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Newbie, urgent, worried sick about Pola

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  • polastraus08
    Hi, i may not be able to reply to you til Sunday.. I m very stressed. I don t want to lose my beloved 16 yr. old, half-Siamese, Pola . I successfully
    Message 1 of 3 , Oct 3, 2008
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      Hi, i may not be able to reply to you til Sunday..
      I'm very stressed. I don't want to lose my beloved 16 yr. old, half-Siamese, Pola . I
      successfully syringe fed her a year ago, so I know I can do it, but.... this time I am very
      worried. I've been syringe feeding her for a few days now.
      She has had CRF for 2 yrs. but her kidney numbers are O.K.

      She was doing fine on daily hydration, Pepsid, and Azodyl, until a few weeks ago. In May
      she was 7.1 lbs. She was fine. Then she started sneezing now and then... (none of my
      other cats got it) and she would sniffle when she would eat, and it seemed that she could
      not smell her food. She started eating less. I hardly noticed it. The vet homeopath
      prescribed a remedy for the sneeze, and it went away in one day ! But her appetite
      seemed to get worse. (maybe since she was not eating enough at that point ?!)

      vet recently found elevated liver enzymes (300) plus arrythmia and heart beating too fast.
      And he said her heart murmer sounded worse. did a sonogram of her heart. She had her
      belly shaved, her heart WAS beating fast, partly due to stress. He wanted to do a liver
      biopsy in 2 weeks if she was not better on the heart meds and the Denamarin. I did not
      like that idea.

      I took her for second opinion, - that vet said 300 was not too bad for liver, and her heart
      did not seem that abnormal. Second vet is very experienced, but more holistic.
      First vet prescribed heart meds , Dilitiazem ( has side effects) and Lotensin (also has side
      effects)
      He also wanted to put her on 'Denamarin', a liver detoxifier (milk thistle and SAM-E)
      I put her on the Denamarin for 2 days and her appetite shut down. She had been eating
      tiny amounts. So I stopped the Denamarin.
      Second vet put her on 1/2 tab daily of the appetite stimulant (Cyproheptadine). I've given
      her 2 doses, but so far it has not worked. She has picked at some food yesterday, but
      mostly today she turns her head when i offer her food.
      Second vet said if she does not start eating after a week or two on the Cyproheptadine,
      then he will be worried.
      My other homeopathic vet prescribed a constitutional remedy (Lyc.) for her, to see if that
      might work.
      She also said to give her a few drops daily of the alcohol free tincture of Milk Thistle and
      Dandelion, plus Hawthorne for her heart, along with CoQ10 and vitamin E.
      And also 'Feline Cardiac Support' by Standard process, 1 tab. daily.
      I have not done much of this since the second vet wants to see if she will start eating on
      her own before we do too many other things.

      I'm very worried . She is also getting 100 ml. sub Q hydration daily. Up til now, I've been
      hydrating her alone for over a year, and she has eaten chicken treats during hydration to
      distract her.
      Now, she does not want the treats, and she resists hydration so I have to get a friend to
      help me hold her.
      She is still fiesty, and has a strong spirit, but she is not as energetic as before, and she is
      clearly losing weight.
      Yesterday she was better, but today she is worse.. not wanting to move much, etc.
      I try to get a can of A/D into her daily. I put canned pumpkin into it and add a bit of water,
      and this prevents constipation. She has tiny round stools.

      I won't stop worrying until my girl starts eating on her own.
      I've thought of putting her back on the Denamarin, but I just read online that Milk Thistle
      extract (no alcohol) works better, so i'll try that tonite. I'm thinking of putting her back on
      the Denamarin tomorrow for a few days to see if that makes her better. i may do that in
      fact, since the second vet said it works on his animals. the first vet said it works so maybe
      i should have kept her on it.
      i do'nt know if it is her liver or her heart at this point, or both. i just joined the cardiac
      group too. the other vets dont like those heart meds since they have side effects so i am
      focusing on her liver for now hope i am doing the right thing. i have seen cats go
      downhill with traditional meds in the past so i am not wanting to risk the heart meds in
      her frail condition.
      I am at my wit's end.
      I may have to take her in next week if she is not better. i'm trying to get enough food into
      her, and need to try harder tomorrow. today i think i gave her 3/4 can of A/D.

      Thank you,
      Susan
    • Carol
      hi Susan, I ve given various forms of SAMe to my guys for liver problems, and I ve had problems with it giving them nausea. That s one of the side effects of
      Message 2 of 3 , Oct 4, 2008
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        hi Susan,

        I've given various forms of SAMe to my guys for liver problems, and
        I've had problems with it giving them nausea. That's one of the side
        effects of SAMe - nausea. You're supposed to give SAMe on an empty
        stomach, same for any milk thistle supplement, for optimum
        absorption, and it's hard to do that when it makes them get a tummy
        ache. My angel dog, Fritzy, never did tolerate the Denosyl/SAMe
        (same as Denamarin but w/o the milk thistle in it), but she did well
        with milk thistle.

        If Pola has some kind of upper respiratory problem, and she can't
        smell, that'll make her not want to eat, but it sounds more like
        she's nauseated.

        A rapid heart rate can make them nauseated. One of my vets told me
        that heart problems can cause nausea. My Snowball's heart rate is
        high a lot, and that's one of the things that they think is making
        her nauseated all the time.

        >>
        First vet prescribed heart meds , Dilitiazem ( has side effects) and
        Lotensin (also has side effects)
        >>

        I know that there are side effects to the drugs, but not all cats
        experience them. It might be worth trying the medications for her
        heart to get her stable and then you can ask the vet if you can wean
        her off of them once she's feeling better.

        Liver values of 300 may not seem "high" to some, but it all depends
        on the patient. A value of 300 in one cat may not affect them like
        it will another. My angel Sweetie had elevated liver values and it
        never affected her much, but my dog Fritzy was very sick with hers.

        >>
        Second vet put her on 1/2 tab daily of the appetite stimulant
        (Cyproheptadine). I've given her 2 doses, but so far it has not
        worked.
        >>

        Wow...1/2 a Cyproheptadine is a lot! The usual dose that we've ever
        been told to give is 1/4 a tablet, but we only give Snowball 1/8.
        If it's going to work, it'll work within the first day, from our
        experience with it. If it's not working with 1/2 a tablet, then I'd
        just stop it, because the Cyproheptadine elevates the heart rate
        too, and Pola's already dealing with that.

        >>
        My other homeopathic vet prescribed a constitutional remedy (Lyc.)
        for her, to see if that might work.
        >>

        Did your homeopathic vet do a repertory on Pola before prescribing
        the Lyc. (Lycopodium)? If She didn't then it may not be the right
        homeopathic remedy for Pola. Some vets use homeopathy like other
        vets use medications...treating a symptom with a remedy. Sometimes
        that can work, but most of the time you really need to match up the
        patient's complete repertory (which includes not only symptoms but
        also personality, behaviors, physical attributes, etc.) with the
        remedies to find the right one for that particular patient.

        Lycopodium is often given for liver problems, but if Pola's liver
        problems are being caused from another primary condition, then
        Lycopodium may not work for her. She'd need to be treated for the
        primary condition first to see if that helps the liver. You can only
        do that by completing a repertory for the patient.

        >>
        She also said to give her a few drops daily of the alcohol free
        tincture of Milk Thistle and Dandelion, plus Hawthorne for her
        heart, along with CoQ10 and vitamin E. And also 'Feline Cardiac
        Support' by Standard process, 1 tab. daily.
        >>

        All of these are great supplements for the liver and heart, but be
        careful with the Dandelion, because it's a diuretic and with Pola's
        kidney issues, you may not want her on a diuretic (unless she's got
        fluid in her lungs/chest from her heart problems).

        Did you have an xray to see if there was any fluid? You might want
        to do that if you haven't. If she does have fluid in there, then
        she does need a diuretic, which you then have to balance with the
        kidney treatments.... less subQ's so you don't tax the heart.

        >>
        I have not done much of this since the second vet wants to see if
        she will start eating on her own before we do too many other things.
        >>

        This is a good idea. It's always good to wait till they're eating
        again before starting a bunch of supplements or medications that may
        make them more nauseated.

        >>
        I'm very worried . She is also getting 100 ml. sub Q hydration daily.
        >>

        Since you're giving her subQ's, I'd definitely ask the vet about the
        fluid in the lungs/chest issue. If Pola does have fluid, you need
        to cut way back on subQ's.

        >>
        the other vets don't like those heart meds since they have side
        effects so i am focusing on her liver for now hope i am doing the
        right thing. i have seen cats go downhill with traditional meds in
        the past so i am not wanting to risk the heart meds in her frail
        condition.
        >>

        I know how you feel. I'm kinda the same way with medications, but
        sometimes you need them to get them over a hump.

        There are some things you can do to slow her heart rate. First, I'd
        stop the Cyproheptadine, because it does increase the heart rate.
        You can try doing some Reiki and/or acupuncture on her. Energy
        healing can be very helpful. We get acupuncture for Snowball once a
        week, and I see a huge difference in her on the days she gets her
        treatments. Acupuncture can help with nausea, and it can also help
        strengthen the organs to initiate healing...like for her liver.

        We've had horrible problems for the past year with Snowball being
        nauseated and vomiting. We've tried every holistic thing you can
        imagine, and nothing has really helped much. Then a couple months
        ago our holistic vet gave us some Chinese herbs for her and since on
        them, she's only thrown up a few times. The one that she's on now
        is called "Happy Stomach". I know there is some Chinese name for
        it, but that's what the bottle says. It's helped Snowball a lot.
        Maybe you can ask your holistic vet about it for Pola.

        You can also try anti-nausea medication. There are two that a lot of
        people on the pancreatitis group use for their kitties and have had
        good results with - dolasetron (generic for Anzemet) and ondansetron
        (generic for Zofran). They come in either pill form or injectibles.
        It might be worth a try for a short term fix to get her over the
        inappetance.

        I hope Pola feels better very soon.

        hugs,
        Carol and Snowball and the gang
      • Vicky
        Have you considered a feeding tube for her? Please see Dr. Lisa Pierson s wonderful information about this life- saving procedure.
        Message 3 of 3 , Oct 4, 2008
        • 0 Attachment
          Have you considered a feeding tube for her?

          Please see Dr. Lisa Pierson's wonderful information about this life-
          saving procedure.

          http://www.catinfo.org/feedingtubes.htm

          Good luck and bless you for the amazing care you are giving!

          Vicky
          On Oct 4, 2008, at 12:18 AM, polastraus08 wrote:

          >
          > Hi, i may not be able to reply to you til Sunday..
          > I'm very stressed. I don't want to lose my beloved 16 yr. old, half-
          > Siamese, Pola . I
          > successfully syringe fed her a year ago, so I know I can do it,
          > but.... this time I am very
          > worried. I've been syringe feeding her for a few days now.
          > She has had CRF for 2 yrs. but her kidney numbers are O.K.
          >
          > She was doing fine on daily hydration, Pepsid, and Azodyl, until a
          > few weeks ago. In May
          > she was 7.1 lbs. She was fine. Then she started sneezing now and
          > then... (none of my
          > other cats got it) and she would sniffle when she would eat, and it
          > seemed that she could
          > not smell her food. She started eating less. I hardly noticed it.
          > The vet homeopath
          > prescribed a remedy for the sneeze, and it went away in one day !
          > But her appetite
          > seemed to get worse. (maybe since she was not eating enough at that
          > point ?!)
          >
          > vet recently found elevated liver enzymes (300) plus arrythmia and
          > heart beating too fast.
          > And he said her heart murmer sounded worse. did a sonogram of her
          > heart. She had her
          > belly shaved, her heart WAS beating fast, partly due to stress. He
          > wanted to do a liver
          > biopsy in 2 weeks if she was not better on the heart meds and the
          > Denamarin. I did not
          > like that idea.
          >
          > I took her for second opinion, - that vet said 300 was not too bad
          > for liver, and her heart
          > did not seem that abnormal. Second vet is very experienced, but more
          > holistic.
          > First vet prescribed heart meds , Dilitiazem ( has side effects) and
          > Lotensin (also has side
          > effects)
          > He also wanted to put her on 'Denamarin', a liver detoxifier (milk
          > thistle and SAM-E)
          > I put her on the Denamarin for 2 days and her appetite shut down.
          > She had been eating
          > tiny amounts. So I stopped the Denamarin.
          > Second vet put her on 1/2 tab daily of the appetite stimulant
          > (Cyproheptadine). I've given
          > her 2 doses, but so far it has not worked. She has picked at some
          > food yesterday, but
          > mostly today she turns her head when i offer her food.
          > Second vet said if she does not start eating after a week or two on
          > the Cyproheptadine,
          > then he will be worried.
          > My other homeopathic vet prescribed a constitutional remedy (Lyc.)
          > for her, to see if that
          > might work.
          > She also said to give her a few drops daily of the alcohol free
          > tincture of Milk Thistle and
          > Dandelion, plus Hawthorne for her heart, along with CoQ10 and
          > vitamin E.
          > And also 'Feline Cardiac Support' by Standard process, 1 tab. daily.
          > I have not done much of this since the second vet wants to see if
          > she will start eating on
          > her own before we do too many other things.
          >
          > I'm very worried . She is also getting 100 ml. sub Q hydration
          > daily. Up til now, I've been
          > hydrating her alone for over a year, and she has eaten chicken
          > treats during hydration to
          > distract her.
          > Now, she does not want the treats, and she resists hydration so I
          > have to get a friend to
          > help me hold her.
          > She is still fiesty, and has a strong spirit, but she is not as
          > energetic as before, and she is
          > clearly losing weight.
          > Yesterday she was better, but today she is worse.. not wanting to
          > move much, etc.
          > I try to get a can of A/D into her daily. I put canned pumpkin into
          > it and add a bit of water,
          > and this prevents constipation. She has tiny round stools.
          >
          > I won't stop worrying until my girl starts eating on her own.
          > I've thought of putting her back on the Denamarin, but I just read
          > online that Milk Thistle
          > extract (no alcohol) works better, so i'll try that tonite. I'm
          > thinking of putting her back on
          > the Denamarin tomorrow for a few days to see if that makes her
          > better. i may do that in
          > fact, since the second vet said it works on his animals. the first
          > vet said it works so maybe
          > i should have kept her on it.
          > i do'nt know if it is her liver or her heart at this point, or both.
          > i just joined the cardiac
          > group too. the other vets dont like those heart meds since they have
          > side effects so i am
          > focusing on her liver for now hope i am doing the right thing. i
          > have seen cats go
          > downhill with traditional meds in the past so i am not wanting to
          > risk the heart meds in
          > her frail condition.
          > I am at my wit's end.
          > I may have to take her in next week if she is not better. i'm trying
          > to get enough food into
          > her, and need to try harder tomorrow. today i think i gave her 3/4
          > can of A/D.
          >
          > Thank you,
          > Susan
          >
          >
          >



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