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Re: [firebird-support]Index corruption

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  • Vlad Khorsun
    ... Even if 1.5.5 have no index related fixes (i don t remember) it have a few other important enough fixes. There is ZERO reasons to use any of 1.5.x version
    Message 1 of 28 , May 1 12:35 AM
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      > Hello Vlad
      >
      > Picking up this thread from a while ago I have just checked the release
      > notes for from 1.5.3 to 1.5.5 and cant see any reference to index related
      > fixes, I just wondered what you had in mind?

      Even if 1.5.5 have no index related fixes (i don't remember) it have a few
      other important enough fixes. There is ZERO reasons to use any of 1.5.x
      version when x != 5, imho.

      But key phrase was "consider upgrade to 2.1". You must understand that
      1.5. series is maintained only by critical security fixes.

      Regards,
      Vlad
    • Paul
      Thanks Vlad I agree about 1.5.5 I will do that anyway- I was just curious to know what was included, index wise. As I said before 2.1 presents problems that
      Message 2 of 28 , May 1 7:33 AM
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        Thanks Vlad
        I agree about 1.5.5 I will do that anyway- I was just curious to know what
        was included, index wise. As I said before 2.1 presents problems that we
        need to overcome with no visible benefit to our customers so conversion has
        background priority.
        Regards
        Paul


        > > Hello Vlad
        > >
        > > Picking up this thread from a while ago I have just checked the release
        > > notes for from 1.5.3 to 1.5.5 and cant see any reference to index
        > related
        > > fixes, I just wondered what you had in mind?
        >
        > Even if 1.5.5 have no index related fixes (i don't remember) it have a
        > few
        > other important enough fixes. There is ZERO reasons to use any of 1.5.x
        > version when x != 5, imho.
        >
        > But key phrase was "consider upgrade to 2.1". You must understand that
        > 1.5. series is maintained only by critical security fixes.
        >
        > Regards,
        > Vlad
        >
      • mnavahan
        ... Hi vlad i have relay same problem about index in FB finally decide migrate from firebird to postgresql or oracle(seems must) 1.if firebird must need grow
        Message 3 of 28 , May 23 9:03 PM
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          --- In firebird-support@yahoogroups.com, "Vlad Khorsun" <hvlad@...> wrote:
          >
          > > We have experienced out first database corruption from any of our customers
          > > in 15 years of Interbase and Firebird!
          > >
          > > I would like some clues as to what may have caused it.
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > FB 1.5.3, windows server 2003, superserver
          >
          > Read ReleaseNotes for 1.5.5 (and, better for 2.1.2) and seek how many
          > index related error was fixed. Then ask yourself - why i still use 1.5.3 ???
          >
          > Without run of gfix -v -f it is impossible to said even which kind of corruption
          > you encountered. Upgrade at least up to 1.5.5 ASAP and consider upgrade to
          > 2.1...
          >
          > Regards,
          > Vlad
          >

          Hi vlad

          i have relay same problem about index in FB
          finally decide migrate from firebird to postgresql or oracle(seems must)

          1.if firebird must need grow to enterprise space first solve some background problem such ans index errors

          2.if firebird don't support online change of dml then i think is not one *enterprise* RDBMS and is only one workgroup DB.....
          if some action (such as change dml) in online DB is wrong FB must do raise error and dont do it.... but you think about change table A without any relation to table B ...doing some fault in B !
          i dont understand why can not chnge table struct and add own field to table A when users only work with table B ?

          i do up dramatically with postgresql in other project and have not *any* problem .....

          accept reality sometimes HARD !
        • Vlad Khorsun
          ... You have absolutely another issue, as i can see from your (almost not understandable) e-mails. ... Good luck ... I don t understand what you mean ...
          Message 4 of 28 , May 24 12:40 AM
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            > Hi vlad
            >
            > i have relay same problem about index in FB

            You have absolutely another issue, as i can see from your (almost not understandable) e-mails.

            > finally decide migrate from firebird to postgresql or oracle(seems must)

            Good luck

            > 1.if firebird must need grow to enterprise space first solve some background problem such ans index errors
            > 2.if firebird don't support online change of dml then i think is not one *enterprise* RDBMS and is only one workgroup DB.....

            I don't understand what you mean

            > if some action (such as change dml) in online DB is wrong FB must do raise error and dont do it....

            Example ?

            > but you think about change table A without any relation to table B ...doing some fault in B !

            Example ??

            > i dont understand why can not chnge table struct and add own field to table A when users only work with table B ?

            Example ???

            > i do up dramatically with postgresql in other project and have not *any* problem .....
            >
            > accept reality sometimes HARD !

            Agree. And seems you have promlems with it, or i can't understand you completely.

            Good luck with PG\ORACLE\etc...
            Vlad
          • mnavahan
            ... Hi vlad the same as you i also i dont understand comment of you for ex. i can see from your e-mails : i think i dont send any email to you, but if it for
            Message 5 of 28 , May 24 1:19 AM
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              --- In firebird-support@yahoogroups.com, "Vlad Khorsun" <hvlad@...> wrote:
              >
              > > Hi vlad
              > >
              > > i have relay same problem about index in FB
              >
              > You have absolutely another issue, as i can see from your (almost not understandable) e-mails.

              Hi vlad


              the same as you i also i dont understand comment of you
              for ex. "i can see from your e-mails" : i think i dont send any email to you,

              but if it for is last topic of "index corruption" of me also
              show serious problem of index corruption without any hardware problem
              when force write is ON

              some time helen try comment me try reduce buffer but never help me ...
              (i also use buffer of 64kb then db very slowly but never solve problem)

              then i dont think really this is not "absolutely another issue"

              best regards
              maziar navahan
            • Vlad Khorsun
              ... I mean e-mails into this *mailing list* ... Are you sure it is really serious ? Do you have any query produced wrong results because of it ? I would like
              Message 6 of 28 , May 24 1:40 AM
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                >> > i have relay same problem about index in FB
                >>
                >> You have absolutely another issue, as i can see from your (almost not understandable) e-mails.
                >
                > Hi vlad
                >
                >
                > the same as you i also i dont understand comment of you
                > for ex. "i can see from your e-mails" : i think i dont send any email to you,

                I mean e-mails into this *mailing list*

                > but if it for is last topic of "index corruption" of me also
                > show serious problem of index corruption without any hardware problem
                > when force write is ON

                Are you sure it is really serious ? Do you have any query produced wrong results because
                of it ? I would like to know because so far i see *no* real impact on query from errors you
                saw in your firebird.log...

                > some time helen try comment me try reduce buffer but never help me ...
                > (i also use buffer of 64kb then db very slowly but never solve problem)
                >
                > then i dont think really this is not "absolutely another issue"

                It absolutely another. Paul used FB 1.5.x with ODS 10. Your errors is ODS 11 specific.

                Regards,
                Vlad
              • mnavahan
                ... YES , serious bevause *enterprise* data is *serious* ! YES, some time afer grow index error 3...5..14..24 .... then have some query dont get true result !
                Message 7 of 28 , May 24 2:15 AM
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                  > Are you sure it is really serious ? Do you have any query produced wrong results because
                  > of it ? I would like to know because so far i see *no* real impact on query from errors you
                  > saw in your firebird.log...
                  >
                  >
                  > It absolutely another. Paul used FB 1.5.x with ODS 10. Your errors is ODS 11 specific.
                  >


                  YES , serious bevause *enterprise* data is *serious* !
                  YES, some time afer grow index error 3...5..14..24 .... then have some query dont get true result ! is really !
                  yes the same paul for me show some error from fb 1.5 to 2 to 2.1 (and perhaps FB ver 50000000 !)

                  best regards
                  maziar navahan
                • Fidel Viegas
                  ... It may be a MUST for you, but don t generalise. ... You have to be more specific about your statement. What sort of index errors? ... Once again, what do
                  Message 8 of 28 , May 24 2:31 AM
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                    On Sun, May 24, 2009 at 5:03 AM, mnavahan <mnavahan@...> wrote:
                    >

                    > i have relay same problem about index in FB
                    > finally decide migrate from firebird to postgresql or oracle(seems must)
                    >

                    It may be a MUST for you, but don't generalise.

                    > 1.if firebird must need grow to enterprise space first solve some background
                    > problem such ans index errors
                    >

                    You have to be more specific about your statement. What sort of index errors?

                    > 2.if firebird don't support online change of dml then i think is not one
                    > *enterprise* RDBMS and is only one workgroup DB.....
                    > if some action (such as change dml) in online DB is wrong FB must do raise
                    > error and dont do it.... but you think about change table A without any
                    > relation to table B ...doing some fault in B !
                    > i dont understand why can not chnge table struct and add own field to table
                    > A when users only work with table B ?
                    >

                    Once again, what do you mean by this? Do you have pratical examples of
                    this? As far as I know, Firebird always raises errors whenever you try
                    to do something that is not possible. For instance, if your table is
                    being used by somebody else, then firebird will not let you do any DML
                    to it. But, I have never seen in case where making a change to one
                    table affects another. The first thing you should do is trace the
                    cause of the problem, and not blame the RDBMS for it. Something must
                    have happened, and that's what you should try to find out. Did you
                    find what the cause of the problem was? Or you just decided that it
                    was Firebird's fault?


                    > i do up dramatically with postgresql in other project and have not *any*
                    > problem .....
                    >

                    I haven't had any problems with Firebird either. I am aware that
                    Firebird may have some hidden bugs that may cause some data
                    corruption, but that can happen with any open-source software, not to
                    mention commercial ones. And if I do encounter a problem that corrupts
                    my database, the first thing I do is try to find a solution, and not
                    stop using Firebird just because this one problem has occurred.

                    All the best,

                    Fidel
                  • Vlad Khorsun
                    ... I don t understand this numbers ... And this query used problem index ? And without that index it produced another result ? ... You don t hear me and don t
                    Message 9 of 28 , May 24 2:49 AM
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                      >> Are you sure it is really serious ? Do you have any query produced wrong results because
                      >> of it ? I would like to know because so far i see *no* real impact on query from errors you
                      >> saw in your firebird.log...
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> It absolutely another. Paul used FB 1.5.x with ODS 10. Your errors is ODS 11 specific.
                      >>
                      >
                      >
                      > YES , serious bevause *enterprise* data is *serious* !
                      > YES, some time afer grow index error 3...5..14..24 ....

                      I don't understand this numbers

                      > then have some query dont get true result ! is really !

                      And this query used problem index ? And without that index it produced another result ?

                      > yes the same

                      You don't hear me and don't want to hear me. Your decision.

                      > paul for me show some error from fb 1.5 to 2 to 2.1 (and perhaps FB ver 50000000 !)

                      Well, go to another DBMS and be happy with it...

                      Bye,
                      Vlad

                      PS Some (strange) people when see such error trying to
                      a) isolate the issue for developers to allow to fix it
                      b) show as much info as possible

                      And another people migrate from DBMS to DBMS... endless...
                    • mnavahan
                      hi vlad ... a.never do a also if try start one project with PG continue trace this problem if problem from me then learn more and if from db trace it to end of
                      Message 10 of 28 , May 24 7:27 AM
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                        hi vlad

                        >>PS Some (strange) people when see such error trying to
                        >>a) isolate the issue for developers to allow to fix it
                        >>b) show as much info as possible

                        >>And another people migrate from DBMS to DBMS... endless...

                        a.never do a also if try start one project with PG continue trace this problem if problem from me then learn more and if from db trace it to end of life me !;-)

                        then no never bye always hello and always i try hard to solve it *always*(unless don't any answer me)!
                        b.comment me what to do to help resolve this : i full ready to it !

                        i also ready pay time & money & work in this line also !

                        wait for it
                        maziar navahan
                      • Vlad Khorsun
                        ... I understand nothing ... I understand almost nothing again :( ... Ideal would be to reproduce steps after which good index became corrupted. So far nobody
                        Message 11 of 28 , May 24 7:40 AM
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                          >>>PS Some (strange) people when see such error trying to
                          >>>a) isolate the issue for developers to allow to fix it
                          >>>b) show as much info as possible
                          >
                          >>>And another people migrate from DBMS to DBMS... endless...
                          >
                          > a.never do a also if try start one project with PG continue trace this problem if problem from me then learn more and if from db
                          > trace it to end of life me !;-)

                          I understand nothing

                          > then no never bye always hello and always i try hard to solve it *always*(unless don't any answer me)!

                          I understand almost nothing again :(

                          > b.comment me what to do to help resolve this : i full ready to it !

                          Ideal would be to reproduce steps after which good index became corrupted.
                          So far nobody was able to do it. If you also can't create such example, i would
                          like to take a look at corrupted database.

                          Regards,
                          Vlad
                        • tomkrej
                          ... Hi, may be You can start to learn English, it will help us to understand what You want, and help You to understand whet Vlad send to You. Then You may be
                          Message 12 of 28 , May 24 3:40 PM
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                            > a.never do a also if try start one project with PG continue trace this problem if problem from me then learn more and if from db trace it to end of life me !;-)
                            >
                            > then no never bye always hello and always i try hard to solve it *always*(unless don't any answer me)!
                            > b.comment me what to do to help resolve this : i full ready to it !
                            >
                            > i also ready pay time & money & work in this line also !
                            >
                            > wait for it
                            > maziar navahan
                            >
                            Hi, may be You can start to learn English, it will help us to understand what You want, and help You to understand whet Vlad send to You.
                            Then You may be send us some SQL code that raises an error on Firebird with tables A and B.
                            Then may be we can help You with Your problem.

                            Tom
                          • Anderson Farias
                            Hi, ... Then try to get support from some FB consultant at your place (or who at least speaks your primary language). It s quite impossible to understand
                            Message 13 of 28 , May 24 8:55 PM
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                              Hi,

                              > i also ready pay time & money & work in this line also !


                              Then try to get support from some FB "consultant" at your place (or who at
                              least speaks your primary language). It's quite impossible to understand
                              anything from you, sometimes becouse your english, sometimes because your
                              lack of any detail or ability to put things logicaly organized (most of
                              times because of both) -- you don't even respond to what people (who is
                              trying to help) ask you -- it seems you're not understanding anyone here as
                              well or have not the necessary skills to do it.

                              So. Go find some good FB guy at your country and I'm sure everything will be
                              ok.


                              Regards,
                              Anderson Farias
                            • mnavahan
                              ... Hi tom i think you usually speak English but for me always use *Persian* *writing* with one language with different strut some harder ! i think in *big
                              Message 14 of 28 , May 24 9:03 PM
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                                --- In firebird-support@yahoogroups.com, "tomkrej" <respektive@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > > a.never do a also if try start one project with PG continue trace this problem if problem from me then learn more and if from db trace it to end of life me !;-)
                                > >
                                > > then no never bye always hello and always i try hard to solve it *always*(unless don't any answer me)!
                                > > b.comment me what to do to help resolve this : i full ready to it !
                                > >
                                > > i also ready pay time & money & work in this line also !
                                > >
                                > > wait for it
                                > > maziar navahan
                                > >
                                > Hi, may be You can start to learn English, it will help us to understand what You want, and help You to understand whet Vlad send to You.
                                > Then You may be send us some SQL code that raises an error on Firebird with tables A and B.
                                > Then may be we can help You with Your problem.
                                >
                                > Tom
                                >

                                Hi tom

                                i think you usually speak English

                                but for me always use *Persian*
                                *writing* with one language with different strut some harder !
                                i think in *big world* this comment of me is not very hard to understand ! ;-)

                                regards
                                maziar navahan
                              • mnavahan
                                ... i think some hard to find good consultant in my language *Persian* have know about it ?
                                Message 15 of 28 , May 24 9:04 PM
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                                  --- In firebird-support@yahoogroups.com, "Anderson Farias" <peixedragao@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Hi,
                                  >
                                  > > i also ready pay time & money & work in this line also !
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Then try to get support from some FB "consultant" at your place (or who at
                                  > least speaks your primary language). It's quite impossible to understand
                                  > anything from you, sometimes becouse your english, sometimes because your
                                  > lack of any detail or ability to put things logicaly organized (most of
                                  > times because of both) -- you don't even respond to what people (who is
                                  > trying to help) ask you -- it seems you're not understanding anyone here as
                                  > well or have not the necessary skills to do it.
                                  >
                                  > So. Go find some good FB guy at your country and I'm sure everything will be
                                  > ok.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Regards,
                                  > Anderson Farias
                                  >

                                  i think some hard to find good consultant in my language *Persian*
                                  have know about it ?
                                • Anderson Farias
                                  Hi, ... Maybe, and maybe not. Have you look for at IT or Database forums in your country? ... Unfurtunatly I don t. Well, if you really can t get help from
                                  Message 16 of 28 , May 25 7:54 AM
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                                    Hi,

                                    > i think some hard to find good consultant in my language *Persian*

                                    Maybe, and maybe not. Have you look for at IT or Database forums in your
                                    country?


                                    > have know about it ?

                                    Unfurtunatly I don't.


                                    Well, if you really can't get help from someone at your country, then try to
                                    be more precise on describing your problems. Tell your actions, detailed
                                    error messages, your SQL code or DDL when asked. Try to be more
                                    communicative!!!

                                    =)

                                    Good luck,
                                    Anderson Farias
                                  • Maya Opperman
                                    Hi Vlad, My customer with the repeated index corruptions on FB 2.1.3 has finally upgraded to 2.1.4, but I m afraid they are still getting index corruptions
                                    Message 17 of 28 , May 5 4:02 AM
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                                      Hi Vlad,

                                      My customer with the repeated index corruptions on FB 2.1.3 has finally upgraded to 2.1.4, but I'm afraid they are still getting index corruptions after a day or two of working after a clean restore.

                                      They will upload a ZIP of the FDB database it to our FTP site tonight once everyone is logged out. The FDB file is 1.5 GB

                                      Regards
                                      Maya



                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Maya Opperman
                                      Hi Vlad, I have received a zipped copy of the 1.5 GB database that has corrupt indices almost daily and is using Fb 2.1.4 The FDB is 300 MB when zipped.
                                      Message 18 of 28 , May 6 6:57 AM
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                                        Hi Vlad,

                                        I have received a zipped copy of the 1.5 GB database that has corrupt indices almost daily and is using Fb 2.1.4

                                        The FDB is 300 MB when zipped.

                                        Running a validation, then checking Firebird.log shows the following errors:

                                        GANDALF (Server) Fri May 06 15:50:02 2011
                                        Database: C:\<snip>.FDB
                                        Index 3 is corrupt (missing entries) in table NL_TRANSACTIONS (147)


                                        GANDALF (Server) Fri May 06 15:50:02 2011
                                        Database: C:\ <snip>.FDB
                                        Index 4 is corrupt (missing entries) in table NL_TRANSACTIONS (147)


                                        GANDALF (Server) Fri May 06 15:50:02 2011
                                        Database: <snip>.FDB
                                        Index 6 is corrupt (missing entries) in table NL_TRANSACTIONS (147)

                                        Are there any more tests I can perform this side, or would you like me to make a copy of the database available to you?

                                        Thanks in advance
                                        Maya
                                      • hvlad
                                        Hi Maya, ... Contact me privately, please, i ll ask you some questions about database. Regards, Vlad
                                        Message 19 of 28 , May 6 9:31 AM
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                                          Hi Maya,
                                          >
                                          > I have received a zipped copy of the 1.5 GB database that has corrupt indices almost daily and is using Fb 2.1.4
                                          >
                                          > The FDB is 300 MB when zipped.
                                          >
                                          > Running a validation, then checking Firebird.log shows the following errors:
                                          >
                                          > GANDALF (Server) Fri May 06 15:50:02 2011
                                          > Database: C:\<snip>.FDB
                                          > Index 3 is corrupt (missing entries) in table NL_TRANSACTIONS (147)
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > GANDALF (Server) Fri May 06 15:50:02 2011
                                          > Database: C:\ <snip>.FDB
                                          > Index 4 is corrupt (missing entries) in table NL_TRANSACTIONS (147)
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > GANDALF (Server) Fri May 06 15:50:02 2011
                                          > Database: <snip>.FDB
                                          > Index 6 is corrupt (missing entries) in table NL_TRANSACTIONS (147)
                                          >
                                          > Are there any more tests I can perform this side, or would you like me to make a copy of the database available to you?

                                          Contact me privately, please, i'll ask you some questions about database.

                                          Regards,
                                          Vlad
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