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RE: [feline-heart] New to the group

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  • Jonathan Rosenberg
    ... I see two downsides to this approach: 1) Hyper-T can cause all kind of problems besides heart disease if left untreated. 2) There is a good chance that
    Message 1 of 20 , Oct 15 6:18 PM
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: Voula Augerinos [mailto:catwoman1@...]
      > Sent: Monday, October 16, 2000 12:09 PM
      > To: feline-heart@egroups.com
      > Subject: Re: [feline-heart] New to the group

      > I wonder if it's possible to treat the heart if there is
      > a problem by using heart drugs, if the treatment of the
      > thyroid with drugs might affect the kidneys? I know that is not
      > getting to the root cause though. What do others think?

      I see two downsides to this approach:
      1) Hyper-T can cause all kind of problems besides heart disease if left
      untreated.
      2) There is a good chance that treating the hyper-T will NOT reveal any
      kidney problems.

      > Yes it will be a fine balancing act. And I wonder whether
      > I would be best to seek a specialist referral for the heart
      > and thyroid?

      I most strongly recommend seeing a vet cardiologist.

      > I do want to continue using the herbs though if possible
      > in combination with any drugs that might be needed. So I
      > don't want to alienate the regular vet because he is trained
      > in TCM.

      Any good professional should be happy to have a specialist involved.

      > > . . .

      > That is a relief, but no-one can give a guarantee though.

      There is no guarantee for anything in life.

      > Love, Voula and Pebbles and my Beautiful Angel Sachie.

      --
      JR
      & Tabby (RB), Licorice, Tigger, Lynx
    • Jonathan Rosenberg
      BTW: regarding the ultrasound. As far as I know it is very rare for a cat to be sedated for an ultrasound. Our guy Lynx is incredibly wiggly during the
      Message 2 of 20 , Oct 15 6:25 PM
        BTW: regarding the ultrasound. As far as I know it is very rare for a cat
        to be sedated for an ultrasound. Our guy Lynx is incredibly wiggly during
        the ultrasound (as they tell me each & every time), but he has never been
        sedated. Of course, he does come back all covered with the gel they use :-)

        Ask the person who will be doing the ultrasound. I'd be very surprised if
        they suggest sedation (unless your cat is entirely unmanageable).

        --
        JR
        & Tabby (RB), Licorice, Tigger, Lynx
      • biggers_eric@yahoo.com
        Hi, my name is Eric and I currently have a very sick cat named Gatsby (5 year Tabby). I m wondering if any one else can give me some answers from their
        Message 3 of 20 , Jun 12, 2001
          Hi, my name is Eric and I currently have a very sick cat named Gatsby
          (5 year Tabby). I'm wondering if any one else can give me some
          answers from their experiences.
          She started having trouble breathing, so my wife took her to the vet
          and they found a large amount of fluid in her chest pushing on her
          lungs. They drained it (240 cc) and tested it to see if she had
          chylothorax (tear in the thoracic duct), but the tests determined
          that the fluid composition couldn't be from that condition.
          They've done blood tests, heartworm tests, an echocardigram, and many
          x-rays. They drain the fluid (another 140 cc) but it still keeps
          coming back around her lungs, so they put her on Lasix to absorb a
          lot of the fluid and a heart medication called Diltiazem (generic for
          cardizem). I'm very worried that this might keep dragging out,
          because even on these drugs the fluid still accumulated (even though
          it was a smaller amount). They drained 20 cc yesterday.
          I don't want to make her suffer anymore if she really cannot be
          treated, but it's very hard to just give up. This whole ordeal has
          been very expensive and I just don't know if she'll ever get better.
          If anyone has had the same experience or can offer any advice, I'd
          like to hear from you.
          Thanks, Eric
        • Jonathan Rosenberg
          I would suggest you see whether you can get a referral to an internal medicine specialist (or cardiologist) near you. You can start by looking here:
          Message 4 of 20 , Jun 12, 2001
            I would suggest you see whether you can get a referral to an internal
            medicine specialist (or cardiologist) near you. You can start by looking
            here:

            http://www.acvim.org/Kittleson/search.htm

            You're not likely to do better than an ACVIM specialist.

            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: biggers_eric@... [mailto:biggers_eric@...]
            > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2001 4:16 PM
            > To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [feline-heart] New to the group
            >
            >
            >
            > Hi, my name is Eric and I currently have a very sick cat named Gatsby
            > (5 year Tabby). I'm wondering if any one else can give me some
            > answers from their experiences.
            > She started having trouble breathing, so my wife took her to the vet
            > and they found a large amount of fluid in her chest pushing on her
            > lungs. They drained it (240 cc) and tested it to see if she had
            > chylothorax (tear in the thoracic duct), but the tests determined
            > that the fluid composition couldn't be from that condition.
            > They've done blood tests, heartworm tests, an echocardigram, and many
            > x-rays. They drain the fluid (another 140 cc) but it still keeps
            > coming back around her lungs, so they put her on Lasix to absorb a
            > lot of the fluid and a heart medication called Diltiazem (generic for
            > cardizem). I'm very worried that this might keep dragging out,
            > because even on these drugs the fluid still accumulated (even though
            > it was a smaller amount). They drained 20 cc yesterday.
            > I don't want to make her suffer anymore if she really cannot be
            > treated, but it's very hard to just give up. This whole ordeal has
            > been very expensive and I just don't know if she'll ever get better.
            > If anyone has had the same experience or can offer any advice, I'd
            > like to hear from you.
            > Thanks, Eric
            >
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > feline-heart-unsubscribe@onelist.com
            >
            >
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
          • sciani@aol.com
            Eric: We went through this with Whiskers (17yo) starting last Thanksgiving. His chest was tapped several times - a total of more than one liter. An internist
            Message 5 of 20 , Jun 13, 2001
              Eric:

              We went through this with Whiskers (17yo) starting last
              Thanksgiving. His chest was tapped several times - a total of more
              than one liter. An internist dx'd moderate cardiomyopathy. In
              January, a cardiologist finetuned the dx to Restrictive
              Cardiomyopathy and gave the cat 4-6 months. I think the last tap was
              in January.

              I was ready to give up just at the point Whiskers turned the corner.

              Whiskers is also anemic and suffers from IBD, so he gets quite the
              handful of pills.

              For the heart and chylothorax:
              Diltiazem
              Enalapril
              Furosemide
              Spironolactone
              Potassium Gluconate
              Taurine
              Rutin
              Co-Q10

              For the IBD:
              Prednisolone
              Salmon oil

              For the anemia:
              Iron
              Vitamin B-12
              Folic acid

              A blood test last week had a BUN of 40, but creatinine was normal.
              An x-ray showed a little fluid around the lungs, but not enough to
              tap. Vets are so pleased/surprised, they don't want to change
              anything he's getting.

              Whiskers seems happy to be around. He's not active, rather weak and
              sleeps a lot, but his appetite is very good and he still walks up and
              down stairs and hops onto the bed at night. I know we have him on
              borrowed time and have no expectation of his returning to his old
              self.

              Yes, it has been expensive and kinda crept up on us, so we don't go
              out to eat at fancy places and my wardrobe will make do. Guess I
              won't be quitting my job anytime soon. ;-)

              Each kitty's situation is a bit different. If you plan to continue
              further with Gatsby, the feline cardiologist is the way to go.

              Please keep us posted.

              Susan C




              --- In feline-heart@y..., biggers_eric@y... wrote:
              >
              > Hi, my name is Eric and I currently have a very sick cat named
              Gatsby
              > (5 year Tabby). I'm wondering if any one else can give me some
              > answers from their experiences.
              > She started having trouble breathing, so my wife took her to the
              vet
              > and they found a large amount of fluid in her chest pushing on her
              > lungs. They drained it (240 cc) and tested it to see if she had
              > chylothorax (tear in the thoracic duct), but the tests determined
              > that the fluid composition couldn't be from that condition.
              > They've done blood tests, heartworm tests, an echocardigram, and
              many
              > x-rays. They drain the fluid (another 140 cc) but it still keeps
              > coming back around her lungs, so they put her on Lasix to absorb a
              > lot of the fluid and a heart medication called Diltiazem (generic
              for
              > cardizem). I'm very worried that this might keep dragging out,
              > because even on these drugs the fluid still accumulated (even
              though
              > it was a smaller amount). They drained 20 cc yesterday.
              > I don't want to make her suffer anymore if she really cannot be
              > treated, but it's very hard to just give up. This whole ordeal has
              > been very expensive and I just don't know if she'll ever get better.
              > If anyone has had the same experience or can offer any advice, I'd
              > like to hear from you.
              > Thanks, Eric
            • pjscpa31a
              Bobby Knight is one of my recent rescue fur babies. My vet estimates he is around 2 years old. Since joining our family we noticed that Bobby has an
              Message 6 of 20 , Dec 28, 2004
                Bobby Knight is one of my recent rescue fur babies. My vet estimates
                he is around 2 years old. Since joining our "family" we noticed that
                Bobby has an occassional deep cough. Yesterday, the vet checked him
                to be sure there were no foreign objects in his throat by examination
                and x-ray. It was during the x-ray that he discovered that the
                otherwise healthy looking kitty has an enlarged heart. He also
                performed an ECG and prescribed that I give him 1/2 tab of lasix, two
                times a day and return for a repeat set of x-rays and ECG in 30 days,
                unless of course the cough worsens. He indicated that the enlarged
                heart can be the cause of the cough - he didn't find anything else...

                I know from my experience with the Yahoo VAS support group, that I
                can learn a world of info here from you. Can anyone provide me any
                information - should I seek another opinion? Is an x-ray and ECG
                enough to make a correct diagnosis. Should I seek a specialist for
                Bobby? Is there anything else I should be doing for him?

                I have dealt with feline leukemia and VAS, but this problem is a new
                one for me. I would appreciate all info you can send my way.

                Pam
                Spooky, Daphne, Katy, Cissy, Spike, Bobby Knight and angels Taffy,
                Boots and Magic
              • Susan
                Pam, It sounds like your regular vet a DVM has diagnosed Bobby. Most cats on this list are seen by a type of vet who has an additional advanced degree called
                Message 7 of 20 , Dec 29, 2004
                  Pam,

                  It sounds like your regular vet a DVM has diagnosed
                  Bobby. Most cats on this list are seen by a type of
                  vet who has an additional advanced degree called ACVIM
                  for the American College of Veterinary Internal
                  Medicine. You can look for ACVIM vets close to you by
                  going to:

                  http://acvim.org/wwwfp/Directory/Cardio_Geo.pdf
                  for cardiologists.

                  or:
                  http://acvim.org/wwwfp/Directory/SAIM_Geo.pdf
                  for small animal internal medicine (internists)

                  either of which would be qualified to treat Bobbie for
                  heart problems.

                  Part of the reason I bring this up is because lasix
                  monotherapy, ie. lasix prescribed without being paired
                  with an ACE-inhibitor such as enalapril is not
                  recommended (See Dr. Clarke Atkins articles in the
                  links section).

                  Susan



                  --- pjscpa31a <pjscpa31a@...> wrote:

                  >
                  >
                  > Bobby Knight is one of my recent rescue fur babies.
                  > My vet estimates
                  > he is around 2 years old. Since joining our
                  > "family" we noticed that
                  > Bobby has an occassional deep cough. Yesterday, the
                  > vet checked him
                  > to be sure there were no foreign objects in his
                  > throat by examination
                  > and x-ray. It was during the x-ray that he
                  > discovered that the
                  > otherwise healthy looking kitty has an enlarged
                  > heart. He also
                  > performed an ECG and prescribed that I give him 1/2
                  > tab of lasix, two
                  > times a day and return for a repeat set of x-rays
                  > and ECG in 30 days,
                  > unless of course the cough worsens. He indicated
                  > that the enlarged
                  > heart can be the cause of the cough - he didn't find
                  > anything else...
                  >
                  > I know from my experience with the Yahoo VAS support
                  > group, that I
                  > can learn a world of info here from you. Can anyone
                  > provide me any
                  > information - should I seek another opinion? Is an
                  > x-ray and ECG
                  > enough to make a correct diagnosis. Should I seek a
                  > specialist for
                  > Bobby? Is there anything else I should be doing for
                  > him?
                  >
                  > I have dealt with feline leukemia and VAS, but this
                  > problem is a new
                  > one for me. I would appreciate all info you can
                  > send my way.
                  >
                  > Pam
                  > Spooky, Daphne, Katy, Cissy, Spike, Bobby Knight and
                  > angels Taffy,
                  > Boots and Magic
                  >




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                • karen
                  Hi, I was directed to this group from another and am grateful such groups exist, I have found the info in the files very helpful. I was wondering if anyone
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 13, 2005
                    Hi,


                    I was directed to this group from another and am grateful such
                    groups exist, I have found the info in the files very helpful. I
                    was wondering if anyone here has had a cat with Dilated
                    cardiomyopathy, my little cat Anfield who is 10 years old has
                    been diagnosed on friday with this complaint. Three weeks ago
                    she had a chest xray and I was told she had an enlarged heart at
                    this time I was hoping it was the other cardiomyoathy and not
                    the dilated one, I believe this is the worst one to have and the
                    outlook is poor.



                    I have a few questions I was wondering if anyone could help me
                    with, The first is can this complaint be correctly diagnosed
                    from a chest xray or does it need an Ultra sound(I am asking my
                    vet could he refer me to a specialist tomorrow when I see him
                    again) and has anyone had a cat with this complaint that has
                    survived more than a few weeks.



                    I was devastaed when I asked my vet what the longterm prognosis
                    is and he told me on the downside 3-4 weeks and the up side
                    anything up to 12 months. I feel so useless and helpless for her
                    I have had anfield since day one, she means the world to me.
                    Sorry for all the questions.



                    Karen.



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Lisa Clarizia
                    Hi Karen, My kitty, Baby Boy, has severe dilated cardiomyopathy (DCM). He was diagnosed about 15 months ago, and with a combination of meds and supplements, is
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 13, 2005
                      Hi Karen,

                      My kitty, Baby Boy, has severe dilated cardiomyopathy (DCM). He was
                      diagnosed about 15 months ago, and with a combination of meds and
                      supplements, is doing pretty well.

                      DCM is often considered to have a poor outcome, but my little guy has a very
                      bad heart and has lived much longer and much *better* than anyone said he
                      would. I know of at least one other person who has had their DCM kitty
                      survive this long as well.

                      In answer to your question -- no, you really can't diagnose what kind of
                      cardiomyopathy a cat has by x-ray alone, you absolutely need an ultrasound
                      to determine this.

                      As for supplements, you need to start giving her taurine and coenzyme q10
                      right away. Taurine deficiency is one possible cause of DCM (though rare in
                      cats who eat commercially available food) and she should be getting it just
                      in case. The q10 is critical for DCM cats as well, I credit it with saving
                      Baby Boy's life and allowing him to feel as good as he does. I would also
                      add l-carnitine. You can get all these at GNC or the Vitamin Shoppe or a
                      drugstore -- I would give 60-100 mg of q10 per day and 125-250 mg of the
                      taurine and l-carnitine a day. You can add them to her food.

                      Is Anfield in congestive heart failure (CHF)? What meds is she getting? If
                      she is in CHF, then she should be getting a diuretic (lasix, sometimes
                      combined with another diuretic called spironolactone) and a med called an
                      ACE-inhibitor (enalapril, or another like it).

                      If at all possible you should get her to a specialist as soon as possible.
                      She needs an accurate and definitive diagnosis to receive the most
                      appropriate treatment. I hope this helps, welcome to this list though I am
                      sorry you had to join us, and I hope Anfield is feeling better soon!

                      Lisa


                      On 11/13/05, karen <Torchgirl@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > Hi,
                      >
                      >
                      > I was directed to this group from another and am grateful such
                      > groups exist, I have found the info in the files very helpful. I
                      > was wondering if anyone here has had a cat with Dilated
                      > cardiomyopathy, my little cat Anfield who is 10 years old has
                      > been diagnosed on friday with this complaint. Three weeks ago
                      > she had a chest xray and I was told she had an enlarged heart at
                      > this time I was hoping it was the other cardiomyoathy and not
                      > the dilated one, I believe this is the worst one to have and the
                      > outlook is poor.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I have a few questions I was wondering if anyone could help me
                      > with, The first is can this complaint be correctly diagnosed
                      > from a chest xray or does it need an Ultra sound(I am asking my
                      > vet could he refer me to a specialist tomorrow when I see him
                      > again) and has anyone had a cat with this complaint that has
                      > survived more than a few weeks.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I was devastaed when I asked my vet what the longterm prognosis
                      > is and he told me on the downside 3-4 weeks and the up side
                      > anything up to 12 months. I feel so useless and helpless for her
                      > I have had anfield since day one, she means the world to me.
                      > Sorry for all the questions.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Karen.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Your reply will go to the author of this message. If you feel your reply
                      > will benefit the entire group, please change the "To:" line to
                      > feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
                      >
                      >
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                      >
                      > ------------------------------
                      >



                      --
                      Lisa Clarizia
                      lclarizia@...


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • samanthag1977
                      Hello Everyone, My name is Marc and my cat Samantha was diagnosed with cardiomyopathy in February 2009. She is a black American Short hair about 12-14 years
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jul 21, 2009
                        Hello Everyone,

                        My name is Marc and my cat Samantha was diagnosed with cardiomyopathy in February 2009. She is a black American Short hair about 12-14 years old. The doctor gave her four months to live. She is still hanging in there as of today, (the 5th month) but I have to go out of town for a week next week for business and I'm feeling a lot of guilt about it and worried that something might happen to her while I'm gone. My neighbor is a big cat lover and takes care of her while I'm away. I lost my job in April and it has been kind of a blessing that I have been able to be home with her most of time to care for her. I just got a new job last week and will be traveling some.

                        I first noticed her heavy breathing which prompted me to take her to my vet back in Feb. He drained about 4 ounces of fluid from her chest cavity and referred me to a heart specialist who performed an electrocardiogram, x-ray, etc. and confirmed her condition. I've had her on Enalapril, Vetmedin and Lasix since then.

                        I'm having a very difficult time dealing with this, knowing at any moment she could suddenly die or worse become paralyzed and be in a lot of pain while I'm away. I have no children and she is my sole companion. It's really hard to deal with this alone.

                        Thanks for listening. I'll post a picture of Sam as soon as I figure it out.

                        Warm regards,

                        Marc
                      • Judi Levens
                        Hi Marc; I understand your concern, we ve all been through this, but the dianosis is not necessarily a death sentance. It s equally true that she may die or
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jul 22, 2009
                          Hi Marc; I understand your concern, we've all been through this, but the dianosis is not necessarily a death sentance. It's equally true that she may die or she may last fo several years with the meds. You might add some supplements including cQ10 and nattokinesse or natto zyme (brand name) to help her survival chances and there is something called Cardio Strength taht many people here swear by. Try to have your friend understand how to count Sam's breaths as that is probably the best indication of distress happening...if they become rapid have him take her to the emregency vet. Also, if you want to talk with a pet communicator...we have one we use before trips to be sure that Max understands that we are leaving but we will be back soon and he'll be OK...I can give you a name. Good luck with Samantha.

                          Judi and Max


                          To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
                          From: m.goldberg@...
                          Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2009 05:18:49 +0000
                          Subject: [FH] New to the group





                          Hello Everyone,

                          My name is Marc and my cat Samantha was diagnosed with cardiomyopathy in February 2009. She is a black American Short hair about 12-14 years old. The doctor gave her four months to live. She is still hanging in there as of today, (the 5th month) but I have to go out of town for a week next week for business and I'm feeling a lot of guilt about it and worried that something might happen to her while I'm gone. My neighbor is a big cat lover and takes care of her while I'm away. I lost my job in April and it has been kind of a blessing that I have been able to be home with her most of time to care for her. I just got a new job last week and will be traveling some.

                          I first noticed her heavy breathing which prompted me to take her to my vet back in Feb. He drained about 4 ounces of fluid from her chest cavity and referred me to a heart specialist who performed an electrocardiogram, x-ray, etc. and confirmed her condition. I've had her on Enalapril, Vetmedin and Lasix since then.

                          I'm having a very difficult time dealing with this, knowing at any moment she could suddenly die or worse become paralyzed and be in a lot of pain while I'm away. I have no children and she is my sole companion. It's really hard to deal with this alone.

                          Thanks for listening. I'll post a picture of Sam as soon as I figure it out.

                          Warm regards,

                          Marc










                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • elfinmyst@aol.com
                          Hi Marc I fully understand your caution. Every time I leave the house, it is at the back of my mind and I`d panic if I had to go on holiday. But in my
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jul 22, 2009
                            Hi Marc

                            I fully understand your caution. Every time I leave the house, it is at the
                            back of my mind and I`d panic if I had to go on holiday. But in my
                            experience, cats don't listen to their prognosis. Trixi was given 2 months at age
                            12 weeks and is nearly three in August!

                            Enjoy every day. Would your neighbour keep Sam in her house perhaps? I
                            could say don't worry, but I know I would, and that's a normal part of having
                            heart kitties! Remember she wants you to be happy and part of that is your
                            new job.
                            Sounds like she is on the right medication to support her.

                            Lyn:)

                            _www.myfurkids.co.uk_ (http://www.myfurkids.co.uk/)


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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