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RE: [fearnwhiskey] RIP Jam Master Jay

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  • Jason E Baldwin
    Carl Z. wrote:
    Message 1 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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      Carl Z. wrote:

      < I just heard the news & sadly the AP has confirmed it.

      That's awful. A couple weeks ago, I grew tired of the 30 or 40 CDs I'd been
      playing in rotation at work; for a change, I played Run DMC's RAISING HELL and
      the new-ish Greatest Hits comp, and it reminded me how much I used to love those
      guys. I've never been much of a fan of rap or hip-hop in general, but when I was
      a kid, I had RAISING HELL and LL Cool J's WALKING WITH THE PANTHER (or whatever
      it was called) and played the hell out of those cassettes. They're still
      floating around here somewhere.

      Sad news, indeed.

      -Jason
    • Dave Purcell
      Sad news, indeed. Run DMC was so fresh and different (at least to a white Kentucky kid s ears) when they first came out. I d heard a lot of early Kurtis Blow
      Message 2 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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        Sad news, indeed. Run DMC was so fresh and different (at least to a
        white Kentucky kid's ears) when they first came out. I'd heard a lot
        of early Kurtis Blow and Grandmaster Flash thanks to a friend's big
        brother, an avid record collector who turned me onto punk my frosh
        year in high school. But Run DMC was somehow harder and more
        accessible at the same time. They blew us all away.

        I'd throw early Kool Moe Dee in there too, Jason. Good stuff.

        dp


        --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., "Jason E Baldwin" <jebaldwin@i...> wrote:

        > That's awful. A couple weeks ago, I grew tired of the 30 or 40 CDs
        I'd been
        > playing in rotation at work; for a change, I played Run DMC's
        RAISING HELL and
        > the new-ish Greatest Hits comp, and it reminded me how much I used
        to love those
        > guys. I've never been much of a fan of rap or hip-hop in general,
        but when I was
        > a kid, I had RAISING HELL and LL Cool J's WALKING WITH THE PANTHER
        (or whatever
        > it was called) and played the hell out of those cassettes. They're
        still
        > floating around here somewhere.
        >
        > Sad news, indeed.
        >
        > -Jason
      • Jeff J
        ... Yes, it is sad news. But why it s front-page news in today s NY dailies and the lead-off story on last night s 10 and 11 pm newscasts (one station giving
        Message 3 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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          --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., "Dave Purcell" <dave@p...> wrote:
          > Sad news, indeed.

          Yes, it is sad news. But why it's front-page news in today's NY dailies and the lead-off story on last
          night's 10 and 11 pm newscasts (one station giving it more airtime than the Wellstone death which didn't
          even lead off that night's newscast) is beyond me. This country sure has its priorities screwed up.

          Jeff J
        • Carl Zimring
          --On Thursday, October 31, 2002 6:11 AM -0500 Jason E Baldwin ... I went to a large high school with a pretty diverse population, but one thing seemingly
          Message 4 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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            --On Thursday, October 31, 2002 6:11 AM -0500 Jason E Baldwin
            <jebaldwin@...> wrote:

            > A couple weeks ago, I grew tired of the 30 or 40 CDs I'd been
            > playing in rotation at work; for a change, I played Run DMC's RAISING
            > HELL and the new-ish Greatest Hits comp, and it reminded me how much I
            > used to love those guys. I've never been much of a fan of rap or hip-hop
            > in general, but when I was a kid, I had RAISING HELL and LL Cool J's
            > WALKING WITH THE PANTHER (or whatever it was called) and played the hell
            > out of those cassettes. They're still floating around here somewhere.

            I went to a large high school with a pretty diverse population, but one
            thing seemingly everyone had in common was having copies of _Raising Hell_
            my senior year. The record was so popular that even my algebra teacher
            could recite "Proud to Be Black" from memory. I'm still a little baffled
            that Aereosmith's career took off again after "Walk This Way" while Run-DMC
            lost momentum, because they seemed to be as big as it got in 1986.

            Carl Z.
          • Lance Davis
            ... America?? ... screwed up priorities?? .... nawww ... say it ain t so, Jeff!!! Lance ===== President Bush tells us that civilization is at stake and that
            Message 5 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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              > This country sure has its priorities
              > screwed up ... Jeff J

              America?? ... screwed up priorities?? .... nawww ... say it
              ain't so, Jeff!!!

              Lance

              =====
              "President Bush tells us that civilization is at stake and that we're at war, but apparently it's a war that we can win so easily that all we have to do to help win it is shop, eat out and travel. They don't ask you to sacrifice because one of the major things they'd ask you to sacrifice is oil, but it's oil money that put Bush into office."
              --Bill Maher

              __________________________________________________
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            • Carl Zimring
              --On Thursday, October 31, 2002 1:42 PM +0000 Jeff J ... That might be a local thing for NYC, as the Pittsburgh news put it ten minutes in
              Message 6 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                --On Thursday, October 31, 2002 1:42 PM +0000 Jeff J <jeffj@...>
                wrote:

                > Yes, it is sad news. But why it's front-page news in today's NY dailies
                > and the lead-off story on last night's 10 and 11 pm newscasts (one
                > station giving it more airtime than the Wellstone death which didn't
                > even lead off that night's newscast) is beyond me. This country sure has
                > its priorities screwed up.

                That might be a local thing for NYC, as the Pittsburgh news put it ten
                minutes in for about 10 seconds last night. Wellstone's memorial service
                was apparently carried live in its entirity by the Minneapolis stations, so
                I'd chalk the varying coverage up to regional mourning.

                Is it me, or are a disproportionate number of people I admire sick and/or
                dying these days? This is the worst, most morbid year I can remember in a
                long time.

                Carl Z.
              • Jeff J
                ... Well, I don t know how America would have survived without the Post s front page expose on James Gandolfini s secret drug and alcohol detox treatment. Of
                Message 7 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                  --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., Lance Davis <lwdavis1@y...> wrote:
                  > America?? ... screwed up priorities?? .... nawww ... say it
                  > ain't so, Jeff!!!

                  Well, I don't know how America would have survived without the Post's front page expose on James
                  Gandolfini's secret drug and alcohol detox treatment. Of course, the Post's readership is up 8 or 9
                  percent in the last year.

                  Ooops, I forgot. This is a music list. Sorry about that.

                  CMJ starts tonight! Woohoo! Looks like I'm gonna miss it all. I am curious about the new (and the old)
                  Swedish, etc. bands playing this weekend- Division Of Laura Lee, Hot Sahara Nights, Flaming Sideburns.
                  Anybody see 'em live? Any comments?

                  Jeff J
                • samchecker
                  ... curious about the new (and the old) ... Sahara Nights, Flaming Sideburns. ... I really like the Sahara Hotnights and D.O.L.L. CD s, but I m curious about
                  Message 8 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                    --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., "Jeff J" <jeffj@b...> wrote:

                    >
                    > CMJ starts tonight! Woohoo! Looks like I'm gonna miss it all. I am
                    curious about the new (and the old)
                    > Swedish, etc. bands playing this weekend- Division Of Laura Lee, Hot
                    Sahara Nights, Flaming Sideburns.
                    > Anybody see 'em live? Any comments?

                    I really like the Sahara Hotnights and D.O.L.L. CD's, but I'm curious
                    about how they carry it off onstage, too. Reports, we want reports!

                    Mark
                  • Christopher Knaus
                    ... Assuming you mean Sahara Hotnights, saw em as SXSW, good garage punk rawk stuff, knowing your style, I think you ll dig it. Later... CK Last call for big
                    Message 9 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                      >Hey there,

                      >CMJ starts tonight! Woohoo! Looks like I'm gonna miss it all. I am curious
                      >about the new (and the old)
                      >Swedish, etc. bands playing this weekend- Division Of Laura Lee, Hot
                      >Sahara Nights, Flaming Sideburns.
                      >Anybody see 'em live? Any comments?
                      >
                      >Jeff J

                      Assuming you mean Sahara Hotnights, saw 'em as SXSW, good garage punk rawk
                      stuff, knowing your style, I think you'll dig it.

                      Later...
                      CK

                      Last call for big candy on a pole-stick.
                    • Jeff J
                      ... Actually, I was more curious about Hot Sahara Nights. I think it might be playing on the Spice Channel tonight. Too bad I don t have a satellite dish. Jeff
                      Message 10 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                        --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., Christopher Knaus <soda@n...> wrote:
                        > Assuming you mean Sahara Hotnights, saw 'em as SXSW, good garage punk rawk
                        > stuff, knowing your style, I think you'll dig it.

                        Actually, I was more curious about Hot Sahara Nights. I think it might be playing on the Spice Channel
                        tonight. Too bad I don't have a satellite dish.

                        Jeff J
                      • Wilson, Carl
                        I really don t think it s a matter of screwed-up priorities, Jeff. In fact I think it s surprisingly sensitive to the place of Run-DMC in the culture. As
                        Message 11 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                          I really don't think it's a matter of screwed-up priorities, Jeff. In fact I
                          think it's surprisingly sensitive to the place of Run-DMC in the culture.

                          As admirable and important as Wellstone was, his was a struggling and lonely
                          voice that's getting a lot more attention and respect in death than it did
                          in life. Run-DMC was one of the key forces in bringing hip-hop culture to
                          America at large, and for better and for worse, hip-hop culture has changed
                          life in America in a pervasive way - for a lot of people under or around 30
                          now (myself not included, if that's not obvious) it *is* the culture. And
                          Run-DMC also represented the best, most community-building elements of
                          hip-hop, and became elder statesmen who stood outside the thuggism and
                          dysfunction that came to dominate the form, and in a much more mainstream
                          and populist way than all the "alternative" positive-minded rappers who
                          followed. Except maybe Public Enemy, it's hard to name anyone more vital to
                          the evolution of hip-hop culture.

                          So, for much of America this is front-page news, just as deservedly as
                          Elvis's or John Lennon's deaths. It's more important than, for instance,
                          Aaliyah's death last year, which got a far more disproportionate level of
                          attention. And certainly more important (if less preternaturally compelling,
                          somehow) than Winona Ryder's shoplifting case, which made a lot of front
                          pages this week.

                          Compare the attention given to Winona to the frequently grudging-seeming
                          mainstream attention given to the deaths of Biggie Smalls and, especially,
                          Tupac, whose demise was arguably one of the biggest milestones of the decade
                          for black youth. Tupac's story probably resonated more deeply with more
                          people than Kurt Cobain's really did, but which one pervades media memory
                          more?

                          All of which is to say Wellstone was a cult hero, and damn straight he
                          deserved it. But Run-DMC are folk heroes, and there's nothing wrong with
                          honoring that.

                          carl w.
                        • Nina Melechen
                          ... the decade ... more ... makes me wonder, though. I have no information at all about how many people felt personally affected by those two deaths. I m
                          Message 12 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                            --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., "Wilson, Carl" <cwilson@g...> wrote:
                            > I really don't think it's a matter of screwed-up priorities

                            I agree with most of what you've written. This bit:

                            > Tupac, whose demise was arguably one of the biggest milestones of
                            the decade
                            > for black youth. Tupac's story probably resonated more deeply with
                            more
                            > people than Kurt Cobain's really did

                            makes me wonder, though. I have no information at all about how many
                            people felt personally affected by those two deaths. I'm astounded by
                            the similarities in the ways popular imagination has transformed them
                            both. Especially the proliferation of conspiracy theories: Courtney
                            really killed Kurt; Sug Knight killed Tupac; no, Tupac isn't really
                            dead--the impression that these deaths damaged the respective cultures
                            so greatly that there *must* be an explanation or a mitigation is
                            overwhelming. The only thing I can think of that had the same
                            conspiritorial resonance for people my age was "Paul is dead," which,
                            of course, indicated that a lot of people thought the Beatles had
                            taken a Wrong Turn and the culture was following.

                            Nina M.
                          • Jim Caligiuri
                            I saw Elvis yesterday [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            Message 13 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                              I saw Elvis yesterday


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Steve Gardner
                              ... lonely ... Ok, maybe I m outing myself as a loser (again!) but I d never heard of that Wellstone fellow until he died. If you would have asked what
                              Message 14 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                                > As admirable and important as Wellstone was, his was a struggling and
                                lonely
                                > voice that's getting a lot more attention and respect in death than it did
                                > in life.

                                Ok, maybe I'm outing myself as a loser (again!) but I'd never heard of that
                                Wellstone fellow until he died. If you would have asked what Wellstone was
                                before he died I probably would have said a Cabernet.

                                But I've heard of Run DMC.

                                Seeing as how most of America is at least as stupid as I am, I'm betting
                                that Jam Master Jay's death is on most people's radar way before Mr
                                Wellstone.

                                Granted, I pride myself on my political apathy.

                                steve, who will vote on Tuesday if they let him
                              • Jason E Baldwin
                                Steve wrote:
                                Message 15 of 18 , Oct 31, 2002
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                                  Steve wrote:

                                  < Ok, maybe I'm outing myself as a loser (again!) but I'd never heard of that
                                  < Wellstone fellow until he died. If you would have asked what Wellstone was
                                  < before he died I probably would have said a Cabernet.
                                  <
                                  < But I've heard of Run DMC.
                                  <
                                  < Seeing as how most of America is at least as stupid as I am, I'm betting
                                  < that Jam Master Jay's death is on most people's radar way before Mr
                                  < Wellstone.
                                  <
                                  < Granted, I pride myself on my political apathy.

                                  That makes two of us, on all the counts you listed.

                                  -Jason
                                • Carl Zimring
                                  This Newsday article gives a good account of Mizell s influence. Carl Z. *** http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-jam,0,6480075.story?coll
                                  Message 16 of 18 , Nov 1, 2002
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                                    This Newsday article gives a good account of Mizell's influence.

                                    Carl Z.

                                    ***

                                    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-jam,0,6480075.story?coll
                                    =chi%2Dnews%2Dhed&

                                    From Newsday
                                    Police, friends seek motive in rapper's killing
                                    Run-DMC's Jam Master Jay gunned down in N.Y. recording studio

                                    By Melanie Lefkowitz and Curtis Taylor
                                    Newsday
                                    Published October 31, 2002

                                    NEW YORK -- While police investigated whether a feud led to the fatal
                                    shooting of hip-hop pioneer Jam Master Jay, skeptical friends and family
                                    mourned him today and puzzled over the slaying.

                                    "There's no reason," said the victim's teenage son, Jason Mizell Jr. "He
                                    didn't really do anything wrong."

                                    Witnesses said two men in dark clothing were buzzed into the rap star's
                                    second-floor Queens recording studio on Wednesday night, police said. A
                                    single bullet was fired into the head of the Run-DMC co-founder as he
                                    played a video game with another man. Jam Master Jay, whose real name was
                                    Jason Mizell, was 37.

                                    The other man, Uriel Rincon, 25, was shot in the leg and was released from
                                    the hospital today. He was among five witnesses being questioned by police,
                                    said a law enforcement source who spoke on condition of anonymity.

                                    "They're checking out varying theories, including, "Was it the result of a
                                    personal feud? Was it linked to this East Coast-West Coast rappers?' and
                                    other possible motives," the law enforcement source said.

                                    Another source, also speaking anonymously, said: "They're looking at some
                                    sort of dispute, anything from a personal dispute to some kind of rap
                                    rivalry."

                                    Many in the rap industry questioned whether Mizell, known as a family man
                                    and social activist, would ever be caught in a violent flare-up --
                                    especially a coastal feud that seemed to have little to do with him.

                                    "Before the media rushes to attribute this to East Coast-West Coast
                                    violence, they should examine Run-DMC's two decades of contributions and
                                    Jam Master Jay's personal character," said hip-hop mogul Russell Simmons,
                                    whose brother Joseph founded the group with Mizell.

                                    "Rest In Peace Jam Master," Run DMC's official Web site read early today,
                                    underneath a picture of Mizell.

                                    At the scene today, fans placed flowers, candles and remembrance messages
                                    next to a fence. Someone placed an Adidas sneaker -- a reference to the
                                    group's hit song "My Adidas" -- with "R.I.P JMJ" handwritten in marker.

                                    Chuck D, the founder of the hip-hop group Public Enemy, blamed record
                                    companies and the advertising for perpetuating "a climate of violence" in
                                    the rap industry. "When it comes to us, we're disposable commodities," he
                                    said.

                                    Doctor Dre, a New York radio station DJ who had been friends with Mizell
                                    since the mid-1980s, said, "This is not a person who went out looking for
                                    trouble. ... He's known as a person that builds, that creates and is trying
                                    to make the right things happen."

                                    Publicist Tracy Miller said Mizell and McDaniels had planned to perform in
                                    Washington, D.C., on Thursday at a Washington Wizards basketball game.
                                    Mizell had performed on Tuesday in Alabama, she said.

                                    Mizell was married and had three children, she said.

                                    Distraught fans gathered in the cold rain outside the recording studio.
                                    Several cried, while others stood stunned. Still others hugged each other.

                                    "They're the best. They're the pioneers in hip-hop," said fan Arlene Clark,
                                    39, of Hollis.

                                    Another fan who lives nearby, Leslie Bell, 33, said the members of Run DMC
                                    often let local musicians record for free at the studio.

                                    "That was their decision, to stay here and give back to the community,"
                                    Bell said. "He is one great man. The good always die young. He's the good
                                    guy."

                                    Word of Jam Master Jay's death struck hard at those who knew him.

                                    "He's a positive brother, trying to do the right thing in the community,"
                                    said Charles Fischer, who runs the Hip-Hop Youth Summit Network and knew
                                    Jam Master Jay for years. "I hope we can bring to justice whoever shot him,
                                    and I hope other hip-hop artists will rally around this unfortunate
                                    incident and use it to rally against violence in the hip-hop nation and the
                                    community across the country."

                                    Jam Master Jay, 37, who was also a producer, grew up in Hollis, where he
                                    and two childhood friends, Run (Joseph Simmons) and DMC (Darryl McDaniels),
                                    came together to form the seminal 1980s band.

                                    Simmons, the younger brother of Def Jam records founder Russell Simmons,
                                    first approached McDaniels about forming a rap group. The two then added
                                    Jam Master Jay as their DJ in 1982.

                                    The trio popularized the rap genre as well as their signature look: unlaced
                                    Adidas sneakers and heavy gold jewelry.

                                    In his book, "It's Like That: A Spiritual Memoir," Simmons attributed the
                                    group's look to Mizell.

                                    It was 1984 and Mizell was walking down the street in Jamaica after
                                    purchasing some leather pants, a leather jacket, Adidas sneakers, a large
                                    gold rope chain, a black hat and some Gazelle glasses.

                                    All eyes were upon Mizell, Simmons said.

                                    "It was like everybody wanted to snatch something from him because he had
                                    it going on. I mean nobody had everything: the glasses, the leather, the
                                    shoes, and the gold rope," Simmons said. "We were doing well and Jay just
                                    was helping to create a nationwide trend and didn't know it."

                                    The group was indeed doing well.

                                    Their third album, "Raising Hell," was the first rap album to sell more
                                    than a million copies.

                                    The trio continued its trend-setting ways, and in 1986, Run-DMC covered
                                    Aerosmith's 1970s hit "Walk This Way" with lead singer Steven Tyler and
                                    guitarist Joe Perry. The recording helped resurrect Aerosmith's floundering
                                    career and gave Run-DMC a chart-topping single.

                                    Run-DMC went on to become the first rap band to appear on the cover of
                                    Rolling Stone and Spin magazines, as well as "American Bandstand" and
                                    "Saturday Night Live." Their list of firsts included first rap video on MTV
                                    and first rap group to receive gold and platinum albums.

                                    Run-DMC eventually lost its allure, with more hard-core gangsta rap
                                    changing the genre's landscape. When Run-DMC decided to make a comeback
                                    this year, Aerosmith invited the group to perform on its summer tour. Their
                                    most recent album of new material, the long-awaited "Crown Royal," was
                                    released last year.

                                    Staff Writer Sean Gardiner and The Associated Press contributed to this
                                    story.
                                  • Jeff J
                                    ... Elvis Presley?! Really? Cool! What kind of drugs were you on at the time? Jeff J, who recognizes one and only one Elvis , the rest have to use their full
                                    Message 17 of 18 , Nov 1, 2002
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                                      --- In fearnwhiskey@y..., "Jim Caligiuri" <jcalig@s...> wrote:
                                      > I saw Elvis yesterday

                                      Elvis Presley?! Really? Cool! What kind of drugs were you on at the time?

                                      Jeff J, who recognizes one and only one "Elvis", the rest have to use their full names.
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