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Re: [XP] comp.software.extreme-programming passes 155:13

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  • Eric Rizzo
    ... That s great news (pun intended) AFAIAC. Now I guess the hard part is migrating these discussions over to it. What are the groups opinions on which (if
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 28, 2000
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      Steve Cline wrote:
      >
      > see todays news.announce.newgroups on Deja.com or your favorite news
      > server
      >
      > should be available in a week or 2

      That's great news (pun intended) AFAIAC. Now I guess the hard part is migrating
      these discussions over to it. What are the groups opinions on which (if any) of
      the following are likely to happen now:

      1) The mailing list will eventually migrate fully over to the newsgroup
      2) Discussions will continue here as well as the newsgroup, with some overlap
      and but little cross posting
      3) Cross posting will run rampant, and the two forums will parallel one another
      nearly completely
      4) The newsgroup will suffer from not being the "first to market" in the
      business of XP discussion. Traffic will not match what is here and it will
      wither away into obscurity

      Does anyone care?

      --
      Eric Nicholas Rizzo
      eric.rizzo@...
      The Technical Resource Connection, Inc. Perot Systems
      http://www.trcinc.com
      ---------------------------------------------------------------
      "A man talking sense to himself is no more insane than
      a man talking nonsense not to himself...or just as insane."
      -Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
    • Ron Jeffries
      I d like to keep the total number of fora down. Also I get mondo emails per day from this, which makes my ISP angry when I travel. My preference would be to
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 28, 2000
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        I'd like to keep the total number of fora down. Also I get mondo emails per
        day from this, which makes my ISP angry when I travel. My preference would
        be to migrate ASAP to the newsgroup. As always, reality and other people's
        ideas may intervene ...

        R
      • Phlip
        From: Eric Rizzo ... overlap ... another ... will ... Compare the effect this list server had on the (previously wild) XP threads on news:comp.object... Phlip
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 28, 2000
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          From: Eric Rizzo

          > 1) The mailing list will eventually migrate fully over to the newsgroup
          > 2) Discussions will continue here as well as the newsgroup, with some
          overlap
          > and but little cross posting
          > 3) Cross posting will run rampant, and the two forums will parallel one
          another
          > nearly completely
          > 4) The newsgroup will suffer from not being the "first to market" in the
          > business of XP discussion. Traffic will not match what is here and it
          will
          > wither away into obscurity

          Compare the effect this list server had on the (previously wild) XP threads
          on news:comp.object...

          Phlip
          ======= http://users.deltanet.com/~tegan/home.html =======
        • Phil Goodwin
          ... I won t use the newsgroup as long as the list remains interesting (I m one of the 13 who voted against it). I think that it would be great if the list
          Message 4 of 9 , Apr 28, 2000
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            Eric Rizzo wrote:
            >
            > Steve Cline wrote:
            > >
            > > see todays news.announce.newgroups on Deja.com or your favorite news
            > > server
            > >
            > > should be available in a week or 2
            >
            > That's great news (pun intended) AFAIAC. Now I guess the hard part is migrating
            > these discussions over to it. What are the groups opinions on which (if any) of
            > the following are likely to happen now:
            >
            > 1) The mailing list will eventually migrate fully over to the newsgroup
            > 2) Discussions will continue here as well as the newsgroup, with some overlap
            > and but little cross posting
            > 3) Cross posting will run rampant, and the two forums will parallel one another
            > nearly completely
            > 4) The newsgroup will suffer from not being the "first to market" in the
            > business of XP discussion. Traffic will not match what is here and it will
            > wither away into obscurity

            I won't use the newsgroup as long as the list remains interesting (I'm
            one of the 13 who voted against it). I think that it would be great if
            the list server and the newsgroup server were linked so that every
            message was transparently cross-posted.

            In the meantime. Does anyone know a better way than DejaNews to read
            newsgroups from behind a firewall?

            --
            Phil Goodwin, Java Software, Sun Microsystems, 408-517-6951, or x66951

            "There's only so much you can do, and you have to do that much, even if
            you don't know how much it is." --Garrison Keillor
          • Phlip
            From: Phil Goodwin ... News junkies... About the my home ISP s server rocks but my workplace ISP s news server has a 2-day window and drops half the posts
            Message 5 of 9 , Apr 28, 2000
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              From: Phil Goodwin

              > In the meantime. Does anyone know a better way than DejaNews to read
              > newsgroups from behind a firewall?

              News junkies...

              About the "my home ISP's server rocks but my workplace ISP's news server has
              a 2-day window and drops half the posts" syndrome...

              At my day job we have a T1 to UUNET. They use two kinds of news servers; one
              set for feeding ISPs and the other for your newsreader to pull from.

              Guess which kind absolutely sucks.

              Browse here:

              http://www.dejanews.com/%5bST_rn=ps]/getdoc.xp?AN=350582689.1

              It's a Perl script (possibly portable) that forwards any IP service on any
              port from a remote host thru your host. You could fake Yahoo on your own
              domain name, for example.

              Absofuckin'lutely incredible, and just slightly easier to configure than
              INN. I'm gonna leave it running at home, wander into work, point my news
              reader at my home server's static IP, and steal the feed from my ISPs
              well-oiled leaf servers.

              If you'r firewall's the miserable paranoid kind, use that script to
              translate the port number to 80 during the turnaround. Then configure your
              news agent to read that port.

              --
              Phlip
              ======= http://users.deltanet.com/~tegan/home.html =======
              -- The object of the game is to transfer the
              projects "Critical Path" to a colleague --
            • Asim Jalis
              There is another factor in all of this. Mailing-lists tend to have a higher signal-to-noise ratio than usenet. Perhaps because on a mailing-list you cannot
              Message 6 of 9 , Apr 28, 2000
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                There is another factor in all of this. Mailing-lists tend to have a
                higher signal-to-noise ratio than usenet. Perhaps because on a
                mailing-list you cannot hit-and-run as easily. Subscribing to a
                mailing-list requires more commitment.

                E.g. one of the neat things about this list is that I have not seen a
                single flamefest.

                I suspect the usenet group will have a different flavor. Also posting
                to the usenet without munging your e-mail results in a spam flood
                which might discourage some people from posting.

                However the newsgroup might result in more exposure for XP which will be
                good in the long run.

                Personally I suspect the group will generate its own traffic and the
                list discussions will remain intact.

                Asim
              • Thomas Ball
                All of the comp.* newsgroups are available to Sun s engineers from the engnews2 server. There are other servers, including a JavaSoft-specific one (I was with
                Message 7 of 9 , Apr 29, 2000
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                  All of the comp.* newsgroups are available to Sun's engineers from the
                  engnews2 server. There are other servers, including a JavaSoft-specific one
                  (I was with JavaSoft until transferring to the Alliance a few months ago),
                  but I found engnews2 to be the most reliable.

                  If you need other feeds, submit a servicedesk request and make it clear it's
                  work-related -- I did that for some microsoft.* and netscape.* feeds we
                  needed.

                  Tom

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Phil Goodwin <phil.goodwin@...>
                  To: <extremeprogramming@egroups.com>
                  Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 12:07 PM
                  Subject: Re: [XP] comp.software.extreme-programming passes 155:13


                  > Eric Rizzo wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Steve Cline wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > see todays news.announce.newgroups on Deja.com or your favorite news
                  > > > server
                  > > >
                  > > > should be available in a week or 2
                  > >
                  > > That's great news (pun intended) AFAIAC. Now I guess the hard part is
                  migrating
                  > > these discussions over to it. What are the groups opinions on which (if
                  any) of
                  > > the following are likely to happen now:
                  > >
                  > > 1) The mailing list will eventually migrate fully over to the newsgroup
                  > > 2) Discussions will continue here as well as the newsgroup, with some
                  overlap
                  > > and but little cross posting
                  > > 3) Cross posting will run rampant, and the two forums will parallel one
                  another
                  > > nearly completely
                  > > 4) The newsgroup will suffer from not being the "first to market" in the
                  > > business of XP discussion. Traffic will not match what is here and it
                  will
                  > > wither away into obscurity
                  >
                  > I won't use the newsgroup as long as the list remains interesting (I'm
                  > one of the 13 who voted against it). I think that it would be great if
                  > the list server and the newsgroup server were linked so that every
                  > message was transparently cross-posted.
                  >
                  > In the meantime. Does anyone know a better way than DejaNews to read
                  > newsgroups from behind a firewall?
                  >
                  > --
                  > Phil Goodwin, Java Software, Sun Microsystems, 408-517-6951, or x66951
                  >
                  > "There's only so much you can do, and you have to do that much, even if
                  > you don't know how much it is." --Garrison Keillor
                  >
                  >
                  > To Post a message, send it to: extremeprogramming@...
                  >
                  > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
                  extremeprogramming-unsubscribe@...
                  >
                  > Ad-free courtesy of objectmentor.com
                  >
                  >
                • Eric Rizzo
                  ... I don t think that s a valid comparison for several reasons. c.l.object is, by its nature, full of non-XPers. The new XP newsgroup would be far more
                  Message 8 of 9 , May 1, 2000
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                    Phlip wrote:
                    > Compare the effect this list server had on the (previously wild) XP threads
                    > on news:comp.object...

                    I don't think that's a valid comparison for several reasons. c.l.object is, by
                    its nature, full of non-XPers. The new XP newsgroup would be far more weighted
                    towards people who either are familiar with XP or are genuinely interested in
                    it. Also, IME c.l.object has traditionally been an pretty hostile place, what
                    with all the cross-posted religious wars being played out again and again there
                    and the general melting pot of opinions, perspectives, and attitudes. The XP
                    scene seems much different in these regards. I am a regular on some newsgroups
                    that are consistently pleasant, high SNR, informative places to hang out.
                    Although they are actually hosted by IBM, the VisualAge for Java newsgroups are
                    one example.

                    Eric
                    --
                    Eric Nicholas Rizzo
                    eric.rizzo@...
                    The Technical Resource Connection, Inc. Perot Systems
                    http://www.trcinc.com
                    ---------------------------------------------------------------
                    "A man talking sense to himself is no more insane than
                    a man talking nonsense not to himself...or just as insane."
                    -Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
                  • Eric Rizzo
                    ... Yes, I agree. That would be ideal. ... Deja provides a service (part of MyDeja) that will let you set up an automatic forward of USENET messages from any
                    Message 9 of 9 , May 1, 2000
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                      Phil Goodwin wrote:
                      >
                      > I won't use the newsgroup as long as the list remains interesting (I'm
                      > one of the 13 who voted against it). I think that it would be great if
                      > the list server and the newsgroup server were linked so that every
                      > message was transparently cross-posted.

                      Yes, I agree. That would be ideal.

                      >
                      > In the meantime. Does anyone know a better way than DejaNews to read
                      > newsgroups from behind a firewall?

                      Deja provides a service (part of MyDeja) that will let you set up an automatic
                      forward of USENET messages from any group to be mailed to your email address. I
                      used it for a while about 6-8 months ago, although it was very buggy at the
                      time. You could set it up to forward each message to you individually or as a
                      daily digest. It's possible this could be set up to forward the XP newsgroup
                      messages to the list automatically, but that would require a group "consensus"
                      to be fair and reasonable, since some on this list might not want the extra
                      traffic.

                      Any thoughts?

                      --
                      Eric Nicholas Rizzo
                      eric.rizzo@...
                      The Technical Resource Connection, Inc. Perot Systems
                      http://www.trcinc.com
                      ---------------------------------------------------------------
                      "A man talking sense to himself is no more insane than
                      a man talking nonsense not to himself...or just as insane."
                      -Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
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