Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

[XP] iterations vs continuous flow, kanban ...

Expand Messages
  • Jeff Grigg
    ... Me too. ... We tried kanban on a number of teams at my previous employer. I was not impressed. The biggest problem I had with kanban is that since it s
    Message 1 of 187 , Aug 2 7:53 AM
    • 0 Attachment
      --- Arnaud Bailly <abailly@...> wrote:
      > I join the choir of appraisal to Ron Jeffries for starting
      > this interesting thread.

      Me too.

      > [...] AFAICT ([...]), kanban is "just" a signaling technique
      > to constraint the size of queues in a process. Define process
      > cycle time, queues, inputs/outputs, you got a nice Markov
      > process which you can solve to define the optimum number of
      > kanbans, ie. the optimal number of work items transiting at
      > a single point of time in all the process.

      We tried kanban on a number of teams at my previous employer. I was not impressed.

      The biggest problem I had with kanban is that since it's designed to manage the size of the handoff queues between work processes, teams will add queues (IE: handoffs) to the process in order to have something to manage with kanban. In other words, we create a problem because we happen to have selected a tool that manages that problem. "We need a separate testing phase," they say, "so that we can manage the number of work items waiting to be tested." And then we need an analysis phase, a design phase, and a code review phase after the coding phase, etc. Waterfall anyone?

      I've seen kanban work well in operations groups -- those who respond to randomly arriving service requests which can each be completed and delivered independently of each other. But if you're going to package up and deliver a new version of a working system every month (or every two weeks or whatever), then I don't find it helpful to deny the actual release heartbeat in favor of an unhelpful flatline flow.
    • Ron Jeffries
      Hello, davenicolette. On Monday, August 10, 2009, at 7:52:58 PM, ... Yep! Ron Jeffries www.XProgramming.com www.xprogramming.com/blog Accroche toi a ton reve.
      Message 187 of 187 , Aug 10 8:51 PM
      • 0 Attachment
        Hello, davenicolette. On Monday, August 10, 2009, at 7:52:58 PM,
        you wrote:

        >> Seems to me this is a quite valid thing to do, but that it's still
        >> managing scope.

        > That's fine. I don't want to get into a circular debate about
        > words. The key thing IMO is that we understand how to work with
        > that type of trade-off to the customer's benefit.

        Yep!

        Ron Jeffries
        www.XProgramming.com
        www.xprogramming.com/blog
        Accroche toi a ton reve. --ELO
      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.