Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

158696Re: [XP] Examples of good acceptance test criteria

Expand Messages
  • George Dinwiddie
    Jul 23, 2013
    • 0 Attachment

      On 7/22/13 9:21 PM, Adam Sroka wrote:
      > I'm not sure how this is a response to what I wrote. If your point is that
      > the customer needs to be the one driving the scenarios then you are
      > preaching to the choir. Although, I would never email them the scenarios. I
      > would insist on a face-to-face conversation.
      > I would never use Cucumber to write tests for myself or my fellow
      > programmers. I would use something like RSpec or xUnit for that. Cucumber
      > is for facilitating conversations with customers. If the customer is not
      > involved then it is the wrong tool (And quite likely the wrong project.)

      I would. Sometimes I need to facilitate the conversation with myself. I
      find that expressing the business problem in "english" is often better
      for that than expressing it in code.

      If the Customer is not involved, that's a different problem. Getting the
      Customer involved may take more than just a BDD/ATDD tool. ;-)

      - George

      P.S. Nice examples, Phlip.

      > On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 8:44 PM, Phlip <phlip2005@...> wrote:
      >> **
      >>> Note that while Cucumber is an excellent tool compatible with many
      >>> different programming languages you don't need to be using Cucumber to
      >>> benefit from writing your scenarios this way. There are also alternative
      >>> tools that use similar syntax.
      >> When I wrote Morelia viridis (a Python clone for Cucumber, in like 5%
      >> of the lines of code), I was not working with an XP team. But the only
      >> point of Cucumber notation ("Gherkin") is to let an onsite customer
      >> read and write the scenarios as business rules, without the extra
      >> clutter that a real programming language drags in.
      >> But one of my assignments went something like this: "If the customer
      >> orders up to 4 tee-shirts and one speed-suit, stick them all in a
      >> one-wet-suit box. But if they order two speed-suits, put these into a
      >> wet-suit box. If they order two speed-suits and a wet-suit, put them
      >> in a two-wet-suit box." And so on.
      >> I wrote all that up as Cucumber scenarios, passed them, and e-mailed them
      >> out.
      >> Our client emailed back one of the scenarios emended (4 tee-shirts & 1
      >> wet-suit in a single wet-suit box), and I entered that and passed it.
      >> _that_ is what Cucumber is for. And that's why DHH wrote a post
      >> flaming Cucumber, because he's tired of seeing everyone use it wrong.

      Want to speak at AgileDC October 8, 2013? http://agiledc.org/speak/
      * George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com
      Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com
      Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org
    • Show all 17 messages in this topic