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Gary T
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > > > From: Chris Lawless
      > > > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:36 PM
      > > > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Carol I don't really know who you are directing that at.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > In NH it is 100% legal to have a gun in then open. (see the
      > > > video of
      > > > > > the police officer and William)
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > I won't speak for William but I know that many of the people
      > > > that I
      > > > > was
      > > > > > with at the 'rally' were also protesting President Bush in the
      > > > past. In
      > > > > > fact the Obama fans couldn't figure us out because we were anti
      > > > > Government
      > > > > > healthcare, anti occupation of Iraq, expansion of Afghan war,
      > > > anti Bush
      > > > > etc
      > > > > > etc.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/12/09, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > > wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > From: Carol Moore/Secession.Net <contacts@...
      > <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > > Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 6:20 AM
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > And let's not forget "Gun toting to prove you are a "real man"
      > > > can
      > > > > ruin
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > a revolution."
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Not to mention where was he when Bush was stealing all our
      > > > liberties,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > which Obama is merely expanding upon?? And where were the
      > > > Republicans
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > in producing a free market in health care the 6 years they
      > > > controlled
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > presidency, house and senate? Where's their united front on
      > > > such an
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > alternative now? Could it be: "Sold to the insurance industry
      > > > that
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > doesn't want competition, be it from lower priced individual
      > > > plans
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > (which would flourish if individuals got same tax break as
      > > > business)
      > > > > > and
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > doesn't want cross-state competition, which currently is
      > > > illegal. Just
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > for starters...
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Chris Lawless wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > http://digg. com/politics/ Gun_Toting_ Man_Draws_ Scrutiny_
      > > > > > Outside_Obama_ Town_Hall
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > and please forward
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > ************ ********* ********* ********* *
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty
      > > > is no
      > > > > > vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the
      > pursuit of
      > > > > justice
      > > > > > is no virtue!
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > --
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://carolmoore. net/
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://carolmoorere port.blogspot. com/
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://youtube. com/carolmoore
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://secession. net
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://stopthewarno w.net
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://whatwouldgan dhido.net
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://radicalbutto ns.com
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --
      > > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > > > http://carolmoore.net/ <http://carolmoore.net/>
      > > > > > http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/
      > <http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/>
      > > > > > http://youtube.com/carolmoore <http://youtube.com/carolmoore>
      > > > > > http://secession.net <http://secession.net>
      > > > > > http://stopthewarnow.net <http://stopthewarnow.net>
      > > > > > http://whatwouldgandhido.net <http://whatwouldgandhido.net>
      > > > > > http://radicalbuttons.com <http://radicalbuttons.com>
      > > > > >
      > > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > >
      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------------
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > Back to top <#toc>
      > Reply to sender
      > <mailto:tim@...?Subject=Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
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      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up> | Reply via
      > web post
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJycXFucW1lBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQyBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM-?act=reply&messageNum=15642>
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      > Messages in this topic
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15611;_ylc=X3oDMTM3NHZwYW1hBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQyBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODMEdHBjSWQDMTU2MTE->
      > (20)
      > 1c.
      >
      >
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15643;_ylc=X3oDMTJyMG9ybWsyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQzBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM->
      >
      >
      >
      > Posted by: "Tim Condon" tim@...
      > <mailto:tim@...?Subject=
      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
      > suggesto <http://profiles.yahoo.com/suggesto>
      >
      >
      > Tue Aug 18, 2009 11:26 am (PDT)
      >
      >
      >
      > I understand your position and concerns, Gary. However, I have to
      > reiterate
      > that I feel it is never wrong to exercise a Constitutional right,
      > particularly that of bearing arms. People are leery about open carry now
      > because it is "odd" and "unusual." We should ensure that from now it is
      > *not* odd or unusual, and in fact is done all the time, as befits free
      > people. Further, we all know that rights, like muscles, atrophy when not
      > used. Thus, we should use our rights publicly whenever and wherever
      > possible. ---Tim C.
      >
      > On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 11:07 AM, GaryT <garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
      >
      > > Well the arguments may coincide, (mine and theirs) but that
      > doesn't mean
      > > too much, because obversely Demopublicans' political positions
      > also coincide
      > > with libertarian political positions (as do sheer Socialist
      > arguments), but
      > > only part of the time.
      > >
      > > I don't think guns should be outlawed, or zoned, or real id'd,
      > etc. Those
      > > are laws infringing upon the right to carry and bear arms.
      > > My commentary never mentioned laws, it only concerned applied civility
      > > under the right circumstances.
      > >
      > > Again, I don't suggest an infringement of rights, just the social
      > > wherewithal to know when and where public social behavior is
      > appropriate.
      > > This is a problem that those with Aspberger's often have, they are
      > good at
      > > understanding the black and white of laws and rights, but they
      > have a tough
      > > time with the variations of grey as applied in social situations.
      > > There is a value associated with social conduct, which a
      > meta-libertarian
      > > concept, and a society I would hope to live in, within a
      > libertarian legal
      > > system.
      > >
      > > Gary T
      > >
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: Tim Condon
      > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com> ; RLCNH ;
      > nhrvc@yahoogroups.com <mailto:nhrvc%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > Sent: Monday, August 17, 2009 10:27 PM
      > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > >
      > >
      > > No offense taken, Gary. However, the arguments you make below sound an
      > > awful
      > > lot like the arguments liberals and other statists use all the time to
      > > continually encroach upon individual liberties. They think guns
      > should be
      > > outlawed because if guns were legal "people would be shooting each
      > other
      > > on
      > > the street every day." We must have zoning because "if we don't have
      > > zoning
      > > they'll put up a pig farm (or chemical factory; those are the two
      > > favorites)
      > > right next door to your house!" And we must have Real ID because
      > > terrorists
      > > will run rampant throughout America and kill everyone if we don't have
      > > "papers" that everyone must carry.
      > > You pick out some examples below that are certainly designed to
      > elicit the
      > > same response. But we're not talking about doing any of those things.
      > > We're
      > > talking about a specific, inalienable, Constitutionally mandated
      > right,
      > > i.e.
      > > the right to keep and "bear" arms. I don't particularly care if every
      > > other
      > > person in America (in addition to Chris Matthews) thinks was
      > > "inappropriate"
      > > to openly carry a sidearm at the Portsmouth protest. I repeat: "It is
      > > *never* inappropriate to openly exercise a specific right that is
      > > guaranteed
      > > in the U.S. Constitution." So although there may be all kinds of
      > people
      > > who
      > > think exercising that particular right, at that particular time,
      > at that
      > > particular venue was "in poor taste," or "silly," or "scary," or
      > > whatever....that's too bad. This is the Free State. We take our
      > natural
      > > and
      > > Constitutional rights seriously, and there's never a "wrong" time to
      > > exercise any of them. ---Tim Condon
      > >
      > > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:14 AM, GaryT <garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
      > >
      > > > Well, don't take this personally, but I think that is extremist
      > thinking
      > > > and can lead to foolish behavior.
      > > >
      > > > Once again, as I said before, there are many things you may have
      > legal
      > > > right to do, but may be completely socially inappropriate
      > nonetheless.
      > > > You may invited to a vegetarian dinner function, yet choose to
      > slaughter
      > > a
      > > > rabbit and eat it raw in front of all there.
      > > > Legal? Yes. Appropriate? No. Unless you were affirmatively trying to
      > > > offend.
      > > >
      > > > You might take a dump on public land in front of a 7 year old child.
      > > Legal?
      > > > Probably.
      > > > Acceptable under social civililty norms? Not at all.
      > > >
      > > > You might stand outside a restaurant on a public sidewalk, and
      > proceed
      > > to
      > > > cut yourself and bleed on the sidewalk in front of the patrons.
      > Legal?
      > > Yes.
      > > > Appropriate? No.
      > > >
      > > > The list is endless.
      > > >
      > > > The point being, the level of legality is not the same level for
      > social
      > > > consideration or politeness, or common decency.
      > > > The fact that you can do something, does not mean you should do it.
      > > >
      > > > Gary T
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: Tim Condon
      > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009 6:01 PM
      > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > So long as your activity doesn't aggress against anyone else or
      > their
      > > > co-equal right to do what they want without aggressing against
      > you, yes.
      > > > Appropriateness isn't the measure of whether other people
      > disapprove, or
      > > > are
      > > > made uncomfortable. And it is *never* inappropriate to openly
      > exercise a
      > > > specific right that is guaranteed in the U.S. Constitution. In
      > fact, it
      > > is
      > > > absolutely necessary that people exercise such rights openly; such
      > > actions
      > > > should be encouraged, or such rights will come to be frowned
      > upon, and
      > > > even
      > > > judged "inappropriate" in many---and eventually all---circumstances.
      > > > Exhibit
      > > > #1: The Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, which William
      > > Kostic
      > > > was peaceably and entirely legitimately exercising. I wish I had
      > been
      > > > present to support him by keeping and bearing my own openly-carried
      > > > side-arm, the right to which is guaranteed by the above-said Second
      > > > Amendment. ---Tim Condon (who is a lawyer)
      > > >
      > > > On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 11:55 AM, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > > It would be perfectly legal for me to wear a big
      > > > > fake breasts prop to speak up for nudists rights
      > > > > on private property, but would it be appropriate
      > > > > at every libertarian protest??
      > > > >
      > > > > GTriest wrote:
      > > > > > I think Chris Matthews had a point though, many things are
      > perfectly
      > > > > legal but simply inappropriate.
      > > > > > The sign of course refers to blood and revolution, etc.
      > > > > > I think it might have been too close to other implications
      > to have
      > > > been
      > > > > appropriate. Sure a judgment call, but that is my opinion.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > If this was the president campaigning for an anti-gun law,
      > then it
      > > > might
      > > > > be appropriate.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Gary T
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > > From: Chris Lawless
      > > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:36 PM
      > > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Carol I don't really know who you are directing that at.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > In NH it is 100% legal to have a gun in then open. (see the
      > video of
      > > > > the police officer and William)
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I won't speak for William but I know that many of the people
      > that I
      > > > was
      > > > > with at the 'rally' were also protesting President Bush in the
      > past.
      > > In
      > > > > fact the Obama fans couldn't figure us out because we were anti
      > > > Government
      > > > > healthcare, anti occupation of Iraq, expansion of Afghan war, anti
      > > Bush
      > > > etc
      > > > > etc.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/12/09, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > From: Carol Moore/Secession.Net <contacts@...
      > <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 6:20 AM
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > And let's not forget "Gun toting to prove you are a "real
      > man" can
      > > > ruin
      > > > > >
      > > > > > a revolution."
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Not to mention where was he when Bush was stealing all our
      > > liberties,
      > > > > >
      > > > > > which Obama is merely expanding upon?? And where were the
      > > Republicans
      > > > > >
      > > > > > in producing a free market in health care the 6 years they
      > > controlled
      > > > > >
      > > > > > presidency, house and senate? Where's their united front on
      > such an
      > > > > >
      > > > > > alternative now? Could it be: "Sold to the insurance
      > industry that
      > > > > >
      > > > > > doesn't want competition, be it from lower priced individual
      > plans
      > > > > >
      > > > > > (which would flourish if individuals got same tax break as
      > business)
      > > > > and
      > > > > >
      > > > > > doesn't want cross-state competition, which currently is
      > illegal.
      > > Just
      > > > > >
      > > > > > for starters...
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Chris Lawless wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://digg. com/politics/ Gun_Toting_ Man_Draws_ Scrutiny_
      > > > > Outside_Obama_ Town_Hall
      > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > and please forward
      > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > ************ ********* ********* ********* *
      > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > I would remind you that extremism in the defense of
      > liberty is no
      > > > > vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of
      > > > justice
      > > > > is no virtue!
      > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > --
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://carolmoore. net/
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://carolmoorere port.blogspot. com/
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://youtube. com/carolmoore
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://secession. net
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://stopthewarno w.net
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://whatwouldgan dhido.net
      > > > > >
      > > > > > http://radicalbutto ns.com
      > > > > >
      > > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > > >
      > > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > > >
      > > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > > >
      > > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > > >
      > > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > --
      > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > > http://carolmoore.net/ <http://carolmoore.net/>
      > > > > http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/
      > <http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/>
      > > > > http://youtube.com/carolmoore <http://youtube.com/carolmoore>
      > > > > http://secession.net <http://secession.net>
      > > > > http://stopthewarnow.net <http://stopthewarnow.net>
      > > > > http://whatwouldgandhido.net <http://whatwouldgandhido.net>
      > > > > http://radicalbuttons.com <http://radicalbuttons.com>
      > > > >
      > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > >
      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ------------------------------------
      > > >
      > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------------
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > Back to top <#toc>
      > Reply to sender
      > <mailto:tim@...?Subject=Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
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      > web post
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJyMDdmdjg4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQzBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM-?act=reply&messageNum=15643>
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      > Messages in this topic
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15611;_ylc=X3oDMTM3N2J1cTY2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQzBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODMEdHBjSWQDMTU2MTE->
      > (20)
      > 1d.
      >
      >
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15644;_ylc=X3oDMTJydDk3NXRrBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQ0BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM->
      >
      >
      >
      > Posted by: "GaryT" garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet@...?Subject=
      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
      > garyonthenet <http://profiles.yahoo.com/garyonthenet>
      >
      >
      > Tue Aug 18, 2009 4:21 pm (PDT)
      >
      >
      >
      > I agree that another person should have had the right to carry
      > there. Then most likely someone would have been able to stop him.
      >
      > Gary T
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Tim Condon
      > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2009 8:20 AM
      > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      >
      > Thank you, Ma'am.
      > If only someone in the gym other than the mentally deranged killer
      > had had a
      > sidearm...it might have been only him who got killed. As it was, no
      > one had
      > the means to put a quick stop to him. One more example and reason
      > why "more
      > guns means less crime." <http://www.aei.org/book/605
      > <http://www.aei.org/book/605>> ---Tim Condon
      >
      > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 10:56 PM, Lady Liberty
      > <ladylibrty@... <mailto:ladylibrty%40ladylibrty.com>>wrote:
      >
      > > I'm falling on the side of the angels, here. In case it's not obvious,
      > > Tim, that's you. :-)
      > >
      > > Here's a brief excerpt from my commentary this week which talks about
      > > the Pittsburgh gym shooter and the New Hampshire free man:
      > >
      > > "These two scenarios occurring two weeks apart couldn't be much more
      > > different. In the first, a man with a gun committed murder. In the
      > > second, a man with a gun did...nothing. And yet both have engendered
      > > horror from anti-gun advocates. To me, this proves that some people
      > > are far more fearful of firearms than they are of the person wielding
      > > them. Given the end result of both these incidents, I think there's
      > > ample evidence instead that they might want to place blame where it
      > > goes rather than on a tool that can be used, misused, or, most often,
      > > not used at all."
      > >
      > > Lady Liberty
      > >
      > >
      > > On Aug 17, 2009, at 10:27 PM, Tim Condon wrote:
      > >
      > > > No offense taken, Gary. However, the arguments you make below sound
      > > > an awful
      > > > lot like the arguments liberals and other statists use all the
      > time to
      > > > continually encroach upon individual liberties. They think guns
      > > > should be
      > > > outlawed because if guns were legal "people would be shooting each
      > > > other on
      > > > the street every day." We must have zoning because "if we don't have
      > > > zoning
      > > > they'll put up a pig farm (or chemical factory; those are the two
      > > > favorites)
      > > > right next door to your house!" And we must have Real ID because
      > > > terrorists
      > > > will run rampant throughout America and kill everyone if we
      > don't have
      > > > "papers" that everyone must carry.
      > > > You pick out some examples below that are certainly designed to
      > > > elicit the
      > > > same response. But we're not talking about doing any of those
      > > > things. We're
      > > > talking about a specific, inalienable, Constitutionally mandated
      > > > right, i.e.
      > > > the right to keep and "bear" arms. I don't particularly care if
      > > > every other
      > > > person in America (in addition to Chris Matthews) thinks was
      > > > "inappropriate"
      > > > to openly carry a sidearm at the Portsmouth protest. I repeat:
      > "It is
      > > > *never* inappropriate to openly exercise a specific right that is
      > > > guaranteed
      > > > in the U.S. Constitution." So although there may be all kinds of
      > > > people who
      > > > think exercising that particular right, at that particular time, at
      > > > that
      > > > particular venue was "in poor taste," or "silly," or "scary," or
      > > > whatever....that's too bad. This is the Free State. We take our
      > > > natural and
      > > > Constitutional rights seriously, and there's never a "wrong" time to
      > > > exercise any of them. ---Tim Condon
      > > >
      > > > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:14 AM, GaryT <garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > > Well, don't take this personally, but I think that is extremist
      > > > thinking
      > > > > and can lead to foolish behavior.
      > > > >
      > > > > Once again, as I said before, there are many things you may have
      > > > legal
      > > > > right to do, but may be completely socially inappropriate
      > > > nonetheless.
      > > > > You may invited to a vegetarian dinner function, yet choose to
      > > > slaughter a
      > > > > rabbit and eat it raw in front of all there.
      > > > > Legal? Yes. Appropriate? No. Unless you were affirmatively
      > trying to
      > > > > offend.
      > > > >
      > > > > You might take a dump on public land in front of a 7 year old
      > > > child. Legal?
      > > > > Probably.
      > > > > Acceptable under social civililty norms? Not at all.
      > > > >
      > > > > You might stand outside a restaurant on a public sidewalk, and
      > > > proceed to
      > > > > cut yourself and bleed on the sidewalk in front of the patrons.
      > > > Legal? Yes.
      > > > > Appropriate? No.
      > > > >
      > > > > The list is endless.
      > > > >
      > > > > The point being, the level of legality is not the same level for
      > > > social
      > > > > consideration or politeness, or common decency.
      > > > > The fact that you can do something, does not mean you should
      > do it.
      > > > >
      > > > > Gary T
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > From: Tim Condon
      > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009 6:01 PM
      > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > So long as your activity doesn't aggress against anyone else or
      > > > their
      > > > > co-equal right to do what they want without aggressing against
      > > > you, yes.
      > > > > Appropriateness isn't the measure of whether other people
      > > > disapprove, or
      > > > > are
      > > > > made uncomfortable. And it is *never* inappropriate to openly
      > > > exercise a
      > > > > specific right that is guaranteed in the U.S. Constitution. In
      > > > fact, it is
      > > > > absolutely necessary that people exercise such rights openly; such
      > > > actions
      > > > > should be encouraged, or such rights will come to be frowned upon,
      > > > and
      > > > > even
      > > > > judged "inappropriate" in many---and eventually
      > all---circumstances.
      > > > > Exhibit
      > > > > #1: The Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, which
      > > > William Kostic
      > > > > was peaceably and entirely legitimately exercising. I wish I had
      > > > been
      > > > > present to support him by keeping and bearing my own
      > openly-carried
      > > > > side-arm, the right to which is guaranteed by the above-said
      > Second
      > > > > Amendment. ---Tim Condon (who is a lawyer)
      > > > >
      > > > > On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 11:55 AM, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > > It would be perfectly legal for me to wear a big
      > > > > > fake breasts prop to speak up for nudists rights
      > > > > > on private property, but would it be appropriate
      > > > > > at every libertarian protest??
      > > > > >
      > > > > > GTriest wrote:
      > > > > > > I think Chris Matthews had a point though, many things are
      > > > perfectly
      > > > > > legal but simply inappropriate.
      > > > > > > The sign of course refers to blood and revolution, etc.
      > > > > > > I think it might have been too close to other implications to
      > > > have
      > > > > been
      > > > > > appropriate. Sure a judgment call, but that is my opinion.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > If this was the president campaigning for an anti-gun law,
      > > > then it
      > > > > might
      > > > > > be appropriate.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Gary T
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > > > From: Chris Lawless
      > > > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 12:36 PM
      > > > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Carol I don't really know who you are directing that at.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > In NH it is 100% legal to have a gun in then open. (see the
      > > > video of
      > > > > > the police officer and William)
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > I won't speak for William but I know that many of the people
      > > > that I
      > > > > was
      > > > > > with at the 'rally' were also protesting President Bush in the
      > > > past. In
      > > > > > fact the Obama fans couldn't figure us out because we were anti
      > > > > Government
      > > > > > healthcare, anti occupation of Iraq, expansion of Afghan war,
      > > > anti Bush
      > > > > etc
      > > > > > etc.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/12/09, Carol Moore/Secession.Net <
      > > > > contacts@... <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > > wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > From: Carol Moore/Secession.Net <contacts@...
      > <mailto:contacts%40secession.net>>
      > > > > > > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > > > > > > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > > Date: Wednesday, August 12, 2009, 6:20 AM
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > And let's not forget "Gun toting to prove you are a "real man"
      > > > can
      > > > > ruin
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > a revolution."
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Not to mention where was he when Bush was stealing all our
      > > > liberties,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > which Obama is merely expanding upon?? And where were the
      > > > Republicans
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > in producing a free market in health care the 6 years they
      > > > controlled
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > presidency, house and senate? Where's their united front on
      > > > such an
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > alternative now? Could it be: "Sold to the insurance industry
      > > > that
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > doesn't want competition, be it from lower priced individual
      > > > plans
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > (which would flourish if individuals got same tax break as
      > > > business)
      > > > > > and
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > doesn't want cross-state competition, which currently is
      > > > illegal. Just
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > for starters...
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Chris Lawless wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > http://digg. com/politics/ Gun_Toting_ Man_Draws_ Scrutiny_
      > > > > > Outside_Obama_ Town_Hall
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > and please forward
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > ************ ********* ********* ********* *
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty
      > > > is no
      > > > > > vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the
      > pursuit of
      > > > > justice
      > > > > > is no virtue!
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > --
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://carolmoore. net/
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://carolmoorere port.blogspot. com/
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://youtube. com/carolmoore
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://secession. net
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://stopthewarno w.net
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://whatwouldgan dhido.net
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://radicalbutto ns.com
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --
      > > > > > Carol Moore in DC
      > > > > > http://carolmoore.net/ <http://carolmoore.net/>
      > > > > > http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/
      > <http://carolmoorereport.blogspot.com/>
      > > > > > http://youtube.com/carolmoore <http://youtube.com/carolmoore>
      > > > > > http://secession.net <http://secession.net>
      > > > > > http://stopthewarnow.net <http://stopthewarnow.net>
      > > > > > http://whatwouldgandhido.net <http://whatwouldgandhido.net>
      > > > > > http://radicalbuttons.com <http://radicalbuttons.com>
      > > > > >
      > > > > > NOTICE: Due to Presidential Executive Orders,
      > > > > > the National Security Agency may have read this
      > > > > > email without judicial or legislative oversight
      > > > > > or warning, warrant, or notice. You have no
      > > > > > recourse nor protection save to secede from the union.
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ------------------------------------
      > > > >
      > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ------------------------------------
      > >
      > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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      > Messages in this topic
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15611;_ylc=X3oDMTM3MmIxa3I4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQ0BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODMEdHBjSWQDMTU2MTE->
      > (20)
      > 1e.
      >
      >
      > Re: Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/freestateproject/message/15645;_ylc=X3oDMTJyYW1nNzc0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzUyNDgxNDgEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYwMzc1BG1zZ0lkAzE1NjQ1BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyNTA2ODUyODM->
      >
      >
      >
      > Posted by: "GaryT" garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet@...?Subject=
      > Re%3A%20Pls%20Digg%2E%2E%2E%20CBS%20picked%20this%20up>
      > garyonthenet <http://profiles.yahoo.com/garyonthenet>
      >
      >
      > Tue Aug 18, 2009 4:22 pm (PDT)
      >
      >
      >
      > A principled position to take, and I respect that opinion.
      >
      > Gary T
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Tim Condon
      > To: freestateproject@yahoogroups.com
      > <mailto:freestateproject%40yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2009 2:24 PM
      > Subject: Re: [FSP] Pls Digg... CBS picked this up
      >
      > I understand your position and concerns, Gary. However, I have to
      > reiterate
      > that I feel it is never wrong to exercise a Constitutional right,
      > particularly that of bearing arms. People are leery about open carry now
      > because it is "odd" and "unusual." We should ensure that from now it is
      > *not* odd or unusual, and in fact is done all the time, as befits free
      > people. Further, we all know that rights, like muscles, atrophy when not
      > used. Thus, we should use our rights publicly whenever and wherever
      > possible. ---Tim C.
      >
      > On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 11:07 AM, GaryT <garyonthenet@...
      > <mailto:garyonthenet%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
      >
      > > Well the arguments may coincide, (mine and theirs) but that
      > doesn't mean
      > > too much, because obversely Demopublicans' political positions
      > also coincide
      > > with libertarian political positions (as do sheer Socialist
      > arguments), but
      > > only part of the time.
      > <br/><br/>(Message over 64 KB, truncated)
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