Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Scaling Scrum and XP with Dynamic Governance

Expand Messages
  • jhrothjr
    Hi Ron, I just saw this on the Sociocracy list - http://www.socionet.us/dynamic-governance-is-scrums-big-brother/ I presume you know about it. Opinions? John
    Message 1 of 5 , Dec 15, 2012
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi Ron,

      I just saw this on the Sociocracy list - http://www.socionet.us/dynamic-governance-is-scrums-big-brother/

      I presume you know about it. Opinions?

      John Roth
    • RonJeffries
      Hi John, it s nice to hear from you ... ... I do not know about it. Not sure if I m sorry or not. It sounds kind of pseudo to me. I suppose I should put it on
      Message 2 of 5 , Dec 15, 2012
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi John, it's nice to hear from you ...

        On Dec 15, 2012, at 3:36 PM, "jhrothjr" <JohnRoth1@...> wrote:

        > I just saw this on the Sociocracy list - http://www.socionet.us/dynamic-governance-is-scrums-big-brother/
        >
        > I presume you know about it. Opinions?


        I do not know about it. Not sure if I'm sorry or not. It sounds kind of pseudo to me. I suppose I should put it on my list of things to look into.

        What do you know about Sociocracy, in general or specifics?

        Ron Jeffries
        www.XProgramming.com
        Impossible is not a fact. It is an opinion. -- Muhammad Ali




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Michael K Spayd
        Hello Everyone, Sociacracy is, from my point of view, a very sophisticated governance system, and is the literal father of Holcracy, which is another
        Message 3 of 5 , Dec 15, 2012
        • 0 Attachment
          Hello Everyone,
          Sociacracy is, from my point of view, a very sophisticated governance
          system, and is the literal father of Holcracy,
          which is another governance system. It is quite consistent with the values
          of Agile and would be great for a
          company or department to adopt. The caveat is that most organizations are
          frankly not mature enough to use
          such a system, it is appropriate to a higher developmental level than they
          are at. Of course, the same could be
          said for most organizations chances of becoming truly agile.

          I recommend study/contemplation of both or either system as to what
          governance that is not rooted in the machine
          model and command and control assumptions looks like.

          Hope that is useful information.

          Best,
          Michael


          On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 3:34 PM, RonJeffries <ronjeffries@...> wrote:

          > I do not know about it. Not sure if I'm sorry or not. It sounds kind of
          > pseudo to me. I suppose I should put it on my list of things to look into.
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • John Roth
          Hi Ron, As Michael Spayd says, it s a corporate governance system that s much more democratic than the more usual command and control corporate governance
          Message 4 of 5 , Dec 15, 2012
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Ron,

            As Michael Spayd says, it's a corporate governance system that's much
            more democratic than the more usual command and control corporate
            governance systems we love to hate. It was rebranded in the US as
            Dynamic Governance because of reactions to words that either begin with
            soc- or end with -ocracy.

            A well-functioning XP or Scrum team would probably recognize most of the
            team (called circle) practices except for the actual decision process,
            which is based on consent (not consensus as it's usually understood),
            not on majority vote. If someone wants to make a change to the current
            procedure, they make a proposal. The proposal is presumed to be adopted
            unless someone objects. Objections are worked through until they're
            either resolved or it's recognized that the proposal can't be achieved.
            The process is structured to make sure everyone has a voice: the
            facilitator calls on each person in turn; she does not recognize people
            who want to speak. The process is further structured so that the first
            round is reserved for clarifications, the second round for objections
            and then the third round to attempt resolution of the objections.

            A couple more qualifications: all, and I mean all, procedures are
            subject to revision. There's no such thing as a practice that can't be
            changed. Once a proposal is adopted, compliance is not optional - this
            is the same as Lean Manufacturing and most other functional team practices.

            Structures larger than a circle are based on multiple circles and a
            procedure called "double linking." That is, the subordinate circle has
            two delegates to the next superior circle, one of whom is the manager
            and the other is elected by the team. They have full voting powers so if
            a subordinate circle does not consent to a policy that affects them, it
            does not go into effect.

            My general impression is that Scrum/XP would be a natural fit for a
            Sociocratic organization, however I don't think that it's necessary in
            order to achieve scaling. The place where Sociocracy would work well is
            in getting agreed-on coding standards, protocols and similar things that
            cross teams, since the procedure for getting agreement among separate
            teams is essentially baked into the corporate culture.

            The system came from the Netherlands and the usual example is Endenburg
            Electric, an electrical contractor which has about 10,000 employees. I'm
            told it's accepted in some European countries as satisfying labor laws
            requiring employee participation. There's a book on it titled "We the
            People: Consenting to a Deeper Democracy."
            http://www.amazon.com/We-People-Consenting-Deeper-Democracy/dp/0979282705

            Full disclosure: I had nothing whatever to do with writing the book, and
            I don't work for these people. I just like what they're doing.

            John Roth




            On 12/15/12 3:34 PM, RonJeffries wrote:
            >
            > Hi John, it's nice to hear from you ...
            >
            > On Dec 15, 2012, at 3:36 PM, "jhrothjr" <JohnRoth1@...
            > <mailto:JohnRoth1%40gmail.com>> wrote:
            >
            > > I just saw this on the Sociocracy list -
            > http://www.socionet.us/dynamic-governance-is-scrums-big-brother/
            > >
            > > I presume you know about it. Opinions?
            >
            > I do not know about it. Not sure if I'm sorry or not. It sounds kind
            > of pseudo to me. I suppose I should put it on my list of things to
            > look into.
            >
            > What do you know about Sociocracy, in general or specifics?
            >
            > Ron Jeffries
            > www.XProgramming.com
            > Impossible is not a fact. It is an opinion. -- Muhammad Ali
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • RonJeffries
            Hi John, ... It has the ring of something that would appeal to you, somehow. Thanks to you and Michael for the update about it. Seems interesting, and odd. Ron
            Message 5 of 5 , Dec 15, 2012
            • 0 Attachment
              Hi John,

              On Dec 15, 2012, at 6:46 PM, John Roth <JohnRoth1@...> wrote:

              > Full disclosure: I had nothing whatever to do with writing the book, and
              > I don't work for these people. I just like what they're doing.


              It has the ring of something that would appeal to you, somehow.

              Thanks to you and Michael for the update about it. Seems interesting, and odd.

              Ron Jeffries
              www.XProgramming.com
              I'm not bad, I'm just drawn that way. -- Jessica Rabbit



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.