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Stage D Congestive Heart Failure

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  • smittyhj82
    We started Winston on Carvedilol alittle over 4 weeks ago. He is still in congestive heart failure. How many of you have had kitties that are constanly
    Message 1 of 4 , Sep 30, 2010
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      We started Winston on Carvedilol alittle over 4 weeks ago. He is still in congestive heart failure. How many of you have had kitties that are constanly building fluid? What have your vets done? I give sub q lasix instead of oral, but now it is barely helping and fluid returns within 8 hours. We are not open mouth breathing. Just increased respiratory rate. I need advice. I am out of ideas :(

      Melissa and Winston
    • Barbie
      Hi Melissa, I have a cat that went into heart failure about 7 weeks ago to date. I as well have her on diuretics to clear water off and around lungs. Like you
      Message 2 of 4 , Sep 30, 2010
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        Hi Melissa,

        I have a cat that went into heart failure about 7 weeks ago to date.
        I as well have her on diuretics to clear water off and around lungs.
        Like you it seems to consistantly build up over short periods of time.
        I was hoping I could use a weaker diuretic that spared potassium
        which is the pill call spirolocatone but it wasn't efficient enough to
        remove the fluid.  So I had to put her back on the furosemide which
        she was having issues with but I had a decision to make, either I
        had to give it to her knowing she was having an allergic reaction
        or lose her completely.  Like my vet said, sometimes we have to
        endure an hour of discomfort for 23 or so hours of comfort.  That
        is what I chose.  I also started giving the furosemide with food which
        I had not been doing at first, not sure I wasn't....... hadn't even realized.
        But she seems to have an easier time and less reaction with her
        taking it with food. 

        I know that there are many ladies who have their pets on lasix
        or other diuretics on a daily basis because they are having the same
        issues as you/me. Some of them on a as need basis, but many do give
        everyday to keep fluid buildup away.  Many worry about Lasix because
        it is hard on the kidneys but I talked to a uroligist who my next
        door neighbor works for and he said as long as she is eating
        and replenishing her nutrients, losing so much potassium that it begins
        to be a problem is rare.  So it is important that cats on Lasix maintain
        a good intake of food and water.  I give mine spiro because it spares
        potassium but I give lasix too.  So I kinda feel that they are kinda working
        with each other or against each other in a good way. 

        Is your cat on any type of heart med as well as diuretic?  I have noticed
        my cat heavy breaths before her next Atenolol dose.  ATenolol slows
        the heart rate and allows the heart to complete its respirations.  When
        the respirations are not controlled the heart cannot pump completely
        which is when fluid builds up in the lungs or at least that is what my Internist
        explained to me. 

        How much Lasix are you giving.  It may not be enough to clear it up.
        When my cat was first diagnosed I was on a full pill for a good 9 days
        I think it was, then it was cut down to half a pill giving 1/4 of it twice
        daily.  That seems to be the dose that is maintaining her right now.  Although
        like any terminally ill patients HCM cats will have good days and bad days.
        There were 3 days I had to give an additional dose of lasix and extra 1/4 pill
        and that helped a lot.  I don't think it is okay to self medicate but I was told
        to give the additional if I thought she needed.  

        Do you hear the fluid, crackle, pop sounds is that why you think it is coming
        back so soon?
         
        Barbie
         
        "Whoever wants to know something about me,
        must observe my paintings carefully and try to
        see in them what I am".
         
        Gustav Klimt
         
         
         
         




        ________________________________
        From: smittyhj82 <smittyhj82@...>
        To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Thu, September 30, 2010 2:02:24 PM
        Subject: [FH] Stage D Congestive Heart Failure

         
        We started Winston on Carvedilol alittle over 4 weeks ago. He is still in
        congestive heart failure. How many of you have had kitties that are constanly
        building fluid? What have your vets done? I give sub q lasix instead of oral,
        but now it is barely helping and fluid returns within 8 hours. We are not open
        mouth breathing. Just increased respiratory rate. I need advice. I am out of
        ideas :(

        Melissa and Winston







        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Melissa Legan
        Winston is a far advanced case. He already receives 12.5 mg s lasix twice a day as well as 12.5 mg s HCTZ twice daily. He also gets Diltiazem, Enalapril,
        Message 3 of 4 , Sep 30, 2010
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          Winston is a far advanced case. He already receives 12.5 mg's lasix twice a day as well as 12.5 mg's HCTZ twice daily. He also gets Diltiazem, Enalapril, Carvedilol, Asprin and Potassium Gluconate.
          We are on the highest diuretic dose possible already0 thus Stage D CHF.
           
           
          JUST AN FYI- Atenolol use is high contridicted in cats that are already in active Congestive Heart Failure. That is why I cannot give Atenolol- we are in active CHF. Atenolol can also cause Asthma like or allergy like syptoms.

          --- On Thu, 9/30/10, Barbie <barbie_guitard@...> wrote:


          From: Barbie <barbie_guitard@...>
          Subject: Re: [FH] Stage D Congestive Heart Failure
          To: smittyhj82@..., feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Thursday, September 30, 2010, 3:27 PM


           



          Hi Melissa,

          I have a cat that went into heart failure about 7 weeks ago to date.
          I as well have her on diuretics to clear water off and around lungs.
          Like you it seems to consistantly build up over short periods of time.
          I was hoping I could use a weaker diuretic that spared potassium
          which is the pill call spirolocatone but it wasn't efficient enough to
          remove the fluid.  So I had to put her back on the furosemide which
          she was having issues with but I had a decision to make, either I
          had to give it to her knowing she was having an allergic reaction
          or lose her completely.  Like my vet said, sometimes we have to
          endure an hour of discomfort for 23 or so hours of comfort.  That
          is what I chose.  I also started giving the furosemide with food which
          I had not been doing at first, not sure I wasn't....... hadn't even realized.
          But she seems to have an easier time and less reaction with her
          taking it with food. 

          I know that there are many ladies who have their pets on lasix
          or other diuretics on a daily basis because they are having the same
          issues as you/me. Some of them on a as need basis, but many do give
          everyday to keep fluid buildup away.  Many worry about Lasix because
          it is hard on the kidneys but I talked to a uroligist who my next
          door neighbor works for and he said as long as she is eating
          and replenishing her nutrients, losing so much potassium that it begins
          to be a problem is rare.  So it is important that cats on Lasix maintain
          a good intake of food and water.  I give mine spiro because it spares
          potassium but I give lasix too.  So I kinda feel that they are kinda working
          with each other or against each other in a good way. 

          Is your cat on any type of heart med as well as diuretic?  I have noticed
          my cat heavy breaths before her next Atenolol dose.  ATenolol slows
          the heart rate and allows the heart to complete its respirations.  When
          the respirations are not controlled the heart cannot pump completely
          which is when fluid builds up in the lungs or at least that is what my Internist
          explained to me. 

          How much Lasix are you giving.  It may not be enough to clear it up.
          When my cat was first diagnosed I was on a full pill for a good 9 days
          I think it was, then it was cut down to half a pill giving 1/4 of it twice
          daily.  That seems to be the dose that is maintaining her right now.  Although
          like any terminally ill patients HCM cats will have good days and bad days.
          There were 3 days I had to give an additional dose of lasix and extra 1/4 pill
          and that helped a lot.  I don't think it is okay to self medicate but I was told
          to give the additional if I thought she needed.  

          Do you hear the fluid, crackle, pop sounds is that why you think it is coming
          back so soon?
           
          Barbie
           
          "Whoever wants to know something about me,
          must observe my paintings carefully and try to
          see in them what I am".
           
          Gustav Klimt
           
           
           
           

          ________________________________
          From: smittyhj82 <smittyhj82@...>
          To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Thu, September 30, 2010 2:02:24 PM
          Subject: [FH] Stage D Congestive Heart Failure

           
          We started Winston on Carvedilol alittle over 4 weeks ago. He is still in
          congestive heart failure. How many of you have had kitties that are constanly
          building fluid? What have your vets done? I give sub q lasix instead of oral,
          but now it is barely helping and fluid returns within 8 hours. We are not open
          mouth breathing. Just increased respiratory rate. I need advice. I am out of
          ideas :(

          Melissa and Winston

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]











          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Westgold
          I hope this isn t a silly question -- I have no experience with fluid buildup ---- but why can t they implant a drain tube, the way they put drains in the
          Message 4 of 4 , Sep 30, 2010
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            I hope this isn't a silly question -- I have no experience with fluid buildup ---- but why can't they implant a drain tube, the way they put drains in the heads of people with head injuries, then the excess fluid just drains out as fast as it accumulates??
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: smittyhj82
            To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2010 2:02 PM
            Subject: [FH] Stage D Congestive Heart Failure



            We started Winston on Carvedilol alittle over 4 weeks ago. He is still in congestive heart failure. How many of you have had kitties that are constanly building fluid? What have your vets done? I give sub q lasix instead of oral, but now it is barely helping and fluid returns within 8 hours. We are not open mouth breathing. Just increased respiratory rate. I need advice. I am out of ideas :(

            Melissa and Winston





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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