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Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...

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  • Kathleen King
    Here are a couple of links I have found all talking about giving Nitroglycerin to cats in a CHF emergency:  
    Message 1 of 22 , May 2, 2012
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      Here are a couple of links I have found all talking about giving Nitroglycerin to cats in a CHF emergency:
       
      http://maxshouse.com/Cardiology/myocardial_diseases_of_the_cat.htm
      http://zimmer-foundation.org/sch/ajd.html
       
      There appears to be a lot of mention of it's use in cases of acute pulmonary edema, given with lasix when a cat is hospitalized.  There were a couple of PDF's about it too, but I could not always determine how recent articles were written.


      ________________________________
      From: Westgold <westgold@...>
      To: Kathleen King <katn3kits@...>; feline-heart <feline-heart@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 2:41 PM
      Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...


      
      Wow, this sounds like something we all could have on hand.  Especially for those whose cats have had fluid on the lungs previously.  I hope you have a chance to do a little research on this and its exact uses.  Has anyone else been given nitroglycerin for their cats?   
      ----- Original Message -----
      >From: Kathleen King
      >To: Westgold ; feline-heart
      >Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2012 1:51 PM
      >Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...
      >
      >
      >I don't have my instruction sheet any longer since Danny died, but I was actually given that before he had CHF.  I was to use it if he had a sudden change in cardiac symptoms.  I believe it was a way to buy time since I live in the mountains and it is 45 minute to an hour to the emergency vet.  Washington State University mentions it as a possible medication for pets with heart disease, but I have not researched it and I did not used it for Danny. 
      >It does dialate the blood vessels and in an emergency can help with both pulmonary edema and pulmonary effusion.


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    • acrocat@rocketmail.com
      Re: nitroprusside ... Some cardiologists don t use it anymore in animals because they think it does not absorb transdermally. If it does absorb transdermally,
      Message 2 of 22 , May 2, 2012
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        Re: nitroprusside

        --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, "Westgold" <westgold@...> wrote:
        > Wow, this sounds like something we all could have on hand. Especially for those whose cats have had fluid on the lungs previously. I hope you have a chance to do a little research on this and its exact uses. Has anyone else been given nitroglycerin for their cats?

        Some cardiologists don't use it anymore in animals because they think it does not absorb transdermally. If it does absorb transdermally, it can cause a frightening drop in blood pressure -- animals on IV nitroprusside have their BP monitored constantly because its effect on BP can be so strong.

        Personally, if my cat was in bad enough shape that I thought he needed nitro before we got to the ER, he'd be in bad enough shape that I'd be too nervous about his BP to try it. Cats and dogs in a CHF crisis can be hypotensive and this is life-threatening. I think getting to the ER is the important thing. If you live more than 30 min away, it's good to have a plan, but apart from those cases, just getting there as fast as you can while still being safe is the most important thing.
      • acrocat@rocketmail.com
        ... It was I who said that I d be surprised if butorphanol did anything. It is not like morphine -- it is a weak pain medication. Back in the olden days (5-10
        Message 3 of 22 , May 2, 2012
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          --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, Laurie Stead <kittykatwhiskas@...> wrote:
          > Interesting to read about using butorphenol....   You wrote: "It's for pain and relaxes them also (the Mexican vet said it
          > was like morphine.)"

          It was I who said that I'd be surprised if butorphanol did anything. It is not like morphine -- it is a weak pain medication. Back in the olden days (5-10 years ago), butorphanol was widely used as a pain medication. Some older-school vets still use it. It is not nearly as effective as other opioids, so everyone needs to make sure their dog or cat is getting more than butorphanol if they are having surgery or in pain for another reason.

          Among veterinary anesthesiologists, butorphanol is most used for its sedative effects when used in combination with other medications. Among other vet specialists, it is often used as a cough medication in dogs with chronic cough.

          If you are concerned, Laurie, can you just give the butorphanol one day at home and see? Do you have enough for two doses?
        • Main Moulu
          Message 4 of 22 , May 3, 2012
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            ------------------------------
            On Wed, May 2, 2012 8:51 PM AST (Arabian) Kathleen King wrote:

            >I don't have my instruction sheet any longer since Danny died, but I was actually given that before he had CHF.  I was to use it if he had a sudden change in cardiac symptoms.  I believe it was a way to buy time since I live in the mountains and it is 45 minute to an hour to the emergency vet.  Washington State University mentions it as a possible medication for pets with heart disease, but I have not researched it and I did not used it for Danny. 
            >It does dialate the blood vessels and in an emergency can help with both pulmonary edema and pulmonary effusion.



            >From: Westgold <westgold@...>
            >To: Kathleen King <katn3kits@...>; feline-heart <feline-heart@yahoogroups.com>
            >Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 12:16 AM
            >Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...
            >
            >

            >Hi -- I never heard of giving a kitty nitroglycerin -- under what circumstances did he say you would use it?
            >----- Original Message -----
            >From: Kathleen King
            >To: joeychloe ; feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
            >Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2012 11:59 PM
            >Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...
            >
            >With Danny, my vet helped me develop an emergency plan and gave me some emergency meds including nitroglycerin paste and injectable lasix. When he was on Enalapril I was also suppose to give an extra dose of that if there was ever an emergency or if he even started acting like he was having problems. I live even further from the vet and the emergency hospital so that was always a fear of mine.
            >
            >I didn't know you could get oxygen without a doctor's order.
            >
            >________________________________
            >From: joeychloe <joeychloe@...>
            >To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
            >Sent: Tuesday, May 1, 2012 9:46 PM
            >Subject: [FH] plan for an emergency...
            >
            >does anyone know the best plan for an emergency for a cat with hcm if they need to go to the emergency hospital and it is 15 minutes away? the only one i have come up with is to buy an oxygen mask and request medication from his cardiologist such as lasix (or something more effective for emergencies) to buy me some time to get to the hospital...all suggestions are so welcome :)
            >
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          • elfinmyst@aol.com
            Hi Melinda That s really good news and great for Jazzie. Give her a big hug for me and I think it s good she keeps on the atenolol. Cats caught early seem to
            Message 5 of 22 , May 3, 2012
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              Hi Melinda

              That's really good news and great for Jazzie. Give her a big hug for me and
              I think it's good she keeps on the atenolol. Cats caught early seem to do
              well on that.

              Lyn:)

              _www.myfurkids.co.uk_ (http://www.myfurkids.co.uk/)

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Judi Levens
              Hi: I wonder if maybe I have the name wrong...it s been over a year since Max passed and maybe I am forgetting, but I thought that was the name. What I had
              Message 6 of 22 , May 3, 2012
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                Hi: I wonder if maybe I have the name wrong...it's been over a year since Max passed and maybe I am forgetting, but I thought that was the name. What I had came in glass ampules with a needle to administer. The vet in Mexico said that he couldn't even perscribe that drug because it was like Morphine and he didn't have authority to use it. Can you think of something else which sounds similar and would come in that packaging? I had 3 ampules in a package. I know that it knocked Max out...hope I'm not leading you wrong...Judi and Angel Max and Tucker



                To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
                From: acrocat@...
                Date: Thu, 3 May 2012 05:38:19 +0000
                Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...






























                --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, Laurie Stead <kittykatwhiskas@...> wrote:

                > Interesting to read about using butorphenol.... You wrote: "It's for pain and relaxes them also (the Mexican vet said it

                > was like morphine.)"



                It was I who said that I'd be surprised if butorphanol did anything. It is not like morphine -- it is a weak pain medication. Back in the olden days (5-10 years ago), butorphanol was widely used as a pain medication. Some older-school vets still use it. It is not nearly as effective as other opioids, so everyone needs to make sure their dog or cat is getting more than butorphanol if they are having surgery or in pain for another reason.



                Among veterinary anesthesiologists, butorphanol is most used for its sedative effects when used in combination with other medications. Among other vet specialists, it is often used as a cough medication in dogs with chronic cough.



                If you are concerned, Laurie, can you just give the butorphanol one day at home and see? Do you have enough for two doses?


















                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Kathleen King
                As I said before - I beleive part of the reason I was given this is because I live so far away from the emergency vet.  The other things is, we knew Danny s
                Message 7 of 22 , May 3, 2012
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                  As I said before - I beleive part of the reason I was given this is because I live so far away from the emergency vet.  The other things is, we knew Danny's BP went up during emergencies. 
                   
                  I think it is really important to know your cat.  I considered the Nitro a life or death situation medication.  I did not use it because I was not in that situation. On the other hand, my brother-in-law found his cat collasped with very labored breathing and cyanotic gums and pads.  I think I would have used it if Danny had been like that.
                   

                  ________________________________
                  From: "acrocat@..." <acrocat@...>
                  To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Wednesday, May 2, 2012 11:30 PM
                  Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...


                   
                  Re: nitroprusside

                  --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, "Westgold" <westgold@...> wrote:
                  > Wow, this sounds like something we all could have on hand. Especially for those whose cats have had fluid on the lungs previously. I hope you have a chance to do a little research on this and its exact uses. Has anyone else been given nitroglycerin for their cats?

                  Some cardiologists don't use it anymore in animals because they think it does not absorb transdermally. If it does absorb transdermally, it can cause a frightening drop in blood pressure -- animals on IV nitroprusside have their BP monitored constantly because its effect on BP can be so strong.

                  Personally, if my cat was in bad enough shape that I thought he needed nitro before we got to the ER, he'd be in bad enough shape that I'd be too nervous about his BP to try it. Cats and dogs in a CHF crisis can be hypotensive and this is life-threatening. I think getting to the ER is the important thing. If you live more than 30 min away, it's good to have a plan, but apart from those cases, just getting there as fast as you can while still being safe is the most important thing.




                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Jim Sinclair
                  ... My Buttercup was like that. She would invariably pant, drool, and vomit when taken anywhere in the vehicle. Vets always thought she was acutely ill even
                  Message 8 of 22 , May 3, 2012
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                    On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 12:22 AM, Joanne Haeussinger <chmiss01@...> wrote:

                    > I even put Feliway in her carrier. Do any of you have cats that get super nervous when going to the vet, and if so, how do you stop them from having such a reaction?

                    My Buttercup was like that. She would invariably pant, drool, and
                    vomit when taken anywhere in the vehicle. Vets always thought she was
                    acutely ill even when I just took her for routine checkups and
                    vaccinations.

                    I eventually learned to spray Feliway on a pad and put it into her
                    carrier at least half an hour before I put the cat into the carrier
                    and took her into the vehicle. That 30-60 minutes seemed to make a
                    huge difference in the effectiveness of the Feliway, so she was
                    finally able to travel without panic and puking.

                    Jim Sinclair  jisincla@...
                    www.jimsinclair.org
                    http://moosepuppy.petfinder.com
                  • Westgold
                    Great advice. My vet also told me that I could give Tigger a double dose of the atenolol before any really stressful event. It is not a sedative, but helps
                    Message 9 of 22 , May 3, 2012
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                      Great advice. My vet also told me that I could give Tigger a double dose of the atenolol before any really stressful event. It is not a sedative, but helps with the heart rhythm. But I wouldn't do this unless my vet approved -- so check with yours ahead of time.
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: Jim Sinclair
                      To: Joanne Haeussinger
                      Cc: joeychloe ; feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2012 2:03 PM
                      Subject: Re: [FH] plan for an emergency...



                      On Wed, May 2, 2012 at 12:22 AM, Joanne Haeussinger <chmiss01@...> wrote:

                      > I even put Feliway in her carrier. Do any of you have cats that get super nervous when going to the vet, and if so, how do you stop them from having such a reaction?

                      My Buttercup was like that. She would invariably pant, drool, and
                      vomit when taken anywhere in the vehicle. Vets always thought she was
                      acutely ill even when I just took her for routine checkups and
                      vaccinations.

                      I eventually learned to spray Feliway on a pad and put it into her
                      carrier at least half an hour before I put the cat into the carrier
                      and took her into the vehicle. That 30-60 minutes seemed to make a
                      huge difference in the effectiveness of the Feliway, so she was
                      finally able to travel without panic and puking.

                      Jim Sinclair jisincla@...
                      www.jimsinclair.org
                      http://moosepuppy.petfinder.com




                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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