Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Baggins

Expand Messages
  • blackbeltmouse
    I originally joined this group, because of my 2year old Siamese cross, ZiZou, who is on Atelenol and remais asymtematic. We ve recently adopted one of our
    Message 1 of 6 , May 2, 2008
    • 0 Attachment
      I originally joined this group, because of my 2year old Siamese cross,
      ZiZou, who is on Atelenol and remais asymtematic.

      We've recently adopted one of our fosters, who is 14, blind (as a
      result of Glaucoma) and missing and eye, and deaf. We had bloodwork
      done and his results have come back - he's in the initial stages of
      CRF. In addition to this, he was diagnosed with a Heart Murmer (grade
      3) and appears to be in Congestive Heart Failure. He's coughing and
      sounds like he has a cold, but doesn't have one. He's going on special
      food, supplements and we go in for x-rays and deeper anaylsis tonight.

      I feel sooo bad for him - along will all of his health issues, he's
      trying to adapt from living with his previous owners (for his entire
      life) as an only cat, to our very busy multi-critter home.

      Can any talk on the issue of spirit/emotional state of cats with cong
      heart failure? Do you find they become depressed or withdrawn? I'm
      looking for 'signs' that he might be in distress. We don't know him
      very well, and we so deraly want to do what is the best for him.

      Any insight is appreciated.

      freedom
    • Leah Ferron
      Freedom, I don t knoe if anyone has already answered your post or not, but I just saw it and thought I would give you some info. Poor, Baggins! What a tough
      Message 2 of 6 , May 6, 2008
      • 0 Attachment
        Freedom,

        I don't knoe if anyone has already answered your post or not, but I just saw it and thought I would give you some info.

        Poor, Baggins! What a tough little guy he must be to endure all that he has. What a wonderful thing you did for him by adopting him. First, CRF and heart problems often go hand in hand. Since Baggins is in beginning CRF, he should be able to handle the meds OK. I had a kitty with both CRF and RCM (restricive cardiomyopathy) and he handled the duiretics and heart meds pretty well. Some vets get very nervous giving duiretics to a CRF kitty, but it must be done if there is CHF. Remember this, the heart always trumps the kidneys. If the heart isn't working, it won't matter how the kidneys are functioning.

        If you have a vet cardiologist that you can go to, that would be best. Baggins needs an echocardiogram to figure out what type of heart problems he has. Each type of heart problem is treated differently, especially with CRF as a consideration. My kitty, Alec, was given enalapril for his heart because it was easier on the kidneys.

        Yes, kitties with serious health problems can get depressed. Given that Baggins is in a new place, probably doesn't know his way around very well and has new fur-siblings, I would think his stress-o-meter is on high. The best thing you can do is give hime lots of love and attention, if he will take it. Maybe a room to himself for a while might be a good idea too until he gets used to his surroundings. I have not had a blind kitty before so I am not sure on the best protocol for him but I would think getting to know the space little by little would be better. Maybe others with experience on this could chime in.

        There are some supplements that you could give him like taurine, l-carnitine and especially CoEnzyme Q10, that we recommend for kitties with heart problems. If you need more info on this, just ask.

        Please do not hesitate to ask any questions, even if they aren't heart related because they often are. Keep us updated on Baggins too. He sounds like quite a special boy.

        Leah and her cats and Angel Alec

        blackbeltmouse <freedom.chevalier@...> wrote:
        I originally joined this group, because of my 2year old Siamese cross,
        ZiZou, who is on Atelenol and remais asymtematic.

        We've recently adopted one of our fosters, who is 14, blind (as a
        result of Glaucoma) and missing and eye, and deaf. We had bloodwork
        done and his results have come back - he's in the initial stages of
        CRF. In addition to this, he was diagnosed with a Heart Murmer (grade
        3) and appears to be in Congestive Heart Failure. He's coughing and
        sounds like he has a cold, but doesn't have one. He's going on special
        food, supplements and we go in for x-rays and deeper anaylsis tonight.

        I feel sooo bad for him - along will all of his health issues, he's
        trying to adapt from living with his previous owners (for his entire
        life) as an only cat, to our very busy multi-critter home.

        Can any talk on the issue of spirit/emotional state of cats with cong
        heart failure? Do you find they become depressed or withdrawn? I'm
        looking for 'signs' that he might be in distress. We don't know him
        very well, and we so deraly want to do what is the best for him.

        Any insight is appreciated.

        freedom






        ---------------------------------
        Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Carol
        hi Freedom, I m glad you found the group. Sorry that Baggins is having such a hard time of it. CRF and HCM/CHF kitties have a rougher time of it, but you can
        Message 3 of 6 , May 6, 2008
        • 0 Attachment
          hi Freedom,

          I'm glad you found the group. Sorry that Baggins is having such a
          hard time of it.

          CRF and HCM/CHF kitties have a rougher time of it, but you can treat
          both diseases pretty well and have them feeling better. It's just
          learning to balance the CRF with heart problems. Leah is so right
          about the heart being first in importance. You have to treat the
          heart first and then deal with the CRF as best you can. Since
          Baggins is in the "early stages" of CRF, it should be easier for you
          to balance the two.

          Are you taking him to a cardiologist? If not, it would be a good
          idea to do that. Getting an ultrasound of the heart will give you a
          lot more information about how his heart is doing, and the
          cardiologist can prescribe the appropriate medication for him.

          Can you tell us what his kidney values are? The BUN, Creatinine,
          Phosphorus, Potassium, HCT or PCV are the ones that are kidney
          related. Also the liver values (ALT and ALK Phos) can be affected
          when there are kidney problems.

          In addition to the supplements that Leah mentioned (taurine, l-
          carnitine and CoQ10), there are a couple more that may help...DMG
          (dimethylglycine) and heart glandulars can also be helpful for heart
          kitties.

          Please let us know what the vet said about his xrays.

          Take care,
          Carol and Snowball and the gang



          --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, "blackbeltmouse"
          <freedom.chevalier@...> wrote:

          We had bloodwork done and his results have come back - he's in the
          initial stages of CRF. In addition to this, he was diagnosed with a
          Heart Murmer (grade 3) and appears to be in Congestive Heart
          Failure. He's coughing and sounds like he has a cold, but doesn't
          have one. He's going on special food, supplements and we go in for x-
          rays and deeper anaylsis tonight.
        • Carol
          I forgot to mention about the depression. I really do think that kitties get depressed and have emotional issues when they re sick, in new places, etc., just
          Message 4 of 6 , May 6, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            I forgot to mention about the depression. I really do think that
            kitties get depressed and have emotional issues when they're sick,
            in new places, etc., just like people do. Our Snowball has had a
            terrible time of it since she got sick last October. You can look
            at her and just see in her face that she's upset. Her body language
            is off too. She'll kind of mope around the house, not interested in
            anything, won't play, won't sit with us.

            I started giving her some flower essences. You might try that with
            Baggins. Flower essences are very safe and can really help
            sometimes. You can try something like Bach's Rescue Remedy, or
            there are individual flower essences that you can try alone or mix
            together. You choose the FE depending on the personality and
            symptoms. Here is some info on how to do that and what things FE's
            are used for.

            These are from the Flower Essence Society.
            Frequentyly Asked Questions:
            http://www.fesflowers.com/faq_essences.htm#e1

            Selecting and using FE's:
            http://www.fesflowers.com/using.htm

            North American flower essences:
            http://www.fesflowers.com/FES_Quintessentials1.htm

            Bach's English healing essences:
            http://www.fesflowers.com/healing_herbs1.htm

            Right now we're doing a combination of Gentian, Gorse, Olive,
            California Wild Rose and Borage. I really can see a difference in
            her attitude since I've been using these on her.

            You can dose FE's directly from the stock bottle you buy or make a
            remedy from that in another bottle by adding 3 to 5 drops of the FE
            to an ounce of spring water. Do not use tap water or distilled
            water. Use a dark colored, glass dropper bottle, and sterilize it
            before you use it by boiling the glass parts in water for about 30
            seconds. Then the first time you make the remedy you shake the
            bottle hard, pounding it on the palm of your hand 100 times. This is
            called succussing. After that when you dose, you succuss the bottle
            about 20 times before each use. This "activates" the energy in the
            flower essence. You give a few drops each time you dose, and you
            can start the dose by giving it once every 15 minutes for 4 doses,
            then you can see how he is after that. We give Snowball her FE's 3
            times a day now. You can mix it in their food, water, or give it in
            their mouth or just rub it into their skin. The calming point on a
            cat is in the middle of the top of the head, between the ears. You
            can put a few drops at that point and rub it in with little circular
            motions to make sure it gets to touching the skin and not just on
            the fur. Massaging that calming point alone can help too. When
            Snowball gets her acupuncture treatments, the first needle they put
            in is in that calming point on the top of her head.

            If you touch the end of the dropper to anything, make sure you rinse
            it off in very hot or boiling water to sterilize it afterwards
            before you put the dropper back in the bottle.

            If you can get some Rescue Remedy, I might give that a try on
            Baggins first and see if it helps him. Sometimes Rescue Remedy
            works really well, other times I find that we need to make our own
            combination.

            Hope this helps.

            Carol and Snowball and the gang
          • Judi Levens
            When Max first came home from 2 days on oxygen at the emergency vet s he was definitely scared, a little lost, and a little standoffish. We tried lots of
            Message 5 of 6 , May 6, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              When Max first came home from 2 days on oxygen at the emergency vet's he was definitely scared, a little lost, and a little standoffish. We tried lots of things to get through to him; we brought him lots of tempting things to get him eating again, we spent a lot of time with him, and of course at first we were very emotional and afraid ourselves about losing him. I got the clear message from him that he didn't want us upset, but he wanted us nearby. We started spending more time with him, just reading or being nearby, sometimes lying down (he loves to walk on us) but not focusing totally on him...just being there for him. This seemed to do it for him...he grew to EXPECT us to be available; he doesn't like us to leave him now although of course we have to. But, it really improved his recovery mood. He started to feel safe again after the "attack" which happened to him in emergency (and saved his life, but it had to be very frightening to be in the oxygen chamber for 48 hours and not being able to breathe for a good part of that time, with lots of other emergency animals being treated nearby.) I think they sense a lot of what we're feeling, so I try to be careful not to be too worried around him, to just feel the pleasure I get from being with him. I think he'll always have a little memory of the fear he felt in CHF, and since he's a little asthmatic he still loses his breath sometimes for a short time, but I think he's grown to trust us again.
              Baggins has the added problem of having been abandoned by his owners when he needed them, but given his great need now, he may be very receptive to your loving care once he gets familiar with his surroundings. You are so good to help him, and he will feel your good intentions and respond to them in time. Again...good luck and thank you for being such a fine person.
              Oh yes, another thing we started, (which he didn't like before) is lots of brushing...he loves it now, and it helps to keep his fur a little less dry.
              Judi and Max (and John and Angel Cleo)


              To: feline-heart@yahoogroups.comFrom: carolroars@...: Tue, 6 May 2008 14:44:28 +0000Subject: [FH] Re: Baggins




              I forgot to mention about the depression. I really do think that kitties get depressed and have emotional issues when they're sick, in new places, etc., just like people do. Our Snowball has had a terrible time of it since she got sick last October. You can look at her and just see in her face that she's upset. Her body language is off too. She'll kind of mope around the house, not interested in anything, won't play, won't sit with us. I started giving her some flower essences. You might try that with Baggins. Flower essences are very safe and can really help sometimes. You can try something like Bach's Rescue Remedy, or there are individual flower essences that you can try alone or mix together. You choose the FE depending on the personality and symptoms. Here is some info on how to do that and what things FE's are used for. These are from the Flower Essence Society.Frequentyly Asked Questions:http://www.fesflowers.com/faq_essences.htm#e1Selecting and using FE's:http://www.fesflowers.com/using.htmNorth American flower essences:http://www.fesflowers.com/FES_Quintessentials1.htmBach's English healing essences:http://www.fesflowers.com/healing_herbs1.htmRight now we're doing a combination of Gentian, Gorse, Olive, California Wild Rose and Borage. I really can see a difference in her attitude since I've been using these on her. You can dose FE's directly from the stock bottle you buy or make a remedy from that in another bottle by adding 3 to 5 drops of the FE to an ounce of spring water. Do not use tap water or distilled water. Use a dark colored, glass dropper bottle, and sterilize it before you use it by boiling the glass parts in water for about 30 seconds. Then the first time you make the remedy you shake the bottle hard, pounding it on the palm of your hand 100 times. This is called succussing. After that when you dose, you succuss the bottle about 20 times before each use. This "activates" the energy in the flower essence. You give a few drops each time you dose, and you can start the dose by giving it once every 15 minutes for 4 doses, then you can see how he is after that. We give Snowball her FE's 3 times a day now. You can mix it in their food, water, or give it in their mouth or just rub it into their skin. The calming point on a cat is in the middle of the top of the head, between the ears. You can put a few drops at that point and rub it in with little circular motions to make sure it gets to touching the skin and not just on the fur. Massaging that calming point alone can help too. When Snowball gets her acupuncture treatments, the first needle they put in is in that calming point on the top of her head.If you touch the end of the dropper to anything, make sure you rinse it off in very hot or boiling water to sterilize it afterwards before you put the dropper back in the bottle.If you can get some Rescue Remedy, I might give that a try on Baggins first and see if it helps him. Sometimes Rescue Remedy works really well, other times I find that we need to make our own combination.Hope this helps.Carol and Snowball and the gang







              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Carol R.
              Judi is so right about this. They really do feel what we re feeling, and any anxiousness or us being upset did upset Snowball too. It s really hard for me to
              Message 6 of 6 , May 6, 2008
              • 0 Attachment
                Judi is so right about this. They really do feel what we're feeling, and any anxiousness or us being upset did upset Snowball too. It's really hard for me to not be upset around her when she's feeling so bad, but I try to think good things and bring up the mood as best I can.

                We do the same thing with Snowball, spending nice quality time with her, and I think it takes her mind off of being sick and depressed too. Sometimes when I get up in the morning at 6am and she's looking kind of spewey, like she's going to throw up any minute, I'll take out her favorite toy, this cat dancer thing, and start playing with her to get her mind off of her tummy. Most of the time it works! She begins to feel better and the playing somehow changes the brain chemistry I think...sends out those feel good endorphins and not so much of the tummy ache, throw up ones! I don't know for sure, but sometimes when I can get her to play, I really think it takes her mind off of her tummy, and any day that she doesn't spew is a good day!

                I'm sure Baggins is probably feeling you being worried about him, so just try the best you can to be up around him. Judi mentioned the brushing... for us and Snowball it's music. For some unknown reason she actually likes the sound of my voice! Steve and I sing the beginning of "you raise me up" (that Josh Groban song) to her and she gets all happy and purring! Go figure... but whatever works, I say.

                hugs,
                Carol and Snowball and the gang

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.