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Politics-Oriented Software Development

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  • PA
    For your consideration: http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/1/28/32622/4244 Cheers -- PA, Onnay Equitursay http://alt.textdrive.com/
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 30, 2005
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      For your consideration:

      http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/1/28/32622/4244

      Cheers

      --
      PA, Onnay Equitursay
      http://alt.textdrive.com/
    • Phlip
      ... This reminds me of the passages from /Agile & Iterative Development/ by Craig Larman, indicating that Waterfall performed strictly is less productive than
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 30, 2005
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        PA wrote:
        >
        > For your consideration:
        >
        > http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/1/28/32622/4244

        This reminds me of the passages from /Agile & Iterative Development/
        by Craig Larman, indicating that Waterfall performed strictly is less
        productive than performed loosely. The author seems to argue for
        Code-and-Fix performed strictly...

        --
        Phlip
      • Jeff Grigg
        ... I was actually on a project, once, where on multiple occasions at least one developer deliberately sabotaged another s code -- changing it so that it would
        Message 3 of 12 , Jan 30, 2005
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          --- PA <petite.abeille@g...> wrote:
          > For your consideration:
          > http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/1/28/32622/4244

          I was actually on a project, once, where on multiple occasions at
          least one developer deliberately sabotaged another's code --
          changing it so that it would fail. It seems that there were several
          arguments going on between some of the developers at the time, of
          the form, "Let's do this." vs "No, that will never work." So
          the "can-do" guy did it, and found that it worked fine. And that so
          annoyed some of the "never work" guy(s) that he/they edited
          the "offensive" (successfully running) programs, and threw in random
          edits to make them fail. Corporate security got involved. Someone
          lost their job.
        • Kay Pentecost
          I have to know... the can-do or the saboteurs?? Kay
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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            I have to know... the can-do or the saboteurs??

            Kay

            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: Jeff Grigg [mailto:jeffgrigg@...]
            > Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2005 5:54 PM
            > To: extremeprogramming@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [XP] Re: Politics-Oriented Software Development
            >
            >
            >
            > --- PA <petite.abeille@g...> wrote:
            > > For your consideration:
            > > http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/1/28/32622/4244
            >
            > I was actually on a project, once, where on multiple occasions at
            > least one developer deliberately sabotaged another's code --
            > changing it so that it would fail. It seems that there were several
            > arguments going on between some of the developers at the time, of
            > the form, "Let's do this." vs "No, that will never work." So
            > the "can-do" guy did it, and found that it worked fine. And that so
            > annoyed some of the "never work" guy(s) that he/they edited
            > the "offensive" (successfully running) programs, and threw in random
            > edits to make them fail. Corporate security got involved. Someone
            > lost their job.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > To Post a message, send it to: extremeprogramming@...
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          • Luiz Esmiralha
            That´s the kind of place where you don t work, you serve time.
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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              That´s the kind of place where you don't work, you serve time.

              On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 22:53:56 -0000, Jeff Grigg <jeffgrigg@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > I was actually on a project, once, where on multiple occasions at
              > least one developer deliberately sabotaged another's code --
              > changing it so that it would fail. It seems that there were several
              > arguments going on between some of the developers at the time, of
              > the form, "Let's do this." vs "No, that will never work." So
              > the "can-do" guy did it, and found that it worked fine. And that so
              > annoyed some of the "never work" guy(s) that he/they edited
              > the "offensive" (successfully running) programs, and threw in random
              > edits to make them fail. Corporate security got involved. Someone
              > lost their job.
              >
              >
            • Jeff Grigg
              A most insightful question. ;- Yes, the can-do guy got fired. Not a team player. was the essence of the issue. (I think a really honest assessment of
              Message 6 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                A most insightful question. ;->

                Yes, the "can-do" guy got fired. "Not a team player." was the
                essence of the issue.

                (I think a really honest assessment of the situation would reveal
                that just about everyone involved was being a jerk (behaving
                unprofessionally ;-) -- from each and every one of the team
                members, to the project manager himself. And yes, *I* was in that
                set of people somewhere. ;-)


                --- "Kay Pentecost" <tranzpupy@i...> wrote:
                > I have to know... the can-do or the saboteurs??
                > Kay

                >> -----Original Message-----
                >> From: Jeff Grigg [mailto:jeffgrigg@c...]
                >>
                >> I was actually on a project, once, where on multiple
                >> occasions at least one developer deliberately sabotaged
                >> another's code -- changing it so that it would fail. It
                >> seems that there were several arguments going on between
                >> some of the developers at the time, of the form, "Let's
                >> do this." vs "No, that will never work." So the "can-do"
                >> guy did it, and found that it worked fine. [That] so
                >> annoyed some of the "never work" guy(s) that he/they
                >> edited the "offensive" (successfully running) programs,
                >> and threw in random edits to make them fail. Corporate
                >> security got involved. Someone lost their job.

                >> --- PA <petite.abeille@g...> wrote:
                >>> For your consideration:
                >>> http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2005/1/28/32622/4244
              • banshee858
                ... When things get political, the person who gets canned is ALWAYS the person who is not a team player . The only team them seem not to be part of is the
                Message 7 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                  >
                  > Yes, the "can-do" guy got fired. "Not a team player." was the
                  > essence of the issue.
                  >
                  When things get political, the person who gets canned is ALWAYS the
                  person who is "not a team player". The only "team" them seem not to
                  be part of is the clique of chattering sycophants who only look out
                  for themselves at the expense of the "team" and generally the larger
                  organization.

                  Carlton
                • Kay Pentecost
                  Hi, Jeff, ... Thank you. ... Bummer. ... Yes. I ll agree with that assesment. And yes, *I* was in that ... I m so sorry. And yet, I m sure you learned
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                    Hi, Jeff,

                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: Jeff Grigg [mailto:jeffgrigg@...]
                    > Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 5:20 PM
                    > To: extremeprogramming@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [XP] Re: Politics-Oriented Software Development
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > A most insightful question. ;->

                    Thank you.

                    >
                    > Yes, the "can-do" guy got fired. "Not a team player." was the
                    > essence of the issue.

                    Bummer.

                    >
                    > (I think a really honest assessment of the situation would reveal
                    > that just about everyone involved was being a jerk (behaving
                    > unprofessionally ;-) -- from each and every one of the team
                    > members, to the project manager himself.

                    Yes. I'll agree with that assesment.

                    And yes, *I* was in that
                    > set of people somewhere. ;-)

                    I'm so sorry.

                    And yet, I'm sure you learned something valuable from it.



                    Kay
                  • Kay Pentecost
                    Hi, Carlton, ... Do you think you re saying this strongly enough? But I agree. Kay Pentecost
                    Message 9 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                      Hi, Carlton,

                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: banshee858 [mailto:cnett858@...]
                      > Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 5:34 PM
                      > To: extremeprogramming@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: [XP] Re: Politics-Oriented Software Development
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > >
                      > > Yes, the "can-do" guy got fired. "Not a team player." was the
                      > > essence of the issue.
                      > >
                      > When things get political, the person who gets canned is ALWAYS the
                      > person who is "not a team player". The only "team" them seem not to
                      > be part of is the clique of chattering sycophants who only look out
                      > for themselves at the expense of the "team" and generally the larger
                      > organization.

                      Do you think you're saying this strongly enough?

                      <grin>

                      But I agree.

                      Kay Pentecost
                    • Jeff Grigg
                      ... Yes, it was /quite/ an educational experience. ;- I was hot out of college, with 5 years of part-time experience as a contractor. The rest of the team
                      Message 10 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                        > --- Jeff,
                        >> And yes, *I* was in that set of people somewhere. ;-)

                        --- "Kay Pentecost" <tranzpupy@i...> wrote:
                        > I'm so sorry.
                        > And yet, I'm sure you learned something valuable from it.

                        Yes, it was /quite/ an educational experience. ;->

                        I was hot out of college, with 5 years of part-time experience as a
                        contractor. The rest of the team were likewise college graduates,
                        but with no experience. This was back in 1988, and the experience
                        taught me to be much more politically savvy, and not nearly as
                        obnoxious and disagreeable (unless the situation warrants it. ;-)

                        Oh, I learned things like...

                        When your project manager says, "I hate my job; I want to be
                        demoted." it's a bad sign. >>> RUN!!! <<<

                        And...

                        Don't start a fight, unless you intend to win it. ;->

                        That is, don't let conflict simmer: Either win or settle. Ongoing
                        arguments can be painful and counterproductive.
                      • Kay Pentecost
                        Hi, Jeff, ... It must have been, because I ve been learning a lot from you. ... Oh yes. ... I will take that to heart. Thanks, Kay
                        Message 11 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                          Hi, Jeff,

                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: Jeff Grigg [mailto:jeffgrigg@...]
                          > Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 9:37 PM
                          > To: extremeprogramming@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: [XP] Re: Politics-Oriented Software Development
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > > --- Jeff,
                          > >> And yes, *I* was in that set of people somewhere. ;-)
                          >
                          > --- "Kay Pentecost" <tranzpupy@i...> wrote:
                          > > I'm so sorry.
                          > > And yet, I'm sure you learned something valuable from it.
                          >
                          > Yes, it was /quite/ an educational experience. ;->

                          It must have been, because I've been learning a lot from you.

                          >
                          > I was hot out of college, with 5 years of part-time experience as a
                          > contractor. The rest of the team were likewise college graduates,
                          > but with no experience. This was back in 1988, and the experience
                          > taught me to be much more politically savvy, and not nearly as
                          > obnoxious and disagreeable (unless the situation warrants it. ;-)
                          >
                          > Oh, I learned things like...
                          >
                          > When your project manager says, "I hate my job; I want to be
                          > demoted." it's a bad sign. >>> RUN!!! <<<

                          Oh yes.


                          >
                          > And...
                          >
                          > Don't start a fight, unless you intend to win it. ;->
                          >
                          > That is, don't let conflict simmer: Either win or settle. Ongoing
                          > arguments can be painful and counterproductive.

                          I will take that to heart.

                          Thanks,

                          Kay
                        • George Dinwiddie
                          ... I didn t want to ask. -- ... When I remember bygone days George Dinwiddie I think how evening follows morn;
                          Message 12 of 12 , Jan 31, 2005
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                            Jeff Grigg wrote:
                            >
                            > A most insightful question. ;->
                            >
                            > Yes, the "can-do" guy got fired. "Not a team player." was the
                            > essence of the issue.

                            <sigh> I didn't want to ask.


                            --
                            ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                            When I remember bygone days George Dinwiddie
                            I think how evening follows morn; gdinwiddie@...
                            So many I loved were not yet dead, http://www.idiacomputing.com
                            So many I love were not yet born. http://www.agilemaryland.org
                            'The Middle' by Ogden Nash
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