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Re: [FH] Please help me... in a panic

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  • Suzianne Painter-Thorne
    I GET that it what she is doing. And since Lora had written that she was in a panic over it, I m pretty sure she already knew the importance of being aware.
    Message 1 of 16 , Jan 3, 2011
      I GET that it what she is doing. And since Lora had written that she was in
      a panic over it, I'm pretty sure she already knew the importance of being
      aware.

      I'm not sure what you're really disagreeing with. I said my experience did
      not prove they were not a problem for her cat. And I also said she should
      speak to her vet. That every cat is different. That we are not vets. I
      didn't use all caps for it, but I said the same thing.

      If you're talking about this study:
      http://jarvm.com/articles/Vol2Iss3/TOBIASJARVMVol2No304.pdf, that report
      concludes that "CHF should be listed as a potential adverse effect of
      corticosteroid administration in cats." It doesn't say always, it says
      potential.

      And, the thing is, that study's sample started with only cats who had been
      diagnosed with CHF. It did not look at all the cats given steroids to
      determine the risk of CHF. Instead, it looked only at cats who had already
      developed CHF and considered how many had done so within a certain time of
      getting steroids. It excluded cats who'd been on steroids for months or
      years prior to CHF. And--most important--it did not look at the number of
      cats who are on steroids who did or did not go into CHF, which would be an
      entirely different study and would actually give more answers about the
      risks of steroids themselves.

      So yes, speak to your vet about it. But don't get into a panic and don't
      cause someone else to panic by telling them they're killing their cat by
      giving steroids.

      Sue & Boo

      On 1/3/11 9:40 AM, "Melissa Legan" <smittyhj82@...> wrote:

      > I think Judi was just trying to relay the importantance of being aware of the
      > effects. My Winston was adminstired ORAL steriods and DID go into CHF. I think
      > the severity of the heart disease also plays a role. Winston has end stage
      > heart disease....very severe HCM with mitral value displysia and conduction
      > distrubance pattern (AV ans sinus). So, i think that the steriods proved to be
      > too much, and caused the CHF. There is a WONDERFUL copy of the study performed
      > on the internet- just google it. EVEN cats without heart diease went into
      > idopathic heart failure after the ADMINISTRATION of steriods.
      >  
      > Please keep in mind, every cat is different. Steriods are in fact very
      > dangerous for heart kitties. Just because one cat didnt go into CHF after
      > steriods does not put to rest the fact that steriods in heart kitties have
      > been studied extensively (oral and injectable).
      >  
      > If you have questions about steriods and CHF ask your vet, I dont think any of
      > us should make judgment on the reaction that any of our kitties should have or
      > could have. We ARENT vets (to my knowledge). The best advice is- call your
      > vet, tell him you have concerns and leave it at that.
    • Melissa Legan
      OK, I think this is enough.   People are here to share their expereinces. Steriods are a very serious issue and I think Judi and I feel this way because we
      Message 2 of 16 , Jan 3, 2011
        OK, I think this is enough.
         
        People are here to share their expereinces. Steriods are a very serious issue and I think Judi and I feel this way because we almost lost our kitties because of it. Losing my Winston will be like losing a child.
         
        Sorry that we feel strongly about a very serious situation. No one wanted to panic anyone.
         
        Nothing in the realm of heart disease should be taken lightly, and Judi and I probably feel this way given what our kitties have been through. My Winston is one of the most complicated and serious cases ever seen by my cardio.
         
         
        Melissa

        --- On Mon, 1/3/11, Suzianne Painter-Thorne <npumie@...> wrote:


        From: Suzianne Painter-Thorne <npumie@...>
        Subject: Re: [FH] Please help me... in a panic
        To: "Melissa Legan" <smittyhj82@...>, "Judi Levens" <casaobelisco@...>, feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Monday, January 3, 2011, 10:18 AM


        I GET that it what she is doing. And since Lora had written that she was in
        a panic over it, I'm pretty sure she already knew the importance of being
        aware.

        I'm not sure what you're really disagreeing with. I  said my experience did
        not prove they were not a problem for her cat. And I also said she should
        speak to her vet. That every cat is different. That we are not vets. I
        didn't use all caps for it, but I said the same thing.

        If you're talking about this study:
        http://jarvm.com/articles/Vol2Iss3/TOBIASJARVMVol2No304.pdf, that report
        concludes that "CHF should be listed as a potential adverse effect of
        corticosteroid administration in cats." It doesn't say always, it says
        potential.

        And, the thing is, that study's sample started with only cats who had been
        diagnosed with CHF. It did not look at all the cats given steroids to
        determine the risk of CHF. Instead, it looked only at cats who had already
        developed CHF and considered how many had done so within a certain time of
        getting steroids. It excluded cats who'd been on steroids for months or
        years prior to CHF. And--most important--it did not look at the number of
        cats who are on steroids who did or did not go into CHF, which would be an
        entirely different study and would actually give more answers about the
        risks of steroids themselves.

        So yes, speak to your vet about it. But don't get into a panic and don't
        cause someone else to panic by telling them they're killing their cat by
        giving steroids.

        Sue & Boo

        On 1/3/11 9:40 AM, "Melissa Legan" <smittyhj82@...> wrote:

        > I think Judi was just trying to relay the importantance of being aware of the
        > effects. My Winston was adminstired ORAL steriods and DID go into CHF. I think
        > the severity of the heart disease also plays a role. Winston has end stage
        > heart disease....very severe HCM with mitral value displysia and conduction
        > distrubance pattern (AV ans sinus). So, i think that the steriods proved to be
        > too much, and caused the CHF. There is a WONDERFUL copy of the study performed
        > on the internet- just google it. EVEN cats without heart diease went into
        > idopathic heart failure after the ADMINISTRATION of steriods.
        >  
        > Please keep in mind, every cat is different. Steriods are in fact very
        > dangerous for heart kitties. Just because one cat didnt go into CHF after
        > steriods does not put to rest the fact that steriods in heart kitties have
        > been studied extensively (oral and injectable).
        >  
        > If you have questions about steriods and CHF ask your vet, I dont think any of
        > us should make judgment on the reaction that any of our kitties should have or
        > could have. We ARENT vets (to my knowledge). The best advice is- call your
        > vet, tell him you have concerns and leave it at that.







        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Suzianne Painter-Thorne
        Please don t suggest I m saying anyone should take anything to do with heart disease or their cats lightly. I have not done this or come close to suggesting
        Message 3 of 16 , Jan 3, 2011
          Please don't suggest I'm saying anyone should take anything to do with heart
          disease or their cats lightly. I have not done this or come close to
          suggesting it. I have not said heart disease is not a serious situation. I
          have shared my experience, which you acknowledge people are here to do. As a
          member of this list, I assume I am allowed to do so as well.

          And I feel strongly about this too. I have been advised by people on this
          list to ignore a health problem my cat was having--one that was putting her
          life at risk--because of their fear of steroids because of their experience
          with their cats.

          Everyone on this list feels strongly about their cats and my assumption is
          that for all of us the loss of our cat is the loss of a beloved child. I
          also assume everyone is trying to do the best she or he can for their cat.
          That goes for those I agree and disagree with.

          Sue & Boo


          On 1/3/11 10:42 AM, "Melissa Legan" <smittyhj82@...> wrote:

          > OK, I think this is enough.
          >  
          > People are here to share their expereinces. Steriods are a very serious issue
          > and I think Judi and I feel this way because we almost lost our kitties
          > because of it. Losing my Winston will be like losing a child.
          >  
          > Sorry that we feel strongly about a very serious situation. No one wanted to
          > panic anyone.
          >  
          > Nothing in the realm of heart disease should be taken lightly, and Judi and I
          > probably feel this way given what our kitties have been through. My Winston is
          > one of the most complicated and serious cases ever seen by my cardio.
        • Mmayer11
          Please everyone let s take Sue s words as the end of this subject. We are back going in circles. Let s try starting the New Year giving this topic a rest. Ir s
          Message 4 of 16 , Jan 3, 2011
            Please everyone let's take Sue's words as the end of this subject. We are back going in circles. Let's try starting the New Year giving this topic a rest. Ir's unhelpful to drag this on.


            Sue wrote:for all of us the loss of our cat is the loss of a beloved child. I
            also assume everyone is trying to do the best she or he can for their cat.
            That goes for those I agree and disagree with.





            Marianna








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          • Patti Thomas
            From Washington State University regarding HCM research in Sphynx. The following is from Dr.Kate Meurs: We have had a fabulous response to our request for
            Message 5 of 16 , Jan 3, 2011
              From Washington State University regarding HCM research in Sphynx.

              The following is from Dr.Kate Meurs:

              We have had a fabulous response to our request for samples and they have really
              been coming in! The company that makes the feline array is running behind
              schedule so we still have time to collect both affected and unaffected samples
              and would still really like them! We will start looking at some new genes next
              week so we can keep progressing while we wait for the array.

              Also , we really need some heart tissue samples (just a few) from affected and
              unaffected cats. If someone is unfortunate enough to be putting their HCM
              affected cat or older (at least 8 years of age) to sleep it would be extremely
              helpful if we could ask the veterinarian to save a small section of the heart
              for us? It does have to be specially preserved in a solution from us, but we
              could fedex the solution for next day arrival to your veterinarian. At this
              point we have ruled out many genes but have not found anything and being able to
              exam the tissue may be very helpful. We don't need very many so if even 3-4
              people can help us it may be enough!

              Thank you!
              Kate






              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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