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Kitty in treatment and wondering where it goes from here

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  • jillym74
    Hi everyone- So glad this group exists. Here is Maya s story. Any words of advice, or just if this is similar to what your kitty is going through will help so
    Message 1 of 9 , Jul 2, 2012
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      Hi everyone-

      So glad this group exists. Here is Maya's story. Any words of advice, or just if this is similar to what your kitty is going through will help so much.

      2 months ago, we lost one of our cats to lymphoma. During the time she was sick our kitty Maya was getting sicker, but we were too focused on the other one at the time.

      About a year ago, Maya started coughing (hint #1 we missed). We didn't know if it was a sneeze, hairball, allergy, or what. It happened every time she hissed, which was at least a couple times a day. The vet didn't hear anything when she breathed and wanted to put her under to check for throat polyps. Since she has a heart murmur (missed hint #2), it was advised that this was not wise to do. So they didn't mention this could be heart related, or a serious issue, we let it go. Then our Orwell passed away and Maya's cough got worse. We took her in and an xray showed asthma. She started Bethine and Clavomax. Maya is a VERY picky eater and giving her a pill is nearly impossible. She was not taking the Clavomax and we tried many methods of pill giving. She took some of the brethine, but not all the time. Within a few days her cough got MUCH worse. At night she would heave all night long. The vet then added prednisolone. Since she has the murmur, this again was risky. Her cough stayed bad. Took her in and they did an xray, and her lungs were saturated with blood. The steroid was causing heart failure. We talked about this could be the end for her. They kept her there for 3 nights with O2, brethine, and Lasix. She got better and we took her home. Normally this cat is hyper and talkative. Not the case now. She was defiantly traumatized from this hospital stay. She had no coughing for a week, then her breathing got heavy and the cough came back. Took her in for an ultrasound and found out she has HCM, murmur, and asthma. By this time she is taking her pills after crushing in food. This is now last week. She was doing well and only was on the Lasix and Brethine before starting her heart med. By the end of last week, she was having a hard time breathing. Took her in Friday and an xray later, her heart has gotten larger. So she immediately stated the atenerol while on the brethine and lasix. She is doing well now this week but I am always worried she will get worse, yet another week later.

      Sorry for the long story, this has just been an ordeal we never anticipated so soon after our other kitty's passing.

      We asked if she should have her blood taken to check for her thyroid function and the vet said she may do that and also check for the med levels in her blood. If I didn't find this out online, I would never know to ask. Is this even necessary? Maya is such a nervous mess at the vet that they have not attempted to take blood from her b/c of the difficulty. All these vet visits are really stressing her out and only makes her condition worse I feel. Yet, she needs to go to keep her going it seems.

      Is your story similar? What did you do? Please share!

      Thanks-
      Sarah
    • Laurie Stead
      Hi Sarah, I am so sorry you are dealing with all this.  You have found a great group of very knowledgeable people.  This group really helped me in the
      Message 2 of 9 , Jul 2, 2012
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        Hi Sarah,

        I am so sorry you are dealing with all this.  You have found a great group of very knowledgeable people.  This group really helped me in the beginning when I was just trying to make sense of it all.

        My Boo was misdiagnosed as having asthma and was given a steroid which put her into CHF.  She too remained in ICU in oxygen for several days.  Thankfully she pulled through and it has been almost 8mos.  No one expected her to make it this long. We were very fortunate to find a wonderful cardiologist.  Has Maya been seen by a cardiologist?  Who did the actual ultrasound?  Vets just are not knowledgeable enough and you really need her to be seen by someone specializing in the heart.

        I am surprised the vet did not do blood work.  This is important to make sure her kidney values and all are good.  It is then used as a benchmark in comparing future blood work to see what changes are happening.  

        If you have not gone to a cardiologist yet I would do that, and get the blood work done then so its just one more visit.  Hopefully after that she will be stable enough where she won't have to go back for several months.  I understand about the visits causing stress... Boo hates it as well and its important to alleviate whatever stress we can from our heart kitties.

        Meanwhile, learn to take her RRR (resting respiratory rate) and make sure you monitor her breathing this way.  This is the best indication of future heart failure. 

        Best to you and Maya.  Keep us posted.

        Laurie and Boo




        --- On Mon, 7/2/12, jillym74 <jillym74@...> wrote:

        From: jillym74 <jillym74@...>
        Subject: [FH] Kitty in treatment and wondering where it goes from here
        To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Monday, July 2, 2012, 6:23 PM
















         









        Hi everyone-



        So glad this group exists. Here is Maya's story. Any words of advice, or just if this is similar to what your kitty is going through will help so much.



        2 months ago, we lost one of our cats to lymphoma. During the time she was sick our kitty Maya was getting sicker, but we were too focused on the other one at the time.



        About a year ago, Maya started coughing (hint #1 we missed). We didn't know if it was a sneeze, hairball, allergy, or what. It happened every time she hissed, which was at least a couple times a day. The vet didn't hear anything when she breathed and wanted to put her under to check for throat polyps. Since she has a heart murmur (missed hint #2), it was advised that this was not wise to do. So they didn't mention this could be heart related, or a serious issue, we let it go. Then our Orwell passed away and Maya's cough got worse. We took her in and an xray showed asthma. She started Bethine and Clavomax. Maya is a VERY picky eater and giving her a pill is nearly impossible. She was not taking the Clavomax and we tried many methods of pill giving. She took some of the brethine, but not all the time. Within a few days her cough got MUCH worse. At night she would heave all night long. The vet then added prednisolone. Since she has the
        murmur, this again was risky. Her cough stayed bad. Took her in and they did an xray, and her lungs were saturated with blood. The steroid was causing heart failure. We talked about this could be the end for her. They kept her there for 3 nights with O2, brethine, and Lasix. She got better and we took her home. Normally this cat is hyper and talkative. Not the case now. She was defiantly traumatized from this hospital stay. She had no coughing for a week, then her breathing got heavy and the cough came back. Took her in for an ultrasound and found out she has HCM, murmur, and asthma. By this time she is taking her pills after crushing in food. This is now last week. She was doing well and only was on the Lasix and Brethine before starting her heart med. By the end of last week, she was having a hard time breathing. Took her in Friday and an xray later, her heart has gotten larger. So she immediately stated the atenerol while on the
        brethine and lasix. She is doing well now this week but I am always worried she will get worse, yet another week later.



        Sorry for the long story, this has just been an ordeal we never anticipated so soon after our other kitty's passing.



        We asked if she should have her blood taken to check for her thyroid function and the vet said she may do that and also check for the med levels in her blood. If I didn't find this out online, I would never know to ask. Is this even necessary? Maya is such a nervous mess at the vet that they have not attempted to take blood from her b/c of the difficulty. All these vet visits are really stressing her out and only makes her condition worse I feel. Yet, she needs to go to keep her going it seems.



        Is your story similar? What did you do? Please share!



        Thanks-

        Sarah
























        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • elfinmyst@aol.com
        Hi Sarah As you well know, steroids can push a cat in to CHF and it sounds like this happened to Maya. The lasix is needed to get fluid off her lungs and she
        Message 3 of 9 , Jul 3, 2012
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          Hi Sarah

          As you well know, steroids can push a cat in to CHF and it sounds like this
          happened to Maya. The lasix is needed to get fluid off her lungs and she
          will need drugs to help her heart work more easily. It's difficult to
          balance heart disease and ashtma if she won't tolerate the breathed in medication.

          COenzyme Q seems to help a lot with cats with heart problems and its dose
          is 30mg a day. Stabilising the heart s vital now for her.

          Someone mentioned learning to count breaths which is an excellent thing for
          us all to do. Count whilst she is resting, not purring or dreaming or
          reacting to you.. it should be under 30 in a minute.m(Count 15 seconds and
          multiply by four) Learn what is normal for Maya and other red flags are 'sphinx
          like sitting up and unable to lie down comfortably and laboured breathing
          and open mouth breathing. All those suggest her lungs are filling up again.

          What dose meds is she on?

          Lyn

          _www.myfurkids.co.uk_ (http://www.myfurkids.co.uk/)

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • jillym74
          Thanks to the great feedback I have received regarding Maya and her situation, we are going to a specialty clinic to get a second opinion from a Cardiologist.
          Message 4 of 9 , Jul 5, 2012
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            Thanks to the great feedback I have received regarding Maya and her situation, we are going to a specialty clinic to get a second opinion from a Cardiologist. This will be Monday morning, which can't come soon enough.

            Starting Tuesday morning, she has refused medication in her food. She is still hungry pretty much, but now has caught onto our plan. Shoot! We have tried so many things with her and we will not force a pill down her throat. She is incredibly nervous and when we attempt any sort of mouth contact with her whether it's a syringe, piller, our hands, she is out of there and looks like a miserable wreck for hours afterwards. Plus then her heart and breathing start going. I called the vet this morning and asked if we can't try a liquid route and maybe just have her on 1 pill (atenolol).

            She is doing well so far without meds but since the insane fireworks that occurred in our neighborhood for hours last night, she is hiding under the bed and by the looks of it, her breathing is increasing again.

            Has anyone tried a liquid form of the drug? She is also on Brethine and Lasix. Any luck with a picky eater with the liquid? Any other options/ advice?

            Thanks so much!

            Sarah

            --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, "jillym74" <jillym74@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi everyone-
            >
            > So glad this group exists. Here is Maya's story. Any words of advice, or just if this is similar to what your kitty is going through will help so much.
            >
            > 2 months ago, we lost one of our cats to lymphoma. During the time she was sick our kitty Maya was getting sicker, but we were too focused on the other one at the time.
            >
            > About a year ago, Maya started coughing (hint #1 we missed). We didn't know if it was a sneeze, hairball, allergy, or what. It happened every time she hissed, which was at least a couple times a day. The vet didn't hear anything when she breathed and wanted to put her under to check for throat polyps. Since she has a heart murmur (missed hint #2), it was advised that this was not wise to do. So they didn't mention this could be heart related, or a serious issue, we let it go. Then our Orwell passed away and Maya's cough got worse. We took her in and an xray showed asthma. She started Bethine and Clavomax. Maya is a VERY picky eater and giving her a pill is nearly impossible. She was not taking the Clavomax and we tried many methods of pill giving. She took some of the brethine, but not all the time. Within a few days her cough got MUCH worse. At night she would heave all night long. The vet then added prednisolone. Since she has the murmur, this again was risky. Her cough stayed bad. Took her in and they did an xray, and her lungs were saturated with blood. The steroid was causing heart failure. We talked about this could be the end for her. They kept her there for 3 nights with O2, brethine, and Lasix. She got better and we took her home. Normally this cat is hyper and talkative. Not the case now. She was defiantly traumatized from this hospital stay. She had no coughing for a week, then her breathing got heavy and the cough came back. Took her in for an ultrasound and found out she has HCM, murmur, and asthma. By this time she is taking her pills after crushing in food. This is now last week. She was doing well and only was on the Lasix and Brethine before starting her heart med. By the end of last week, she was having a hard time breathing. Took her in Friday and an xray later, her heart has gotten larger. So she immediately stated the atenerol while on the brethine and lasix. She is doing well now this week but I am always worried she will get worse, yet another week later.
            >
            > Sorry for the long story, this has just been an ordeal we never anticipated so soon after our other kitty's passing.
            >
            > We asked if she should have her blood taken to check for her thyroid function and the vet said she may do that and also check for the med levels in her blood. If I didn't find this out online, I would never know to ask. Is this even necessary? Maya is such a nervous mess at the vet that they have not attempted to take blood from her b/c of the difficulty. All these vet visits are really stressing her out and only makes her condition worse I feel. Yet, she needs to go to keep her going it seems.
            >
            > Is your story similar? What did you do? Please share!
            >
            > Thanks-
            > Sarah
            >
          • Laurie Stead
            The lasix is imperative if her breathing rate is elevated.  This is a sign of crisis to come so you must get the lasix in her to protect her heart.  Have you
            Message 5 of 9 , Jul 5, 2012
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              The lasix is imperative if her breathing rate is elevated.  This is a sign of crisis to come so you must get the lasix in her to protect her heart.  Have you tried putting it in some other "people food" she may
              enjoy?  Just something to get her motivated enough to take it until you
              can find a better alternative.  It's a real small pill so just for now you may have to put it on the back of her tongue.  Take control, do it quickly and it will do wonders for her breathing.  Are you able to take her RRR while she is under the bed?  If it's elevated do not wait on the lasix.  RRR of 40+ is an emergency.

              For future, you can look into getting injectible lasix.

              Paws crossed!
              Laurie


              --- On Thu, 7/5/12, jillym74 <jillym74@...> wrote:

              From: jillym74 <jillym74@...>
              Subject: [FH] It's been 3 days since Maya has taken meds
              To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Thursday, July 5, 2012, 2:43 PM
















               









              Thanks to the great feedback I have received regarding Maya and her situation, we are going to a specialty clinic to get a second opinion from a Cardiologist. This will be Monday morning, which can't come soon enough.



              Starting Tuesday morning, she has refused medication in her food. She is still hungry pretty much, but now has caught onto our plan. Shoot! We have tried so many things with her and we will not force a pill down her throat. She is incredibly nervous and when we attempt any sort of mouth contact with her whether it's a syringe, piller, our hands, she is out of there and looks like a miserable wreck for hours afterwards. Plus then her heart and breathing start going. I called the vet this morning and asked if we can't try a liquid route and maybe just have her on 1 pill (atenolol).



              She is doing well so far without meds but since the insane fireworks that occurred in our neighborhood for hours last night, she is hiding under the bed and by the looks of it, her breathing is increasing again.



              Has anyone tried a liquid form of the drug? She is also on Brethine and Lasix. Any luck with a picky eater with the liquid? Any other options/ advice?



              Thanks so much!



              Sarah



              --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, "jillym74" <jillym74@...> wrote:

              >

              > Hi everyone-

              >

              > So glad this group exists. Here is Maya's story. Any words of advice, or just if this is similar to what your kitty is going through will help so much.

              >

              > 2 months ago, we lost one of our cats to lymphoma. During the time she was sick our kitty Maya was getting sicker, but we were too focused on the other one at the time.

              >

              > About a year ago, Maya started coughing (hint #1 we missed). We didn't know if it was a sneeze, hairball, allergy, or what. It happened every time she hissed, which was at least a couple times a day. The vet didn't hear anything when she breathed and wanted to put her under to check for throat polyps. Since she has a heart murmur (missed hint #2), it was advised that this was not wise to do. So they didn't mention this could be heart related, or a serious issue, we let it go. Then our Orwell passed away and Maya's cough got worse. We took her in and an xray showed asthma. She started Bethine and Clavomax. Maya is a VERY picky eater and giving her a pill is nearly impossible. She was not taking the Clavomax and we tried many methods of pill giving. She took some of the brethine, but not all the time. Within a few days her cough got MUCH worse. At night she would heave all night long. The vet then added prednisolone. Since she has the
              murmur, this again was risky. Her cough stayed bad. Took her in and they did an xray, and her lungs were saturated with blood. The steroid was causing heart failure. We talked about this could be the end for her. They kept her there for 3 nights with O2, brethine, and Lasix. She got better and we took her home. Normally this cat is hyper and talkative. Not the case now. She was defiantly traumatized from this hospital stay. She had no coughing for a week, then her breathing got heavy and the cough came back. Took her in for an ultrasound and found out she has HCM, murmur, and asthma. By this time she is taking her pills after crushing in food. This is now last week. She was doing well and only was on the Lasix and Brethine before starting her heart med. By the end of last week, she was having a hard time breathing. Took her in Friday and an xray later, her heart has gotten larger. So she immediately stated the atenerol while on the
              brethine and lasix. She is doing well now this week but I am always worried she will get worse, yet another week later.

              >

              > Sorry for the long story, this has just been an ordeal we never anticipated so soon after our other kitty's passing.

              >

              > We asked if she should have her blood taken to check for her thyroid function and the vet said she may do that and also check for the med levels in her blood. If I didn't find this out online, I would never know to ask. Is this even necessary? Maya is such a nervous mess at the vet that they have not attempted to take blood from her b/c of the difficulty. All these vet visits are really stressing her out and only makes her condition worse I feel. Yet, she needs to go to keep her going it seems.

              >

              > Is your story similar? What did you do? Please share!

              >

              > Thanks-

              > Sarah

              >



























              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • elfinmyst@aol.com
              Hi Maxi had liquid atenolol but its a human preparation and would taste syrup like. You can squirt it into her mouth or maybe mix it with tuna juice? If Maya
              Message 6 of 9 , Jul 5, 2012
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                Hi

                Maxi had liquid atenolol but its a human preparation and would taste syrup
                like. You can squirt it into her mouth or maybe mix it with tuna juice? If
                Maya won't take lasix, I`d really look into having it compounded into a
                liquid at the pharmacy. Or put the pill in a little fish oil crushed and put
                it on her paw where she would lick it off.

                Unfortunately, stopping atenolol suddenly can have severe effects. I was
                told they can't mmiss a dose and when Trixi wouldn't eat, I had to take her
                to the vets twice a day for meds until they showed me how to pill her. A
                fingerful of chicken paste with the pills in, pushed to the back of the mouth
                and down it goes. But Trixi isnt as nervous as Maya so I understand your
                difficulty.

                Lyn

                _www.myfurkids.co.uk_ (http://www.myfurkids.co.uk/)

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Westgold
                Hi -- my Tigger is on the liquid beef-flavored atenolol. This is quite innocuous, smells vauguely like beef bouillon -- I just measure and mix it into his
                Message 7 of 9 , Jul 5, 2012
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                  Hi -- my Tigger is on the liquid beef-flavored atenolol. This is quite innocuous, smells vauguely like beef bouillon -- I just measure and mix it into his canned food twice a day -- never had a problem.
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: elfinmyst@...
                  To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2012 3:18 PM
                  Subject: Re: [FH] It's been 3 days since Maya has taken meds



                  Hi

                  Maxi had liquid atenolol but its a human preparation and would taste syrup
                  like. You can squirt it into her mouth or maybe mix it with tuna juice? If
                  Maya won't take lasix, I`d really look into having it compounded into a
                  liquid at the pharmacy. Or put the pill in a little fish oil crushed and put
                  it on her paw where she would lick it off.

                  Unfortunately, stopping atenolol suddenly can have severe effects. I was
                  told they can't mmiss a dose and when Trixi wouldn't eat, I had to take her
                  to the vets twice a day for meds until they showed me how to pill her. A
                  fingerful of chicken paste with the pills in, pushed to the back of the mouth
                  and down it goes. But Trixi isnt as nervous as Maya so I understand your
                  difficulty.

                  Lyn

                  _www.myfurkids.co.uk_ (http://www.myfurkids.co.uk/)

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Missy Zane
                  I just learned this trick from a client. Crush the pill, put it in a tiny bit of hairball gel, and smear it on her foot. She ll lick it off. Hairball gel can
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jul 6, 2012
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                    I just learned this trick from a client. Crush the pill, put it in a
                    tiny bit of hairball gel, and smear it on her foot. She'll lick it off.
                    Hairball gel can interfere with the adsorption of food, and I wondered
                    if it would do the same thing with medicine, so when I was pet sitting
                    for him, I used gooey vitamin gel instead, and I smeared it on his mouth
                    so I'd be sure he got it. He's very resistant to medicine, even ear gel,
                    but he seemed fine with this.
                    Missy


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Lee Evans
                    I usually keep up with this group, even though I don t at this time have a cat with heart problems.  However, I learned a good way to pill a cat that doesn t
                    Message 9 of 9 , Jul 6, 2012
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                      I usually keep up with this group, even though I don't at this time have a cat with heart problems.  However, I learned a good way to pill a cat
                      that doesn't put stress on the cat or put me in danger of losing
                      fingers and I want to share it.  My friend and I were discussing metronidazole which most vets
                      here recommend for chronic diarrhea.  Unfortunately, my experience with
                      the ugly stuff is that when I syringe it into the cat, I have a cat
                      racing around with streams of mucus running from his mouth.  My friend
                      gives it to her two cats in vanilla ice cream and they slurp it up.  So
                      when Schubert, one of my rescues was diagnosed with seizure disorder,
                      the vet told me the cat would have to stay on very low dose
                      phenobarbital for the rest of his life.  At first, it worked out with me popping the pill down his throat.  But recently, he tried to bite my
                      finger off.  That was a no-no in my book.  When my friend told me about
                      the ice cream, I bought some.  I don't usually buy dairy products as I
                      am a vegan but hey, for a cat?  Of course.  First I tried him on plain
                      ice cream, no pill.  He lapped it up and all the rest of the cats in the room came running.  I realized that this was going to have to be an ice cream party for 20!  So I now prepare one large plate with small lumps of ice cream for all the other cats and one small plate with a crushed pill of pheno in a small lump of ice cream for Shubert.  No
                      more problems and I still have 10 fingers.  You might try this method
                      with Maya.

                       
                       
                      Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors too!

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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