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Re: [FH] Bella thoughts

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  • Melody Woods
    This is very helpful...Glad Muffin still in there fighting as well.. I have a question .............just to rule it out as factor..how did they determine your
    Message 1 of 5 , Jun 19, 2002
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      This is very helpful...Glad Muffin still in there fighting as well..

      I have a question .............just to rule it out as factor..how did they
      determine your cat had stomach effusion
      Is that also an xray deal..i dont think that's Bella's problem
      still.........how did Muffin act when this happened..was it the grasping
      for air and wandering that Bella did with edema and lung effusion and then
      weakly sitting on floor....or something else..her stomach seems to be
      hurting a bit and tail is switching off and on and respiration a little up
      but not as much as before..and she does know me........did your cat eat..was
      any time of day worse for her.
      Can you give your cat aspirin..cat amount of aspirin every three days? can
      you give pepcid or any antiacid.....Bella and late afternoon don't go
      together..so back she is on oxygen now but it's cause house gets to warn
      even with air conditioning i think..

      You know this morning she wanted out of the terrace so i went out with her
      first time all year Suddenly realized it was Summer really realized not
      through a window like in a movie..it was so nice out there..and the view
      so lovely...must find the time to do some summer sitting...for cats need to
      fence off one small area first

      im so tired of having to learn new stuff fast all the time....but i guess
      the other alternative is an x kitty


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "sallymerlin" <sallymerlin@...>
      To: <feline-heart@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2002 5:18 PM
      Subject: [FH] Bella thoughts


      > Hi Melody!
      >
      > She's still hanging in there! Good for all of you! I know you feel
      > stressed, but it sounds like your efforts are being rewarded.
      >
      > Muffin has the straining/vomit pattern too sometimes and while I do
      > use the laculose occassionally, I found something that seems to work
      > better for us...good old Metamucil. Since Muffin gets homemade moist
      > meals, it's easy enough to add 1/4 teaspn of the powder to his
      > food....then I add warm water to make it a thick chowder consistancy.
      > I usually only do this for the morning meal, or if he seems a little
      > more constipated then I 'll do it in the evening as well.
      >
      > Also, have you tried supporting Bella's hindquarters while she's
      > "pushing"...it's tedious, but it has made a difference...not so much
      > upchucking anymore. We did try the spironolactone for awhile and it
      > really gave him constipation and a rumbly,gassy belly, NOT what he
      > needed...eventually we decided it was making things more complicated
      > for Muffin, so we went back to lasix.
      >
      > There are two additional things you might want to try for her...
      >
      > For general immune system strengthening; tincture of Astragalus, mixed
      > in water like you do already.
      >
      > And for crying after peeing, try a homeopathic remedy called
      > "Cantharis"....give it to her outside of her feeding schedule..a tiny
      > sugary pill popped into her mouth...just one and see if it helps...if
      > it does not try it again. If she won't tolerate it that way, you could
      > dissolve it in her water, but I know she's already getting a lot of
      > other stuff that way. If the cantharis works, you may not need to give
      > it again for awhile...wait till she cries again and then use it like
      > you did to get her to her comfort zone. Homeopathics either work well
      > for an individual or hardly not at all....they are not terribly
      > expensive, 3-5 a bottle, so it's worth a try.
      >
      > As for wobbling, Muffin does too...I was told it is just a normal part
      > of aging and since Miss Bella is even more "mature" than the Muff, it
      > does not surprise me that she wobbles. There is also apparently a
      > common degenerative ailment of the nerves as cats get into the
      > much older stage and the shuffling or slightly less "active" leg one
      > one side, or toe dragging can be a symptom....I've been told there's
      > nothing to be done except make the environment easier for kitty to
      > navigate.
      >
      > Keep up the good work....Bella sure is a lucky kitty!!
      >
      > Sally
      >
      >
      >
      > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > feline-heart-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      >
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
    • sallymerlin
      Hi Melody and Bella, (reply s inserted after your questions) ... did they determine your cat had stomach effusion (at first it showed up as an undetermined
      Message 2 of 5 , Jun 20, 2002
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        Hi Melody and Bella,

        (reply's inserted after your questions)



        > I have a question .............just to rule it out as factor..how
        did they determine your cat had stomach effusion

        (at first it showed up as an undetermined fluid seen on the
        ultrasound...my vets are still new to their equipment and Muffin is a
        very co-operative patient, so they did his heart/chest area AND all
        his abdominal area just to give him a check-up...we wanted to rule out
        any possible cancer, though he had no symptoms. There was a small
        pocket of fluid they could see, but couldn't tell what it was. Over
        the next few weeks he started to gain weight, which the vet thought
        was good, but I did not have a good feeling about it.
        Then his abdomen began to be visibly larger. We went back for
        another ultrasound to REALLY rule out cancer and we drew off some of
        the fluid and sent it off to see if it had any of the cells that would
        indicate cancer somewhere in the system. It came back negative. At the
        same time the Cardio consult results came back that Muffin's heart had
        deteriorated more. The cardio and my vet conferred about the fluid and
        we began to do the "taps".)

        how did Muffin act when this happened..was it the
        grasping for air and wandering that Bella did with edema and lung
        effusion and then weakly sitting on floor

        (No, Muffin's breathing never reached a "gasping" stage....but he did
        "sigh" a lot. And he was more lethargic and as his belly got bigger,
        it was clear that he was having difficulty carrying the weight well
        and finding a comfortable position for resting was also more
        difficult.
        With the abdominal effusion it's much different...the belly has no
        bones around it like the chest, so the fluid just builds up and the
        skin stretches, just like in pregnancy. In fact, most of his symptoms
        are just like the ones pregnant moms face; constipation, difficulty
        breathing because the diaphragm is pushed up, waddling etc, etc.)

        did your cat eat..was any time of day worse for her.

        (Muffin has always had a fairly good appetite, but he did stop eating
        his kibble entirely once this came on....not sure why but he just
        stopped. So it's now all homemade meals. Yes, definitly there are
        better and "worse" times of the day...and heat is a factor...just like
        with pregnant women...their is already too much "heat" so any outside
        makes it worse...but he has always been that way, so I don't worry too
        much.)

        > Can you give your cat aspirin..cat amount of aspirin every three
        days?

        (He was on asprin for 2 years but he developed tiny cysts in his
        bladder and always had trace amounts of blood in his urine...cutting
        back on the tapazole and eliminating the asprin have stopped the blood
        in urine. His particular clotting factors have always been on the low
        side of normal so I am crossing fingers this will be OK)

        > you give pepcid or any antiacid

        (My vet had me try something else...it's called "Alleragel" and is a
        potassium binder. A small amount of this liquid (1/2 ml) in some
        "treat" and his tummy discomfort seems to subside, but it does act to
        firm up stool so I have to be careful and not give too much.

        I just thought of another great stool softener...baked sweet
        potatoe...it works like magic. Try some for Bella...I use about 1
        rounded teaspoon mixed in with some meat...fish, pork,
        whatever...Muffin even likes it warm with a little butter and a drop
        of maple syrup (who doesn't!) But it works very well to get things
        "moving" )


        .so back she is on oxygen now but it's cause house gets to
        warm even with air conditioning i think..

        (I think it's normal for cats/animals to just lounge and take it easy
        when it's hot out...just look at nature, all the big cats sleep during
        the day)


        > You know this morning she wanted out of the terrace so i went out
        with her
        > first time all year Suddenly realized it was Summer really
        realized not
        > through a window like in a movie..it was so nice out there..and
        the view
        > so lovely...must find the time to do some summer sitting...for cats
        need to
        > fence off one small area first

        (I recommend this highly....fresh air and sunshine, great for elders
        of all sorts! I too had to fence off my deck...because of the wobbles.
        It takes time, but it is worth it to let them go out and you don't
        have to worry)
        >
        > im so tired of having to learn new stuff fast all the time....but i
        guess
        > the other alternative is an x kitty


        (Yes, I agree...the "no kitty" option is one I want to hold off for as
        long as possible...when it does come though the only blessing will be
        more time for OUR life once again! And more flexibility in the social
        schedule...still, I am happy to have it like this for a while longer
        yet..as long as Muffin WANTS to be here, I'll do what I can)
      • Pam Vojtas
        Hi Melody and Bella, Maggie s basketball belly story is similar to Muffins, probably aggravated by the fluid therapy 200 Ml every other day for CRF. At
        Message 3 of 5 , Jun 20, 2002
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          Hi Melody and Bella,

          Maggie's "basketball belly" story is similar to Muffins, probably aggravated
          by the fluid therapy 200 Ml every other day for CRF. At first, I thought it
          was weight gain (hooray), but soon became apparent things weren't right. It
          looked like she had swallowed a grapefruit! (I was clueless at the time,
          thought it may be a tumor or something). My regular vet just thought the
          kidneys were shutting down and all was over. Maggie completely stopped
          eating - I'm sure it was uncomfortable. After several folks on the CRF site
          suggested this may be heart related, Maggie saw an internist where there was
          also a cardiologist on staff. They did an echocardiogram (sp?) and an
          ultrasound, which revealed heart disease and the stomach effusion. They
          drained 400 CCs of fluid from her belly and sent the fluids off for
          analysis. They thought she may have to return to drain again, however Lasix
          is keeping it under control for the time being. She is now on appetite
          stimulants and Pepcid AC and eating again. We have had a spell of vomiting,
          but the last few days I've tried the Slippery Elm - so far, so good.

          Maggie's heart is "severly diseased", however she hasn't had any visible
          signs of difficulty breathing and does not have high blood pressure. (thank
          goodness for this). She is still a bit lethargic, but is obviously more
          comfortable since the belly has been drained.

          As for fresh air, we're big fans. Maggie has always loved the heat and being
          outdoors (we're in south Florida, so she's probably more used to heat than
          Bella or Muffin). I've been letting her out for an hour or so around 7 pm
          and she lays on the warm driveway looking a bit like road kill :). My social
          life is pretty much non-existant too, and my work schedule has been
          rearranged around med-time, but right now I'd rather be watching my little
          one roasting on the driveway :)

          Pam and Miss Maggie May


          -----Original Message-----
          From: sallymerlin [mailto:sallymerlin@...]
          Sent: Thursday, June 20, 2002 3:23 PM
          To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [FH] Bella thoughts


          Hi Melody and Bella,

          (reply's inserted after your questions)



          > I have a question .............just to rule it out as factor..how
          did they determine your cat had stomach effusion

          (at first it showed up as an undetermined fluid seen on the
          ultrasound...my vets are still new to their equipment and Muffin is a
          very co-operative patient, so they did his heart/chest area AND all
          his abdominal area just to give him a check-up...we wanted to rule out
          any possible cancer, though he had no symptoms. There was a small
          pocket of fluid they could see, but couldn't tell what it was. Over
          the next few weeks he started to gain weight, which the vet thought
          was good, but I did not have a good feeling about it.
          Then his abdomen began to be visibly larger. We went back for
          another ultrasound to REALLY rule out cancer and we drew off some of
          the fluid and sent it off to see if it had any of the cells that would
          indicate cancer somewhere in the system. It came back negative. At the
          same time the Cardio consult results came back that Muffin's heart had
          deteriorated more. The cardio and my vet conferred about the fluid and
          we began to do the "taps".)

          how did Muffin act when this happened..was it the
          grasping for air and wandering that Bella did with edema and lung
          effusion and then weakly sitting on floor

          (No, Muffin's breathing never reached a "gasping" stage....but he did
          "sigh" a lot. And he was more lethargic and as his belly got bigger,
          it was clear that he was having difficulty carrying the weight well
          and finding a comfortable position for resting was also more
          difficult.
          With the abdominal effusion it's much different...the belly has no
          bones around it like the chest, so the fluid just builds up and the
          skin stretches, just like in pregnancy. In fact, most of his symptoms
          are just like the ones pregnant moms face; constipation, difficulty
          breathing because the diaphragm is pushed up, waddling etc, etc.)

          did your cat eat..was any time of day worse for her.

          (Muffin has always had a fairly good appetite, but he did stop eating
          his kibble entirely once this came on....not sure why but he just
          stopped. So it's now all homemade meals. Yes, definitly there are
          better and "worse" times of the day...and heat is a factor...just like
          with pregnant women...their is already too much "heat" so any outside
          makes it worse...but he has always been that way, so I don't worry too
          much.)

          > Can you give your cat aspirin..cat amount of aspirin every three
          days?

          (He was on asprin for 2 years but he developed tiny cysts in his
          bladder and always had trace amounts of blood in his urine...cutting
          back on the tapazole and eliminating the asprin have stopped the blood
          in urine. His particular clotting factors have always been on the low
          side of normal so I am crossing fingers this will be OK)

          > you give pepcid or any antiacid

          (My vet had me try something else...it's called "Alleragel" and is a
          potassium binder. A small amount of this liquid (1/2 ml) in some
          "treat" and his tummy discomfort seems to subside, but it does act to
          firm up stool so I have to be careful and not give too much.

          I just thought of another great stool softener...baked sweet
          potatoe...it works like magic. Try some for Bella...I use about 1
          rounded teaspoon mixed in with some meat...fish, pork,
          whatever...Muffin even likes it warm with a little butter and a drop
          of maple syrup (who doesn't!) But it works very well to get things
          "moving" )


          .so back she is on oxygen now but it's cause house gets to
          warm even with air conditioning i think..

          (I think it's normal for cats/animals to just lounge and take it easy
          when it's hot out...just look at nature, all the big cats sleep during
          the day)


          > You know this morning she wanted out of the terrace so i went out
          with her
          > first time all year Suddenly realized it was Summer really
          realized not
          > through a window like in a movie..it was so nice out there..and
          the view
          > so lovely...must find the time to do some summer sitting...for cats
          need to
          > fence off one small area first

          (I recommend this highly....fresh air and sunshine, great for elders
          of all sorts! I too had to fence off my deck...because of the wobbles.
          It takes time, but it is worth it to let them go out and you don't
          have to worry)
          >
          > im so tired of having to learn new stuff fast all the time....but i
          guess
          > the other alternative is an x kitty


          (Yes, I agree...the "no kitty" option is one I want to hold off for as
          long as possible...when it does come though the only blessing will be
          more time for OUR life once again! And more flexibility in the social
          schedule...still, I am happy to have it like this for a while longer
          yet..as long as Muffin WANTS to be here, I'll do what I can)



          To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          feline-heart-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com



          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
          <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Mike & Linda Irrgang
          when administering antacids i ts improtant to remember that they will interfere with the absorption of the hcm meds....you need to consult your vet and/or
          Message 4 of 5 , Jun 21, 2002
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            when administering antacids i'ts improtant to remember that they will
            interfere with the absorption of the hcm meds....you need to consult your
            vet and/or pharmacist about how many hours apart you need to administer the
            hcm meds and the antacids....


            linda and the boys

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Melody Woods [mailto:newoods@...]
            Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2002 4:43 PM
            To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [FH] Bella thoughts


            This is very helpful...Glad Muffin still in there fighting as well..

            I have a question .............just to rule it out as factor..how did they
            determine your cat had stomach effusion
            Is that also an xray deal..i dont think that's Bella's problem
            still.........how did Muffin act when this happened..was it the grasping
            for air and wandering that Bella did with edema and lung effusion and then
            weakly sitting on floor....or something else..her stomach seems to be
            hurting a bit and tail is switching off and on and respiration a little up
            but not as much as before..and she does know me........did your cat eat..was
            any time of day worse for her.
            Can you give your cat aspirin..cat amount of aspirin every three days? can
            you give pepcid or any antiacid.....Bella and late afternoon don't go
            together..so back she is on oxygen now but it's cause house gets to warn
            even with air conditioning i think..

            You know this morning she wanted out of the terrace so i went out with her
            first time all year Suddenly realized it was Summer really realized not
            through a window like in a movie..it was so nice out there..and the view
            so lovely...must find the time to do some summer sitting...for cats need to
            fence off one small area first

            im so tired of having to learn new stuff fast all the time....but i guess
            the other alternative is an x kitty


            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "sallymerlin" <sallymerlin@...>
            To: <feline-heart@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2002 5:18 PM
            Subject: [FH] Bella thoughts


            > Hi Melody!
            >
            > She's still hanging in there! Good for all of you! I know you feel
            > stressed, but it sounds like your efforts are being rewarded.
            >
            > Muffin has the straining/vomit pattern too sometimes and while I do
            > use the laculose occassionally, I found something that seems to work
            > better for us...good old Metamucil. Since Muffin gets homemade moist
            > meals, it's easy enough to add 1/4 teaspn of the powder to his
            > food....then I add warm water to make it a thick chowder consistancy.
            > I usually only do this for the morning meal, or if he seems a little
            > more constipated then I 'll do it in the evening as well.
            >
            > Also, have you tried supporting Bella's hindquarters while she's
            > "pushing"...it's tedious, but it has made a difference...not so much
            > upchucking anymore. We did try the spironolactone for awhile and it
            > really gave him constipation and a rumbly,gassy belly, NOT what he
            > needed...eventually we decided it was making things more complicated
            > for Muffin, so we went back to lasix.
            >
            > There are two additional things you might want to try for her...
            >
            > For general immune system strengthening; tincture of Astragalus, mixed
            > in water like you do already.
            >
            > And for crying after peeing, try a homeopathic remedy called
            > "Cantharis"....give it to her outside of her feeding schedule..a tiny
            > sugary pill popped into her mouth...just one and see if it helps...if
            > it does not try it again. If she won't tolerate it that way, you could
            > dissolve it in her water, but I know she's already getting a lot of
            > other stuff that way. If the cantharis works, you may not need to give
            > it again for awhile...wait till she cries again and then use it like
            > you did to get her to her comfort zone. Homeopathics either work well
            > for an individual or hardly not at all....they are not terribly
            > expensive, 3-5 a bottle, so it's worth a try.
            >
            > As for wobbling, Muffin does too...I was told it is just a normal part
            > of aging and since Miss Bella is even more "mature" than the Muff, it
            > does not surprise me that she wobbles. There is also apparently a
            > common degenerative ailment of the nerves as cats get into the
            > much older stage and the shuffling or slightly less "active" leg one
            > one side, or toe dragging can be a symptom....I've been told there's
            > nothing to be done except make the environment easier for kitty to
            > navigate.
            >
            > Keep up the good work....Bella sure is a lucky kitty!!
            >
            > Sally
            >
            >
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > feline-heart-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            >
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >



            To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            feline-heart-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com



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          • Melody Woods
            Thanks for that heads up ..i only related that to carafate ... From: Mike & Linda Irrgang To: Sent: Friday,
            Message 5 of 5 , Jun 21, 2002
            • 0 Attachment
              Thanks for that heads up ..i only related that to carafate
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "Mike & Linda Irrgang" <irrgang@...>
              To: <feline-heart@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Friday, June 21, 2002 8:40 AM
              Subject: RE: [FH] Bella thoughts


              > when administering antacids i'ts improtant to remember that they will
              > interfere with the absorption of the hcm meds
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