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Re: [XP] Communicating from the Enterprise to Project Teams

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  • PAUL
    Hi Marvin, ... I ve got hands-on experience of this. A big pharmaceutical company hired a big french consultancy to build a drug safety system for them. The
    Message 1 of 370 , Aug 1, 2010
      Hi Marvin,

      > Hello, MarvinToll.com. On Saturday, July 31, 2010, at 11:08:08
      > PM, you wrote:
      >
      > > P.S. I've mentioned that our company has 22 different enterprise
      > > service organizations telling teams what to do (depending on the
      > > project). So there is plenty of frustration which is not going to
      > > change because you and I want it to. What I believe is a starting
      > > point for change is how we communicate. Or said another way, if an
      > > Application Architectural/Design point can not be made via working
      > > software in a deployable Reference Implementation and/or Code
      > > Sampled Pattern... then shut-up about it. The inbound language of
      > > a project team should be 'working software'.
      >
      > If this means "provide them with something they can use", then I
      > agree.
      >

      I've got hands-on experience of this. A big pharmaceutical company hired a big french consultancy to build a drug safety system for them. The consultancy chose to use architectural code "templates" to build the system. In fact this approach was hailed as a unique selling advantage. The system was to be a J2EE system, and the code templates enforced J2EE three tier client server "best practices", using struts and EJB's. After a year or so the team still hadn't delivered a single phase in a 9-12 phase programme of work.

      I and four others were brought in as experienced (and suitably expensive) contractors. We said ditch the EJB's and the code templates. The French architect said no. Six months later Thoughtworks were brought in and immediately ditched the templates, replacing EJB's with POJO's and complex server and client side form validation with much simpler server side validation. The architect and the French consultancy had been fired by this time. Our productivity soared and in 4 months we had delivered the first phase.

      By this time the project was in financial crisis (no money left). We were let go (I'm still owed money that wasn't paid), and a few weeks later a much smaller project with a much smaller scope and a smaller team was launched. Also a leading Agile coach was retained (thoughtworks had gone too).

      The team went on to be very successful, and a number of the team members went on to populate other successful Agile teams.

      True story.

      Regards,

      Paul.
    • Bill Caputo
      ... The problem is that it isn t just one topic - its at least 2 or 3 and as near as I can tell constitutes the entire traffic of the list right now. Also, I
      Message 370 of 370 , Sep 8, 2010
        On Wed, Sep 8, 2010 at 9:20 PM, Ron Jeffries <ronjeffries@...> wrote:
        > Seems not reading this topic might suffice ... but to each his own
        > ... I guess.

        The problem is that it isn't just one topic - its at least 2 or 3 and
        as near as I can tell constitutes the entire traffic of the list right
        now. Also, I can't not read things, it's a medical condition or
        something...

        > I know Marvin and I am confident that he's trying to do as right a
        > thing as he can.

        I agree with that. The again, the road to hell and all that...

        > I freely grant that I cannot figure out why what we
        > are saying seems to elude him.

        I don't know either. We could ask him, I suppose. But I expect it'll
        just start the whole thing all over again.

        > I suppose we could stop trying, but
        > that seems wrong to me.

        To each his own... I guess ;->

        > I'd say that if the thread ticks you, or
        > anyone, off ... start new ones, respond to other ones, pitch in in
        > other ways.

        Well, as I said, no other threads seem to be going on right now. If I
        can think of something constructive to say, I'll start a new one.
        However, I apologize to the list for venting publicly (and so adding
        to the noise). I'll stick to signal or silence for a while.

        Best,
        Bill
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