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Re: [FH] Weight loss (was CoQ-10 and L-Carnitine dosages)

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  • savionna@aol.com
    Hi Gwen, In a message dated 10/31/05 9:57:10 PM, paragem@hotmail.com writes: What does Bud eat (brand, flavor, canned or dry)? The
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 1, 2005
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      Hi Gwen,

      In a message dated 10/31/05 9:57:10 PM, paragem@... writes:

      << My Bud is 16 lbs >>

      What does Bud eat (brand, flavor, canned or dry)? The leading contributing
      factor to obesity in cats is a dry food diet, which is high in carbohydrate.
      Just two excerpts from the links below:

      1. From Elizabeth Hodgkins DVM (former director of Hill's Pet Nutrition) at

      "Excessive carbohydrate consumption, over time, causes both obesity and
      strongly predisposes the cat, an obligatory carnivore, to the metabolic "train
      wreak" we know as type II feline diabetes mellitus....Consumption of dry cat food
      causes a very rapid and extreme surge in blood glucose as the predigested
      carbohydrate in the food is dissolved and absorbed into the bloodstream
      essentially as sugar from the stomach and intestines....Along the way, the constant high
      insulin levels (hyperinsulinemia) cause the cat to experience
      hypertriglyceridemia (high triglycerides) and hypercholesterolemia (high cholesterol), and
      obesity results....For now, there is compelling scientific evidence to show that
      high carbohydrate diets (essentially all dry cat foods) fed to pet cats on a
      continuous and exclusive basis predispose to, or even directly cause, feline
      obesity and type II feline diabetes mellitus." 

      2. From Lisa A. Pierson, DVM at www.catinfo.org:

      "Obesity is an extremely common and very serious health problem in cats. For
      instance, overweight cats are four times more likely to develop diabetes than
      cats that are at an optimal weight. Obligate carnivores are designed to meet
      their energy needs with a high protein, moderate fat diet with little to no
      carbohydrates. Carbohydrates are minimally used for energy and those that are
      not used are converted to and stored as fat. The so-called “light” diets that
      are on the market have targeted the fat content as the nutrient to be
      decreased, but in doing so, the pet food manufacturers have increased the grain
      fraction, leading to a higher level of carbohydrates. Hence, many overweight cats
      eating these diets are still obese. These "light" products are among the most
      species-inappropriate, unhealthy diets available to cat caretakers. Many
      caretakers feed very small amounts of these diets hoping that their cat will lose
      weight but feeding a small amount of a diet that is inappropriate for the species
      is NOT the answer!".

      << the vet says that is TOO MUCH - in fact, he
      is what she calls "pre-diabetic". >>

      See above. A high carbohydrate diet is also the leading contributing factor
      to feline diabetes. Cats who are borderline...with a blood glucose of 150-200
      mg/dL...are giving us a warning that the pancreas is starting to not function.
      Changing the diet to a high-quality, low-carbohdyrate, well-balanced,
      moisture-rich, meat-based diet...that is, the diet for which a cat's body was
      designed...can restore pancreatic function in most cats.

      << the bad news was the
      high sugar. >>

      How high? Above 200 mg/dL? Was it a fasting blood sample? If not, how many
      hrs was the sample taken after a meal?

      << She says she has seen cats lose weight and stay on one of the
      prescription diets and get rid of the diabetes >>

      She may have seen that. But there is absolutely no reason to feed any cat a
      "prescription" diet, which are uniformly of poor nutritional quality. This is
      doubly true for diabetics, who used to be prescribed Hill's w/d...which is a
      high-carbohydrate, high-fiber diet that is completely contraindicated for cats,
      esp diabetics (it doesn't work well in humans or dogs, either)...precisely b/c
      it is high in carbohydrate. Now they are prescribed either Purina DM or
      Hill's m/d, both of which may have lower carbohdyrate content than most commercial
      dry foods (13% of calories, as opposed to the usual 20-50%; Innova's new EVO
      has 7% of calories from carbohdyrate)...but they have very poor nutritional

      There are several canned commercial products with high nutritional quality
      and low carbohydrates. These incl: Wellness, www.oldmotherhubbard.com; Nature's
      Variety, www.naturesvariety.com; PetGuard, www.petguard.com; Felidae,
      www.canidae.com; Natural Balance, www.naturalbalanceinc.com; Innova,
      www.naturapet.com; and Eagle Pack, www.eaglepack.com.

      Only the first 2 are grain free in the entire line...and contain usually less
      than 5% calories from carbohydrate. The rest contain grains but are generally
      under 10%.

      << I need to find a good way
      to help him lose a couple of pounds. >>

      Cats will achieve and stabilize at a healthy weight for their frames when fed
      a species-appropriate diet.

      << Any suggestions will be appreciated. >>

      It might be useful to start with feline nutrition. Many of these articles
      also contain information about the relationship between diet and
      diabetes/obesity. Feeding the high-quality species-appropriate diet that cats need "magically"
      eliminates many common health problems.

      1. http://home.earthlink.net/~jacm2/id1.html
      2. www.catinfo.org
      3. www.maxshouse.com/feline_nutrition.htm
      4. http://rocquoone.com/diet_and_health.htm
      5. www.advancepetfood.com.au/nutrition
      6. ww.drsfostersmith.com/general.cfm?siteid=0&gid=74&ref=2066&subref=AN

      // Rosemary
    • Deena
      ... But there is absolutely no reason to feed any cat a prescription diet, which are uniformly of poor nutritional quality. This is doubly true for
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 1, 2005
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        --- In feline-heart@yahoogroups.com, savionna@a... wrote:
        But there is absolutely no reason to feed any cat a "prescription"
        diet, which are uniformly of poor nutritional quality. This is
        doubly true for diabetics...

        As usual, I agree with Rosemary. With minimal understanding of
        feline nutritional requirements and an understanding of what needs
        to be tweaked with certain conditions, you can often do better on
        your own. If you have the time and willingness to do this.

        If not, there IS a line of prescription diets that seems to be based
        on science rather than profits: Wysong. I have no financial
        connection and will probably always make my own. While not still
        perfect, IMO, for those most comfortable with a prescription diet,
        it's an option that you should have your vets investigate.

        Dr Wysong's "Scientific & Philosophical basis of Rx Diets" paper
        does an excellent job at explaining nutritional concepts which few
        vets unfortunately don't understand.
        Feeding food that the cat's body is able & designed to utilize is
        the best defense against disease. When cats are fighting other
        illnesses, it's even more important. Many of the supplements
        recommended for heart kitties, I was able to get into Mr Pepe in
        their original form, aka food.

        Check out the "Pancreas Size" chart on pg 14. Rats & Mice fed
        processed foods have pancreas's that are more than twice the size
        (.84 vs .32) as those fed a species appropriate diet. The pancreas
        is one of the masters of our immune system and allows us fight
        disease. Bigger is not better, since this indicates its working too
        hard and is breaking down.

        I had a funny dog experience a few weeks ago, which hammered this
        home. I took my 4.5 yr old dog in for an ultrasound to check her
        reproductive organs. The first thing out of the vets mouth
        was "whoa, what a pancreas!" His assistant walks in and he shouts
        to her, "check out Buddie's pancreas?" I was afraid to ask what's
        wrong with her pancreas - thinking the worse. As dogs age, it
        becomes bigger, mushier and less distinct on u/s. Her's jumped off
        the screen and looked like a puppy's pancreas. I took her off
        kibble at 7 mos and have been feeding her a species appropriate diet
        for the past 4 years. Looks like her pancreas hasn't aged since the
        switch. Hmmm....

        Lisa: It was Dr C who got so excited about Buddie's pancreas. He's
        also one of the few vets in the area who doesn't hassle raw
        feeders. I hope he made the connection.

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