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Re: [FH] Chloe Update

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  • Laurie Stead
    Hi Suzanne, I am in 100% agreement! Chloe s kidneys are fine and the concern needs to be the fluid. The last thing you want to do is give SubQ fluids which if
    Message 1 of 5 , Feb 2, 2013
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      Hi Suzanne,

      I am in 100% agreement! Chloe's kidneys are fine and the concern needs to be the fluid. The last thing you want to do is give SubQ fluids which if I remember correctly resulted in the last emergency. 

      Making her food more water like is perfect... having the fluid removed, increasing her meds, getting nutrients from her "milkshakes" and being home will all work toward her feeling better and wanting to eat/drink on her own.  Have water throughout the house if you don't already.  Cats tend to like to drink more water when it is not near their food dish. 

      You have a really good handle on things.  Vets are not always correct and I believe your gut is right on this so continue to listen to it :-)  Did you discuss spacing out the lasix to 3x a day?  It tends to stay in the system approx 8hrs so it may be a good thing to try.

      Wishing you, your mom and Chloe a very peaceful weekend!!

      Laurie and Boo




      ________________________________
      From: zan200 <zan200@...>
      To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Saturday, February 2, 2013 12:08 AM
      Subject: [FH] Chloe Update


       
      Hi All...

      First I want to thank EVERYONE for their wonderful notes of support - again, your kindness, caring, and valuable advice are major reasons why Chloe is still here with me.

      Chloe's vet called me early this afternoon - Chloe's kidney values are still OK (remarkable considering Chloe's present situation), but the fluid buildup is extremely serious. Vet is going to increase Chloe's spiro dose from 1/8 to 1/4 tab (6.25mgs) 2X per day, along with the 1 tab Lasix (12.5mgs), and the 1/2 tab enalapril (1.25mgs) also, 2X per day. I had asked about increasing the spiro, so I must have been on the right track...

      After the medication discussion, the conversation with the vet got "interesting". Since Chloe was still not eating (vet was hoping the buprenorphine injection yesterday would perk Chloe up enough to eat - it did not), she explained that Chloe would most likely need some Sub-Q fluids over the weekend to avoid becoming dangerously dehydrated. She didn't give Chloe any Sub-Q fluids yesterday because she was afraid of the possible life-threatening side effects of adding more fluid to Chloe's already fluid filled chest…but…she wants me to do it…Uh???

      I first asked about the side effects from the fluids – Dangerous increase in respiration rate. The fluid might not be absorbed into the skin, but fill up the chest.
      Should I immediately give extra Lasix? Yes.
      Is it possible the extra Lasix won't work? Yes.
      I assume this would be an emergency. Yes.
      I asked if it was possible to give a smaller amount of fluid. Yes. 25mls.
      I then asked how I can avoid having to give any fluids at all - Increased spiro may get rid of more of the fluid, making Chloe feel better, thus making her want to eat. If she eats, her need for fluids decreases.
      I then asked if it would help if I began assist-feeding Chloe. Yes. She did not elaborate on how much food Chloe needs or how best to administer it…
      Can I get in contact with her? – Office closes 5:00PM until Monday.
      Final thoughts from vet – Good Luck – Call in on Monday…

      I was flabbergasted – The vet is telling me she was afraid to give Chloe fluids, while at the same time telling me I'm probably going to have to do it…alone…on a weekend???

      Needless to say, I was not happy…First thing I did was run to my computer, get over to the Feline Assisted Feeding group, and get going. I got out my immersion blender and within the hour Chloe received her first Fancy Feast milkshake via syringe…I started with 10mls – Chloe was not happy, but actually wanted to nibble a bit on her own about an hour later…I don't want to overload her, but Chloe's had 3 "milkshakes" so far – I'm trying for every 3 hours up until bedtime…

      Thank goodness I've got my mother here to bounce ideas off of…when I told her about the fluid situation she rightly said to not even attempt it – if I think Chloe is in dire need of fluids over the weekend, call the Emergency Hospital, explain the situation, bring Chloe over and let them give the fluids and monitor her – makes much more sense than the vet's "go it on your own and hope for the best" scenario.

      I'm exhausted, but still determined to give Chloe every chance possible – she's accepting the syringe feedings – not happily, but doing OK…I should have started it much sooner…

      Here's hoping for a peaceful night,
      Suzanne and Chloe

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      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Westgold
      I always add hot water to every can of food I put down -- a half can full of water. They LOVE the warm soup it creates on the top, and slurp that right up.
      Message 2 of 5 , Feb 2, 2013
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        I always add hot water to every can of food I put down -- a half can full of water. They LOVE the warm soup it creates on the top, and slurp that right up. Then I add a little more after they suck it dry. This is truly the easiest way to get water into them.
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Lynda Doty
        To: zan200 ; feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2013 7:31 AM
        Subject: Re: [FH] Chloe Update



        Suzanne, you can add extra water to her food--you'd be surprised how quickly it adds up!
        1 ounce, or 6 tsp = 30 mL.
        1 can of wet food = 60 mL.
        I got Martha completely off subQ fluids by doing this. It might help you, especially during this critical time.

        ~~~~~~~~~~~~
        Blessings,Lynda, Martha, Morelli and Angel C.B.

        --- On Sat, 2/2/13, zan200 zan200@...> wrote:

        From: zan200 zan200@...>
        Subject: [FH] Chloe Update
        To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Saturday, February 2, 2013, 12:08 AM



        Hi All...

        First I want to thank EVERYONE for their wonderful notes of support - again, your kindness, caring, and valuable advice are major reasons why Chloe is still here with me.

        Chloe's vet called me early this afternoon - Chloe's kidney values are still OK (remarkable considering Chloe's present situation), but the fluid buildup is extremely serious. Vet is going to increase Chloe's spiro dose from 1/8 to 1/4 tab (6.25mgs) 2X per day, along with the 1 tab Lasix (12.5mgs), and the 1/2 tab enalapril (1.25mgs) also, 2X per day. I had asked about increasing the spiro, so I must have been on the right track...

        After the medication discussion, the conversation with the vet got "interesting". Since Chloe was still not eating (vet was hoping the buprenorphine injection yesterday would perk Chloe up enough to eat - it did not), she explained that Chloe would most likely need some Sub-Q fluids over the weekend to avoid becoming dangerously dehydrated. She didn't give Chloe any Sub-Q fluids yesterday because she was afraid of the possible life-threatening side effects of adding more fluid to Chloe's already fluid filled chest…but…she wants me to do it…Uh???

        I first asked about the side effects from the fluids – Dangerous increase in respiration rate. The fluid might not be absorbed into the skin, but fill up the chest.

        Should I immediately give extra Lasix? Yes.

        Is it possible the extra Lasix won't work? Yes.

        I assume this would be an emergency. Yes.

        I asked if it was possible to give a smaller amount of fluid. Yes. 25mls.

        I then asked how I can avoid having to give any fluids at all - Increased spiro may get rid of more of the fluid, making Chloe feel better, thus making her want to eat. If she eats, her need for fluids decreases.

        I then asked if it would help if I began assist-feeding Chloe. Yes. She did not elaborate on how much food Chloe needs or how best to administer it…

        Can I get in contact with her? – Office closes 5:00PM until Monday.

        Final thoughts from vet – Good Luck – Call in on Monday…

        I was flabbergasted – The vet is telling me she was afraid to give Chloe fluids, while at the same time telling me I'm probably going to have to do it…alone…on a weekend???

        Needless to say, I was not happy…First thing I did was run to my computer, get over to the Feline Assisted Feeding group, and get going. I got out my immersion blender and within the hour Chloe received her first Fancy Feast milkshake via syringe…I started with 10mls – Chloe was not happy, but actually wanted to nibble a bit on her own about an hour later…I don't want to overload her, but Chloe's had 3 "milkshakes" so far – I'm trying for every 3 hours up until bedtime…

        Thank goodness I've got my mother here to bounce ideas off of…when I told her about the fluid situation she rightly said to not even attempt it – if I think Chloe is in dire need of fluids over the weekend, call the Emergency Hospital, explain the situation, bring Chloe over and let them give the fluids and monitor her – makes much more sense than the vet's "go it on your own and hope for the best" scenario.

        I'm exhausted, but still determined to give Chloe every chance possible – she's accepting the syringe feedings – not happily, but doing OK…I should have started it much sooner…

        Here's hoping for a peaceful night,

        Suzanne and Chloe

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • marianna.mayer
        I don t doubt that you are exhausted. Having to think this hard against so much stress is very hard. You are on uncharted territory, and you know it! I know
        Message 3 of 5 , Feb 2, 2013
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          I don't doubt that you are exhausted. Having to think this hard against so much stress is very hard. You are on uncharted territory, and you know it! I know how that feels.

          You are doing everything I would do, and I have the benefit of hindsight...no comfort for me, but it may help Chloe.

          I think your decision to join Assisted-Feeding is brilliant. Assisted feeding will prevent dehydration...after all you are adding fluid to the mix to make it easy to syringe feed, right? The Assisted-Feeding group can give you an good gauge as to how much Chloe should be eating based on her optimum weight. Just ask them to help you arrive at how many ounces per meal and how frequently. Usually they suggest 5--6 times per day at the minimum...at least that what I recall. Better check.

          Also Chloe's lack of appetite may have to do with the spiro. I have not used this med, but some members have thought it does deter appetite. So will some of the heart meds Rx.

          Have you tried pepcid AC? 1/4 of a tab of a *10* mg tablet 2 X daily, about an 1 to 2 hrs away from meds and with food. If not, you may want to give pepcid AC a try for a day or two to see if it helps along with all the other great thing you are now doing. It is bitter tasting, so you will have to do a good job of disguising the taste.

          Thank goodness for your sensible mother! Having a loving, trusted someone to exchange thoughts with is invaluable during times like this..

          >Thank goodness I've got my mother here to bounce ideas off of…when I told her about the fluid >situation she rightly said to not even attempt it – if I think Chloe is in dire need of fluids over >the weekend, call the Emergency Hospital, explain the situation, bring Chloe over and let >them give the fluids and monitor her – makes much more sense than the vet's "go it on your >own and hope for the best" scenario.



          >I'm exhausted, but still determined to give Chloe every chance possible – she's accepting the >syringe feedings – not happily, but doing OK…I should have started it much sooner…

          >Here's hoping for a peaceful night,
          Suzanne and Chloe






          Marianna




          -----Original Message-----
          From: zan200 <zan200@...>
          To: feline-heart <feline-heart@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Sat, Feb 2, 2013 12:08 am
          Subject: [FH] Chloe Update





          Hi All...

          First I want to thank EVERYONE for their wonderful notes of support - again, your kindness, caring, and valuable advice are major reasons why Chloe is still here with me.

          Chloe's vet called me early this afternoon - Chloe's kidney values are still OK (remarkable considering Chloe's present situation), but the fluid buildup is extremely serious. Vet is going to increase Chloe's spiro dose from 1/8 to 1/4 tab (6.25mgs) 2X per day, along with the 1 tab Lasix (12.5mgs), and the 1/2 tab enalapril (1.25mgs) also, 2X per day. I had asked about increasing the spiro, so I must have been on the right track...

          After the medication discussion, the conversation with the vet got "interesting". Since Chloe was still not eating (vet was hoping the buprenorphine injection yesterday would perk Chloe up enough to eat - it did not), she explained that Chloe would most likely need some Sub-Q fluids over the weekend to avoid becoming dangerously dehydrated. She didn't give Chloe any Sub-Q fluids yesterday because she was afraid of the possible life-threatening side effects of adding more fluid to Chloe's already fluid filled chest…but…she wants me to do it…Uh???

          I first asked about the side effects from the fluids – Dangerous increase in respiration rate. The fluid might not be absorbed into the skin, but fill up the chest.
          Should I immediately give extra Lasix? Yes.
          Is it possible the extra Lasix won't work? Yes.
          I assume this would be an emergency. Yes.
          I asked if it was possible to give a smaller amount of fluid. Yes. 25mls.
          I then asked how I can avoid having to give any fluids at all - Increased spiro may get rid of more of the fluid, making Chloe feel better, thus making her want to eat. If she eats, her need for fluids decreases.
          I then asked if it would help if I began assist-feeding Chloe. Yes. She did not elaborate on how much food Chloe needs or how best to administer it…
          Can I get in contact with her? – Office closes 5:00PM until Monday.
          Final thoughts from vet – Good Luck – Call in on Monday…

          I was flabbergasted – The vet is telling me she was afraid to give Chloe fluids, while at the same time telling me I'm probably going to have to do it…alone…on a weekend???

          Needless to say, I was not happy…First thing I did was run to my computer, get over to the Feline Assisted Feeding group, and get going. I got out my immersion blender and within the hour Chloe received her first Fancy Feast milkshake via syringe…I started with 10mls – Chloe was not happy, but actually wanted to nibble a bit on her own about an hour later…I don't want to overload her, but Chloe's had 3 "milkshakes" so far – I'm trying for every 3 hours up until bedtime…

          Thank goodness I've got my mother here to bounce ideas off of…when I told her about the fluid situation she rightly said to not even attempt it – if I think Chloe is in dire need of fluids over the weekend, call the Emergency Hospital, explain the situation, bring Chloe over and let them give the fluids and monitor her – makes much more sense than the vet's "go it on your own and hope for the best" scenario.

          I'm exhausted, but still determined to give Chloe every chance possible – she's accepting the syringe feedings – not happily, but doing OK…I should have started it much sooner…

          Here's hoping for a peaceful night,
          Suzanne and Chloe









          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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