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Re: [XP] Gut feeling vs head language

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  • Thomas Eyde
    This is (was) not an XP shop, not even close to be agile. We tried to do iterations, but the manager willingly let the date slip so we could put all promised
    Message 1 of 17 , Sep 1, 2005
      This is (was) not an XP shop, not even close to be agile. We tried to
      do iterations, but the manager willingly let the date slip so we could
      put all promised features in.

      We don't pair at all. The workspace is open, yes, but doesn't seem to
      help. We don't work on the same tasks, and we don't switch them. So I
      am the gui expert, some other on BizTalk, yet another on database
      access and so on.

      The project is over, my opponent (enemy is such a harsh word) has
      moved to another city, and I don't think it's likely we'll work
      together in the near future. I share and ask because I hope to learn
      what I can do better next time.

      The issue, really, is how can I open up the other's mind when I see
      and feel the pain of bad judgements.

      On 9/1/05, Ron Jeffries <ronjeffries@...> wrote:
      > In passing, I don't know if this is supposed to be an XP shop.
      > Anyway, I am guessing that you and Jack don't pair program a lot. Is
      > the team working in an open workspace?
    • Steve Tooke
      ... I think the only option, really, is honesty. If you aren t on board with a decision you have to question it and try to understand why it was made. This way
      Message 2 of 17 , Sep 1, 2005
        On 9/1/05, Thomas Eyde <thomas.eyde@...> wrote:
        > The issue, really, is how can I open up the other's mind when I see
        > and feel the pain of bad judgements.

        I think the only option, really, is honesty. If you aren't on board
        with a decision you have to question it and try to understand why it
        was made. This way you get to learn what the PIQ was thinking. During
        this discussion you can point out where your ideas may be a better
        fit, or you may see that the other idea is in fact the better option,
        or some new plan may hit one of you. The best thing is that you should
        both learn something.
      • Cory Foy
        ... I think there are two schools to this. I truly believe there is a camp where people want to refuse to believe there is a problem. However, I think the
        Message 3 of 17 , Sep 26, 2005
          Thomas Eyde wrote:
          > Sometimes people will simply not understand there is a problem. I have
          > experienced that when I was the more knowledged person on the subject
          > (which, btw, was/is ASP.NET). My opponent on the subject had chosen a
          > hopeless GUI library.
          >
          > Hopeless in my opinion, anyway.
          >
          > Any of my attempts was countered by something which boils down to:
          > "Let's just define the application *not* to be used that way. If the
          > users choose to do otherwise, then it's their problem."
          >
          > So what do we do when people just refuse to understand the problem?

          I think there are two schools to this. I truly believe there is a camp
          where people want to refuse to believe there is a problem. However, I
          think the second camp might be a little more likely. This is the camp
          that doesn't know enough to know they don't know. I've mentioned the
          paper on here once or twice before, but the basic concept is that
          participants in a study proved over and over that they didn't always
          possess the knowledge to recognize how bad they were.

          In those cases, the resistance may be from them not wanting to admit
          that they don't know. I've certainly been guilty of that in my past. The
          only thing that can help in that situation is training, which if they
          pretend like they don't need, can lead to a bad situation.

          Have you seen situations like I am referring to?

          Cory
        • Thomas Eyde
          The only thing I can think of right now, is rejecting the idea of TDD. Except from that, I think I have been blessed with open minded coworkers. The story
          Message 4 of 17 , Sep 26, 2005
            The only thing I can think of right now, is rejecting the idea of TDD.
            Except from that, I think I have been blessed with open minded
            coworkers.

            The story about the GUI library is a totally different one. This guy
            is good at what he does, but wait...

            I think you hit the nail!

            In retrospect I think the problem is more that *he* refuse to
            acknowledge he lack information or knowledge. Other people have told
            me this person is over confident in his own expertise.

            I guess because he is good at most thing which he does, makes him
            think he is good at everything he does. I wish I had this insight 9
            moths ago.

            --
            Thomas

            On 9/26/05, Cory Foy <usergroup@...> wrote:
            > I think there are two schools to this. I truly believe there is a camp
            > where people want to refuse to believe there is a problem. However, I
            > think the second camp might be a little more likely. This is the camp
            > that doesn't know enough to know they don't know.
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