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Re: [foss.in] FOSS.IN/2008: Event Announcement

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  • Animesh Saxena
    Too much of hacking and stuff in FOSS! More and more people view it as a development platform and well I also love to attend FOSS for this very same reason -
    Message 1 of 29 , Aug 14, 2008
      Too much of hacking and stuff in FOSS! More and more people view it as a
      development platform and well I also love to attend FOSS for this very
      same reason - to learn about new technical stuff. Still when I browse
      the web Linux is considerd a black word by many new generation people
      atleast here in India. It might be a long shot why not target the
      Windows users. People who somehow view computers as "Which version of
      windows you have?". I would much rather want those people to admire the
      rock solid Linux and admire systems like Fedora with all the regular
      games and stuff. It's more user friendly than Windows and for the very
      same reason I have people like my dad shifting to Linux rather than
      crashy Windows. I am not sure if FOSS emphasizes that but I think it can
      be used for putting brakes on new Windows users. Something with cool
      graphics like beryl and new games, 3d stuff or migrating from Windows -
      Linux. Simple sessions if we can attract more people it will be too
      good. But anyway just a suggestion, not sure if it can work out.

      Animesh
    • Atul Chitnis
      ... Hmmm, did you miss the event last year? :) http://foss.in/2007/schedules/ Atul -- Atul Chitnis Bangalore, India http://atulchitnis.net
      Message 2 of 29 , Aug 15, 2008
        On Fri, 15 Aug 2008, Aditya Godbole wrote:

        > Something like "We are adding so and so feature to Kontact. We will
        > give la ive demo and commentary of what we are doing. And we will
        > explain the relevant architecture and API along the way." - done by
        > the KDE team. This is just an example.
        > Hell, even if it goes on the full day, sitting through it will be
        > worth 10 talks.

        Hmmm, did you miss the event last year? :)

        http://foss.in/2007/schedules/

        Atul

        --
        Atul Chitnis
        Bangalore, India
        http://atulchitnis.net
      • Atul Chitnis
        ... FOSS.IN is not a user conference - it is a contributor and developer oriented conference. From last year s CfP: In the past, the event has had topics
        Message 3 of 29 , Aug 15, 2008
          On Fri, 15 Aug 2008, Animesh Saxena wrote:

          > Too much of hacking and stuff in FOSS! More and more people view it as a
          > development platform and well I also love to attend FOSS for this very
          > same reason - to learn about new technical stuff. Still when I browse
          ...
          > Linux. Simple sessions if we can attract more people it will be too
          > good. But anyway just a suggestion, not sure if it can work out.

          FOSS.IN is not a user conference - it is a contributor and developer
          oriented conference.

          From last year's CfP:

          "In the past, the event has had topics ranging from community building to
          advocacy. Although this approach has achieved considerable success,
          FOSS.IN/2007 will be dominated by project and technology talks, in order
          to avoid duplicating the efforts of User Groups and other conferences that
          focus on user and introductory topics.

          The main objective of FOSS.IN is to promote involvement in FOSS projects,
          so presentations about actual contribution to FOSS projects would be of
          primary importance.

          Contribution is defined as actual coding, design, documentation, testing,
          etc. Our primary criteria for selection of talks (especially for the Main
          Conference sessions) will be whether the presenters are actually involved
          in the project that they are talking about - as contributors, not solely
          as users.

          This change in orientation has been a result of continuous feedback from
          FOSS stalwarts who have attended the previous events."



          --
          Atul Chitnis
          Bangalore, India
          http://atulchitnis.net
        • Philip Tellis
          ... Sure it can work - as long as the talk is about an actual concrete contribution in this field. How about this - you start working on some 3D game or
          Message 4 of 29 , Aug 15, 2008
            2008/8/14 Animesh Saxena <animesh.saxena@...>:

            > be used for putting brakes on new Windows users. Something with cool
            > graphics like beryl and new games, 3d stuff or migrating from Windows -
            > Linux. Simple sessions if we can attract more people it will be too
            > good. But anyway just a suggestion, not sure if it can work out.

            Sure it can work - as long as the talk is about an actual concrete
            contribution in this field. How about this - you start working on
            some 3D game or animation, and then set up a FOSS.in session where
            everyone who attends is supposed to contribute some part to the
            project. It could be gimp work, it could be code, it could be
            documentation, it could be testing, it could be packaging, anything.
            I'll leave it to you to figure out the logistics ;)
          • Sashank Dara
            ... At first i thought are we going back to Linux Bangalore days in sense that its a developer conference in contrast to last years motto contributors
            Message 5 of 29 , Aug 15, 2008
              > "Talk is Cheap , Show me the code "

              At first i thought are we going back to Linux Bangalore days in sense
              that its a developer conference in contrast to last years motto
              contributors conference

              > Code is more of a metaphor for contribution and not just "source code".

              Some how i still feel its not being conveyed.
              How about "Talk is Cheap , Show me the Bytes " ;) it can be
              anything bytes of artwork , source code , test cases , help manuals :D
              , well just a thought !
            • Shreyas Srinivasan
              ... Well, Literally nothing conveys it like Talk is cheap, show me the ChangeLog but i dont think a lot of people will understand it. The conference motto
              Message 6 of 29 , Aug 15, 2008
                On Sat, Aug 16, 2008 at 11:08 AM, Sashank Dara <sashankdvk@...> wrote:
                >> Code is more of a metaphor for contribution and not just "source code".
                >
                > Some how i still feel its not being conveyed.
                > How about "Talk is Cheap , Show me the Bytes " ;) it can be
                > anything bytes of artwork , source code , test cases , help manuals :D
                > , well just a thought !

                Well, Literally nothing conveys it like

                "Talk is cheap, show me the ChangeLog"

                but i dont think a lot of people will understand it. The conference motto
                needs to be clear and understandable to a wide variety of people. I somehow
                doubt either "Byte" or "ChangeLog" fit in that context.

                Cheers,
                Shreyas


                --
                CelAbrate your flaws
              • Andrew Cowie
                ... I saw that talk last year. Where were you? ++ Ok, so that was abrupt. But foss.in is pretty clued in. We don t really need to tell them what to run.
                Message 7 of 29 , Aug 15, 2008
                  On Fri, 2008-08-15 at 22:26 +0530, Aditya Godbole wrote:
                  > Something like "We are adding so and so feature to Kontact. We will
                  > give la ive demo and commentary of what we are doing. And we will
                  > explain the relevant architecture and API along the way." - done by
                  > the KDE team.

                  I saw that talk last year. Where were you?

                  ++

                  Ok, so that was abrupt.

                  But foss.in is pretty clued in. We don't really need to tell them what
                  to run. Between what gets submitted and their awesome filtering in
                  selecting talks, it'll be a rocking conference regardless.

                  ++

                  That all said, I wonder what would happen if I submitted a talk that was
                  titled "an 8 hour GNOME hacking session"...

                  [Hey, Shreyas, you can do all the work. I'll narrate. Deal?
                  Great! :)]

                  Broadly speaking, this was somewhat what Project Days were targetted to
                  achieve last year. In so far as that is a group of related people
                  talking about detailed features & contribution to a specific "project" -
                  and attracting new people to participate - they were wildly successful.

                  Open to question is whether a full day live pair-or-greater programming
                  tutorial hackfest with an audience (ie, say a 60 seater or so) would
                  actually accomplish anything FOR THE AUDIENCE in terms of _them_ being
                  able to contribute both *during* and after the event. Hold people's
                  attention for an entire day? At a conference where people a) don't ever
                  show up on time in the morning and b) of course want to flit from talk
                  to talk to sample and enjoy lots of variety? Yeah, right.

                  Speaking personally, I got a lot of really nice feedback after the "User
                  to hacker in 90 minutes" tutorial that Shreyas and I gave live - it
                  turned out that was just what some people needed. Reassured me that I
                  hadn't wasted everyone's time - but both I and Rusty (who did the same
                  live thing in his fun closing talk) agreed that it was really hard to
                  limit the scope to be something that could fit in such a short time and
                  yet be non-trivial.

                  AfC
                  Sydney

                  --
                  Andrew Frederick Cowie

                  Operational Dynamics is an operations and engineering consultancy
                  focusing on IT strategy, organizational architecture, systems
                  review, and effective procedures for change management. We actively
                  carry out research and development in these areas on behalf of our
                  clients, and enable successful use of open source in their mission
                  critical enterprises, worldwide.

                  http://www.operationaldynamics.com/

                  Sydney New York Toronto London



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • ankur
                  On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 4:32 AM, Atul Chitnis
                  Message 8 of 29 , Aug 16, 2008
                    On Fri, Aug 15, 2008 at 4:32 AM, Atul Chitnis <listadmin@...
                    > wrote:

                    >
                    >
                    > "Talk is cheap - show me the code"
                    >



                    > .
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    I remember the T-shirt quote given by Directi in FOSS 2006.

                    "I would love to change the world but they wont give me the source code." :D


                    --
                    ankur


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Aditya Godbole
                    ... I was there alright. I felt that during the main conference and during the project days, the coverage of the topics was too superficial to be of
                    Message 9 of 29 , Aug 16, 2008
                      On 8/16/08, Atul Chitnis <listadmin@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > On Fri, 15 Aug 2008, Aditya Godbole wrote:
                      >
                      > > Something like "We are adding so and so feature to Kontact. We will
                      > > give la ive demo and commentary of what we are doing. And we will
                      > > explain the relevant architecture and API along the way." - done by
                      > > the KDE team. This is just an example.
                      > > Hell, even if it goes on the full day, sitting through it will be
                      > > worth 10 talks.
                      >
                      > Hmmm, did you miss the event last year? :)
                      >


                      I was there alright. I felt that during the main conference and during
                      the project days, the coverage of the topics was too superficial to be
                      of substantial help to contribute. It might be a better idea to cover
                      less topics but spend much more time on them, going beyond mere block
                      diagrams, single line patches or tutorials on using version control.
                      Of course, its possible that the fault lies in me and it was my
                      inability to gain from the talks.

                      -aditya
                    • sanjay_ankur
                      I have end sems till 6th of December.. I wont be able to make it :-(((( I really wanted to make it.. Ankur, Manipal Institute of Tech, Manipal.
                      Message 10 of 29 , Aug 17, 2008
                        I have end sems till 6th of December.. I wont be able to make it :-(((( I really wanted to make it..

                        Ankur,
                        Manipal Institute of Tech,
                        Manipal.
                      • Gopal V
                        ... As a developer, to stand on a podium and talk to 40-odd people is a pain. Trust me, I ve fallen on the side of let s dig deep while making my slides. And
                        Message 11 of 29 , Aug 21, 2008
                          Aditya Godbole wrote:

                          > I was there alright. I felt that during the main conference and during
                          > the project days, the coverage of the topics was too superficial to be
                          > of substantial help to contribute. It might be a better idea to cover
                          > less topics but spend much more time on them, going beyond mere block
                          > diagrams, single line patches or tutorials on using version control.

                          As a developer, to stand on a podium and talk to 40-odd people is a
                          pain.

                          Trust me, I've fallen on the side of "let's dig deep" while making my
                          slides. And once your audience decides they are not involved enough to
                          catch up with you and you keep running along into the topic - not to
                          mention people being too egotistic to stop and ask a question about
                          what that last thing was.

                          http://t3.dotgnu.info/slides/pnet/mgp00013.html

                          Yeah, that's one of my slides from Lb 04. And this would be a slide
                          from a talk two years later

                          http://t3.dotgnu.info/slides/gimpfu/?#slide4

                          Trying to cater to the six people (who have some context) out of the 45
                          is the worst thing you could do as a speaker. And the hardest lesson
                          I've had to learn is that I've got to whittle down what I'm thinking
                          into what I'm saying. The conversational illusion that you will
                          understand what I've learned over a year, is what traps most people
                          into giving incomprehensible talks.

                          Talks are like documentation - the other end is not a machine (and
                          well, read my sig).

                          > Of course, its possible that the fault lies in me and it was my
                          > inability to gain from the talks.

                          This is not a classroom. This is not a place to preach the "how it's
                          done" for you to see or imitate.

                          The talk is something which establishes some context about the
                          project & the person talking[1]. To follow it up is the audience's
                          responsibility - "Thank you, thank you ... I'll be here all week".

                          Cheers,
                          Gopal
                          [1] - http://t3.dotgnu.info/blog/observations/rockstars-and-the-others
                          --
                          If I learn from my mistakes, pretty soon I'll know everything.
                        • Aditya Godbole
                          ... My only request to the speakers this year is - Show me the code . -aditya
                          Message 12 of 29 , Aug 23, 2008
                            On 8/21/08, Gopal V <gopalv82@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > This is not a classroom. This is not a place to preach the "how it's
                            > done" for you to see or imitate.
                            >
                            > The talk is something which establishes some context about the
                            > project & the person talking[1]. To follow it up is the audience's
                            > responsibility - "Thank you, thank you ... I'll be here all week".

                            My only request to the speakers this year is - "Show me the code".

                            -aditya
                          • Atul Chitnis
                            ... Hmmm, I think you may not have quite understood what FOSS.IN is about, and this may possibly not be the lind of event you are looking for. FOSS.IN is not
                            Message 13 of 29 , Aug 25, 2008
                              On Sat, 23 Aug 2008, Aditya Godbole wrote:

                              > My only request to the speakers this year is - "Show me the code".

                              Hmmm, I think you may not have quite understood what FOSS.IN is about, and
                              this may possibly not be the lind of event you are looking for.

                              FOSS.IN is not about people standing on stage giving you something.

                              FOSS.IN is about people standing on stage, in the corridors, on the lawns,
                              in the BOF tents, etc - telling you how to get involved in FOSS projec
                              contribution. They don't have to show you any code, since *their* code is
                              out there for you to see - no one gets to speak at FOSS.IN unless he is a
                              FOSS contributor.

                              FOSS.IN is about *you* showing the code.

                              Atul

                              --
                              Atul Chitnis
                              Bangalore, India
                              http://atulchitnis.net
                            • Balbir Singh
                              On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 10:48 AM, Atul Chitnis ... Atul, I am sure you mean he or she :) ... How about a do it now or newbies track? I spend a lot of time on
                              Message 14 of 29 , Aug 26, 2008
                                On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 10:48 AM, Atul Chitnis
                                <listadmin@...> wrote:
                                > On Sat, 23 Aug 2008, Aditya Godbole wrote:
                                >
                                >> My only request to the speakers this year is - "Show me the code".
                                >
                                > Hmmm, I think you may not have quite understood what FOSS.IN is about, and
                                > this may possibly not be the lind of event you are looking for.
                                >
                                > FOSS.IN is not about people standing on stage giving you something.
                                >
                                > FOSS.IN is about people standing on stage, in the corridors, on the lawns,
                                > in the BOF tents, etc - telling you how to get involved in FOSS projec
                                > contribution. They don't have to show you any code, since *their* code is
                                > out there for you to see - no one gets to speak at FOSS.IN unless he is a
                                > FOSS contributor.
                                >

                                Atul, I am sure you mean he or she :)

                                > FOSS.IN is about *you* showing the code.
                                >
                                > Atul

                                How about a "do it now or newbies" track? I spend a lot of time on
                                http://sourceforge.net/projects/libcg (or libcg.sf.net) apart from the
                                kernel work I try to do these days. My proposal is that I'll bring a
                                set of easy to fix problems (or I could post them here for people to
                                get an early start to FOSS contribution) and some enhancements. I'll
                                let the attendees solve the problem and help them with getting the
                                code included upstream (if they solve it well, I can put it up on the
                                test branch), the process of building the patch, testing it and
                                reviewing process, etc. How does that sound? I'll try and bring along
                                some longer term projects as well. How does that sound?

                                Balbir
                              • Aanjhan R
                                ... Thats exactly what the event is all about. Creating, inspiring new contributors and asking them to Show the code . This can be well achieved and mentored
                                Message 15 of 29 , Aug 26, 2008
                                  On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Balbir Singh <bsingharora@...> wrote:
                                  > How about a "do it now or newbies" track? I spend a lot of time on
                                  > http://sourceforge.net/projects/libcg (or libcg.sf.net) apart from the
                                  > kernel work I try to do these days. My proposal is that I'll bring a
                                  > set of easy to fix problems (or I could post them here for people to
                                  > get an early start to FOSS contribution) and some enhancements. I'll
                                  > let the attendees solve the problem and help them with getting the
                                  > code included upstream (if they solve it well, I can put it up on the
                                  > test branch), the process of building the patch, testing it and
                                  > reviewing process, etc. How does that sound? I'll try and bring along
                                  > some longer term projects as well. How does that sound?

                                  Thats exactly what the event is all about. Creating, inspiring new
                                  contributors and asking them to "Show the code". This can be well
                                  achieved and mentored only by existing contributors. As it always
                                  means, "Code" isnt just "code". I remember last time someone helping
                                  to make people do wonderful artwork and submit it to some free
                                  software project. I think it was for Fedora.

                                  And this need not be an approved "session" as such. It could well be a
                                  hack centre, BOF tent thingi.

                                  Regards,
                                  Aanjhan
                                • Runa Bhattacharjee
                                  ... That was Mo Duffy [1] and she did multiple talks about contributing to the art projects. cheers Runa [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MairinDuffy --
                                  Message 16 of 29 , Aug 26, 2008
                                    Aanjhan R wrote:
                                    > On Tue, Aug 26, 2008 at 2:15 PM, Balbir Singh <bsingharora@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    >> How about a "do it now or newbies" track? I spend a lot of time on
                                    >> http://sourceforge.net/projects/libcg (or libcg.sf.net) apart from the
                                    >> kernel work I try to do these days. My proposal is that I'll bring a
                                    >> set of easy to fix problems (or I could post them here for people to
                                    >> get an early start to FOSS contribution) and some enhancements. I'll
                                    >> let the attendees solve the problem and help them with getting the
                                    >> code included upstream (if they solve it well, I can put it up on the
                                    >> test branch), the process of building the patch, testing it and
                                    >> reviewing process, etc. How does that sound? I'll try and bring along
                                    >> some longer term projects as well. How does that sound?
                                    >>
                                    >
                                    > Thats exactly what the event is all about. Creating, inspiring new
                                    > contributors and asking them to "Show the code". This can be well
                                    > achieved and mentored only by existing contributors. As it always
                                    > means, "Code" isnt just "code". I remember last time someone helping
                                    > to make people do wonderful artwork and submit it to some free
                                    > software project. I think it was for Fedora.
                                    >


                                    That was Mo Duffy [1] and she did multiple talks about contributing to
                                    the art projects.

                                    cheers
                                    Runa

                                    [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/MairinDuffy


                                    --
                                    blog: http://runab.livejournal.com
                                    irc: mishti or runa_b on Freenode
                                  • Atul Chitnis
                                    ... Aaaaarrrghhhhh!!! Yes, I do. Sorry! :) ... Sounds good to me. Even better - instead of restricting that to a session, I ll give you a whiteboard to post
                                    Message 17 of 29 , Aug 27, 2008
                                      On Tue, 26 Aug 2008, Balbir Singh wrote:

                                      > Atul, I am sure you mean he or she :)

                                      Aaaaarrrghhhhh!!! Yes, I do. Sorry! :)

                                      > How about a "do it now or newbies" track? I spend a lot of time on
                                      > http://sourceforge.net/projects/libcg (or libcg.sf.net) apart from the
                                      > kernel work I try to do these days. My proposal is that I'll bring a
                                      > set of easy to fix problems (or I could post them here for people to
                                      > get an early start to FOSS contribution) and some enhancements. I'll
                                      > let the attendees solve the problem and help them with getting the
                                      > code included upstream (if they solve it well, I can put it up on the
                                      > test branch), the process of building the patch, testing it and
                                      > reviewing process, etc. How does that sound? I'll try and bring along
                                      > some longer term projects as well. How does that sound?

                                      Sounds good to me. Even better - instead of restricting that to a session,
                                      I'll give you a whiteboard to post the issues on, and you keep updating it
                                      during the event. Anyone, anywhere on the premises can dig his/her teeth
                                      in - if they need help, your coordinates on the premises will me marked
                                      with a bright red X on the map.

                                      Given that we have enough wifi to redefine the term "bheja fry", that
                                      shouldn't really be difficult to achieve, and it givs an ongoing,
                                      trackable, visible activity throughout the event.

                                      Atul

                                      --
                                      Atul Chitnis
                                      Bangalore, India
                                      http://atulchitnis.net
                                    • Kartik Mistry
                                      On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 2:19 PM, Atul Chitnis ... bugs.foss.in? Post a bug/issue/tasks to solve for you, anyone can track anytime! -- Cheers, Kartik Mistry |
                                      Message 18 of 29 , Aug 27, 2008
                                        On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 2:19 PM, Atul Chitnis
                                        <listadmin@...> wrote:
                                        > Given that we have enough wifi to redefine the term "bheja fry", that
                                        > shouldn't really be difficult to achieve, and it givs an ongoing,
                                        > trackable, visible activity throughout the event.

                                        bugs.foss.in?

                                        Post a bug/issue/tasks to solve for you, anyone can track anytime!

                                        --
                                        Cheers,
                                        Kartik Mistry | 0xD1028C8D | IRC: kart_
                                        Homepage: people.debian.org/~kartik
                                        Blogs: {ftbfs,kartikm}.wordpress.com
                                      • Balbir Singh
                                        On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 2:19 PM, Atul Chitnis ... Fantastic! You ll let me hide once in a while right :) I would also like to announce the names of everyone
                                        Message 19 of 29 , Aug 27, 2008
                                          On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 2:19 PM, Atul Chitnis
                                          <listadmin@...> wrote:

                                          > Sounds good to me. Even better - instead of restricting that to a session,
                                          > I'll give you a whiteboard to post the issues on, and you keep updating it
                                          > during the event. Anyone, anywhere on the premises can dig his/her teeth
                                          > in - if they need help, your coordinates on the premises will me marked
                                          > with a bright red X on the map.
                                          >
                                          > Given that we have enough wifi to redefine the term "bheja fry", that
                                          > shouldn't really be difficult to achieve, and it givs an ongoing,
                                          > trackable, visible activity throughout the event.

                                          Fantastic! You'll let me hide once in a while right :) I would also
                                          like to announce the names of everyone who contributed at the end of
                                          the session/day/event.

                                          Balbir
                                        • Dhaval Giani
                                          On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 2:19 PM, Atul Chitnis ... That sounds really good. To kickstart this, I will setup a page on the libcgroup wiki with a current list of
                                          Message 20 of 29 , Aug 27, 2008
                                            On Wed, Aug 27, 2008 at 2:19 PM, Atul Chitnis
                                            <listadmin@...> wrote:

                                            > Sounds good to me. Even better - instead of restricting that to a session,
                                            > I'll give you a whiteboard to post the issues on, and you keep updating it
                                            > during the event. Anyone, anywhere on the premises can dig his/her teeth
                                            > in - if they need help, your coordinates on the premises will me marked
                                            > with a bright red X on the map.
                                            >

                                            That sounds really good. To kickstart this, I will setup a page on the
                                            libcgroup wiki with a current list of open problems. This will be a
                                            running list, as and when problems get solved, we move them off the
                                            list, and as and when we get new problems, we will add them to the
                                            list. I will post the link soon (currently filling data on the page,
                                            should be at http://libcg.wiki.sourceforge.net/fossin sometime soon)

                                            UPDATE: While having lots of email issues, I have a basic wiki page
                                            up, it will keep getting edited though, as and when we get more
                                            problems (and I remember those I missed :-) )

                                            Thanks,

                                            Dhaval
                                            --

                                            Ogden Nash - "The trouble with a kitten is that when it grows up,
                                            it's always a cat."
                                          • right2bhavi
                                            I am attending as its going to be fun.. and I am one of the top contributors in the ubuntu community and a contributing developer too... cya there.. Ome more
                                            Message 21 of 29 , Sep 4, 2008
                                              I am attending as its going to be fun.. and I am one of the top
                                              contributors in the ubuntu community and a contributing developer
                                              too... cya there..

                                              Ome more thing: Motto would be better as "Show me the ChangeLog" since
                                              changelog consists all the info about the changes to the code.. :)

                                              -
                                              Bhavani Shankar.R <bhavi@...>
                                              https://edge.launchpad.net/~bhavi
                                              A proud Ubuntu Member and user.
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