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  • Stephan Schneider
    Hi! According to Kluge DE Gasse is of unknown origin. mhd. gazze, ahd. gazza. anord. gata and gt. gatwo street of a town, square ( Platz ) . Gatter (. Jh.),
    Message 1 of 6 , Mar 30 3:54 AM
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      Hi!

      According to Kluge DE "Gasse" is of unknown origin. mhd. gazze, ahd. gazza. anord. gata and gt. gatwo "street of a town, square ("Platz")".

      Gatter (. Jh.), mhd. gater, had. gataro, mndd. gaddere. Hierzu stimmt semantisch am genauesten ae. geat, gat "Tor, Gatter, Schranke" (-> Gat(t)). Weitere Herkunft unklar. -> ergattern, -> Gitter

      Gat(t) "Loch, Öse" per. ndd. (16. Jh.), as. gat., afr. jet, gat "Loch", ae. g(e)at "Tor, Tür, Öffnung", anord. gat "Loch". Niederdeutsch/niederländisch (dialektal) bedeutet das Wort auch "Arschloch" und in dieser Bedeutung könnte es angeschlossen werden an ig. *ghed- "scheißen" (ai. hadati, gr. chezo). Es ist aber wohl ausgeschlossen, daß aus einer solhen Bedeutung ein neutrales "Loch, Tür, Tor" wird, wie es für das Germanische vorauszusetzen ist. Deshalb handelt es sich wohl nu um eine zufällige Ähnlichkeit. Hierher Kattegat "Loch in der Tür für die Katze" als Name einer Meerenge (Skagerrak).
      -> Gatter, Speigatt

      Gitter
      Offenbar eine jüngere Abwandung zu -> Gatter und damit in seiner Herkunft unklar wie dieses.

      Bye,
      Stephan

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • thiudans
      Greetings! (my first post) There are two roots in PGmc., probably related. (I give the meanings of their reflexes as given by V. Orel) *gatwon (f)
      Message 2 of 6 , Apr 3, 2006
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        Greetings! (my first post)

        There are two roots in PGmc., probably related. (I give the meanings
        of their reflexes as given by V. Orel)

        *gatwon (f) "thoroughfare, street, passage, quarter"
        *gatan (n) "hole, gate, door, opening, eye of a needle" for *gatan
        (*gatam) Koebler has only "hole" (the other meanings may have arisen
        through confusion with *gatwon or coincidence).

        It is interesting to try to connect or relate these with either
        *gazdaz "sting, goad, spike" or *ga-ng-anan "to go, walk" (cf.
        *ganhtiz < *gangjanan; also EGmc. cf. *therh[w]e "through", *therko[n]
        "hole").


        --- In folkspraak@yahoogroups.com, "Stephan Schneider" <sts@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi!
        >
        > According to Kluge DE "Gasse" is of unknown origin. mhd. gazze, ahd.
        gazza. anord. gata and gt. gatwo "street of a town, square ("Platz")".
        >
        > Gatter (. Jh.), mhd. gater, had. gataro, mndd. gaddere. Hierzu
        stimmt semantisch am genauesten ae. geat, gat "Tor, Gatter, Schranke"
        (-> Gat(t)). Weitere Herkunft unklar. -> ergattern, -> Gitter
        >
        > Gat(t) "Loch, Öse" per. ndd. (16. Jh.), as. gat., afr. jet, gat
        "Loch", ae. g(e)at "Tor, Tür, Öffnung", anord. gat "Loch".
        Niederdeutsch/niederländisch (dialektal) bedeutet das Wort auch
        "Arschloch" und in dieser Bedeutung könnte es angeschlossen werden an
        ig. *ghed- "scheißen" (ai. hadati, gr. chezo). Es ist aber wohl
        ausgeschlossen, daß aus einer solhen Bedeutung ein neutrales "Loch,
        Tür, Tor" wird, wie es für das Germanische vorauszusetzen ist. Deshalb
        handelt es sich wohl nu um eine zufällige Ähnlichkeit. Hierher
        Kattegat "Loch in der Tür für die Katze" als Name einer Meerenge
        (Skagerrak).
        > -> Gatter, Speigatt
        >
        > Gitter
        > Offenbar eine jüngere Abwandung zu -> Gatter und damit in seiner
        Herkunft unklar wie dieses.
        >
        > Bye,
        > Stephan
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • tungol65
        ... meanings ... arisen ... [n] ... Thanks and welcome. Just curious, does your name have anything to do with the Gothic word for people? thiuda ? R
        Message 3 of 6 , Apr 3, 2006
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          --- In folkspraak@yahoogroups.com, "thiudans" <thiudans@...> wrote:
          >
          > Greetings! (my first post)
          >
          > There are two roots in PGmc., probably related. (I give the
          meanings
          > of their reflexes as given by V. Orel)
          >
          > *gatwon (f) "thoroughfare, street, passage, quarter"
          > *gatan (n) "hole, gate, door, opening, eye of a needle" for *gatan
          > (*gatam) Koebler has only "hole" (the other meanings may have
          arisen
          > through confusion with *gatwon or coincidence).
          >
          > It is interesting to try to connect or relate these with either
          > *gazdaz "sting, goad, spike" or *ga-ng-anan "to go, walk" (cf.
          > *ganhtiz < *gangjanan; also EGmc. cf. *therh[w]e "through", *therko
          [n]
          > "hole").

          Thanks and welcome. Just curious, does your name have anything to do
          with the Gothic word for people? "thiuda"?

          R
        • thiudans
          ... Sorry, that s just my username. thiudans is Gothic for king or national ruler, which would be different from PGmc. *kuningaz which if I understand
          Message 4 of 6 , Apr 3, 2006
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            --- In folkspraak@yahoogroups.com, "tungol65" <rdw.young@...> wrote:
            >
            > --- In folkspraak@yahoogroups.com, "thiudans" <thiudans@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Greetings! (my first post)
            > >
            > > There are two roots in PGmc., probably related. (I give the
            > meanings
            > > of their reflexes as given by V. Orel)
            > >
            > > *gatwon (f) "thoroughfare, street, passage, quarter"
            > > *gatan (n) "hole, gate, door, opening, eye of a needle" for *gatan
            > > (*gatam) Koebler has only "hole" (the other meanings may have
            > arisen
            > > through confusion with *gatwon or coincidence).
            > >
            > > It is interesting to try to connect or relate these with either
            > > *gazdaz "sting, goad, spike" or *ga-ng-anan "to go, walk" (cf.
            > > *ganhtiz < *gangjanan; also EGmc. cf. *therh[w]e "through", *therko
            > [n]
            > > "hole").
            >
            > Thanks and welcome. Just curious, does your name have anything to do
            > with the Gothic word for people? "thiuda"?
            >
            > R
            >

            Sorry, that's just my username. thiudans is Gothic for king or
            national ruler, which would be different from PGmc. *kuningaz which if
            I understand correctly emphasizes the personal noble descent (i.e.
            child of the "kin" or perhpas *kuni "tribe") rather than *theudo(n) +
            -an- (same suffix as in OE dryhten, orig. "warlord") which is the king
            in the capacity of a people's ruler. not self-aggrandizing I assure
            you. thiuda is related indeed, and means people or nation. It was more
            or less a random choice when I was choosing an ID.

            cheers,
            Matthew
          • tungol65
            ... if ... king ... more ... OK, thanks for that, the word thiudans did sound familiar. I have just found it in my Gothic wordlist. You seem knowledgable in
            Message 5 of 6 , Apr 3, 2006
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              > Sorry, that's just my username. thiudans is Gothic for king or
              > national ruler, which would be different from PGmc. *kuningaz which
              if
              > I understand correctly emphasizes the personal noble descent (i.e.
              > child of the "kin" or perhpas *kuni "tribe") rather than *theudo(n) +
              > -an- (same suffix as in OE dryhten, orig. "warlord") which is the
              king
              > in the capacity of a people's ruler. not self-aggrandizing I assure
              > you. thiuda is related indeed, and means people or nation. It was
              more
              > or less a random choice when I was choosing an ID.
              >
              > cheers,
              > Matthew

              OK, thanks for that, the word "thiudans" did sound familiar. I have
              just found it in my Gothic wordlist.
              You seem knowledgable in Gothic, Old English and Proto-Germanic. Are
              you interested in languages professionally or as a hobby? Either way
              your contributions are appreciated.

              R
            • thiudans
              thank you. I have hobby interests in Gmc. and moderate yahoogroups theudiskon and gothic-l. professions don t really allow for the language construction or
              Message 6 of 6 , Apr 3, 2006
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                thank you. I have hobby interests in Gmc. and moderate yahoogroups
                theudiskon and gothic-l. professions don't really allow for the
                language construction or reconstruction hobbies and such thesis
                proposals are at least frowned upon by academia as too speculative and
                useless, which I would not necessarily disagree with (for academic
                purposes). but the practicality of this project makes it an important
                exception.

                I hope I can contribute helpfully. I have Vladimir Orel's
                Proto-Germanic roots (which only gives those for which there are
                multiple Germanic languages showing reflexes), Streitberg, Falk Fick
                Torp, etc., and of course Koebler's stuff online.


                --- In folkspraak@yahoogroups.com, "tungol65" <rdw.young@...> wrote:
                >
                > > Sorry, that's just my username. thiudans is Gothic for king or
                > > national ruler, which would be different from PGmc. *kuningaz which
                > if
                > > I understand correctly emphasizes the personal noble descent (i.e.
                > > child of the "kin" or perhpas *kuni "tribe") rather than *theudo(n) +
                > > -an- (same suffix as in OE dryhten, orig. "warlord") which is the
                > king
                > > in the capacity of a people's ruler. not self-aggrandizing I assure
                > > you. thiuda is related indeed, and means people or nation. It was
                > more
                > > or less a random choice when I was choosing an ID.
                > >
                > > cheers,
                > > Matthew
                >
                > OK, thanks for that, the word "thiudans" did sound familiar. I have
                > just found it in my Gothic wordlist.
                > You seem knowledgable in Gothic, Old English and Proto-Germanic. Are
                > you interested in languages professionally or as a hobby? Either way
                > your contributions are appreciated.
                >
                > R
                >
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